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Why O why

Started by Andy S, April 23, 2018, 02:18:20 PM

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Andy S

We all knock Cardiff for the way they play the long ball. We used to knock Wimbledon. Wattford went up a few years ago playing the long ball game as graham Taylor had worked it all out on percentage football. I.e. Every 20 times the ball is launched into the box it will result in a goal. Some Teams play pretty football and when it goes wrong 10 minutes from time they put a big man up front and launch the balls into the box. This is not a tactic I have seen at the cottage in recent times but it seems to work. My question is if it is so successful why don't more clubs play this kind of football for 90 minutes?

MJG

Quote from: Andy S on April 23, 2018, 02:18:20 PM
We all knock Cardiff for the way they play the long ball. We used to knock Wimbledon. Wattford went up a few years ago playing the long ball game as graham Taylor had worked it all out on percentage football. I.e. Every 20 times the ball is launched into the box it will result in a goal. Some Teams play pretty football and when it goes wrong 10 minutes from time they put a big man up front and launch the balls into the box. This is not a tactic I have seen at the cottage in recent times but it seems to work. My question is if it is so successful why don't more clubs play this kind of football for 90 minutes?
because it isn't so successful. Its percentage football that over time throws up the odd team (or manager) here and there who is a success, but overall teams that play 'normal' football do better.
For every one team you mention there are ten others maybe who don't play like that and did well.
Just the views of a long term fan

Andy S

So why do so many teams become a success from 10 minutes of long balls into the box. Don't get me wrong I'm no advocate of the long ball game. I am delighted that we have always tried to play football


MJG

Quote from: Andy S on April 23, 2018, 03:47:47 PM
So why do so many teams become a success from 10 minutes of long balls into the box. Don't get me wrong I'm no advocate of the long ball game. I am delighted that we have always tried to play football
Panic stations. Get ball in quick and stop wasting time.
It's also usually when a game has one goal in it.

How times have we heard it over last three years under Slav... Throw the ball in, get Smith on... Etc etc.

He's stick to his principles and we get late goals as we wear teams down.
You remember the Kate goals from the long ball tactic..... But how many times in reality does it work?
As I say, percentage football.
Just the views of a long term fan

bog

There was an old fool in the FA years ago. His name was Charles Hughes and he was in charge of coaching. His teaching was POMO. Principle of maximum opportunity. His way of playing was to hit long balls into the opponent's area as often as possible and by the law of averages eventually you must score. As far as I am concerned that is crap. I would rather watch Knickerless clueless Clegg receive his knighthood. I wonder what Pep would make of POMO.... 

Thank you and good night

092.gif


Carborundum

I'm not sure things are completely black and white.  Odoi's late equaliser against Preston looked an awful lot like panic stations football to me.  Very enjoyable it was too as it turned out.  Not everyone on this forum is knocking Cardiff either.  It's difficult to win football matches and anyone who wins more than they lose commands a degree of respect. 

I've had plenty of entertainment this season and am very happy with the way we play.  But in all honesty there are times when Ream McDonald Odoi, Bettinelli and Cairney are triangling to their hearts content in our own half when I think being more direct would help alleviate pressure.

The very best teams can do it all and keep the opposition guessing.


Lighthouse

Few would knock Cardiff for their success. But the type of football is not very entertaining to watch week in and week out. Which is why their manager has such a long list of clubs he has been with. Plus the fact to play that physical up and at them type of football requires a certain type of group of players. When it works it is fine but like Wimbledon before them, once they are found out or don't play to the best of their ability the fall is quick and painful.

Many goals will be scored late on and in injury time. Tiredness and panic as well as the bombardment football can all be mentioned as reasons why this happens. But the bottom line is who would the average fan prefer to watch. Cardiff are one of a few clubs in a small Country. They have tradition. Yet without success their type of football would not have fans flocking to watch them.
The above IS NOT A LEGAL DOCUMENT. It is an opinion.

We may yet hear the horse talk.

I can stand my own despair but not others hope

PutneyPhil

I believe statistically the best indicator of the likelihood of winning a game is % of possession in the final third. Long balls are in effect a 50:50 whereas keeping possession while going forward - errrr rather like Fulham - pays back best over time.

Steven Ageroad

Just listening to Talksport, Adrian Durham(don't like the guy),but he mentioned Fulham's win over Millwall and how well we played and said although he has nothing against Warnock he hoped Fulham got the second automatic spot because he would like to watch Fulham play that sort of football in the Premier League.
Enough said.


filham

Some years ago an analysis of goals showed in top  showed that the majority of goals came from long balls or early crosses rather than a lot of short clever passes, I think this is still the case and teams should be prepared to mix a few long balls in with their short passing games. Of course you have to have the right man up front and there are not n not many of those available nowadays.

colinwhite

The stats men were in their glory in the late seventies and  eaghties with long ball football which after 1985 stifled the english game and national team. Quite apart from the fact that is boring fotboll to watch ,it is a game based on chance and the Idea that in order to beat your opponent you must catch them off guard ,and disorganised. Be quicker to the loose or second ball and get it forward as early as possible are 2 mantras of the norwegians ,wimbledon and all the other exponants of hoping for the best fotboll.
The way we play is based on the idea that we will let them chase us ,we are better than them and as long as we have the ball we can score because we have the team play to achieve it. Different philosophies which in many ways reflect different cultures.
Championship football still has lots of teams sticking to the outdated ideas of the long ball game but none of them survive in the premier League. Even pullis ,Allardyce and the like have had to adjust their style to survive in the premiership. 

colinwhite

Quote from: Carborundum on April 23, 2018, 05:21:42 PM
I'm not sure things are completely black and white.  Odoi's late equaliser against Preston looked an awful lot like panic stations football to me.  Very enjoyable it was too as it turned out.  Not everyone on this forum is knocking Cardiff either.  It's difficult to win football matches and anyone who wins more than they lose commands a degree of respect. 

I've had plenty of entertainment this season and am very happy with the way we play.  But in all honesty there are times when Ream McDonald Odoi, Bettinelli and Cairney are triangling to their hearts content in our own half when I think being more direct would help alleviate pressure.

The very best teams can do it all and keep the opposition guessing.
Actually the very best teams Barcelona ,B Munich etc and of course man city triangle their way through games alot more than we do !!!


Bassey the warrior

Quote from: Andy S on April 23, 2018, 02:18:20 PM
We all knock Cardiff for the way they play the long ball. We used to knock Wimbledon. Wattford went up a few years ago playing the long ball game as graham Taylor had worked it all out on percentage football. I.e. Every 20 times the ball is launched into the box it will result in a goal. Some Teams play pretty football and when it goes wrong 10 minutes from time they put a big man up front and launch the balls into the box. This is not a tactic I have seen at the cottage in recent times but it seems to work. My question is if it is so successful why don't more clubs play this kind of football for 90 minutes?

Because it's god awful to watch. People spend a fortune watching football, it should be entertaining.

colinwhite

Quote from: Lighthouse on April 23, 2018, 05:42:43 PM
Few would knock Cardiff for their success. But the type of football is not very entertaining to watch week in and week out. Which is why their manager has such a long list of clubs he has been with. Plus the fact to play that physical up and at them type of football requires a certain type of group of players. When it works it is fine but like Wimbledon before them, once they are found out or don't play to the best of their ability the fall is quick and painful.

Many goals will be scored late on and in injury time. Tiredness and panic as well as the bombardment football can all be mentioned as reasons why this happens. But the bottom line is who would the average fan prefer to watch. Cardiff are one of a few clubs in a small Country. They have tradition. Yet without success their type of football would not have fans flocking to watch them.

I would certainly knock Cardiff . Big players ,long balls, rough your opponents up as much as possible and achieve the result through any means possible ;hold onto players ,  attract free kicks and pump the ball into the opponents box while screening their keeper. Oh and moan and rant at every decision against you correct or incorrect .Be a very bad loser.
Ah the good old fashioned `respect` that is disappearing from the modern game , blood, guts , neversay die and effort, spiced with just about all the cynical fouling and rule bending yoy can think of.  I dont have a lot of time for that.

filham

To say the long ball game is boring is not really correct, with the ball in the penalty area a lot more than it is with the short square passing game there can be a lot more goal mouth incidents .


colinwhite

We suffered it for a short period under Sanchez otherwise weve ner really seen at the cottage week after week.Thank god!

bobbo

Quote from: colinwhite on April 24, 2018, 05:56:09 AM
We suffered it for a short period under Sanchez otherwise weve ner really seen at the cottage week after week.Thank god!

dont want to either, having said that triangles can be very boring also
1975 just leaving home full of hope

bog

I recall a game years back when Sheffled United played Wimbledon. Bassett was running (or was it ruining) the Blades and the Dons were at their gentle best. It was an awful game. Wonder the ball never burst.



092.gif 


Woolly Mammoth

#18
Quote from: bobbo on April 24, 2018, 12:04:10 PM
Quote from: colinwhite on April 24, 2018, 05:56:09 AM
We suffered it for a short period under Sanchez otherwise weve ner really seen at the cottage week after week.Thank god!

dont want to either, having said that triangles can be very boring also

Although I like watching it. Sometimes there are more triangles, than in a Toblerone Chocolate Factory.   
Its not the man in the fight, it's the fight in the man.  🐘

Never forget your Roots.

HV71

Thank god for our style. Thank god for 'poncing ' around with the ball.

Carry on poncing !!