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The next man, my pick.

Started by FPT, October 06, 2015, 04:02:14 PM

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FPT

Now I realise the discussion or thought about potential successors to Kit Symons has more likely than not occurred. But anyway, here's my pick should Symons be sacked sooner rather than later - Gus Poyet. Now I tell you why:

Yes, he had a bad spell at Sunderland, but I'm sure a monkey could realise that it's more of a club issue than managerial. Martin O'Neil, Paolo Di Canio, Gus Poyet and now Dick Advocaat have failed to steer a sinking ship the other way. However, if we look at a bigger picture; Gus Poyet brought success to Brighton, utilising a 433 which saw him beat Southampton team containing Lambert, Lallana, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Fonte and Schneiderlin. Despite losing his top scorer on a free, he still managed to consolidate them as a Championship with a 10th place finish before clinching a play off spot which ended in his termination. I don't think his successes in his 6 year career can be underestimated, not only did he win the League One title with Brighton before leaving them in good shape for another play off finish the year after his own, but at the mess of Sunderland he still managed to take them to a League Cup final as well as leaving with a win percentage higher than that of Mark Hughes' tenure at Fulham.

It's the make up of that Brighton team that won League One which interests me. I feel as though our next 'manager' (I'd prefer to say coach) should be one willing to give opportunities to young players. Why should we have an academy if we are not to give them game time and opportunity to develop? When Brighton won the title, Poyet had frequent contributors in Tommy Elphick (23), Craig Noone (22), Elliott Bennett (21), Liam Bridcutt (21), Ashley Barnes (20) and Chris Wood (18). That didn't stop either as Brighton's first year in the Championship saw their most frequent started eleven contain Noone, Bridcutt and Barnes from the previous list, as well as adding 19 year old Lewis Dunk and 21 year old Will Buckley. Not only was Poyet happy to give the younger players chances to play, but he also gave debuts to Jake Forster-Caskey and the aforementioned Lewis Dunk. Gus also gave Kazenga Lua-Lua, initially 19, his first real break with three loan spells before signing him permanently in his last season at Brighton.

Poyet's favoured system was mentioned a little bit earlier, a fan of the 433, wanting to blend the Spanish possession-based game with English aggression. Poyet's Brighton side in his last season had the best defence in the division, conceding just 43 goals (which in fact, adds to Poyet's two years in the Championship with the Seagulls saw them concede less goals than our time already and we've not even touched November. Along with the best defence in the Championship in his final season, Poyet's side also boasted the 5th highest scoring side - three of the teams with more goals are Premier League sides currently - funnily, only one of his players scored more than 10 goals (11), which shows a nice spreading of the goals with 6 players hitting 7 or more. I find it somewhat important to also say that this season, when Brighton finished 4th, saw no team lose less matches than them - had they managed to win two of their draws, they'd have finished 2nd.

How does Poyet's philosophy mesh with Fulham and the current squad? Quite well I feel. We have a tonne of technically gifted footballers who suit a more possession based game. Lest we forget as well the picture proof of Mike Rigg's aim for a golden thread through the football focused around a 433. What better than to bring in a coach who has had success with the system, wants to use it and is experienced in coaching it?

Last important reasoning for me is his transfer business, even though we can presume the bulk lies with Mike Rigg, but important none the less. He signed Leonardo Ulloa for £2m, 18 months later he's sold to Leicester for £8m. He signed Will Buckley for £1m, sold for £2.5m when he took him to Sunderland with him. He took Liam Bridcutt as a kid released by Chelsea and developed him into one of the better central midfielders in the Championship, a free transfer made Brighton £3.5m. Craig Noone was bought for £250k, and sold for £1m a few years later. He also used some Spanish contacts to bring Bruno, Inigo Calderon, Vicente, Andrea Orlandi and David Lopez. Not only are Brighton still getting service from Bruno and Calderon, but other Poyet signings like Gordon Greer and Kazenga Lua-Lua.




With all the talk of hokey-cokey with Kit in or out, it had made me think the question about who does replace him? I know many will maybe have switched off at the idea of Poyet's name following his Sunderland's tenure, but when broken down, it really wasn't too bad all things considered. His career got off to a strong start at Brighton and he was one of the men on my post-Jol list. He's tasted success, he's tasted failure, he's developed young players, he's played good football, he's had the tightest defence in the division and he's only been doing this since 2009. More than at home in London and on the training pitch, the opportunity for Gus Poyet to take this Fulham squad and help it reach it's full potential could be a perfect match for both long term.

nose

Gus was my choice. we should have got him when jol was taking us backwards.
I was impressed with what he achieved at brighton and that he stayed so long.
i don't know what happened just before, during and after the play off but i was sure there was mega mis-reporting. i felt sunderland was a poor oprtion for gus, or anyone with no previous connection to the club and as such, like roy at liverpool, it was a poison chalice.

my biggest problem with gus is that i suspect 3/4 of our more vocal support are alrady against him, just as they were with laurie sanchez who was castigated as he arrived despite an impressive CV up to that point. If you do not have the full support of the crowd, you are fighting with hand behind your back. Nonetheless unless somebody comes up with a better choice...Gus has to be the man.

epsomraver

Quote from: nose on October 06, 2015, 04:15:02 PM
Gus was my choice. we should have got him when jol was taking us backwards.
I was impressed with what he achieved at brighton and that he stayed so long.
i don't know what happened just before, during and after the play off but i was sure there was mega mis-reporting. i felt sunderland was a poor oprtion for gus, or anyone with no previous connection to the club and as such, like roy at liverpool, it was a poison chalice.

my biggest problem with gus is that i suspect 3/4 of our more vocal support are alrady against him, just as they were with laurie sanchez who was castigatedNonetheless unless somebody comes up with a better choice...Gus has to be the man.  as he arrived despite an impressive CV up to that point. If you do not have the full support of the crowd, you are fighting with hand behind your back.


That is rubbish for a start, Poyet was sacked by Brighton for being underhanded and dishonest, do we need someone like him?


Lighthouse

I thought we had given youngsters a chance. If anything too much of one. Dembele and Woodrow have shown only small signs of being good enough. The others have been injured before they could really prove themselves. We sold a light weight for lots of money because we couldn't waste time in trying to get him to look up.

So what else does Poyet bring that we don't have? Not sure but we will no doubt find out one day.
The above IS NOT A LEGAL DOCUMENT. It is an opinion.

We may yet hear the horse talk.

I can stand my own despair but not others hope

PokerMatt

The man is a rotten egg.

Perhaps he had Brighton playing winning football (if somewhat dull and ponderous), but as a club I think we should keep hold of our class. Poyet doesn't suit us.

The things he said after the playoff defeat to Palace show that he's bitter and arrogant and I'd put the integrity of the club over what he'd bring.

I'm not totally convinced by his record either. Sunderland were absolutely awful under him and when Brighton didn't go up from the Championship they probably had the strongest squad in the league.
Follow me: @mattdjourno

@jolslover

Agree Frankie, Poyet would be my choice
STH H3


Rupert

Okay, I'll start the ball rolling....

Poyet out!

There, I've said it.
Any fool can criticise, condemn and complain, and most fools do.

hovewhite

Quote from: @jolslover on October 06, 2015, 04:48:23 PM
Agree Frankie, Poyet would be my choice
someone that divides opinion.when the job is available and if Gus is free,offer kits vacant seat to him.

Woolly Mammoth

Quote from: FPT on October 06, 2015, 04:02:14 PM
Now I realise the discussion or thought about potential successors to Kit Symons has more likely than not occurred. But anyway, here's my pick should Symons be sacked sooner rather than later - Gus Poyet. Now I tell you why:

Yes, he had a bad spell at Sunderland, but I'm sure a monkey could realise that it's more of a club issue than managerial. Martin O'Neil, Paolo Di Canio, Gus Poyet and now Dick Advocaat have failed to steer a sinking ship the other way. However, if we look at a bigger picture; Gus Poyet brought success to Brighton, utilising a 433 which saw him beat Southampton team containing Lambert, Lallana, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Fonte and Schneiderlin. Despite losing his top scorer on a free, he still managed to consolidate them as a Championship with a 10th place finish before clinching a play off spot which ended in his termination. I don't think his successes in his 6 year career can be underestimated, not only did he win the League One title with Brighton before leaving them in good shape for another play off finish the year after his own, but at the mess of Sunderland he still managed to take them to a League Cup final as well as leaving with a win percentage higher than that of Mark Hughes' tenure at Fulham.

It's the make up of that Brighton team that won League One which interests me. I feel as though our next 'manager' (I'd prefer to say coach) should be one willing to give opportunities to young players. Why should we have an academy if we are not to give them game time and opportunity to develop? When Brighton won the title, Poyet had frequent contributors in Tommy Elphick (23), Craig Noone (22), Elliott Bennett (21), Liam Bridcutt (21), Ashley Barnes (20) and Chris Wood (18). That didn't stop either as Brighton's first year in the Championship saw their most frequent started eleven contain Noone, Bridcutt and Barnes from the previous list, as well as adding 19 year old Lewis Dunk and 21 year old Will Buckley. Not only was Poyet happy to give the younger players chances to play, but he also gave debuts to Jake Forster-Caskey and the aforementioned Lewis Dunk. Gus also gave Kazenga Lua-Lua, initially 19, his first real break with three loan spells before signing him permanently in his last season at Brighton.

Poyet's favoured system was mentioned a little bit earlier, a fan of the 433, wanting to blend the Spanish possession-based game with English aggression. Poyet's Brighton side in his last season had the best defence in the division, conceding just 43 goals (which in fact, adds to Poyet's two years in the Championship with the Seagulls saw them concede less goals than our time already and we've not even touched November. Along with the best defence in the Championship in his final season, Poyet's side also boasted the 5th highest scoring side - three of the teams with more goals are Premier League sides currently - funnily, only one of his players scored more than 10 goals (11), which shows a nice spreading of the goals with 6 players hitting 7 or more. I find it somewhat important to also say that this season, when Brighton finished 4th, saw no team lose less matches than them - had they managed to win two of their draws, they'd have finished 2nd.

How does Poyet's philosophy mesh with Fulham and the current squad? Quite well I feel. We have a tonne of technically gifted footballers who suit a more possession based game. Lest we forget as well the picture proof of Mike Rigg's aim for a golden thread through the football focused around a 433. What better than to bring in a coach who has had success with the system, wants to use it and is experienced in coaching it?

Last important reasoning for me is his transfer business, even though we can presume the bulk lies with Mike Rigg, but important none the less. He signed Leonardo Ulloa for £2m, 18 months later he's sold to Leicester for £8m. He signed Will Buckley for £1m, sold for £2.5m when he took him to Sunderland with him. He took Liam Bridcutt as a kid released by Chelsea and developed him into one of the better central midfielders in the Championship, a free transfer made Brighton £3.5m. Craig Noone was bought for £250k, and sold for £1m a few years later. He also used some Spanish contacts to bring Bruno, Inigo Calderon, Vicente, Andrea Orlandi and David Lopez. Not only are Brighton still getting service from Bruno and Calderon, but other Poyet signings like Gordon Greer and Kazenga Lua-Lua.




With all the talk of hokey-cokey with Kit in or out, it had made me think the question about who does replace him? I know many will maybe have switched off at the idea of Poyet's name following his Sunderland's tenure, but when broken down, it really wasn't too bad all things considered. His career got off to a strong start at Brighton and he was one of the men on my post-Jol list. He's tasted success, he's tasted failure, he's developed young players, he's played good football, he's had the tightest defence in the division and he's only been doing this since 2009. More than at home in London and on the training pitch, the opportunity for Gus Poyet to take this Fulham squad and help it reach it's full potential could be a perfect match for both long term.

He isn't even close to being a candidate. Can't understand a word he says.
Its not the man in the fight, it's the fight in the man.  🐘

Never forget your Roots.