I really cant see why Fonte starts, hes bringing absolutly nothing right now. Kamara for me should be our starting Striker with Mitro the Sub. Fonte isnt on the Level and Kamara have a lot pace and strength.
Yesterday wasnt that bad, we had our chances and a Point away is always good.
COYW!
I still find it odd why people think speed and strength are superior assets than skill and brains.
I'm not trying to change people's opinion because I think they just like a player who has these assets but all i would say is look at the bigger picture.
That's what our manager has to do. Fonte is a class player who is great for the team.
Just remember. We are the 2nd highest scoring team in the league. Just 4 goals less than wolves.
Kamara and mitrovic played a whole half yesterday and we lost that half 1-0.
Cairney and Fonte would create so many chances for the rest of the team. Its frustrating they havent had a chance to get a run going .
What kamara gives us is a diffrent option. He will get better. I like him at the moment as a plan b
Fonte with the only assist of the game.
Quote from: Jonaldiniho 88 on February 11, 2018, 08:08:37 AM
Fonte with the only assist of the game.
Got that wrong mate. Piazon
Quote from: BedsFFC on February 11, 2018, 07:40:18 AM
I still find it odd why people think speed and strength are superior assets than skill and brains.
I'm not trying to change people's opinion because I think they just like a player who has these assets but all i would say is look at the bigger picture.
That's what our manager has to do. Fonte is a class player who is great for the team.
Just remember. We are the 2nd highest scoring team in the league. Just 4 goals less than wolves.
Kamara and mitrovic played a whole half yesterday and we lost that half 1-0.
Cairney and Fonte would create so many chances for the rest of the team. Its frustrating they havent had a chance to get a run going .
What kamara gives us is a diffrent option. He will get better. I like him at the moment as a plan b
Fonte is there to score goals,assist and have shots ,headers.
On this he fails miserably. Give him a chance ,How long does he want?
The aim was to get three points from yesterday's game. That is, I am guessing, the same objective as we have had at the start of every game we have played this season. We fell short yesterday primarily because an opposition player produced one sublime finish. It could be argued that we failed to dictate the game after taking an early lead and squandered a few chances along the way, but the reality of football is that on certain days stuff doesn't happen no matter how hard you try to make it do so. The lads can and will play better as they will show next game.
But please don't let us get embroiled in looking for scapegoats every time we don't achieve maximum points return.
Quote from: toshes mate on February 11, 2018, 08:28:00 AM
But please don't let us get embroiled in looking for scapegoats every time we don't achieve maximum points return.
Amen 082.gif
Quote from: ffcne on February 11, 2018, 08:18:47 AM
Quote from: BedsFFC on February 11, 2018, 07:40:18 AM
I still find it odd why people think speed and strength are superior assets than skill and brains.
I'm not trying to change people's opinion because I think they just like a player who has these assets but all i would say is look at the bigger picture.
That's what our manager has to do. Fonte is a class player who is great for the team.
Just remember. We are the 2nd highest scoring team in the league. Just 4 goals less than wolves.
Kamara and mitrovic played a whole half yesterday and we lost that half 1-0.
Cairney and Fonte would create so many chances for the rest of the team. Its frustrating they havent had a chance to get a run going .
What kamara gives us is a diffrent option. He will get better. I like him at the moment as a plan b
Fonte is there to score goals,assist and have shots ,headers.
On this he fails miserably. Give him a chance ,How long does he want?
Yes. You win. How can I possibly counter a post like that. Let him rot in the reserves
agree with toshs mate. We played quite well against a team fighting for their lives . It was abetter performance than barnsley away and if Stefans shot had gone in instead of hitting the post there would be no discussion.
With regard to Fonte. Piazon and Fonte compliment each other well and we have more control over proceedings whenthey play. kamara has done well but our team play is not quite the same when he comes on, but he does provide other individual qualities ,which dont. always fit in with the way the team is playing.
I also suspect that when Mitrovic starts starting we are more likely to see ojo on that side other than Piazon.
Quote from: toshes mate on February 11, 2018, 08:28:00 AM
The aim was to get three points from yesterday's game. That is, I am guessing, the same objective as we have had at the start of every game we have played this season. We fell short yesterday primarily because an opposition player produced one sublime finish. It could be argued that we failed to dictate the game after taking an early lead and squandered a few chances along the way, but the reality of football is that on certain days stuff doesn't happen no matter how hard you try to make it do so. The lads can and will play better as they will show next game.
But please don't let us get embroiled in looking for scapegoats every time we don't achieve maximum points return.
Message boards ,forums are all about opinions .
So you cant express your opinion?
Just because it differs from someone else.
Quote from: ffcne on February 11, 2018, 08:45:12 AM
Quote from: toshes mate on February 11, 2018, 08:28:00 AM
The aim was to get three points from yesterday's game. That is, I am guessing, the same objective as we have had at the start of every game we have played this season. We fell short yesterday primarily because an opposition player produced one sublime finish. It could be argued that we failed to dictate the game after taking an early lead and squandered a few chances along the way, but the reality of football is that on certain days stuff doesn't happen no matter how hard you try to make it do so. The lads can and will play better as they will show next game.
But please don't let us get embroiled in looking for scapegoats every time we don't achieve maximum points return.
Message boards ,forums are all about opinions .
So you cant express your opinion?
Just because it differs from someone else.
That's not quite what he's saying though mate, is it?
Quote from: VancouverWhite on February 11, 2018, 08:40:05 AM
Quote from: toshes mate on February 11, 2018, 08:28:00 AM
But please don't let us get embroiled in looking for scapegoats every time we don't achieve maximum points return.
Amen 082.gif
:54:
Fonte has been hammered on here on more than this occasion, a little unfairly he works extremely hard chases everything he can,but I have to say produces very little. My opinion is he just doesnt fit.
Some see player's and don't rate them,buts its Slav that picks them and I back his judgement!
Another Brian Ruis, skilful but lightweight.
Fonte could easily be the creator in midfield that we've missed since Cairney's injury. Shame Jokanovic hasn't given him much of a chance with another ST up top.
Quote from: VancouverWhite on February 11, 2018, 08:40:05 AM
Quote from: toshes mate on February 11, 2018, 08:28:00 AM
But please don't let us get embroiled in looking for scapegoats every time we don't achieve maximum points return.
Amen 082.gif
Correct.... besides everyone knows if there is someone to blame it's Senderos!! :)
Quote from: Facts Not Fiction on February 11, 2018, 09:37:56 AM
Fonte could easily be the creator in midfield that we've missed since Cairney's injury. Shame Jokanovic hasn't given him much of a chance with another ST up top.
Absolutely agree he is a midfielder, attributes he brings to the game would work well with Mitro up front
We're all supporting the same team and all hope for success. Some players are better than others and each of us will probably have different views about which players are the better ones.
Personally I rate Fonte as one of our top players. He has skill and vision. When he plays we look a much better side. I don't particularly enjoy watching kick and rush football with a couple of big lumps up front.
MoM yesterday was Fonte until he got taken off and after that we lost rhythm and were pegged back.
I dont say Rui Fonte is a bad Player, i just think he not made for this League. Its not only the Pace from Kamara who makes him Dangerouse. I think he made a huge step also with the ball etc. Of course Fonte has Skill and Tecninc, but he is too lightweight and didnt put the opposite Defense under pressure.
And i dont want to talk bad about him, he is a Fulham Player and i Support every Player and i think he has the heart on the right spot.
COYW!
I think each striker we have needs a different option to the side of him. Sess will most likely play every game on the LW now, so the option is on the right.
Fonte and Piazon work hand in hand in terms of technical ability. Tight, intricate play, which is very difficult to stop when up against weaker defenders.
Mitrovic and one of Kebano/Ayite, players who drift centrally very often, who would pick up his knockdown headers, and add some pace around his titan frame. Fredericks would provide the overlapping crosses into the box.
Kamara is a strange one. For someone with the pace and strength he has, he is only 5'9. How do you compliment his style? Ojo for his pace and dribbling ability? Maybe Kamara is the player we bring on with another striker, and push him out wide? He clearly has potential, its just how do we get the most out of him.
Fonte has played in 24 Championship matches , surely by now he has settled and it is wishful thinking to imagine we are going to see him improve over the remaining 15 games of the season. He has scored 3 goals and really does not look like a £9m striker.
Early days for Mitrovic but time is not on his side, I think we had best put our hopes with Kamara for the rest of the season.
If he would have scored that one on one just after our goal it would have 3 points in the bag.
Kamara showed much more than Rui yesterday.
I just think it's funny the argument is always "He's not fit for this league."...
Guess what? Our system is not even OF THIS LEAGUE. We dominate possession, our midfielders shoot more than our forwards, our center backs are built like midfielders, who can dribble from defensive third to defensive third.
Literally, no other team plays like Fulham.
So it should not be a surprise that we have players that don't play like your common Championship players.
Let that sink in.
Quote from: Matt10 on February 11, 2018, 03:24:49 PM
I just think it's funny the argument is always "He's not fit for this league."...
Guess what? Our system is not even OF THIS LEAGUE. We dominate possession, our midfielders shoot more than our forwards, our center backs are built like midfielders, who can dribble from defensive third to defensive third.
Literally, no other team plays like Fulham.
So it should not be a surprise that we have players that don't play like your common Championship players.
Let that sink in.
The thread is about our £9m striker, we needed a second goal yesterday, this guy had the chance to score and he missed. Whatever his style and our stile he does need to hit the back of the net when he gets the chance.
Quote from: bobbo on February 11, 2018, 09:30:10 AM
Fonte has been hammered on here on more than this occasion, a little unfairly he works extremely hard chases everything he can,but I have to say produces very little. My opinion is he just doesnt fit.
I agree.
However I just think he's not got the final product - whether that be a through ball, cutting run, or goal. Works hard no doubt but I almost think he goes through "the motions" when he plays rather than having any actual instinct to score. I used to do the same when I wasn't playing well in football. I'd make the run into the six yard box when there was a cross but I wouldn't have the confidence that I'd get on the end of it.
Not sure what to say really - we need to give him a few seasons and hope it all comes together but the prognosis is poor given his age.
Quote from: Matt10 on February 11, 2018, 03:24:49 PM
I just think it's funny the argument is always "He's not fit for this league."...
Guess what? Our system is not even OF THIS LEAGUE. We dominate possession, our midfielders shoot more than our forwards, our center backs are built like midfielders, who can dribble from defensive third to defensive third.
Literally, no other team plays like Fulham.
So it should not be a surprise that we have players that don't play like your common Championship players.
Let that sink in.
so the argument should be that he isn't fit for our style of play, which is just as bad is it not?
Quote from: filham on February 11, 2018, 03:43:40 PM
Quote from: Matt10 on February 11, 2018, 03:24:49 PM
I just think it's funny the argument is always "He's not fit for this league."...
Guess what? Our system is not even OF THIS LEAGUE. We dominate possession, our midfielders shoot more than our forwards, our center backs are built like midfielders, who can dribble from defensive third to defensive third.
Literally, no other team plays like Fulham.
So it should not be a surprise that we have players that don't play like your common Championship players.
Let that sink in.
The thread is about our £9m striker, we needed a second goal yesterday, this guy had the chance to score and he missed. Whatever his style and our stile he does need to hit the back of the net when he gets the chance.
It's not just about his goal scoring. If it was, then there wouldn't be any comments of "he doesn't fit in the league". The truth is he doesn't fit in the prototype of championship football system. Therefore, the argument is in fact that our type of football is not of the prototypical championship football system.
Quote from: fulhamben on February 11, 2018, 04:35:32 PM
Quote from: Matt10 on February 11, 2018, 03:24:49 PM
I just think it's funny the argument is always "He's not fit for this league."...
Guess what? Our system is not even OF THIS LEAGUE. We dominate possession, our midfielders shoot more than our forwards, our center backs are built like midfielders, who can dribble from defensive third to defensive third.
Literally, no other team plays like Fulham.
So it should not be a surprise that we have players that don't play like your common Championship players.
Let that sink in.
so the argument should be that he isn't fit for our style of play, which is just as bad is it not?
Who's play style, yours, mine or Slav's? The last one matters the most. We've been winning games with the last one's play style and decisions, so I'm not one to argue.
He did create the chance he missed by pressing a defender into an error, a one on one with the keeper, and these aren't as easy as they look.
I agree that he isn't exactly a prolific scorer, but nor are any of or strikers, though I have expectations for Kamara and Mitro.
If mitro doesn't deliver a lot of people, probably the same people will slag him off no doubt!
Centre forwards are there to score goals and he just doesn't look like doing that. Yesterday, he didn't even hold the ball up and was outmuscled by some big centre backs (as was Piazon) so it was no surprise to see them both subbed for more physical options. I just don't see what he offers really when it was clear that defenders will be far more wary of players like Kamara who are prepared to turn and run at them. Fonte needs to be braver and take more responsibility, whether passing or shooting, to make things happen than play the safe option if he wants to be remembered for anything other than a £9m flop.
Quote from: filham on February 11, 2018, 02:01:01 PM
Fonte has played in 24 Championship matches , surely by now he has settled and it is wishful thinking to imagine we are going to see him improve over the remaining 15 games of the season. He has scored 3 goals and really does not look like a £9m striker.
Early days for Mitrovic but time is not on his side, I think we had best put our hopes with Kamara for the rest of the season.
Please don't blame him for the price tag.
I think Slav tested a shift gameplan yesterday, and I think he received valuable game data. I think it's all about balance though, and the attack was physically stronger with Kamara and Mitro, but defensively we were not. Just like the other way around with Fonte and Piazon playing more like midfielders, and are sent to run up and down the pitch, their defensive dropback responsibilities are higher priority than Mitro and Kamara's are.
That doesn't mean one player is good and one player is bad, or one player doesn't fit this system and that player doesn't. It means that we have an arsenal of decisions that our coach can make at any given time. This makes us less one-dimensional and highly layered in multiple systems. It's exactly what Slav has talked about before, how he can play multiple systems and assign multiple roles within his players - and it can be modified at any point during the match. These modifications allow players to look out of position, but it creates a lot of our chances. Case and point, watch our goal we scored. Johansen deeper than Fonte, Fonte runs into space and sends a ball to Sess. Bolton clear, but because we're so far advanced, everyone crashes on the deflection and Sess finds Piazon backpost, who finds Targett of all people, for the goal.
When Mitro and Kamara entered the field of play, Bolton were now faced with that hold up center forward, but he was paired with a very mobile teammate in Kamara. I think Slav got to see the compliment here and I will not be surprised to see a mix in the lineup against Villa next weekend. I think he's seen that Piazon and Fonte are not as in-sync as they were against Burton, and that may not return. If their defensive responsibilities outweigh the need to play a hold up attack, then we'll most likely see them paired up again, or it may be time for Kamara + someone else. I personally like Kamara and his direct "at you attack" is what I would like Fonte to play like, but that's just not how Fonte is. He likes to set up teammates from advanced positions. If that doesn't make him a typical [forward/striker/winger] , then I'd say that's something Slav may see as an advantage. I think Slav uses the unpredictable nature of his system against opponents, and I'd say it's been working. We, as a team, just need to finish those chances when we have them. Fonte included.
Quote from: Matt10 on February 11, 2018, 09:40:05 PM
I think Slav tested a shift gameplan yesterday, and I think he received valuable game data. I think it's all about balance though, and the attack was physically stronger with Kamara and Mitro, but defensively we were not. Just like the other way around with Fonte and Piazon playing more like midfielders, and are sent to run up and down the pitch, their defensive dropback responsibilities are higher priority than Mitro and Kamara's are.
That doesn't mean one player is good and one player is bad, or one player doesn't fit this system and that player doesn't. It means that we have an arsenal of decisions that our coach can make at any given time. This makes us less one-dimensional and highly layered in multiple systems. It's exactly what Slav has talked about before, how he can play multiple systems and assign multiple roles within his players - and it can be modified at any point during the match. These modifications allow players to look out of position, but it creates a lot of our chances. Case and point, watch our goal we scored. Johansen deeper than Fonte, Fonte runs into space and sends a ball to Sess. Bolton clear, but because we're so far advanced, everyone crashes on the deflection and Sess finds Piazon backpost, who finds Targett of all people, for the goal.
When Mitro and Kamara entered the field of play, Bolton were now faced with that hold up center forward, but he was paired with a very mobile teammate in Kamara. I think Slav got to see the compliment here and I will not be surprised to see a mix in the lineup against Villa next weekend. I think he's seen that Piazon and Fonte are not as in-sync as they were against Burton, and that may not return. If their defensive responsibilities outweigh the need to play a hold up attack, then we'll most likely see them paired up again, or it may be time for Kamara + someone else. I personally like Kamara and his direct "at you attack" is what I would like Fonte to play like, but that's just not how Fonte is. He likes to set up teammates from advanced positions. If that doesn't make him a typical [forward/striker/winger] , then I'd say that's something Slav may see as an advantage. I think Slav uses the unpredictable nature of his system against opponents, and I'd say it's been working. We, as a team, just need to finish those chances when we have them. Fonte included.
I agree with a lot of that. Also, it seemed we were more in control and likely to score again with Piazon and Fonte out there. I'm not saying more likely that Fonte, personally, would score. But they create more chaos and opportunities.
Quote from: filham on February 11, 2018, 03:43:40 PM
Quote from: Matt10 on February 11, 2018, 03:24:49 PM
I just think it's funny the argument is always "He's not fit for this league."...
Guess what? Our system is not even OF THIS LEAGUE. We dominate possession, our midfielders shoot more than our forwards, our center backs are built like midfielders, who can dribble from defensive third to defensive third.
Literally, no other team plays like Fulham.
So it should not be a surprise that we have players that don't play like your common Championship players.
Let that sink in.
The thread is about our £9m striker, we needed a second goal yesterday, this guy had the chance to score and he missed. Whatever his style and our stile he does need to hit the back of the net when he gets the chance.
All three of our strikers missed golden opportunities yesterday, including AK and Mitro.
If they weren't producing any chances I'd be more worried.
Quote from: gang on February 11, 2018, 09:36:51 AM
Another Brian Ruis, skilful but lightweight.
His holdup play is pretty good, though? I don't think it's a physicality thing, more a confidence problem.
Quote from: Facts Not Fiction on February 11, 2018, 09:37:56 AM
Fonte could easily be the creator in midfield that we've missed since Cairney's injury. Shame Jokanovic hasn't given him much of a chance with another ST up top.
Yes JOKA is a crap manager he hasn't got a clue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:
Quote from: EJL on February 12, 2018, 05:07:27 AM
Quote from: gang on February 11, 2018, 09:36:51 AM
Another Brian Ruis, skilful but lightweight.
His holdup play is pretty good, though? I don't think it's a physicality thing, more a confidence problem.
One thing Fonte isn't is another Ruiz!
Quote from: KJS on February 12, 2018, 07:00:16 AM
Quote from: EJL on February 12, 2018, 05:07:27 AM
Quote from: gang on February 11, 2018, 09:36:51 AM
Another Brian Ruis, skilful but lightweight.
His holdup play is pretty good, though? I don't think it's a physicality thing, more a confidence problem.
One thing Fonte isn't is another Ruiz!
No not as good
Quote from: KJS on February 12, 2018, 06:59:38 AM
Quote from: Facts Not Fiction on February 11, 2018, 09:37:56 AM
Fonte could easily be the creator in midfield that we've missed since Cairney's injury. Shame Jokanovic hasn't given him much of a chance with another ST up top.
Yes JOKA is a crap manager he hasn't got a clue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:
Is that what I said?
You are talking about Fonte playing in midfield as an alternative for TC and if JOKA thought that he would no doubt implement it, after all he see's them in training everyday and as he hasn't then perhaps he disagrees with your idea.
I thought that too about Fonte dropping back into midfield BUT Norwood is playing out of his skin there currently and I don't see Fonte being an improvement actually.
TC will be back soon anyway.
I actually think TC could be reintroduced up in attack instead of Fonte. Keep Norwood in midfield. I know we tried him on the wing as part of a 4-3-3 when he first came (Pringle on the other side) but things have changed. We are more in control, wingers are less isolated, and we play a lot of our football on the edge of the area trying to get in behind. I think TC pushed into fonte's RW position would offer us a lot more creativity and also a goal threat cutting inside.
Quote from: Matt10 on February 11, 2018, 09:40:05 PM
I think Slav tested a shift gameplan yesterday, and I think he received valuable game data. I think it's all about balance though, and the attack was physically stronger with Kamara and Mitro, but defensively we were not. Just like the other way around with Fonte and Piazon playing more like midfielders, and are sent to run up and down the pitch, their defensive dropback responsibilities are higher priority than Mitro and Kamara's are.
And I think you are right. This season has been about better protecting our final third at the same time as dominating possession and creating chances as last season. That means greater reliability in team possession and less likelihood of giving the ball away too cheaply and exposing our most obvious defensive weaknesses. For my money that is why Matt Targett has subtly changed the way we play up the left flank and those small changes have impacted elsewhere as adjustments are made.
As you have eloquently stated elsewhere we are not your typical Championship team and many of our methods are pretty alien to the other twenty three involved. Piazon and Fonte are capable in possession. Mitrovic and Kamara are more dangerous on the attack. I think we will see quite a few more subtle changes or shifts to style over the next fifteen games, because the better the quality of the player the greater the range of styles becomes.
:plus one:
Quote from: Milo on February 12, 2018, 09:01:52 AM
I thought that too about Fonte dropping back into midfield BUT Norwood is playing out of his skin there currently and I don't see Fonte being an improvement actually.
TC will be back soon anyway.
I actually think TC could be reintroduced up in attack instead of Fonte. Keep Norwood in midfield. I know we tried him on the wing as part of a 4-3-3 when he first came (Pringle on the other side) but things have changed. We are more in control, wingers are less isolated, and we play a lot of our football on the edge of the area trying to get in behind. I think TC pushed into fonte's RW position would offer us a lot more creativity and also a goal threat cutting inside.
:plus one:
Quote from: Statto on February 12, 2018, 11:12:41 AM
TC out wide? I thought he joined us because Blackburn weren't letting him play in the middle, then looked bang average in his first season with us because we (initially) didn't let him play there either.
[/quoteQuote from: Statto on February 12, 2018, 11:12:41 AM
TC out wide? I thought he joined us because Blackburn weren't letting him play in the middle, then looked bang average in his first season with us because we (initially) didn't let him play there either.
Cairney looked almost ordinary when playing wide, it was obvious to most of us that his place was in the centre of midfield , the only mystery was why it took the management so long to see it.Tom was magnificent last season , just get him fit and he will again give us those magnificent performances, please don't play around with his role in the team.
No square pegs in round holes, that is a recipe for disaster, the best player in each position. Messing players around will signal failure.
Quote from: alfie on February 11, 2018, 08:22:43 PM
Quote from: filham on February 11, 2018, 02:01:01 PM
Fonte has played in 24 Championship matches , surely by now he has settled and it is wishful thinking to imagine we are going to see him improve over the remaining 15 games of the season. He has scored 3 goals and really does not look like a £9m striker.
Early days for Mitrovic but time is not on his side, I think we had best put our hopes with Kamara for the rest of the season.
Please don't blame him for the price tag.
OK the price tag is not his fault but it is difficult to ignore. At that price level we have reason to believe we have bought someone with a good record and who has been vetted by our experts and will generally perform well for us in the Championship. We are beginning to think we have been short changed.
I have considerable faith in the manager. He picks the side each week and consistently picks Fonte up front. He must believe that Fonte is our most talented central forward. I personally agree with that opinion.
Fonte is a class player who brings out the best in those around him. I don't mind the huff and puff type of forward to come on in the last minutes of a game after Fonte and Piazon have worn out the opposition but I don't want to have to watch that all game. They probably came off too early on Saturday and as a result control was lost.
Please no more players out of position. Best player for each position.
Quote from: Mullers OG on February 12, 2018, 01:05:30 PM
I have considerable faith in the manager. He picks the side each week and consistently picks Fonte up front. He must believe that Fonte is our most talented central forward. I personally agree with that opinion.
Fonte is a class player who brings out the best in those around him. I don't mind the huff and puff type of forward to come on in the last minutes of a game after Fonte and Piazon have worn out the opposition but I don't want to have to watch that all game. They probably came off too early on Saturday and as a result control was lost.
Please no more players out of position. Best player for each position.
Remind us how many goals /assists /shots /headers he has this season.
Quote from: ffcne on February 12, 2018, 01:13:23 PM
Quote from: Mullers OG on February 12, 2018, 01:05:30 PM
I have considerable faith in the manager. He picks the side each week and consistently picks Fonte up front. He must believe that Fonte is our most talented central forward. I personally agree with that opinion.
Fonte is a class player who brings out the best in those around him. I don't mind the huff and puff type of forward to come on in the last minutes of a game after Fonte and Piazon have worn out the opposition but I don't want to have to watch that all game. They probably came off too early on Saturday and as a result control was lost.
Please no more players out of position. Best player for each position.
Remind us how many goals /assists /shots /headers he has this season.
Remind he how many Cairney has had this season?
Quote from: Mullers OG on February 12, 2018, 01:05:30 PM
I have considerable faith in the manager. He picks the side each week and consistently picks Fonte up front. He must believe that Fonte is our most talented central forward. I personally agree with that opinion.
Fonte is a class player who brings out the best in those around him. I don't mind the huff and puff type of forward to come on in the last minutes of a game after Fonte and Piazon have worn out the opposition but I don't want to have to watch that all game. They probably came off too early on Saturday and as a result control was lost.
Please no more players out of position. Best player for each position.
I don't think I could agree more.
Quote from: KJS on February 12, 2018, 08:41:19 AM
You are talking about Fonte playing in midfield as an alternative for TC and if JOKA thought that he would no doubt implement it, after all he see's them in training everyday and as he hasn't then perhaps he disagrees with your idea.
I think he would've, if he had suitable options at ST.
It took Kamara time to bed in, and wasn't suited to the ST role originally. Fonte was our only option.
Quote from: Milo on February 12, 2018, 09:01:52 AM
I thought that too about Fonte dropping back into midfield BUT Norwood is playing out of his skin there currently and I don't see Fonte being an improvement actually.
TC will be back soon anyway.
I actually think TC could be reintroduced up in attack instead of Fonte. Keep Norwood in midfield. I know we tried him on the wing as part of a 4-3-3 when he first came (Pringle on the other side) but things have changed. We are more in control, wingers are less isolated, and we play a lot of our football on the edge of the area trying to get in behind. I think TC pushed into fonte's RW position would offer us a lot more creativity and also a goal threat cutting inside.
My personal midfield would be McDonald, Norwood and Cairney. Johansen is not a favourite of mine. His passing is too slow and laboured to be a creator in our midfield.
Quote from: KJS on February 12, 2018, 01:16:06 PM
Quote from: ffcne on February 12, 2018, 01:13:23 PM
Quote from: Mullers OG on February 12, 2018, 01:05:30 PM
I have considerable faith in the manager. He picks the side each week and consistently picks Fonte up front. He must believe that Fonte is our most talented central forward. I personally agree with that opinion.
Fonte is a class player who brings out the best in those around him. I don't mind the huff and puff type of forward to come on in the last minutes of a game after Fonte and Piazon have worn out the opposition but I don't want to have to watch that all game. They probably came off too early on Saturday and as a result control was lost.
Please no more players out of position. Best player for each position.
Remind us how many goals /assists /shots /headers he has this season.
Remind he how many Cairney has had this season?
Fonte signed as a forward to score goals ?? .Cairney a midfielder who has been hampered by injury all season and if fit is our most important player.
Are you really saying Fonte is more effectual than Cairney?
Fonte is ideal to shift the centre backs around, he's not a target man in a one upfront way that say Mitrovic or Kamara could be. His interplay with Piazon is good, and his runs unsettle the defenders as he drags them out of position. Yes he doesn't score enough but his movement is part of the reason we can pile on late pressure and Kamara/Mitrovic can be more effective playing against centre backs that have been moved everywhere during the game.
Kamara looked dangerous out there against Wanderers. i would start Fonte, Piazon, Kamara, and Sessegnon in attacking positions and work backwards from there. i know everyone loves Cairney but he was invisible on saturday. i worry Mitrovic doesn't have the work rate, pace or cleverness to fit into this side.
Quote from: JOND999 on February 12, 2018, 04:37:02 PM
Kamara looked dangerous out there against Wanderers. i would start Fonte, Piazon, Kamara, and Sessegnon in attacking positions and work backwards from there. i know everyone loves Cairney but he was invisible on saturday. i worry Mitrovic doesn't have the work rate, pace or cleverness to fit into this side.
Mitrovic has a high work rate. He's not match fit atm. Let's see again in a few weeks.
When fit mitro season will be over!
Having watched the highlights, both Fonte and AK missed very good chances.
Fonte had a lot of time to slot his chance away.
Pretty poor.
Quote from: toshes mate on February 12, 2018, 10:00:48 AM
Quote from: Matt10 on February 11, 2018, 09:40:05 PM
I think Slav tested a shift gameplan yesterday, and I think he received valuable game data. I think it's all about balance though, and the attack was physically stronger with Kamara and Mitro, but defensively we were not. Just like the other way around with Fonte and Piazon playing more like midfielders, and are sent to run up and down the pitch, their defensive dropback responsibilities are higher priority than Mitro and Kamara's are.
And I think you are right. This season has been about better protecting our final third at the same time as dominating possession and creating chances as last season. That means greater reliability in team possession and less likelihood of giving the ball away too cheaply and exposing our most obvious defensive weaknesses. For my money that is why Matt Targett has subtly changed the way we play up the left flank and those small changes have impacted elsewhere as adjustments are made.
As you have eloquently stated elsewhere we are not your typical Championship team and many of our methods are pretty alien to the other twenty three involved. Piazon and Fonte are capable in possession. Mitrovic and Kamara are more dangerous on the attack. I think we will see quite a few more subtle changes or shifts to style over the next fifteen games, because the better the quality of the player the greater the range of styles becomes.
Good point about Targett. That bit of difference having a left-footed leftback is significant for us. It opens up the sideline play so much more. Defenders now need to cut off an angle that a right footed LB would not threaten. This subtle change allows middle of the pitch to be an outlet again.
The fact that I just read 4 pages about Rui and no one can conclude he should be "out" tells me he should stay.
He does win penalties and has great positioning and is really effective at whatever it is he does.
Cairney and Mitrovic have played little game time, neither of them can be fully match fit, perhaps they should not be on the pitch together.
Quote from: Statto on February 12, 2018, 06:36:30 PM
Quote from: hovewhite on February 12, 2018, 05:50:12 PM
When fit mitro season will be over!
exactly my thoughts and the main reason i couldn't believe everyone else got so excited over our january transfer business. the only signing i can see making an impact is targett, and even in his case i only expect to be indirect, essentially by leaving sessegnon free to play left wing and odoi to be our backup CB
You moan at me for being negative. Even the Lord Slav was happy with the window.
Quote from: The Rock on February 13, 2018, 02:03:07 AM
The fact that I just read 4 pages about Rui and no one can conclude he should be "out" tells me he should stay.
He does win penalties and has great positioning and is really effective at whatever it is he does.
(LOL), except score goals which is what he was signed to do!!! Probably good enough to make the squad but not as a striker.
Quote from: davew on February 13, 2018, 05:05:53 PM
Quote from: The Rock on February 13, 2018, 02:03:07 AM
The fact that I just read 4 pages about Rui and no one can conclude he should be "out" tells me he should stay.
He does win penalties and has great positioning and is really effective at whatever it is he does.
(LOL), except score goals which is what he was signed to do!!! Probably good enough to make the squad but not as a striker.
I just couldn't get past the bit where LOL is put in brackets and then has a comma. Everything else paled into insignificance. It's beautiful.
Quote from: BedsFFC on February 13, 2018, 05:49:56 PM
Quote from: davew on February 13, 2018, 05:05:53 PM
Quote from: The Rock on February 13, 2018, 02:03:07 AM
The fact that I just read 4 pages about Rui and no one can conclude he should be "out" tells me he should stay.
He does win penalties and has great positioning and is really effective at whatever it is he does.
(LOL), except score goals which is what he was signed to do!!! Probably good enough to make the squad but not as a striker.
I just couldn't get past the bit where LOL is put in brackets and then has a comma. Everything else paled into insignificance. It's beautiful.
Thanks normally my grammar is immaculate! The comma was intended as a pause, shame the CAP LOCK button wasn't working while I tried to type the next part of my comment. (lol)
This is edge of the seat action. ⚽️
I have finally watched the 90 minute replay of the Bolton game with 100% focus on Rui's contribution and I cannot change my mind about what he contributes, very little!! A few deft touches here and there, makes a little space by some of his runs (all off the ball) and often seems to be in the wrong position in the box when a good ball comes into it (not very often I know)! Kamara for me in the next few matches in the starting 11 with Fonte on the bench if Kebano, Ayite, Ojo and Piazon are not all available, that is how much I rate him!!
Quote from: davew on February 13, 2018, 08:49:39 PM
I have finally watched the 90 minute replay of the Bolton game with 100% focus on Rui's contribution and I cannot change my mind about what he contributes, very little!! A few deft touches here and there, makes a little space by some of his runs (all off the ball) and often seems to be in the wrong position in the box when a good ball comes into it (not very often I know)! Kamara for me in the next few matches in the starting 11 with Fonte on the bench if Kebano, Ayite, Ojo and Piazon are not all available, that is how much I rate him!!
:plus one:
