Author Topic: What is wrong at the club ?  (Read 983 times)

Offline FulhamStu

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What is wrong at the club ?
« on: November 14, 2017, 08:36:13 AM »
I keep hearing from different people who are extremely supportive and positive supporters that there are problems behind the scenes at the club.  I have heard people saying they don’t want to go into detail because they don’t want to break confidence.

We know about Kline and I have heard Tony Khan has slopped off back to America.  We have debated Jokanović, should he stay or go and the tactics, poor recruitment and bad pre-season.  We have suffered with injuries, especially to Cairney and now Johansen.

All this would be a reason why things are difficult on the pitch but people are saying there is more too it.   My question is WHAT.   Is it just unfounded rumour or something real or bigger.   My only assumption is that it is to do with the Khans.  Has Shahid had enough, clearly Tony has screwed up, but why not just be up front and say and we move on.  I know Americans don’t like to admit failure but someone needs to come out and tell us if they can.

The silence from the club is currently defening !
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 08:40:28 AM by FulhamStu »

Offline Milo

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2017, 09:27:54 AM »
Well as someone has already posted this week - it was largely obvious this was a T Khan pet project from his Dad to see how he handled a business. If he’s given up at the first hurdle then it really would be up in the air as to what’s next.

Offline Southcoastffc

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2017, 09:42:52 AM »
Some big names at the club are on thin ice at the moment so it's unsurprising that people are keeping their own counsel and, for all our sakes, let's hope that approach brings stability and improvement on and off the pitch.
Ær ic wisdom funde, ær wearð ic eald.
Before I found wisdom, I became old.


Offline Holders

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2017, 09:55:37 AM »
So Khan minor is back in America. I wonder what that means.
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Offline toshes mate

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2017, 10:21:31 AM »
As captains of ships know only too well it isn't the iceberg you can see that is the problem; it is the iceberg you don't see that does the damage.

I have always been intrigued by the hidden clues about people's wherewithal.  Body language is obvious but can be coded (e.g. theatrical) and thereby disguised.  Much more difficult to disguise are the products of unhealthiness, just as yellowing skin comes from jaundice.  At a business level it is the mistakes made in what are thought to be very low key matters i.e a public relations exercise complacently organised leading to an undesirable result, or a sleight of hand hopelessly badly executed so that the desired trick is too obvious and awkward questions are then raised.  The many indicators of carelessness or disinterest in design and execution mount up to the point where you know no one is taking responsibility.

What do we make of Fulham's recent disastrous preseason or recruitment and retention policy when measured against last season's brilliant second half if it isn't for complacency at Board level?   And if there is complacency at Board level it will spill over elsewhere.  After all why should the workers put in another season of blood and guts if the bosses are just having a load of fun on the back of last season's success and kidding themselves this is such an easy game to play?  If the senior staff don't take things seriously then why should anyone else?

For what it is worth I believe complacency at the top of the Club is killing Fulham.  It's time to throw out the deadwood and get some real fighters on board and on the Board, perhaps even some former Fulham players who really do still care.   Let the owner own but don't let him meddle beyond setting the targets he wants from his Board and having the decency to sack and replace them if they fail.  And in not meddling I include keeping his son in the States.

Online Woolly Mammoth

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2017, 11:41:33 AM »
I keep hearing from different people who are extremely supportive and positive supporters that there are problems behind the scenes at the club.  I have heard people saying they don’t want to go into detail because they don’t want to break confidence.

We know about Kline and I have heard Tony Khan has slopped off back to America.  We have debated Jokanović, should he stay or go and the tactics, poor recruitment and bad pre-season.  We have suffered with injuries, especially to Cairney and now Johansen.

All this would be a reason why things are difficult on the pitch but people are saying there is more too it.   My question is WHAT.   Is it just unfounded rumour or something real or bigger.   My only assumption is that it is to do with the Khans.  Has Shahid had enough, clearly Tony has screwed up, but why not just be up front and say and we move on.  I know Americans don’t like to admit failure but someone needs to come out and tell us if they can.

The silence from the club is currently defening !

I cannot see how Shahid Khan has had enough, he is never at the club long enough to have had enough.
This is a consequence of having an absent Chairman who apart from his disinterest, clearly hasn’t a clue what’s going on, only what his son wants him to know, so another Khan Senior error of judgement to add to the growing list.
That’s what happens when the Chairman does not take any interest and relies on others to feed him back information, and he wonders why there is trouble at Mill.
Let’s hope Khan Junior stays back where he came from, and has taken his hidden agendas with him.
We need professional football people running this club, not the Marx Brothers.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 01:39:47 PM by Woolly Mammoth »
Its not the man in the fight, it's the fight in the man.  🐘


Offline FulhamStu

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2017, 11:46:10 AM »
As captains of ships know only too well it isn't the iceberg you can see that is the problem; it is the iceberg you don't see that does the damage.

I have always been intrigued by the hidden clues about people's wherewithal.  Body language is obvious but can be coded (e.g. theatrical) and thereby disguised.  Much more difficult to disguise are the products of unhealthiness, just as yellowing skin comes from jaundice.  At a business level it is the mistakes made in what are thought to be very low key matters i.e a public relations exercise complacently organised leading to an undesirable result, or a sleight of hand hopelessly badly executed so that the desired trick is too obvious and awkward questions are then raised.  The many indicators of carelessness or disinterest in design and execution mount up to the point where you know no one is taking responsibility.

What do we make of Fulham's recent disastrous preseason or recruitment and retention policy when measured against last season's brilliant second half if it isn't for complacency at Board level?   And if there is complacency at Board level it will spill over elsewhere.  After all why should the workers put in another season of blood and guts if the bosses are just having a load of fun on the back of last season's success and kidding themselves this is such an easy game to play?  If the senior staff don't take things seriously then why should anyone else?

For what it is worth I believe complacency at the top of the Club is killing Fulham.  It's time to throw out the deadwood and get some real fighters on board and on the Board, perhaps even some former Fulham players who really do still care.   Let the owner own but don't let him meddle beyond setting the targets he wants from his Board and having the decency to sack and replace them if they fail.  And in not meddling I include keeping his son in the States.

I posted the other day, I think the title was who is in charge ?   It did create a bit of discussion but no actual real knowledge.   A question, does Tony Khan report to Ali Mac or his Dad ?  I got no answer.  Clearly Shahid is the owner and man at the top, but we all know that whilst he takes an interest and will be the person making the big decisions like for instance regarding the Riverside stand, who has he delegated the day to day running of the club.   My understanding is Tony Khan on all footballing matters, which I assume includes Jokanović and Ali Mac 9n everything else.  This is I assume why Ali Mac continues to survive.   

If I am correct, then it should be Tony Khans job to support or otherwise The head coach.  But if Tony Khan has run away, where does that leave us.

Leadership is about many things and one of the main ones is fronting up and communicating to maintain and gain support and buy in.  Tony Khan needs to do something, be it give some encouraging or even motivating messages or bugger off properly and resign.  I don’t understand why all the focus is on Jokanovic when it’s Tony Khans job to manage Kline, Talbot and Jokanović.  Yes he is the owners son hence my previous comment about the Khans maybe are the problem, but equally why does Tony not come under more pressure from his supporters, fans and customers and why are we not calling on him to answer some bloody important questions ?

Offline RaySmith

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2017, 12:34:27 PM »
It doesn't seem good to put, completely inexperienced, family members in charge of a professional English football club.

Offline ffcthereligion

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2017, 12:46:55 PM »
Increasingly in football we are hearing that when the team is not performing to its maximum the board are somehow to blame and should go as well as pointing the finger at the manager and players. Whilst there may be one or two plausible criticisms, the fact of the matter is, as eluded to in the OP, none of us have a clue whats going on behind the scenes and anyone that claims to have a clue is peddling hearsay. There is no mention of the board when the team were winning!


Offline Statto

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2017, 01:19:02 PM »
I don’t have any inside info but just look at what’s already in the public domain:

- The team hasn’t performed more poorly at any point in the last 20yrs so the manager is under pressure

- The manager has repeatedly expressed utter contempt for the current scouting and recruitment process and the man at the centre of it

- That man happens to be the chairman’s son’s college buddy

- The chairman has just sacked his son’s college buddy in such acrimonious circumstances that police were called

- The chairman’s son, who is also our DoF, has been humiliated and gone AWOL

- How Teflon Mackintosh has survived the last 4 yrs I’ll never know

Isn’t that enough turmoil for you already? Not sure how it could be much worse tbh

Offline toshes mate

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2017, 07:00:28 PM »
To put something right you really do have to find out what really is wrong and I do not believe any of us know enough about of the inner workings of FFC to actually begin to solve the puzzle. All I'd repeat is that there is something seriously wrong in the way the Club is set up.

I think Statto's last line sums it up at this moment in time.

The one point of optimism is that SJ can fire the beast up as he did last time around and I am hoping the players, as a unit, want that too.  All we need is for one of the newbies to actually turn up for a game and play the match of his life because that can be so infectious. 

Offline Wearethewhites

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2017, 07:04:28 PM »
Simple answer. Inexperienced owners trying to throw their hand at English football, and failing miserably.

Why? Kahn Snr trusting in inexperienced people around him, including Tony, to run his investment. Always said, you need good footballing people up top, sometimes people who have the Clubs best interests at heart.

Why? Tony for allowing Kline to have to much freedom up top, most likely peeing people off, sticking his nose in where it wasn't wanted. Went on for far to long, and the damage is now most likely irreversible. 

Why? Tony & Kline trying to enforce 'their' stats model on a sport, league they know nothing about, but, at the same time, completely ignoring those with experience around them. 

I could go on, but I won't. 


Offline sunburywhite

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2017, 07:24:53 PM »
I don’t have any inside info but just look at what’s already in the public domain:

- The team hasn’t performed more poorly at any point in the last 20yrs so the manager is under pressure

- The manager has repeatedly expressed utter contempt for the current scouting and recruitment process and the man at the centre of it

- That man happens to be the chairman’s son’s college buddy

- The chairman has just sacked his son’s college buddy in such acrimonious circumstances that police were called

- The chairman’s son, who is also our DoF, has been humiliated and gone AWOL

- How Teflon Mackintosh has survived the last 4 yrs I’ll never know

Isn’t that enough turmoil for you already? Not sure how it could be much worse tbh

You could be supporting Sunderland
Remember you are braver than you believe, stronger than you seem, and smarter than you think.
I will be as good as I can be and when I cross the finishing line I will see what it got me

Offline Chutney

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2017, 10:54:22 AM »
Tony Khan happened.
C O Y W

Offline toshes mate

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Re: What is wrong at the club ?
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2017, 11:22:38 AM »
Tony Khan happened.
But he was around before our skirmish with promotion last season and that becomes, for me, the change that altered the course of the good ship Fulham.  Without that near miss consider the questions we would be asking about the head coach, the recruitment team and policy, the owners' politics, the CEO's suitability, and so on.  But it happened and the only people who kept their heads in more ways than one were SJ, his squad and his staff.  We know he was displeased about losing Aluko and Malone, two of the craziest decisions ever made at Craven Cottage considering the impact both had over the last six months of last season.  Success went to the heads of the recruitment team with their 'easy to pick winners' stats system which had simply got lucky with a coaching team who found a dozen or so players in the squad who could handle Championship winning by playing football that was, at times, breathtaking.  SJ's one missing link was a decent goal scoring forward but Martin was, even at less than one hundred percent, enough.  SJ indicated on so many occasions what he needed but Khan Jnr and Kline were already into victory inspired obsessive-compulsive mode, and had to indulge their own fantasy.

Football is hard work and it never stops for successful coaches.  Khan Jnr, Kline, and company need to wise up as to how much effort coaches need to put into making their often stupid choices work in reality.   The algorithm they are missing doesn't have any equivalent in computer programming because it is called common sense.  Computers can add fast but they do not have any sense.