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Rui Fonte

Started by LiveByTheRiver, November 18, 2017, 09:06:13 PM

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davew

Quote from: Matt10 on November 22, 2017, 10:59:42 PM
Quote from: davew on November 22, 2017, 10:02:51 AM
Matt10 if you are of the opinion that Fonte is good enough to play for us, then I sincerely hope you don't apply to join our stats team should another vacancy arise! Now where is that thread on Fulham's all time worst signings, Fonte would definitely be on mine and I have followed the club for over 60 years!!

Yeah, he's good enough. It's easy for you to say he's not because he hasn't done anything, so naturally me being on his side is going to ruffle some feathers. I think it's been proven in Fulham's history that there are players that just aren't given enough time. We still have a lot of season left, and with Ayite out, I expect Fonte's versatility to stand out in either a striker role or winger. Fonte striker or winger (lol), yeah we need a good winger, Fonte's pace is awesome (lol).

Also, noone has corrected the poster, but Fonte didn't send that pass up to Sess, it was Norwood. Maybe watching these videos actually does help :)
No Matt, he isn't m8!! Versatility, what versatility???? Are you saying he can play in many positions, well he can't play as a striker which is what he was signed for and to my knowledge he hasn't made many assists, or has he? He doesn't tackle people and is too lightweight, maybe I need another visit to Specsavers, which in the UK is a top opticians service. Fonte make an assist yesterday (lol), our players yesterday seemed to prefer playing the ball to the opponents than Fonte, I hope he shows more b4 the transfer window otherwise he must be put up for sale/free transfer in the January window with Kline having to pay FFC compensation!!
Grandson of a Former Director of FFC (served 1954 - 1968)

Matt10

Quote from: davew on November 22, 2017, 11:03:07 PM
Quote from: colinwhite on November 22, 2017, 06:31:38 PM
Wouls like to have seen Fonte score a few goals which he hasat,but think it would be a mistake to right him off yet as he is a very skillful player.
Hate to be controversial, but having just watched the 90 minute replay, what skills did he display?? He went missing for most of the 1/2 hour he was on, something he has managed for longer periods before when selected and then usually been substituted!! The rest of the team seem reluctant to pass the ball to him and after what I have seen so far this season, I don't blame them!!! Cairney did pass the ball to him twice, so Fonte could take a throw in, both of them were bordering foul throws!! There is no way he should be in our squad!!!!!!! Maybe the reason we have performed so badly this season is that our best players (when fit) despair at some of the team selections, I know I do!!!

If you watched the match then you would see our tactics changed significantly. Fonte played deeper defensively so Cairney can get on the loose passes and also Fredericks could try to stay goal-side. Fonte's role in the match was not to have the ball at all times. It was to play defense and set up outlets going forward. Having him and AK47 also lessened the chance of their CB from getting forward to overload the left side of the pitch.

I know your mind is made up and all, and there's no changing it, but using Fonte as a scapegoat for this match is out of context and has no validity to compare seeing as we were desperately trying to defend, and find outlets from their numbers being built.

Matt10

Quote from: davew on November 22, 2017, 11:08:56 PM
Quote from: Matt10 on November 22, 2017, 10:59:42 PM
Quote from: davew on November 22, 2017, 10:02:51 AM
Matt10 if you are of the opinion that Fonte is good enough to play for us, then I sincerely hope you don't apply to join our stats team should another vacancy arise! Now where is that thread on Fulham's all time worst signings, Fonte would definitely be on mine and I have followed the club for over 60 years!!

Yeah, he's good enough. It's easy for you to say he's not because he hasn't done anything, so naturally me being on his side is going to ruffle some feathers. I think it's been proven in Fulham's history that there are players that just aren't given enough time. We still have a lot of season left, and with Ayite out, I expect Fonte's versatility to stand out in either a striker role or winger. Fonte striker or winger (lol), yeah we need a good winger, Fonte's pace is awesome (lol).

Also, noone has corrected the poster, but Fonte didn't send that pass up to Sess, it was Norwood. Maybe watching these videos actually does help :)
No Matt, he isn't m8!! Versatility, what versatility???? Are you saying he can play in many positions, well he can't play as a striker which is what he was signed for and to my knowledge he hasn't made many assists, or has he? He doesn't tackle people and is too lightweight, maybe I need another visit to Specsavers, which in the UK is a top opticians service. Fonte make an assist yesterday (lol), our players yesterday seemed to prefer playing the ball to the opponents than Fonte, I hope he shows more b4 the transfer window otherwise he must be put up for sale/free transfer in the January window with Kline having to pay FFC compensation!!

And Tim Ream was a LB, so was Sess, and Odoi was an RB. What are you trying to prove? Fonte is a team player, he will play anywhere the coach puts him. Ayite is the same, and has reaped the benefits.

Like I said, there's no point arguing with you as your mind is made up. Follow that bandwagon of constantly singling out players to validate where we are. It's collective when we lose and it's collective when we win. I've already shown you video, in detail, on what opportunities have been missed and created with Fonte. I've also admitted that he needs to modify something with his runs off the ball in the striker position. I personally would prefer he play the same role as Ayite as they are more similar, like I've already said.


davew

Don't wish to enter an argument, not like me!! Where was I using Fonte as a scapegoat, we won didn't we?? My own analysis is that when he is in the team he doesn't offer very much and our best players know that!! The fact that he is playing out of position so I keep reading I really don't understand any more than what his best position is? I imagined or read somewhere he was signed as a striker, what was it 7, 8 or 9million (lol), in 13 appearances he hasn't once struck me as somebody who could be classed as a striker! Chris Martin took the biscuit for that role.
Grandson of a Former Director of FFC (served 1954 - 1968)

Matt10

Quote from: davew on November 22, 2017, 11:17:54 PM
Don't wish to enter an argument, not like me!! Where was I using Fonte as a scapegoat, we won didn't we?? My own analysis is that when he is in the team he doesn't offer very much and our best players know that!! The fact that he is playing out of position so I keep reading I really don't understand any more than what his best position is? I imagined or read somewhere he was signed as a striker, what was it 7, 8 or 9million (lol), in 13 appearances he hasn't once struck me as somebody who could be classed as a striker! Chris Martin took the biscuit for that role.

Yes, I believe he signed on as a striker. As you know in Slav's realm, that means you could be playing Center Mid. Who knows? Like I also said, he needs to modify the types of runs he makes because he's not being found. I don't think its' something as petty as our best players don't like the guy. I think it's more so that 1. We have played very conservative up until the Derby match and 2. Rui's runs are timed too early, and is not quite in-sync with the nature of the likes of Fredericks. These are things they need to work through. These are things in which they had been in-sync with before the drought we went on.

Lastly, why not just give up on the guy when he actually does get those chances and skies them into Row Z? Also why not just give the guy credit for the chances he created inadvertently, which I also highlighted in my video.

I say give him more time, more chances and let his confidence grow. Ojo proved me wrong, maybe Fonte will do the same for yourself and others. We will see. 

davew

Matt10, I have just been analysing your posts since you joined the forum and many seem to be in defence of our questionable signings by a certain Mr Kline, that isn't you in disguise is it?? (Only joking), have a nice day!!
Grandson of a Former Director of FFC (served 1954 - 1968)


Matt10

Quote from: davew on November 22, 2017, 11:46:23 PM
Matt10, I have just been analysing your posts since you joined the forum and many seem to be in defence of our questionable signings by a certain Mr Kline, that isn't you in disguise is it?? (Only joking), have a nice day!!

Haha, you caught me! :)

Naw, I have been watching Fonte for a while now, and was excited when he joined. He's had to play completely different role here, and admittedly Fulham play differently than most of the clubs I've seen him play for. I honestly think he will benefit from much more direct play and just give him the ball as much as possible. Like any forward, he needs his touches to get his confidence in check. Like I said though, he has to modify something about his game to be more presentable as an option to pass to.

toshes mate

There's a lot of guesswork going on about the instructions given to Fonte before he came on Tuesday night.  I haven't watched the whole match yet but I have a feeling the tactic at 5-2 was to stem the flow of aggression from our opponents because the lead wasn't having the desired effect.  That may have been down to having a free flowing and open game one day earlier than our opponents who played Friday night.  We also had the added problem of travelling.  Our midfield always has a lot of work to do and I'd suggest that poor scheduling of matches does influence what happens on the pitch when you do not have options to rotate players without losing tenacity.

Although I believe Fonte is struggling to find his true place in the side, i.e. whatever it was that Kline wanted Slav to use him for, but I still say it is too early to write him off. 

I'd also ask a serious question about who made the decision to loan Woodrow out - is that made by the recruitment team or does Slav have a veto?  I very much doubt the latter since he didn't have a veto over Aluko and Malone.....   

As I say so much guesswork going on.

toshes mate

Quote from: Statto on November 23, 2017, 08:36:42 AM
In almost 2 yrs at Fulham, I think Slav has only once named Woodrow in a league match starting XI. I don't think Slav rated him at all. 
The point is that for most of the time SJ has been at Fulham Woodrow has been out on loan. That means not training at Motspur Park with those who would be his team mates for starters.  We already know that Kline and the recruitment team as a whole had and perhaps still have a big influence over who should be played by SJ for whatever reasons.  As I say it is all guesswork.  Players all have their seasons when they hit their best and mostly it is all down to chance.  I don't think Woodrow has hit any kind of impressive form anywhere he has gone but that is not to say he cannot achieve it.  Sometimes you just need a mentor who pushes the right buttons often by chance and perhaps that is true of Fonte too.


MJG

Quote from: Statto on November 23, 2017, 11:04:38 AM
Quote from: toshes mate on November 23, 2017, 09:43:43 AM
Quote from: Statto on November 23, 2017, 08:36:42 AM
In almost 2 yrs at Fulham, I think Slav has only once named Woodrow in a league match starting XI. I don't think Slav rated him at all. 
The point is that for most of the time SJ has been at Fulham Woodrow has been out on loan. That means not training at Motspur Park with those who would be his team mates for starters.  We already know that Kline and the recruitment team as a whole had and perhaps still have a big influence over who should be played by SJ for whatever reasons.  As I say it is all guesswork.  Players all have their seasons when they hit their best and mostly it is all down to chance.  I don't think Woodrow has hit any kind of impressive form anywhere he has gone but that is not to say he cannot achieve it.  Sometimes you just need a mentor who pushes the right buttons often by chance and perhaps that is true of Fonte too.

There were 13 months between Jokanovic taking over and Woodrow going out on loan, then he also had this summer to work with him, through the first few games of this season. I do not disagree with you about Kline's influence generally, but specifically in relation to Woodrow I don't think it makes much difference because the manager has shown no desire to use him.
would it surprise you to say it's actually the opposite to the previous poster? . The 'club' rate Woodrow, hence his new contracts and extensions and it's Slav who doesn't? It's the 'club' as such that is in charge of those deals not Slav.
Just the views of a long term fan

MJG

Quote from: Statto on November 23, 2017, 08:36:42 AM
Quote from: toshes mate on November 23, 2017, 08:24:10 AM
I'd also ask a serious question about who made the decision to loan Woodrow out - is that made by the recruitment team or does Slav have a veto?  I very much doubt the latter since he didn't have a veto over Aluko and Malone.....   

With Aluko, Slav came out and said he didn't want him to leave, but what makes you think he didn't want Woodrow to go and would have vetoed that move if he could? In almost 2 yrs at Fulham, I think Slav has only once named Woodrow in a league match starting XI. I don't think Slav rated him at all.
can I just say that the Aluko quite was don't at a time when hardly any signings had been made. And even I agreed with him there. But as more players  came in I did not see any new quotes from Slav.
Now I'm not sayin he didn't want him to stay, but his quite should be seen in the context it was said.
Just the views of a long term fan

Woolly Mammoth

#71
Quote from: MJG on November 23, 2017, 11:37:24 AM
Quote from: Statto on November 23, 2017, 11:04:38 AM
Quote from: toshes mate on November 23, 2017, 09:43:43 AM
Quote from: Statto on November 23, 2017, 08:36:42 AM
In almost 2 yrs at Fulham, I think Slav has only once named Woodrow in a league match starting XI. I don't think Slav rated him at all. 
The point is that for most of the time SJ has been at Fulham Woodrow has been out on loan. That means not training at Motspur Park with those who would be his team mates for starters.  We already know that Kline and the recruitment team as a whole had and perhaps still have a big influence over who should be played by SJ for whatever reasons.  As I say it is all guesswork.  Players all have their seasons when they hit their best and mostly it is all down to chance.  I don't think Woodrow has hit any kind of impressive form anywhere he has gone but that is not to say he cannot achieve it.  Sometimes you just need a mentor who pushes the right buttons often by chance and perhaps that is true of Fonte too.

There were 13 months between Jokanovic taking over and Woodrow going out on loan, then he also had this summer to work with him, through the first few games of this season. I do not disagree with you about Kline's influence generally, but specifically in relation to Woodrow I don't think it makes much difference because the manager has shown no desire to use him.
would it surprise you to say it's actually the opposite to the previous poster? . The 'club' rate Woodrow, hence his new contracts and extensions and it's Slav who doesn't? It's the 'club' as such that is in charge of those deals not Slav.

Yes, I agree with your analogy and that makes sense and explains a quite a lot.
I wonder what the overal relationship is between Jok and the club, is it a healthy one. Or is it slightly strained. I know it's impossible to agree all the time, but I just wondered if there was a big enough difference of opinion to cause alarm.
Its not the man in the fight, it's the fight in the man.  🐘

Never forget your Roots.


toshes mate

Quote from: MJG on November 23, 2017, 11:37:24 AM
would it surprise you to say it's actually the opposite to the previous poster? . The 'club' rate Woodrow, hence his new contracts and extensions and it's Slav who doesn't? It's the 'club' as such that is in charge of those deals not Slav.
But the power of the Kline/Recruitment Team veto affects and applies to all matters concerning recruitment and retention, which rather negates what SJ may think or feel about who is in his 'available' squad - period.  None of us actually know how deep that veto runs in the Club's culture, as the sales and/or failed recruitment of many a player demonstrates.  The application of such an argument to Woodrow is an irrelevance.

We Are Premier League

With Braga winning their Europa League group, perhaps they could repurchase their star in January...could be the man to bring home a European title for them :)

peaty

Quote from: mlangstrom on November 24, 2017, 01:33:56 PM
With Braga winning their Europa League group, perhaps they could repurchase their star in January...could be the man to bring home a European title for them :)

:005:


Woolly Mammoth

Quote from: peaty on November 25, 2017, 03:25:24 AM
Quote from: mlangstrom on November 24, 2017, 01:33:56 PM
With Braga winning their Europa League group, perhaps they could repurchase their star in January...could be the man to bring home a European title for them :)

:005:

I shall drive him to the airport, although I suspect I will have to join the queue.
Its not the man in the fight, it's the fight in the man.  🐘

Never forget your Roots.

Jims Dentist

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on November 25, 2017, 12:51:41 PM
Quote from: peaty on November 25, 2017, 03:25:24 AM
Quote from: mlangstrom on November 24, 2017, 01:33:56 PM
With Braga winning their Europa League group, perhaps they could repurchase their star in January...could be the man to bring home a European title for them :)
[/quot

:005:

I shall drive him to the airport, although I suspect I will have to join the queue.
Yeh and I'll chip in with the air fare.

WayneKerrins

Quote from: WayneKerrins on November 18, 2017, 11:13:47 PM
Not fit for purpose in this League or in our preferred system.

Normally would say that a statement like that is a matter of opinion but in this case it's as plain a a pikestaff.

A month on the pikestaff is getting longer and the video evidence scarcer..


SP

Just back & read the ongoing criticism of Rui Fonte on the match day thread.  Having watched him today, I think he is starting to adapt to the physical challenges of the Championship.  Still a way to go. His off the ball work went largely unproductive today which is a shame given the diagonal runs he was making.  Still time to come good hopefully.

Baszab

Fonte made a couple of tackles when tracking back........so what ?
He was useless

I saw KMac looking pretty underwhelmed when the Kamara/Fonte substitution was made