For starters before we get down about the idea of our squad being dismantled, let's remember that the squad is less than a year old. Especially the settled team we discovered in October/November time. It's not as if this was the second or third attempt and players will be losing faith in the project or ambition.
As wonderful as Cairney and Sessengon are if someone offers upwards of 20m for either then the club should sell them. Sess would be considered a squad player like Piazon if it wasn't for the fact he is 16, very special but not irreplaceable with that kind of dosh to reinvest. Same with TC, wonderful player for a mere 3.5m. I'm sure we could find another for the money a club would need to offer with his long contract.
Unfortunately we aren't at the top of the food chain and with FFP we will encounter situations where one player going to fund 3 good ones is the way to grow. We bought McDonald and Johansen for less than 5m. I'm positive the club could scout another couple of gems because being realistic, we've been extremely lucky to only have 3 midfielders in a system that requires 3 and not have any of them injured at any point.
Having said all that the gaffer reckons he's been promised neither will leave and I take his word. Again it could be early poker face to up their value but look at the Martin saga, he stuck to his word and the club backed him.
I get the impression Tony Khan wants to be loved by the fans. They will be more than aware of the views of many about their ownership until this season and they won't want to tarnish the relationship that is slowly starting to heal. If the club upset Joka or they make decisions that aren't for the benefit of the team/club than they must be stupid.
Enough of that. Let's be positive!!!!! It's been a wonderful season, I'd even suggest Ream has turned a corner and is the answer. No need imo for a new first choice centre half providing Kalas stays. Just a couple of back ups, naturally left and right footed respectively that play the way Joka likes. Which is clearly the problem with Madl and Sigurdsson whom have both proved their qualities as defenders, one for us in the past and the latter for Iceland.
I see no point in messing around with the full Backs, if the rumour of Brighton for Malone is true then I think that shows a massive lack of ambition on their front. I love Scott but he is in a good place with us and we certainly don't need to lose him to a fellow championship club. Our team will be one of the top 3 or 4 favourites next year. Odoi is good enough back up for Fred. Let's replace those that NEED replacing. Obviously we need another Odoi type to back up Malone if and I say if Sess does leave.
Onto the forwards. We play an exciting style of football with our front 3, I would hate to see that change. But it's in this area I feel we are at our weakest despite being the league's joint top scorers. We don't have goalscorers when games are tight. It's the central link of the 3 that needs addressing. Someone who can not only play down the middle but also comfortably run the channels too with pace. Tammy Abrahams springs to mind. He can score all types of goals, is a presence in the box and in the air and is quick enough to fit in with what we want to do. Gary Hooper is another, at the Cottage Wednesday went direct, NOT LONG BALL because that suggests just lump it, instead it was to penetrate the opposition by playing through the forward playing on the shoulder of the last man.
It seems harsh but last night was the last straw for me with Aluko's finishing. Let's not beat around the bush, he's a wonderful skillful wholehearted player but his finishing is a joke. At times so is Ayite's. I wouldn't rule out both being subs next season and what fine subs they will be with Piazon a different kind of bench option possibly as cover for the midfield trio too. I feel next year will be Kebano's season. We also need a plan B which is what Matt Smith could have been, now's the opportunity to bring in a target man to offer something different but not just a lump with no pace or skill. I'm thinking a Glenn Murray.
So to summarise it's not major surgery that's required, we aren't first time buyers so to speak. We are on the property ladder now and are in a position to go from a 2 bed into a 3 and get that dream home we always wanted. Below is a little wishlist from me trying to be sensible
Out
Joronen
Button
Madl
Sigurdsson
Grimmer
Williams
LVC
Tunnicliffe
Parker
Petsos
Jozabed
Martin
Cyriac
Woodrow
Ins
1st choice keeper
Kalas
Long term deal for Sess and keep him
2 back up CBs
2 competent midfielders to give us a 5 overall for 3 spaces (another McD & another Johansen)
Pay rise for Cairney and another year on contract
Piazon
2 quality strikers
So basically 3 first teamers and 4 squad players of the Piazon standard...........not the Petsos standard!
DB over & out 049:gif
We won't get 20 for sess unles he signs a contract, closer to ten. Gave to remember that Danny Ings only went for 8 million plus 20% of any profit and that was via a tribunal.
As for TC closer to 15 we will ask 20 but I can't see anyone paying that for a championship player, he can play higher for sure but he is still a championship player
Signing wise
Keeper Ido twee us signing one but if we do then we should look at Darren Randolph if not wanted by West Ham or maybe even Sam Johnstone from Man Utd
Centre backs I am to really up on but reckon we will be looking abroad
Midfield wise, guy at Southend called Leonard has a lot of potential and is very consistent. Would add to what we have and can any lding or a little further forward, possibly also worth looking abroad as a bargain to be had over there.
Striker wise, it depends what we want but abrahams, fletcher if we want a lump up front or on elf each of those types so we have variety. Again we will probably pluck someone from abroad
Quote from: westcliff white on May 17, 2017, 10:41:08 PM
We won't get 20 for sess unles he signs a contract, closer to ten. Gave to remember that Danny Ings only went for 8 million plus 20% of any profit and that was via a tribunal.
As for TC closer to 15 we will ask 20 but I can't see anyone paying that for a championship player, he can play higher for sure but he is still a championship player
My understanding is the contract will be signed for Sess which is what I was basing it on. 10m doesn't even touch the sides if he's under a professional contract. We are talking about the future Bale, not Danny Ings.
I think you are probably right with Cairney but I'm gonna be harsh here. He was decent last season but not amazing, only this year he has really flourished. We keep him unless we get 20m. Otherwise it's a pointless sale.
After watching the game tonight I feel Nakhi Wells would be perfect
you would hope LVC can regain some of his old form as back up for Johanson save a few quid and talking of Ings reckon we could get him on loan dont see him being used a Liverpool next season now klopp seems to like Sturridge again, and will need some game time
For me:
I think we could use another center back, not including Kalas.
Agree with Dannyboi on the midfield.
Would keep LVC and Woodrow though. Not sure what we have in Cyriac. I'd like to think coming in at January wasn't too settling. Team was already formed and maybe hasn't found his footing. Wouldn't mind him on a permanent. Need another two true strikers. Would love Dom Dwyer from Kansas City and either Assombalonga or Abraham.
Don't think we need an upgrade at GK to be honest. Betts is more than adequate.
Maybe Cyriac will do a Kebano. Both came from the same league and Kebano took half a season of rarely making the bench before he came out of nowhere in February. I doubt it somehow but maybe. His finish against Blackburn was exquisite
Surprised people don't include a place for Jozabed. Remember he joined us having had no pre-season. With a full pre-season behind him I think he would be a very good player.
Technically I dont think their is any midfielder better than him in this league. What other midfielders from this division would play a part in the Europa league semi finals? I don't think even Cairney would. Jozabed came to us as the top scoring midfielder in a league far better than the championship!
Can't deal with this at the moment still thinking about last night, admire you guys though for bouncing back so quickly!!
Quote from: Statto on May 17, 2017, 11:04:06 PM
For me it would be
GK: NEW
RB: Fredericks
CB: Kalas
CB: Ream:
LB: Malone
DM: McDonald
CM: Johansen
AM: Ayite
AM: Cairney
AM: Aluko
ST: NEW
Squad:
Button/Bettinelli
Sessegnon
Odoi
Madl
NEW CB
NEW DM
NEW CM
LVC (possibly)
Kebano
Piazon
NEW AM
NEW ST
I liked dannyboi's original post but think you are closer to the mark.
Couple of thoughts:
I agree about Jozabed being useful addition. With being a year more mature might with Joka's support be able to deal with the London thing and play a role.
LVC seemed to do a job with Burton and got real game time, he will have pre-season to prove himself or will be gone with Williams and the others.
Striker(s): I love Aluko and Ayite for their flair but they just do not convert chances enough and the play-offs showed it. We really need a real goal threat like Martin promised to be but on balance only delivered on a couple of times. We suck at corners, when was the last time we actually scored from one. Please can we have a striker or two who can cause enough trouble in the box to let someone score occasionally! I would also hope our analytic and scouting group can come up with someone better than Hooper or Fletcher. Tammy Abraham is on Chelsea's books so maybe if we take Piazon and Kalas off them we can have him on loan as part of the deal. Dont see him playing anytime soon for Chelsea.
If we keep one keeper as back up it should be Betts, Button is just not confident or vocal enough to work our/Joka's system.
CB: I hope we can actually buy Kalas but would like to see one more strong ball playing CB.
Quote from: Statto on May 17, 2017, 11:04:06 PM
For me it would be
GK: NEW
RB: Fredericks
CB: Kalas
CB: Ream:
LB: Malone
DM: McDonald
CM: Johansen
AM: Ayite
AM: Cairney
AM: Aluko
ST: NEW
Squad:
Button/Bettinelli
Sessegnon
Odoi
Madl
NEW CB
NEW DM
NEW CM
LVC (possibly)
Kebano
Piazon
NEW AM
NEW ST
This isn't entirely unreasonable, but how are we funding the acquisition of seven new players plus buying Kalas without selling one of Cairney or Sess?
I feel like if you get offered 15M for one of them, you take it. I'd rather keep Cairney, as the goal is to get promoted next season, he's way more impactful than Sess is in the short term, and we won't keep Sess for more than another year or two regardless.
If you sell TC, then you have 15M + a few million for others sold off + Khan backing ... so you could get toward 30M to spend. That's what's needed to finish top 2. Just Kalas (5M?), a good starting striker (6-8M) and a new No. 1 GK (2-3M) will cost you ~15M, and you need to replace Cairney's skill set, as well as adding quality depth in spots. We were pretty lucky with injuries this season. No guarantee we can get away with that again.
Between now and the end of August a multitude of things could happen, including the Earth being struck by a massive asteroid coming out of our blind spot, but few of the possibilities will actually take place. In that period a lot of human beings will make promises they will not keep, say things they do not mean, be very selfish, do very nasty things to others, be tempted by something desirable and cause pain and hurt to another. Some of these people may even be connected to Fulham FC. These things happen all the time but it is unbelievably tough predicting tomorrow out of what we think we know about today. You have BLT sandwiches already prepared for lunch today but will you actually eat them?
Last year McCormack did the Fulham Future Foxtrot with the FFC Orchestra playing discordantly in the background, dancing with the bride but actually fancying the maid of honour. This year there'll be something or somebody else not following the written notes in the score or playing out of time. Perhaps we will benefit from this this time around, but maybe we are always to be the bridesmaid and never the bride. Let's just remember what we were saying about Fulham this time last year and compare it to how it all turned out in reality. And, yesterday morning did any one of us really believe Huddesrfield Town would gut Wednesday in the most hurtful way possible? Whayever happens my love for Fulham will continue and my optimism be as brazen as I can make it because it is better to believe and to dream rather than to despair and to suffer nightmares.
I suspect that we may need to sell Cairney and Sessegnon for £20M so that we can afford the following. Two forwards, a central midfielder to replace Cairney, a back up to replace Parker (or LVC returns) and hopefully Kalas but otherwise someone as good. Not certain Kalas would join us so finding a gem like him may be difficult.
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on May 17, 2017, 10:50:31 PM
Quote from: westcliff white on May 17, 2017, 10:41:08 PM
We won't get 20 for sess unles he signs a contract, closer to ten. Gave to remember that Danny Ings only went for 8 million plus 20% of any profit and that was via a tribunal.
As for TC closer to 15 we will ask 20 but I can't see anyone paying that for a championship player, he can play higher for sure but he is still a championship player
My understanding is the contract will be signed for Sess which is what I was basing it on. 10m doesn't even touch the sides if he's under a professional contract. We are talking about the future Bale, not Danny Ings.
I think you are probably right with Cairney but I'm gonna be harsh here. He was decent last season but not amazing, only this year he has really flourished. We keep him unless we get 20m. Otherwise it's a pointless sale.
After watching the game tonight I feel Nakhi Wells would be perfect
I can see your point re TC but still think we wont get more than 15. As for Sess if he signs we will geta lot more, I say if as I heard runours that he is yet to commit, but as he turns 17 today it could be imminent that we find out what is going to happen. I based on Ings as he was 21/22 when he signed for liverpool (Closest I could get age wise for a comparison), I grant that Sess is a lot better at his age, but these tribunals are weird, it is all base don how long he has been with you, who the selling club signed from if at all etc. And as Sess is younger I feel they will say we have not spent as much as Burnley and Bournemuth did on Ings developement. To be perfectly honest I dont sdisgaree with your valuations just the system is a shower of you know what
For me we need an overhaul in defense because, though Kalas and Ream have definitely been playing to the best of their abilities, one clean sheet since February says it all really, so for me we need one new starting CB as a minimum, and sign Kalas permanently. It's also worth remembering that Kalas is quite injury prone so we'll need to have strong enough backup just in case. I think we need a new keeper, but a proper one this time round not a Brentford reject. If that means Bettinelli has to leave then so be it, he'll be looking for first team football that's for sure, and I'd give Joronen a new contract too. Up front I'd like to see us sign at the bare minimum one new striker, preferably two. If we do buy two I'd like one to be a Championship proven one like Assombalonga and the other to be an unknown foreigner that we can get on the cheap and contribute some goals, in the mold of Elias Kachunga or Jonathan Kodjia, players we hadn't heard of before they came to England but were cheap as chips and can score goals. Also I'd like to get Piazon in as well as Kalas, provided he's on the cheap. If the above means selling either Cairney, I'm for it, provided that: a) he goes for 15m minimum b) we can get in a two footed replacement c) we sort out a new captain. As for players potentially leaving the club, I'd like to get rid of: Martin, Grimmer, Stearman, Madl, Sigurdsson, Parker (though stay as coach), Button, Tunnicliffe, Cole, Petsos, Cyriac, Kavanagh, and Burgess. I'd like to see Jozabed given another chance but it looks like he's staying at Celta Vigo. LVC has to be kept, and want him to have a role next season at Fulham, I want to see that player that we saw 2 years ago and recently at Burton again, I think he could do very well for us, at the very least as cover for Johansen. Woodrow I'm split on, but I'd like to have him as a squad player, although it looks like he might b staying at Burton. It's make or break for George Williams, a decision needs to be made this summer whether he has a future here or not. I think Humphrys should also be given another loan spell. All that said, here's my side for next season:
GK: NEW
RB: Fredericks
RCB: Kalas
LCB: NEW
LB: Malone
RM: Aluko
CDM: McDonald
CDM: Johansen
LM: Kebano
CAM: Cairney
ST: NEW
Quote from: Statto on May 18, 2017, 11:06:33 AM
In terms of budget, our last accounts (15/16) showed our revenues and wages being balanced (£36m each) but a lot of those revenues would have been the parachute payment, which we still get next season, but it will probably be lower and the difference may well eat up most our permitted losses. Maybe it will leave us with a few million and/or we've a few mil left in the bank (we did apparently bid £10m for Elrich in January after all)
We still have a lot of players to sell. I'd expect get at least £10m from player sales if we offload Jozabed, Stearman, LVC, Tunnicliffe, Woodrow, Sigurdsson and one of Button or Bettinelli.
If we need say, Kalas, Piazon, a GK, ST and 5 new squad players, you'd expect 2/3 of those to come on loan but could you get the other 6/7 on a budget of £15m? Maybe, maybe not.
Tunni out of contract so no cash there, the others quite opissibly will raise some funds.
i always thought it was 3 years going to 4 under new terms on the parachutwe payemtns but it is 4 years going to 3 for those now releaged, so that is good news. this is what I htink we get or have gotten.....
Each club is currently paid £24m in the first year back in the Championship, £19.2m in year two, £9.6m in year three and another £9.6m in the final year.
That was for the season we were relagted. Tems coming down now get more than that and over 3 years
Quote from: Statto on May 18, 2017, 11:33:55 AM
Quote from: westcliff white on May 18, 2017, 11:16:45 AM
Quote from: Statto on May 18, 2017, 11:06:33 AM
In terms of budget, our last accounts (15/16) showed our revenues and wages being balanced (£36m each) but a lot of those revenues would have been the parachute payment, which we still get next season, but it will probably be lower and the difference may well eat up most our permitted losses. Maybe it will leave us with a few million and/or we've a few mil left in the bank (we did apparently bid £10m for Elrich in January after all)
We still have a lot of players to sell. I'd expect get at least £10m from player sales if we offload Jozabed, Stearman, LVC, Tunnicliffe, Woodrow, Sigurdsson and one of Button or Bettinelli.
If we need say, Kalas, Piazon, a GK, ST and 5 new squad players, you'd expect 2/3 of those to come on loan but could you get the other 6/7 on a budget of £15m? Maybe, maybe not.
Tunni out of contract so no cash there, the others quite opissibly will raise some funds.
i always thought it was 3 years going to 4 under new terms on the parachutwe payemtns but it is 4 years going to 3 for those now releaged, so that is good news. this is what I htink we get or have gotten.....
Each club is currently paid £24m in the first year back in the Championship, £19.2m in year two, £9.6m in year three and another £9.6m in the final year.
That was for the season we were relagted. Tems coming down now get more than that and over 3 years
Yes that's roughly what I was thinking... The bad news is it means the parachute for next season will be £10m less than it was in year 2 (last year's accounts) and that £10m may eat up almost all our permitted losses under FFP.
IMO 6/7 players for £10-15m isn't unreasonable. it equates to about £2m per player which is on average what we've payed in the last couple of seasons. the problem is the striker because there you're talking about £10m just for that position...
My Fear also
Unfortunately people forget financial fair play when we sell players and then purchase others. Our squad is paper thin and therefore hopefully we can afford a few salaries (which also has to be taken into account). However, I think that we will have to sell Cairney and Sessegnon in order to make the next step forward and buy the forwards, central midfielder and central defender that we need. It was one of the reasons that I was desperate for Fulham to win the playoffs this season.
Last season we sold McCormac and the income financed the purchase of almost a complete new team. Now I imagine we will have to sell again to purchase players for a few key positions that need filling. Lets hope that this is the club's philosophy, we don't need another new team but we need to build on what we have.
I don't like the way Dannyboi is prepared to accept that Cairney may have to go in order to raise the transfer money, in my mind that would be a disaster, we just wouldn't replace him and the central engine room of the team would be continually missfiring. On a smaller scale this is a re run of the threat of us losing Haynes in the sixties. It musn't be allowed to happen.
Transferring Sessegnon would be undesirable also but at least it would not have an immediate effect on next season's promotion challenge and if it would enable us to purchase a top rate striker then it is the less of the two evils.
We really must make an attempt to sort out all of our transfer moves during July we really don't want to be making expensive panic buys like Martin again after the season has started.
Bearing in mind that we pretty much broke even on transfers, I can't be the only one who thinks we're in a semi favorable position at the moment in that our losses would have been negligible this year, and with FFP rolling over three seasons, now gives us a chance to spend more and take a slightly larger loss to build on what is already a very capable team? If we sell a couple of the players on the peripheral and bring in a few more additions that genuinely improve the squad, we should have more than enough money to buy the few players we need to push on for automatic promotion. I know people think we were tight in January, but I think in the long run it might play more in our favour by minimizing our losses with a view to strengthening in the summer with a better idea of what we need to push on that little bit further and obtain automatic promotion.
Quote from: westcliff white on May 18, 2017, 12:04:25 PM
Quote from: Statto on May 18, 2017, 11:33:55 AM
Quote from: westcliff white on May 18, 2017, 11:16:45 AM
Quote from: Statto on May 18, 2017, 11:06:33 AM
In terms of budget, our last accounts (15/16) showed our revenues and wages being balanced (£36m each) but a lot of those revenues would have been the parachute payment, which we still get next season, but it will probably be lower and the difference may well eat up most our permitted losses. Maybe it will leave us with a few million and/or we've a few mil left in the bank (we did apparently bid £10m for Elrich in January after all)
We still have a lot of players to sell. I'd expect get at least £10m from player sales if we offload Jozabed, Stearman, LVC, Tunnicliffe, Woodrow, Sigurdsson and one of Button or Bettinelli.
If we need say, Kalas, Piazon, a GK, ST and 5 new squad players, you'd expect 2/3 of those to come on loan but could you get the other 6/7 on a budget of £15m? Maybe, maybe not.
Tunni out of contract so no cash there, the others quite opissibly will raise some funds.
i always thought it was 3 years going to 4 under new terms on the parachutwe payemtns but it is 4 years going to 3 for those now releaged, so that is good news. this is what I htink we get or have gotten.....
Each club is currently paid £24m in the first year back in the Championship, £19.2m in year two, £9.6m in year three and another £9.6m in the final year.
That was for the season we were relagted. Tems coming down now get more than that and over 3 years
Yes that's roughly what I was thinking... The bad news is it means the parachute for next season will be £10m less than it was in year 2 (last year's accounts) and that £10m may eat up almost all our permitted losses under FFP.
IMO 6/7 players for £10-15m isn't unreasonable. it equates to about £2m per player which is on average what we've payed in the last couple of seasons. the problem is the striker because there you're talking about £10m just for that position...
My Fear also
Be creative. Tammy Abraham on loan.
Bettinelli - Good enough at this level and still has the potential to be better. Deserves to start the season as #1.
Fredericks - His place to lose.
NEW CB - Need a physically imposing central defender who's still decent with the ball at his feet. Probably won't come cheap.
Ream - Has won me over with his form the last couple of months. Belongs in the starting eleven if he keeps playing like that.
Malone - His place to lose.
Cairney/Jozabed - Hopefully one of them stays if the other leaves. But if both decide to leave we'll have loads of money to spend on a replacement.
McDonald - His place to lose.
Johansen - His place to lose.
Aluko - His place to lose.
NEW ST - I'm hoping for Kenneth Zohore here, exactly the type of striker we need. Will cost a lot though as he's now proven at this level.
Ayité - His place to lose.
Button - Good enough backup.
Odoi - Great squad player and not far off Fredericks either.
Sigurdsson - Would rather have Kalas here but I can't see us signing both him and a another CB for big money. Sig can still come good.
Madl - Decent enough backup.
Edun - Would be behind Sess and Odoi in the pecking order.
Adeniran - Would be behind the two below in the pecking order.
NEW DM - Need a McDonald clone here. Nir Bitton was rumoured this January and would fit the bill.
Christensen - I hope LVC is involved much more next season. We've really missed someone to rotate with in central midfield.
Kebano - Can replace either Aluko or Ayité at any time.
Woodrow - IMHO good enough to be backup at this level. But if he's deemed not to be, we'll need a another striker. Preferably a more physical one.
Sessegnon - Hopefully he'll be with us next season. But if he doesn't sign or if we get an offer we can't refuse, Piazon would be a good replacement.
So it's three main targets: a big and strong central defender, a defensive minded central midfielder and a striker with pace and power. Then it's a case of replacing/upgrading on players that are under contract and we'll receive a transfer fee for.
First off - We need two out and out strikers. More on this later.
I'm not certain we need Piazon if we bring on two good strikers. With Sess, Kebano, Ayite and Aluko for 2 spots (I believe Sess will be moved to wide player), Piazon might be too expensive. Additionally, I think those 4 are good enough for auto promotion. And this doesn't leave room for Williams from U23 team.
If we paired those 4 with 2 strikers (is Humphreys in the running yet?) that have good speed and scoring ability, then this will already be an improvement from the beginning of last season. The majority of the team knows the brand of football needed and has been playing it well for a while.
From the centre of the field, obviously Cairney, Johansen and McDonald are good enough in combination. I would like one more well rounded player to compete directly for a starting spot (is LVC ready for this?), something we don't currently have in the first team. I think Parker and Adernian are good enough for back ups to these starters, but one more that's better than Parker would be key for any major injury. Our core of the park team are amazingly good, probably the best in the division.
Back of the park we should sign another LB to compete with Malone, as I said before I think Sess will move more into a scoring role. I think Kalas, Ream and Madl are good enough, but would rather find another CB to match with Kalas. RB is set with Odoi and Fredricks.
I think Bett's is ready to go for the full season as well. No need for major investment in G position.
So, in my opinion, here's what happens this summer. I'm not identifying names of players to bring in, just positions.
IN:
2 Strikers
1 CM to compete with Mc, Johan, Cairney
1 LB
1 starting CB
Sign Kalas permanent
OUT:
All out on loan players except possibly LVC (Woodrow, Jozabed, Tunni, Kavanagh, Grimmer, Stearman, Martin, Piazon, Cyriac, Petsos)
Sigurdson
That's 6 players to be signed to loan or permanent contracts, hopefully all of the starting or immediate backup variety, with 7/8 players sold (depending on LVC) and 4 to be returned from loan.
Team would look like:
Striker: 2 to be signed
Wingers: Aluko, Kebano, Ayite, Sess
CM: Cairney, Johansen, McDonald, LVC, 1 to be signed
LB: Malone, 1 to be signed
RB: Fredricks, Odoi
CB: Kalas (perm), Ream, Madl, 1 to be signed
G: Bett's, Button, Joronen
That's a starting roster of 22. Humphrey's, Williams, Adeniran, Davies possibly as backup to the backups from U23.
Most important signings in order - Kalas (Perm), Striker, another CB, 2nd Striker, CM, LB.
Quote from: Statto on May 18, 2017, 08:46:43 PM
Quote from: Deeping_white on May 18, 2017, 07:22:44 PM
Bearing in mind that we pretty much broke even on transfers, I can't be the only one who thinks we're in a semi favorable position at the moment in that our losses would have been negligible this year, and with FFP rolling over three seasons, now gives us a chance to spend more and take a slightly larger loss to build on what is already a very capable team? If we sell a couple of the players on the peripheral and bring in a few more additions that genuinely improve the squad, we should have more than enough money to buy the few players we need to push on for automatic promotion. I know people think we were tight in January, but I think in the long run it might play more in our favour by minimizing our losses with a view to strengthening in the summer with a better idea of what we need to push on that little bit further and obtain automatic promotion.
but take parachute payments out of the equation and our revenues could be £20m less than our revenues these days, so even without buying anyone we could be making big losses
Don't we get another payment of £9.6m this year which is the same as last years payment though, meaning that the incomings would be the same from that standpoint?
Quote from: Statto on May 17, 2017, 11:32:10 PM
Quote from: @jolslover on May 17, 2017, 11:26:58 PM
Surprised people don't include a place for Jozabed. Remember he joined us having had no pre-season. With a full pre-season behind him I think he would be a very good player.
Technically I dont think their is any midfielder better than him in this league. What other midfielders from this division would play a part in the Europa league semi finals? I don't think even Cairney would. Jozabed came to us as the top scoring midfielder in a league far better than the championship!
Celta have an option to buy so they might take him back. Also if he got homesick last time, what has changed now such that the same won't happen again? If Joka wants him I wouldn't mind seeing him come back
I don't think Celta has an option to buy him and I would like to see what he can do with a full pre-season behind him.
It will also be interesting to see if Slavisa thinks that any young players (Adeniran, Edun, G Williams, etc) deserve more chances with the first team next year.
I'm going to be controversial and say I'd like an upgrade on Aluko. Tricky runner, and creates, but misses too many, and not usually requiring the goalkeeper to move (he misses the target).
I'd happily keep him as a squad player though. On his day unplayable.
Quote from: Max Headroom on May 18, 2017, 10:50:47 PM
I'm going to be controversial and say I'd like an upgrade on Aluko. Tricky runner, and creates, but misses too many, and not usually requiring the goalkeeper to move (he misses the target).
I'd happily keep him as a squad player though. On his day unplayable.
That's what I said in the op. Not controversial at all, he misses too.many chances but is too good to let go of completely. He's a great player to have for the front 3. We probably need 5 or 6 realistically and with Aluko Kebano Ayite and Sess all we need is the two top clinical strikers
Quote from: twang on May 18, 2017, 09:47:54 PM
Bettinelli - Good enough at this level and still has the potential to be better. Deserves to start the season as #1.
Fredericks - His place to lose.
NEW CB - Need a physically imposing central defender who's still decent with the ball at his feet. Probably won't come cheap.
Ream - Has won me over with his form the last couple of months. Belongs in the starting eleven if he keeps playing like that.
Malone - His place to lose.
Cairney/Jozabed - Hopefully one of them stays if the other leaves. But if both decide to leave we'll have loads of money to spend on a replacement.
McDonald - His place to lose.
Johansen - His place to lose.
Aluko - His place to lose.
NEW ST - I'm hoping for Kenneth Zohore here, exactly the type of striker we need. Will cost a lot though as he's now proven at this level.
Ayité - His place to lose.
Button - Good enough backup.
Odoi - Great squad player and not far off Fredericks either.
Sigurdsson - Would rather have Kalas here but I can't see us signing both him and a another CB for big money. Sig can still come good.
Madl - Decent enough backup.
Edun - Would be behind Sess and Odoi in the pecking order.
Adeniran - Would be behind the two below in the pecking order.
NEW DM - Need a McDonald clone here. Nir Bitton was rumoured this January and would fit the bill.
Christensen - I hope LVC is involved much more next season. We've really missed someone to rotate with in central midfield.
Kebano - Can replace either Aluko or Ayité at any time.
Woodrow - IMHO good enough to be backup at this level. But if he's deemed not to be, we'll need a another striker. Preferably a more physical one.
Sessegnon - Hopefully he'll be with us next season. But if he doesn't sign or if we get an offer we can't refuse, Piazon would be a good replacement.
So it's three main targets: a big and strong central defender, a defensive minded central midfielder and a striker with pace and power. Then it's a case of replacing/upgrading on players that are under contract and we'll receive a transfer fee for.
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 08:09:13 AM
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Or like Kodjia who's been brilliant for them. There's always an element of risk with any transfer, but this season Zohore has proven that he can be a force in this league.
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on May 19, 2017, 12:00:50 AM
Quote from: Max Headroom on May 18, 2017, 10:50:47 PM
I'm going to be controversial and say I'd like an upgrade on Aluko. Tricky runner, and creates, but misses too many, and not usually requiring the goalkeeper to move (he misses the target).
I'd happily keep him as a squad player though. On his day unplayable.
That's what I said in the op. Not controversial at all, he misses too.many chances but is too good to let go of completely. He's a great player to have for the front 3. We probably need 5 or 6 realistically and with Aluko Kebano Ayite and Sess all we need is the two top clinical strikers
But they do not need to be two TOP clinical strikers before they arrive here do they? It's while the players are here that their performances matter and our coaching staff have proven that given the right material they can cut their cloth. If we can shop wisely then we do not need to pay (and risk) big money on a no show martinesque type when an abrahamesque type may deliver better and with greater regard for the team and Club. As you and Statto have already said Fulham must keep their books in good order or else we will be asking for trouble in the future.
Quote from: Statto on May 19, 2017, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 08:22:48 AM
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 08:09:13 AM
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Or like Kodjia who's been brilliant for them. There's always an element of risk with any transfer, but this season Zohore has proven that he can be a force in this league.
Agree with AlexW132. Cannot believe so many people rate Zohore after only half a good season. The best season of his career and still only 12 goals, 1 more than Chris M****n. Kodjia was much more prolific the year before Villa signed him and had been prolific in the french top flight prior to that as well.
While I agree with you re Zhore, I am not sure that Zhore was prolific in france top flight, think he played in Ligue 2 and was loaned out to some B teams during that as well. Think he scored 30 odd in 100 odd games in Ligues 2 and below though.
Having said all of that he is a proven goalscorer in the championship over two seasons so in that contect he is far more proven than Zohore. His had an average record in scandanavia with 17 goals in 70 odd games
Quote from: toshes mate on May 19, 2017, 08:43:37 AM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on May 19, 2017, 12:00:50 AM
Quote from: Max Headroom on May 18, 2017, 10:50:47 PM
I'm going to be controversial and say I'd like an upgrade on Aluko. Tricky runner, and creates, but misses too many, and not usually requiring the goalkeeper to move (he misses the target).
I'd happily keep him as a squad player though. On his day unplayable.
That's what I said in the op. Not controversial at all, he misses too.many chances but is too good to let go of completely. He's a great player to have for the front 3. We probably need 5 or 6 realistically and with Aluko Kebano Ayite and Sess all we need is the two top clinical strikers
But they do not need to be two TOP clinical strikers before they arrive here do they? It's while the players are here that their performances matter and our coaching staff have proven that given the right material they can cut their cloth. If we can shop wisely then we do not need to pay (and risk) big money on a no show martinesque type when an abrahamesque type may deliver better and with greater regard for the team and Club. As you and Statto have already said Fulham must keep their books in good order or else we will be asking for trouble in the future.
Don't read too much into the top bit. I'm not saying I expect to sign two strikers that are going to cost a total of 20million. I just feel the attribute, stats and potential we need to be focusing on most when considering strikers is their ability to score.
I'd be happy with Tammy Abraham on loan and Gary Hooper for 5/6 million.
Quote from: Statto on May 19, 2017, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 08:22:48 AM
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 08:09:13 AM
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Or like Kodjia who's been brilliant for them. There's always an element of risk with any transfer, but this season Zohore has proven that he can be a force in this league.
Agree with AlexW132. Cannot believe so many people rate Zohore after only half a good season. The best season of his career and still only 12 goals, 1 more than Chris M****n. Kodjia was much more prolific the year before Villa signed him and had been prolific in the french top flight prior to that as well.
Kodjia 15/16: 45 appearances, 18 goals, 3 assists. Minutes per goal: 195. Minutes per point: 167.
Zohore 16/17: 29 appearances, 12 goals, 5 assists. Minutes per goal: 187. Minutes per point: 132.
And Kodjia was prolific in Ligue 2 before his move to Bristol City, not Ligue 1.
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 09:33:27 AM
Quote from: Statto on May 19, 2017, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 08:22:48 AM
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 08:09:13 AM
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Or like Kodjia who's been brilliant for them. There's always an element of risk with any transfer, but this season Zohore has proven that he can be a force in this league.
Agree with AlexW132. Cannot believe so many people rate Zohore after only half a good season. The best season of his career and still only 12 goals, 1 more than Chris M****n. Kodjia was much more prolific the year before Villa signed him and had been prolific in the french top flight prior to that as well.
Kodjia 15/16: 45 appearances, 18 goals, 3 assists. Minutes per goal: 195. Minutes per point: 167.
Zohore 16/17: 29 appearances, 12 goals, 5 assists. Minutes per goal: 187. Minutes per point: 132.
And Kodjia was prolific in Ligue 2 before his move to Bristol City, not Ligue 1.
ALso you should put Kodijas 2016/17 record up as over 2 years that shows consistency and being proven. one season or one half season doesnt really. Look at rashford Prolific last half of last season, not been too good this season, playing a different system and different roles.
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 09:33:27 AM
Quote from: Statto on May 19, 2017, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 08:22:48 AM
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 08:09:13 AM
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Or like Kodjia who's been brilliant for them. There's always an element of risk with any transfer, but this season Zohore has proven that he can be a force in this league.
Agree with AlexW132. Cannot believe so many people rate Zohore after only half a good season. The best season of his career and still only 12 goals, 1 more than Chris M****n. Kodjia was much more prolific the year before Villa signed him and had been prolific in the french top flight prior to that as well.
Kodjia 15/16: 45 appearances, 18 goals, 3 assists. Minutes per goal: 195. Minutes per point: 167.
Zohore 16/17: 29 appearances, 12 goals, 5 assists. Minutes per goal: 187. Minutes per point: 132.
And Kodjia was prolific in Ligue 2 before his move to Bristol City, not Ligue 1.
I'd call Kodjia proven given the fact he's been prolific for most of his career, whereas Zohore barely scored any goals for his clubs before Cardiff.
Quote from: westcliff white on May 19, 2017, 09:49:11 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 09:33:27 AM
Quote from: Statto on May 19, 2017, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 08:22:48 AM
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 08:09:13 AM
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Or like Kodjia who's been brilliant for them. There's always an element of risk with any transfer, but this season Zohore has proven that he can be a force in this league.
Agree with AlexW132. Cannot believe so many people rate Zohore after only half a good season. The best season of his career and still only 12 goals, 1 more than Chris M****n. Kodjia was much more prolific the year before Villa signed him and had been prolific in the french top flight prior to that as well.
Kodjia 15/16: 45 appearances, 18 goals, 3 assists. Minutes per goal: 195. Minutes per point: 167.
Zohore 16/17: 29 appearances, 12 goals, 5 assists. Minutes per goal: 187. Minutes per point: 132.
And Kodjia was prolific in Ligue 2 before his move to Bristol City, not Ligue 1.
ALso you should put Kodijas 2016/17 record up as over 2 years that shows consistency and being proven. one season or one half season doesnt really. Look at rashford Prolific last half of last season, not been too good this season, playing a different system and different roles.
I don't disagree with the fact that Kodjia is more proven NOW. But the argument made above was that Kodjia's first season in the Championship 'was much more prolific' than Zohore's.
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 09:57:38 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 09:33:27 AM
Quote from: Statto on May 19, 2017, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 08:22:48 AM
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 08:09:13 AM
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Or like Kodjia who's been brilliant for them. There's always an element of risk with any transfer, but this season Zohore has proven that he can be a force in this league.
Agree with AlexW132. Cannot believe so many people rate Zohore after only half a good season. The best season of his career and still only 12 goals, 1 more than Chris M****n. Kodjia was much more prolific the year before Villa signed him and had been prolific in the french top flight prior to that as well.
Kodjia 15/16: 45 appearances, 18 goals, 3 assists. Minutes per goal: 195. Minutes per point: 167.
Zohore 16/17: 29 appearances, 12 goals, 5 assists. Minutes per goal: 187. Minutes per point: 132.
And Kodjia was prolific in Ligue 2 before his move to Bristol City, not Ligue 1.
I'd call Kodjia proven given the fact he's been prolific for most of his career, whereas Zohore barely scored any goals for his clubs before Cardiff.
Kodjia only really had one great season before he came to England, and that was the season before he joined Bristol. Other than that, his and Zohore's goal scoring records aren't too different. Plus the fact, of course, that Zohore is 5 years younger and is only now starting to reach the potential Fiorentina saw in him back in 2012.
But once again, I'm not saying that today's Kodjia isn't a more proven goal scorer than Zohore.
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 09:58:57 AM
Quote from: westcliff white on May 19, 2017, 09:49:11 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 09:33:27 AM
Quote from: Statto on May 19, 2017, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: twang on May 19, 2017, 08:22:48 AM
Quote from: AlexW132 on May 19, 2017, 08:09:13 AM
I wouldn't call Zohore 'proven'. He's had half a good Championship season. It's like with Hogan, Villa thought they were getting a 'proven' player but actually he's been a big flop for them.
Or like Kodjia who's been brilliant for them. There's always an element of risk with any transfer, but this season Zohore has proven that he can be a force in this league.
Agree with AlexW132. Cannot believe so many people rate Zohore after only half a good season. The best season of his career and still only 12 goals, 1 more than Chris M****n. Kodjia was much more prolific the year before Villa signed him and had been prolific in the french top flight prior to that as well.
Kodjia 15/16: 45 appearances, 18 goals, 3 assists. Minutes per goal: 195. Minutes per point: 167.
Zohore 16/17: 29 appearances, 12 goals, 5 assists. Minutes per goal: 187. Minutes per point: 132.
And Kodjia was prolific in Ligue 2 before his move to Bristol City, not Ligue 1.
ALso you should put Kodijas 2016/17 record up as over 2 years that shows consistency and being proven. one season or one half season doesnt really. Look at rashford Prolific last half of last season, not been too good this season, playing a different system and different roles.
I don't disagree with the fact that Kodjia is more proven NOW. But the argument made above was that Kodjia's first season in the Championship 'was much more prolific' than Zohore's.
But he was also more prolific before coming to england. it all has ot be taken into account. I am on record as saying one seaosn for Kodija at City didnt make him prolific but he did it this season and before city so he proved me wrong. Zohore wasnt prolific before these 29 games this season, he ha sbeen great so far but it is the second season that proves it. As I say look at Rashford
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on May 19, 2017, 09:05:29 AM
Don't read too much into the top bit. I'm not saying I expect to sign two strikers that are going to cost a total of 20million. I just feel the attribute, stats and potential we need to be focusing on most when considering strikers is their ability to score.
I'd be happy with Tammy Abraham on loan and Gary Hooper for 5/6 million.
Fancy giving up driving the bus, danny?
Aluko is a problem. He's quick, skilful and is very hard to man mark. On the other hand his shooting is woeful, his distribution variable at best and his heading non existent. If the team is going to play without a recognised striker then to have one of the front men who rarely scores is a liability. He came from Hull on a free. That sums up how Fulham have slipped since Hamburg.
Get Steve Mounie in and Tammy Abraham on loan
Quote from: SuperFulham323 on May 19, 2017, 06:57:04 PM
Get Steve Mounie in and Tammy Abraham on loan
That would be great business in my opinion, and not too expensive.
Hows about Enrich again. 3rd time lucky?
Quote from: toshes mate on May 19, 2017, 10:15:21 AM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on May 19, 2017, 09:05:29 AM
Don't read too much into the top bit. I'm not saying I expect to sign two strikers that are going to cost a total of 20million. I just feel the attribute, stats and potential we need to be focusing on most when considering strikers is their ability to score.
I'd be happy with Tammy Abraham on loan and Gary Hooper for 5/6 million.
Fancy giving up driving the bus, danny?
Got a mortgage matey. What are you suggesting I do for a living lol?
