There is a petition out to allow clubs in the top two leagues to have safe standing areas. As football supporters I believe we need to sign this (sorry if it is considered political)
I'll sign it. Stood for the whole game at the back of H6 Tuesday night which I much prefer to bobbing up and down for 90 minutes!
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable.
I will look for a link and sign, agree totally. But politicians are typically over cautious. They will see no great upside but the risk (no matter how remote) of a disaster. I just don't think either party would have the balls (excuse the unintended pun).
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040
Safe standing is normal in Germany and works well, but you do need an element of self discipline which does seem to go missing occasionally in England.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 12:07:39 AM
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable.
They are electected and can be changed at every General Election that is what qualifies them to make decisions.
Signed and lobbied local MP! Although I'd be a bit annoyed if Ipswich got it before us 064.gif
Signed and lobbied my MP
Quote from: gang on April 14, 2018, 10:58:16 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 12:07:39 AM
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable.
They are electected and can be changed at every General Election that is what qualifies them to make decisions.
Disagree, When it comes to Sport none of them are qualified whoever is in government. Anyone who believes these decisions in their hands will be democraticly decided by the elite and the establishment, have an awful lot to learn about politics.
If a politician told me night followed day, I would go and ask someone else.
Leave Football decisions to football people, not politicians they are not qualified, most are in office as it beats working for a living, and will except all the trimmings that go with it, without giving their constituents a minutes thought.
"Sports minister Tracey Crouch is ducking the facts on safe standing"
Daniel Taylor
'There is no desire among the top clubs to change,' Tracey Crouch claimed as West Brom were turned down, but the message from Old Trafford, the Emirates and all is very different
@DTguardian
Sun 15 Apr 2018 07.59 BST Last modified on Sun 15 Apr 2018 20.20 BST
Over the last week I have been reminded of the time Richard Caborn was appointed sports minister and, in his first week in the job, took part in an interview with the BBC's Clare Balding in which he was given five relatively simple questions about sporting events of the time and inadvertently showed this was not, after all, his specialist subject.
Caborn did not know Martin Johnson was captain of the British & Irish Lions rugby team that was touring Australia. He could not name a single jockey going to be at Royal Ascot or another European golfer apart from Colin Montgomerie competing in the US Open. He knew only one of the tennis players from that day's semi-finals at Queen's and when he was asked to name England's cricket coach his reply was more in hope than expectation. "The Aussie?" he asked. Close. It was Duncan Fletcher, from Zimbabwe. "I did not intend to inflict complete and utter humiliation on the newly appointed minister for sport," Balding said afterwards, "but it seems that he did that rather successfully for himself."
Headlines included: Is this The Most Stupid Sports Minister Ever? (Daily Mirror) and Are You Dumb Enough to be Sports Minister? (Daily Mail). Caborn consoled himself by keeping in his wallet a Mail article frothing with indignation about the appointment of a foreigner as England football manager, and another from the same newspaper trumpeting the rise of Sven-Goran Eriksson's team. He was, however, honest enough to accept what was blindingly obvious. "I made an absolute bollocks of it."
Not just him, either. When Helen Grant took the same position in 2013, she was in trouble from the moment an interviewer from Meridian TV asked who had won the FA Cup that year. Grant did not seem to be aware of Wigan's defeat of Manchester City. "Oh, come on – help – FA Cup holders?" She did, however, have a valiant stab at it. "Manchester United" was her answer. "Because it is my favourite club."
Grant could not name the women's Wimbledon champion or the captain of England's rugby union side. She didn't have a clue which Paralympics athlete won the most golds at London 2012 and, if she wasn't aware of Ben Watson's last-minute winner for Wigan, she was never likely to know what year Maidstone dropped out of the Football League. Except, as the Conservative MP for Maidstone, she might have been expected to have a rough idea. "Last year?" she asked, taking whispered advice from one of her press aides and complaining of "these difficult questions". Not quite. It was 1992.
It is fair to say, therefore, that the bar has not been set tremendously high over the years and, if nothing else, at least Tracey Crouch has avoided falling into the same trap as some of her predecessors. Crouch is an FA-registered coach who has worked in grassroots football and describes herself as an avid supporter of Tottenham. I cannot recall too many faux pas during her three years in office and, until the last week, there wasn't a great deal of evidence to suggest she had too much power and too little knowledge.
That was the point the issue of safe standing came on the agenda and it must have slipped her mind, perhaps, that Spurs, her own team, have designed the new White Hart Lane in the hope they can introduce the rail seats that are commonplace in mainland Europe. Presumably she wasn't aware that Richard Arnold, the managing director of Manchester United, had confirmed he was "applying constant encouragement" for safe standing at Old Trafford, that Arsenal want the same at the Emirates, that Manchester City are equally keen and, crucially, that the position on Merseyside has shifted over the last year or so. Liverpool's supporters have voted 88% in favour and the club have said they "will listen to the views of our fans and look to offer the best possible match-going experience in whatever form that may take place". Everton, in turn, have included rail seats in their plans for their new stadium at Bramley Moore dock.
All of which makes it curious, to say the least, that Crouch wants us to believe "there is no desire among the top clubs to change". Really? Chelsea have also incorporated safe standing into their plans for the new Stamford Bridge. West Brom made the formal application that has just been knocked back. Brighton, Burnley, West Ham, Crystal Palace, Huddersfield, Swansea and Watford have all publicly backed safe standing. Stoke and Southampton are privately supportive. Bournemouth say they are open-minded. Newcastle have been to see how it works at Celtic, and Leicester, perhaps, are the only club whose position is not entirely clear. They say they are keeping a watching brief.
That's the Premier League dealt with. As for the Football League, it's even more emphatic. The league was given a mandate by its 72 clubs as far back as 2013 to pursue safe standing and its stated policy is that supporters should be given a choice of whether to stand or have seated accommodation.
Nothing can happen, however, until the government wises up and, plainly, that isn't going to be straightforward when it involves cutting through a hotchpotch of stubbornness, ignorance and the now-familiar parliamentary disdain for football supporters that goes back to the Spitting Image years of Margaret Thatcher insisting on being called "Sir", Kenneth Baker morphing into a slug, Douglas Hurd talking like one of the Daleks and Colin Moynihan going by the title of Miniature of Sport.
To sum up how crackers it all is, start with the response from the Football Safety Officers' Association asking why "the government is choosing to ignore what may prove to be a safer alternative". The clue with safe standing is in the name: it's safe, and certainly less likely to cause injury than the alternative of thousands of people standing behind rows of tipped-up plastic seats. It will improve atmosphere, make English football more attractive and, in theory, lead to cheaper tickets, and if Crouch has been briefed so badly she thinks it is only a "vocal minority" who want it this way perhaps she should start paying more attention and ask around among her fellow Spurs supporters. In the last four years, the surveys carried out by the Tottenham Hotspur Supporters' Trust have shown 85 to 96% in favour of a change. Arsenal's fans have voted 96%, Everton's 92%, Leicester's 86%, Huddersfield's 96% and so on. Why would the Football Supporters' Federation spend years campaigning for it otherwise?
Add in the fact West Brom's application was submitted by the deputy chair of the FSOA and supported by the club's safety advisory group – including representatives of West Midlands police, the fire and ambulance services and the Sports Ground Safety Authority – and that's a lot of people whose combined knowledge, dare it be said, might just outweigh that of the Conservative MP for Chatham and Aylesford.
Perhaps it might make a difference when a delegation from Celtic speaks to the all-party parliamentary football group in a couple of weeks about the club's positive experiences of safe standing. Then again, I'm not so sure I would put my faith in that group, either. When Roy Hodgson was invited to Westminster before the last World Cup, one MP suggested that if he wanted to bring through younger players the Football Association should impose an age limit of 25 or under for the national team (a suggestion that would have meant keeping only nine players from the previous squad).
In the meantime, perhaps our sports minister might reflect, Sunday being the 29th anniversary of Hillsborough, that it was always a myth that standing caused that disaster. Maybe she would be decent enough to name a single club that is actively against the idea when, by my reckoning, it is possibly 92-0. Let us know how something that is acclaimed throughout the sport as a huge success in Glasgow can be illegal 120 miles south-east in Newcastle. And maybe stop to consider why so many people are starting to think that maybe it is you that is the problem now.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2018/apr/15/sports-minister-tracey-crouch-safe-standing
For those who want to sign the petition, here is the link:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/207040
My MP is Steve Pound. In case anyone is not aware, Steve is a great Fulham supporter. He replied to my email stating unequivocally that he is fully in favour of safe standing. We need to get more MPs on board like Steve.
Quote from: Twig on April 16, 2018, 02:02:11 PM
My MP is Steve Pound. In case anyone is not aware, Steve is a great Fulham supporter. He replied to my email stating unequivocally that he is fully in favour of safe standing. We need to get more MPs on board like Steve.
Pound for pound he is the ideal MP.
When the WBA application was turned down a couple of weeks ago the rationale for doing so was purely political i.e. the government's policy is for all seaters, and there is no intent to change this.
Given what else is going on in the world I can't see this issue rising to the top of the agenda, or sufficiently close to the top as to warrant parliamentary time spent discussing it, legislating for any change, etc.
Which is a shame, given there are plenty of examples out there now about how different safe standing is relative to "traditional" standing, and that it can add atmosphere to the matchday experience...
Signed the petition. It's ludicrous that away fans can do what they want and I don't see the back of the hammy being emptied out each game. I would prefer to stand but like to think I am considerate so sit unless those infront of me are standing. What annoys me is that I'd much rather stand and dont want to feel guilty for doing so. People who want to sit shouldn't be inconvenienced by those that are stood infront of them. The solution is clear. We could increase numbers, reduce prices, stop conflict and generate a better atmosphere by using common sense. I'd love to know the best supported team allowed standing compared to Bournemouth or Burton. How can it be deemed "safe" for Brentford to have 3 years to build an all seater since promotion? That's 39 home games where disaster could happen. But modern and better designed systems are way too dangerous to allow a season long trial?
A mate told me that Brentford have terracing behind one of the goals for standing. I've not been to Brentford since the days of Robert Haworth but is this true?
Quote from: cookieg on April 17, 2018, 01:44:01 PM
A mate told me that Brentford have terracing behind one of the goals for standing. I've not been to Brentford since the days of Robert Haworth but is this true?
Lower tier of the away stand
Quote from: Jonaldiniho 88 on April 16, 2018, 11:26:07 PM
Signed the petition. It's ludicrous that away fans can do what they want and I don't see the back of the hammy being emptied out each game. I would prefer to stand but like to think I am considerate so sit unless those infront of me are standing. What annoys me is that I'd much rather stand and dont want to feel guilty for doing so. People who want to sit shouldn't be inconvenienced by those that are stood infront of them. The solution is clear. We could increase numbers, reduce prices, stop conflict and generate a better atmosphere by using common sense. I'd love to know the best supported team allowed standing compared to Bournemouth or Burton. How can it be deemed "safe" for Brentford to have 3 years to build an all seater since promotion? That's 39 home games where disaster could happen. But modern and better designed systems are way too dangerous to allow a season long trial?
Spot on in every sense.
Signed 0001.jpeg
Quote from: Twig on April 17, 2018, 02:35:13 PM
Quote from: Jonaldiniho 88 on April 16, 2018, 11:26:07 PM
Signed the petition. It's ludicrous that away fans can do what they want and I don't see the back of the hammy being emptied out each game. I would prefer to stand but like to think I am considerate so sit unless those infront of me are standing. What annoys me is that I'd much rather stand and dont want to feel guilty for doing so. People who want to sit shouldn't be inconvenienced by those that are stood infront of them. The solution is clear. We could increase numbers, reduce prices, stop conflict and generate a better atmosphere by using common sense. I'd love to know the best supported team allowed standing compared to Bournemouth or Burton. How can it be deemed "safe" for Brentford to have 3 years to build an all seater since promotion? That's 39 home games where disaster could happen. But modern and better designed systems are way too dangerous to allow a season long trial?
Spot on in every sense.
Yes a good post, and while there at it, get rid of that ludicrous neutral area and make it for home supporters standing only. It's right next to the Cottage and where the players come out and go back.
Quote from: ffc2004 on April 17, 2018, 01:51:44 PM
Quote from: cookieg on April 17, 2018, 01:44:01 PM
A mate told me that Brentford have terracing behind one of the goals for standing. I've not been to Brentford since the days of Robert Haworth but is this true?
Lower tier of the away stand
Surely they should have put seats in by now, they've been in the Championship a couple of years now.
I personally have no wish to stand but that doesn't stop me being firmly in favour of safe standing. And having stood in Hamburg I felt much safer with the high rail to lean on than when people stand from their current seats.
Sign the petition. It won't happen soon but safe standing will come some day.
Quote from: cookieg on April 17, 2018, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: ffc2004 on April 17, 2018, 01:51:44 PM
Quote from: cookieg on April 17, 2018, 01:44:01 PM
A mate told me that Brentford have terracing behind one of the goals for standing. I've not been to Brentford since the days of Robert Haworth but is this true?
Lower tier of the away stand
Surely they should have put seats in by now, they've been in the Championship a couple of years now.
because they are building a new ground they were allowed the extension to the rules.
Having signed the petition in favour of safe standing areas, I have now sent e-mails to my local MP in Littlehampton, Ed Davey in Kingston who was my MP in Kingston before I moved and also to Tracey Crouch the Sports Minister. I wonder if I'll get a reply from any of them. If I do, I'll post their replies.
The Guardian
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/apr/22/hillsborough-survivor-football-safe-standing-return
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 02:43:27 PM
Quote from: gang on April 14, 2018, 10:58:16 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 12:07:39 AM
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable.
They are electected and can be changed at every General Election that is what qualifies them to make decisions.
Disagree, When it comes to Sport none of them are qualified whoever is in government. Anyone who believes these decisions in their hands will be democraticly decided by the elite and the establishment, have an awful lot to learn about politics.
If a politician told me night followed day, I would go and ask someone else.
Leave Football decisions to football people, not politicians they are not qualified, most are in office as it beats working for a living, and will except all the trimmings that go with it, without giving their constituents a minutes thought.
How the hell do you know what level of understanding they have, I have a friend who is in politics and he knows more about football than me and probably you,, perhaps you should just think a little before making statements about people you don't know.
From a conversation I had with someone a few years ago when safe standing was debated (and passed as a resolution) at a party political conference, I believe that you have a barrier in front of every row so there can not be a surge forward as happened at Hillsborough. In addition there would be a small seat of the sort sometimes seen at bus shelters behind every person so you can actually park yourself if you're feeling a bit puffed. If "safe standing" came to CC I'd be very interested.
Quote from: Andy S on April 13, 2018, 11:36:42 PM
There is a petition out to allow clubs in the top two leagues to have safe standing areas. As football supporters I believe we need to sign this (sorry if it is considered political)
r
Signed
Following up the 'what do MP's know about football debate', it should be noted that Tracey Crouch, our Sport's Minister, is a qualified FA coach, manages a team, and follows Tottenham Hotspur 'keenly'.
Now none of that makes her a specialist in 'safe' anything, since they are all things more allied to people who actually attend football matches with more than just a manageable number paying to watch. The evidence she should offer, rather than 'well nobody wants in at the top clubs', is what the safety issues are and what has happened to degrade that safety where safe standing has been used. If she cannot do that then she is being plain dictatorially dumb. All I would ask of her is 'where is your evidence?' because so far you have offered nothing.
Quote from: alfie on April 22, 2018, 09:23:07 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 02:43:27 PM
Quote from: gang on April 14, 2018, 10:58:16 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 12:07:39 AM
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable.
They are electected and can be changed at every General Election that is what qualifies them to make decisions.
Disagree, When it comes to Sport none of them are qualified whoever is in government. Anyone who believes these decisions in their hands will be democraticly decided by the elite and the establishment, have an awful lot to learn about politics.
If a politician told me night followed day, I would go and ask someone else.
Leave Football decisions to football people, not politicians they are not qualified, most are in office as it beats working for a living, and will except all the trimmings that go with it, without giving their constituents a minutes thought.
How the hell do you know what level of understanding they have, I have a friend who is in politics and he knows more about football than me and probably you,, perhaps you should just think a little before making statements about people you don't know.
and that goes for you to, what a load of Cobblers.
Wow. I must write down what you have stated and read it at night, it will work better than a sleeping tablet. The NHS could take it up to as a recognised cure.
As for Hell, my advice if you are going through Hell........just keep going.
I don't believe in political jokes, I have seen too many of them get elected.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 23, 2018, 07:08:28 AM
Quote from: alfie on April 22, 2018, 09:23:07 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 02:43:27 PM
Quote from: gang on April 14, 2018, 10:58:16 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 12:07:39 AM
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable. He
They are electected and can be changed at every General Election that is what qualifies them to make decisions.
Disagree, When it comes to Sport none of them are qualified whoever is in government. Anyone who believes these decisions in their hands will be democraticly decided by the elite and the establishment, have an awful lot to learn about politics.
If a politician told me night followed day, I would go and ask someone else.
Leave Football decisions to football people, not politicians they are not qualified, most are in office as it beats working for a living, and will except all the trimmings that go with it, without giving their constituents a minutes thought.
How the hell do you know what level of understanding they have, I have a friend who is in politics and he knows more about football than me and probably you,, perhaps you should just think a little before making statements about people you don't know.
and that goes for you to, what a load of Cobblers.
Wow. I must write down what you have stated and read it at night, it will work better than a sleeping tablet. The NHS could take it up to as a recognised cure.
As for Hell, my advice if you are going through Hell........just keep going.
I don't believe in political jokes, I have seen too many of them get elected.
Wow you are so arrogant, my friend goes to as many matches as he can he has been in and around football for 50 odd years, I guess much the same as you, but because he is a politician he does not have a view or an understanding of football matters, yet you set yourself up as an authority on all matters football, I appreciate you have a view and I do respect opinions, but to make a statement that because someone is a politician they don't understand is just wrong, or should I say cobblers.
I do get the point you are trying to make, alfie, but why not answer the point about what politicians know about safety issues between safe standing and seats i.e. evidence that safe standing is a higher risk than people jumping up and down in seats with no protective barrier in front of them.
Safety was given as the reason all seater stadia were introduce, but it was not about safety at all. It was a political command unsupported by evidence that they were the safest option. Lord Taylor did not say that standing was unsafe even with old style terracing when there was not even the concept of safe standing. That says politicians are acting as petty dictators and not concerned and caring stewards of the people they claim they represent. Now if someone disrespects me by not explaining their decision to refuse me my preferred choice as a football supporter then why should I respect them and their views? Life is a two way street not a march to the tune of political flavours of the month.
Quote from: alfie on April 23, 2018, 09:11:18 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 23, 2018, 07:08:28 AM
Quote from: alfie on April 22, 2018, 09:23:07 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 02:43:27 PM
Quote from: gang on April 14, 2018, 10:58:16 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 12:07:39 AM
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable. He
They are electected and can be changed at every General Election that is what qualifies them to make decisions.
Disagree, When it comes to Sport none of them are qualified whoever is in government. Anyone who believes these decisions in their hands will be democraticly decided by the elite and the establishment, have an awful lot to learn about politics.
If a politician told me night followed day, I would go and ask someone else.
Leave Football decisions to football people, not politicians they are not qualified, most are in office as it beats working for a living, and will except all the trimmings that go with it, without giving their constituents a minutes thought.
How the hell do you know what level of understanding they have, I have a friend who is in politics and he knows more about football than me and probably you,, perhaps you should just think a little before making statements about people you don't know.
and that goes for you to, what a load of Cobblers.
Wow. I must write down what you have stated and read it at night, it will work better than a sleeping tablet. The NHS could take it up to as a recognised cure.
As for Hell, my advice if you are going through Hell........just keep going.
I don't believe in political jokes, I have seen too many of them get elected.
Wow you are so arrogant, my friend goes to as many matches as he can he has been in and around football for 50 odd years, I guess much the same as you, but because he is a politician he does not have a view or an understanding of football matters, yet you set yourself up as an authority on all matters football, I appreciate you have a view and I do respect opinions, but to make a statement that because someone is a politician they don't understand is just wrong, or should I say cobblers.
Alfie, you can say Shoe Menders or even Northampton Town, as they are known as the Cobblers. But Cobblers is my word.
Many years ago I saw a cartoon in a newspaper showing two people fighting over a cow.
One was pulling its tail, the other was pulling it by the horns, and there was a politician underneath milking the cow.
Do you know I once threw a boomerang, and now I live in constant fear.
I personally think all seater stadia are more about control than safety. Not sure why you could not have the same control with safe standing though. Was anyone sitting at the Millwall game ?
Quote from: toshes mate on April 23, 2018, 09:39:38 AM
I do get the point you are trying to make, alfie, but why not answer the point about what politicians know about safety issues between safe standing and seats i.e. evidence that safe standing is a higher risk than people jumping up and down in seats with no protective barrier in front of them.
Safety was given as the reason all seater stadia were introduce, but it was not about safety at all. It was a political command unsupported by evidence that they were the safest option. Lord Taylor did not say that standing was unsafe even with old style terracing when there was not even the concept of safe standing. That says politicians are acting as petty dictators and not concerned and caring stewards of the people they claim they represent. Now if someone disrespects me by not explaining their decision to refuse me my preferred choice as a football supporter then why should I respect them and their views? Life is a two way street not a march to the tune of political flavours of the month.
Well said, and very articulate.
You are not only a man of the people, but you are a man for the people.
Have you ever thought about becoming a politician.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 23, 2018, 10:09:21 AM
Quote from: alfie on April 23, 2018, 09:11:18 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 23, 2018, 07:08:28 AM
Quote from: alfie on April 22, 2018, 09:23:07 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 02:43:27 PM
Quote from: gang on April 14, 2018, 10:58:16 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 12:07:39 AM
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable. He
They are electected and can be changed at every General Election that is what qualifies them to make decisions.
Disagree, When it comes to Sport none of them are qualified whoever is in government. Anyone who believes these decisions in their hands will be democraticly decided by the elite and the establishment, have an awful lot to learn about politics.
If a politician told me night followed day, I would go and ask someone else.
Leave Football decisions to football people, not politicians they are not qualified, most are in office as it beats working for a living, and will except all the trimmings that go with it, without giving their constituents a minutes thought.
How the hell do you know what level of understanding they have, I have a friend who is in politics and he knows more about football than me and probably you,, perhaps you should just think a little before making statements about people you don't know.
and that goes for you to, what a load of Cobblers.
Wow. I must write down what you have stated and read it at night, it will work better than a sleeping tablet. The NHS could take it up to as a recognised cure.
As for Hell, my advice if you are going through Hell........just keep going.
I don't believe in political jokes, I have seen too many of them get elected.
Wow you are so arrogant, my friend goes to as many matches as he can he has been in and around football for 50 odd years, I guess much the same as you, but because he is a politician he does not have a view or an understanding of football matters, yet you set yourself up as an authority on all matters football, I appreciate you have a view and I do respect opinions, but to make a statement that because someone is a politician they don't understand is just wrong, or should I say cobblers.
Alfie, you can say Shoe Menders or even Northampton Town, as they are known as the Cobblers. But Cobblers is my word.
Many years ago I saw a cartoon in a newspaper showing two people fighting over a cow.
One was pulling its tail, the other was pulling it by the horns, and there was a politician underneath milking the cow.
Do you know I once threw a boomerang, and now I live in constant fear.
Well as this was getting a bit heavy, you have responded in a way to lighten the atmosphere, that will do for me. I have come to the conclusion after spending several years in the professional game I know nothing, and that I feel is the best way to be so then I cannot be right or wrong.
Quote from: toshes mate on April 23, 2018, 09:39:38 AM
I do get the point you are trying to make, alfie, but why not answer the point about what politicians know about safety issues between safe standing and seats i.e. evidence that safe standing is a higher risk than people jumping up and down in seats with no protective barrier in front of them.
Safety was given as the reason all seater stadia were introduce, but it was not about safety at all. It was a political command unsupported by evidence that they were the safest option. Lord Taylor did not say that standing was unsafe even with old style terracing when there was not even the concept of safe standing. That says politicians are acting as petty dictators and not concerned and caring stewards of the people they claim they represent. Now if someone disrespects me by not explaining their decision to refuse me my preferred choice as a football supporter then why should I respect them and their views? Life is a two way street not a march to the tune of political flavours of the month.
My point was not about the decision on standing, it was purely about making the statement that if you are a politician you do not have an understanding, that's all, anyway I have said enough on the subject.
Quote from: alfie on April 23, 2018, 01:16:42 PM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 23, 2018, 10:09:21 AM
Quote from: alfie on April 23, 2018, 09:11:18 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 23, 2018, 07:08:28 AM
Quote from: alfie on April 22, 2018, 09:23:07 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 02:43:27 PM
Quote from: gang on April 14, 2018, 10:58:16 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 14, 2018, 12:07:39 AM
Safe standing has to be allowed, it's common sense, and more practical. Unfortunately a lot of these politicians wouldn't know the difference between a football and a snowball, and have no empathy, totally out of touch with the real world. Too busy fiddling their expenses, and staying on the gravy train.
But who are they to make decisions for us, they are neither qualified or capable. He
They are electected and can be changed at every General Election that is what qualifies them to make decisions.
Disagree, When it comes to Sport none of them are qualified whoever is in government. Anyone who believes these decisions in their hands will be democraticly decided by the elite and the establishment, have an awful lot to learn about politics.
If a politician told me night followed day, I would go and ask someone else.
Leave Football decisions to football people, not politicians they are not qualified, most are in office as it beats working for a living, and will except all the trimmings that go with it, without giving their constituents a minutes thought.
How the hell do you know what level of understanding they have, I have a friend who is in politics and he knows more about football than me and probably you,, perhaps you should just think a little before making statements about people you don't know.
and that goes for you to, what a load of Cobblers.
Wow. I must write down what you have stated and read it at night, it will work better than a sleeping tablet. The NHS could take it up to as a recognised cure.
As for Hell, my advice if you are going through Hell........just keep going.
I don't believe in political jokes, I have seen too many of them get elected.
Wow you are so arrogant, my friend goes to as many matches as he can he has been in and around football for 50 odd years, I guess much the same as you, but because he is a politician he does not have a view or an understanding of football matters, yet you set yourself up as an authority on all matters football, I appreciate you have a view and I do respect opinions, but to make a statement that because someone is a politician they don't understand is just wrong, or should I say cobblers.
Alfie, you can say Shoe Menders or even Northampton Town, as they are known as the Cobblers. But Cobblers is my word.
Many years ago I saw a cartoon in a newspaper showing two people fighting over a cow.
One was pulling its tail, the other was pulling it by the horns, and there was a politician underneath milking the cow.
Do you know I once threw a boomerang, and now I live in constant fear.
Well as this was getting a bit heavy, you have responded in a way to lighten the atmosphere, that will do for me. I have come to the conclusion after spending several years in the professional game I know nothing, and that I feel is the best way to be so then I cannot be right or wrong.
Alfie, this is no word of a lie, I have just read in a newspaper that Robots will outnumber Humans by 2048.
I was thinking that we could introduce as many as possible to be Fulham Supporters, not only would that swell the gate, the Robots would join in with the singing which would crank up the atmosphere, If they are primed correctly.
I would also imagine most of the Robots would want to support safe standing also.
Safe standing, as in Hamburg in the Europa final, is totally from different to just standing up in grounds now. If you remember, those who went, the amount of space taken up for a standing is twice the space that we have now and therefore the stadium capacity will be reduced. There was plenty of space to stand up and a safety rail in front of you to stop you falling into the next row, there was also a folding type bench seat for you to sit on if you wanted to. It's not a case of just getting rid of the seats and standing up, there's more to it than that which needs to be taken into consideration.
The petition has reached over 100,000 so it must now be considered for debate in the house.
From the parliamentary website; "Petitions which reach 100,000 signatures are almost always debated. But we may decide not to put a petition forward for debate if the issue has already been debated recently or there's a debate scheduled for the near future".
The petition has achieved its aim and safe standing will now be the subject of a parliamentary debate. PLEASE lobby your MP, let him or her know that this is a subject that many mainstream supporters feel strongly about and not just a few fanatics.
Bump
The issue of safe standing is due to be debated in parliament on June 25th. So if you feel strongly about it please lobby your MP beforehand.
