It ends in a 1-1 draw at Portman Road with a goal from Adama Traore.
Not our best performance, and still early into the season, but what was your post match thoughts on today's game.
Let us know below
#ffc #IPSFUL
::scarf::
The more we play, the more worried I become about how blunt we are up top, and how easily we ship cheap goals. Happy with a draw but really.....if we have ambitions, games we should be taking 3 points from.
We were lucky. The Tractor Boys deserved all three. We looked awful, with such poor decision making in the opposition's box from Iwobi and Traore.
Very very poor performance. Didn't deserve a point, so got to be happy to get one.
Attacking play far too slow, so easy to play against. Couldn't get out of our own half for much of the game. We still struggle to create anything, and the balance of the team, especially the midfield needs changing fast. Pereira cannot play in the deeper role.
CF is going to be an issue all season.
We looked like panic stations at the back, especially towards the end.
Lots and lots of work to do
disagree we deserved a point .not great but a good away point.
I was worried about today & it being Ipswich's first 'winnable' game. Plenty of room for improvement but at least we stopped them picking up three valuable points.
I didn't see the game but the radio coverage suggested the ref was rather inconsistent with his cards?
So three matches in, including two against promoted sides and no clean sheet yet. That could signal a need for a change in personnel sooner rather than later?
Definitely blunt up front, some blame our CF and some the service he gets. I suspect it's a combination of the two. The problem is that, unlike in the defensive areas, we have fewer options to change things. This is the aspect of our squad that concerns me most.
Agree with all the above. We were very lucky to come away with a point there. If I was an Ipswich supporter I would be very disappointed for not finishing with three points there.
Final decision making and sloppy final passes made Ipswich look good.
Only two things to feel encouraged by was Traore getting his goal and his overall showing in the first half and Sander Berg who came on and added some quality and steel to the midfield.
The Everton collapse has cheered me up.
Quote from: SP on August 31, 2024, 05:06:27 PMThe Everton collapse has cheered me up.
Surely they're going to be relegated this year. They should have been relegated the last two years, really.
Not happy at all with the performance today. Taking Emile Smith Rowe out first shouldn't have been a thing.
Tete and Traore by far the best players on the field today.
Diop played better than Bassey again.
Robinson had his worse game today, the amount of mistakes that he committed could have easily ended in an Ipswich goal.
Also Muniz just doesn't seem to be moving enough or doesn't have the pace to counter,
I'm starting to think that selling Stansfield was a mistake.
Also Pereira looks injured, he was one day away from being sold to Marseille or Forest, which I would have done and bring in someone who can finish more often or be more active in the box.
Also Marco Silva needs to start making the substitutions earlier in the game.
Positives that we can take from today is that if this game would have been played last season it could ended in a loss.
Well, we held out for the point- could turn it round and say how well we defended to keep them out, and get a good away point.
According to GJ, Muniz's first half header, where he failed to direct it past the keeper, was a crucial moment, and we need a new number 9 pretty urgently, though we have other goal scorers in the side.
Could have gone either way but Ipswich will feel annoyed more than Fulham. The promoted sides this year are good. When we didn't play that well and we still get a deserved point. I at least predicted it.
We were slow, ponderous and full of basic errors, all that made us vulnerable and never in control for more than odd moments.
They were adventurous, moved the ball quicker and supported each other better than we did.
We weren't headless chickens but we desperately needed someone to manage the game better.
Frankly our below average performance and their early season enthusiasm made them look better than they are.
A point was about right but we must do better.
Thought it was a very poor performance. Berge looked great in his cameo. Need him in team asap, and Andersen's long balls will help us. Our CBs struggled with passing today.
Worried how lightweight our midfield is and it's concerning Berge seems the only physical presence we have for that position. Felt we needed two midfielders in, and we needed a Joao backup when he was here too.
Pereira dropped a 0/10 the day after we turned down €35m for him, but I expect after the international break we'll make at least 2 changes and can see a situation where we have Cuenca and Andersen starting the next game with Berge replacing likely Lukic over AP although I know I'd drop AP, with Nelson likely out wide and Iwobi benched
Do we miss Willian? He had real class and could scare defenders.
I didn't have any issues with this match. They were another team sat on the counter with good tacklers in the center of the park. They trapped Robinson multiple times knowing he can't go inside with his right foot and it hurt a lot of our build up, especially as Iwobi couldn't get deep enough to receive those vertical passes from Bassey. Luckily ESR dropped back to provide better numbers, but then we'd leave Muniz to fend for himself.
Much like last week we still have a tendency to try to walk it into the net, rather than smash one from top of the box or first time in the box (Iwobi). This isn't necessarily slow play like some have posted, but more so just too much of an attempt at perfection and not being decisive in the crucial moments.
Muniz should have scored last week with a header and the same goes with this week. I know he'll come good, but PL attackers don't miss like that.
A point away in a tough environment, I'll take it. Not our best, but not our worst. Lukic did no wrong again, so I think we're at the point now where Silva needs to decide if he can put both Berge and Lukic on the pitch. I think ESR has proven he can play anywhere, and could possibly take over Iwobi's position, which would bring Pereira back to the 10. Just one option of many for him.
Thought Bassey, Andreas, Robinson were quite poor. Adama, Tete and Leno were excellent, rest were okay with ESR slightly above the remaining players though. We did okay overall and the game could have gone either way. After two routine losses in the first two games, Ipswich was always going to play excellent. The positive thing for me is that even though we played average and the opponent played an excellent game, we still got a draw.
Quote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 05:30:22 PMThought Bassey, Andreas, Robinson were quite poor. Adama, Tete and Leno were excellent, rest were okay with ESR slightly above the remaining players though. We did okay overall and the game could have gone either way. After two routine losses in the first two games, Ipswich was always going to play excellent. The positive thing for me is that even though we played average and the opponent played an excellent game, we still got a draw.
Leno should have saved their goal imo. He got a hand to it so it should be staying out.
Very lucky to walk away with a point after that poor performance. Ipswich closed us down very quickly and we didn't seem to have an answer apart from finally humping a long ball up field which we hold onto.
We have Leno to thank for a couple of good blocks.
Where as I cannot remember their keeper having to make a decent save all game.
Poor performance but we often start slowly. Thank god we have Leno.
Also, what a signing Traore has been on a free.
Quote from: Neutral Zone Ultra on August 31, 2024, 05:32:53 PMLeno should have saved their goal imo. He got a hand to it so it should be staying out.
Yes, maybe. But he was world-class apart from that.
Just on the train back
The better team first half, looked exhausted and slow in the second. Frustratingly poor decision making.
Another good game from Sasha
Periera very poor, his passing as all over the place
Robinson very poor
Diop has been the best of our CBs this year. Hard to drop him on this form Bassey has looked very shaky so far. Another game like that and Cuencas in. Andersen's passing range could be really helpful to unlocking runs in behind or out wide when we get stuck
Tetes been good but we do sometimes miss castagnes overlaps
Esr looks knackered, no where near fit yet and doesn't press like andreas does yet at CAM because of it
Adama was very good first half, a beast... our most potent threat... And For some reason we just, stopped using the right side second half. Ridiculous
Muniz doing plenty up top, goals will come, but we lost it in and around him today. Should have gone in up a goal at half time
Iwobi was average
Berge was decent in his minutes
Harrison reed was a bizarre choice of sub... Id drop him and put king on the bench for games like this
Leno did well enough
Raul did nothing
Look very lacking in fitness as a whole. Looking forward to these players getting fitness levels up + the addition of reiss nelson to add a spark too.
Ipswich looked decent and may well stay up, omari the chelsea kid was great. A disappointing result but a point away and now we integrate and get our fitness u for 2 weeks. Well need to be ready for west ham who will pose a bigger threat.
Tete MOTM for me just over Adama. Encouraged by Berge and I'd like to see him start.
Once again, Andreas was poor. For all the chances he provides, they are rarely clear cut ones and rarely accurately reach an attacker. Please, please drop him.
A performance like that should make it easier for Marco to ring the changes against the ⚒️.
We didn't play well and a point flattered us. But, we were reasonably solid at the back, with Tete particularly outstanding. Leno made some good saves too. We were sloppy in possession and at times Ipswich had things too easy with their passing and running through gaps in our midfield. Ipswich did their homework and blocked our left side overlaps with Robinson most of the time, aside from our goal. Up front we look short of ideas. Muniz is lacking confidence and doesn't look like the same player as last season. Hope a goal soon changes that. All in all we take the point, as it was vital we didn't lose this. On to the next.
Quote from: Matt10 on August 31, 2024, 05:30:14 PMI didn't have any issues with this match. They were another team sat on the counter with good tacklers in the center of the park. They trapped Robinson multiple times knowing he can't go inside with his right foot and it hurt a lot of our build up, especially as Iwobi couldn't get deep enough to receive those vertical passes from Bassey. Luckily ESR dropped back to provide better numbers, but then we'd leave Muniz to fend for himself.
Much like last week we still have a tendency to try to walk it into the net, rather than smash one from top of the box or first time in the box (Iwobi). This isn't necessarily slow play like some have posted, but more so just too much of an attempt at perfection and not being decisive in the crucial moments.
Muniz should have scored last week with a header and the same goes with this week. I know he'll come good, but PL attackers don't miss like that.
A point away in a tough environment, I'll take it. Not our best, but not our worst. Lukic did no wrong again, so I think we're at the point now where Silva needs to decide if he can put both Berge and Lukic on the pitch. I think ESR has proven he can play anywhere, and could possibly take over Iwobi's position, which would bring Pereira back to the 10. Just one option of many for him.
Agree with this! I think Lukic and Berge would make a formidable pair in the middle, with Periera back as a 10 and ESR on the left. I'd also start Drop on the left next to Anderson. Bassey has shown very little composure this year. Same goes for Robinson. He is so important to us, but makes some really spastic awkward decisions near our own box. I wish he'd just calm down a little sometimes.
I'm also not sure we want to be bringing in both Reed and Cairney late in games. Cairney is basically immobile and Reed just runs around in circles not affecting the game in any way.
Quote from: Al-Fayed on August 31, 2024, 05:28:25 PMDo we miss Willian? He had real class and could scare defenders.
Of course we do. He was quality for us. His movement, his touch and his decision making were excellent and when he had the ball you always thought something may happen. Iwobi and Traore offer more trickery and in Traore's case, pace, but overall neither is as good. Smith-Rowe's touch and decision-making look good so far, but his role is different so we'll miss Willian out wide.
I found the match rather ponderous. Robinson and Bassey were poor. I fear the lack of a striker is going to kill us this year. The biggest problem, with the exception of Berge, was a total lack of contribution by the subs. They made the team weaker. Berge's size is quite the attribute and I look forward to seeing more of him. Why put Reed in when your chasing a goal and why pull Smith-Rowe?
Quote from: YankeeJim on August 31, 2024, 06:50:41 PMI found the match rather ponderous. Robinson and Bassey were poor. I fear the lack of a striker is going to kill us this year. The biggest problem, with the exception of Berge, was a total lack of contribution by the subs. They made the team weaker. Berge's size is quite the attribute and I look forward to seeing more of him. Why put Reed in when your chasing a goal and why pull Smith-Rowe?
Smith rowe was knackered and is working up his fitness... But reed was a terrible choice. Cairney only got called in cos periera went down with cramp. TC should have been coming on in the first place given we had Berge on.
Very questionable decision there.
Again, bench crying out for the likes of nelson and king more than reed and Wilson imo
Quote from: Neutral Zone Ultra on August 31, 2024, 05:32:53 PMQuote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 05:30:22 PMThought Bassey, Andreas, Robinson were quite poor. Adama, Tete and Leno were excellent, rest were okay with ESR slightly above the remaining players though. We did okay overall and the game could have gone either way. After two routine losses in the first two games, Ipswich was always going to play excellent. The positive thing for me is that even though we played average and the opponent played an excellent game, we still got a draw.
Leno should have saved their goal imo. He got a hand to it so it should be staying out.
[/quote
I agree with this sentiment,
It sounds a little counter intuitive but hear me out.
I feel he should have gone one arm outstretched not two,
Two makes you feel you can get 'more on the ball' but
Your reach is longer diving one arm outstretched meaning if you touch that ball, your more likely to reach the ball with your palm,
Two arms outstretched and he's looking to touch that ball with minimum fingers.
I thought Leno was our best player today and I thought Tete had a good defensive display.
I thought our overall shape was way off, everyone seemed to be completely lost at times.
I thought our midfield was very weak. ESR needs to play further forward. I personally don't like Iwobi on the left, I don't think he's in the game as much out there.
Muniz again did everything but score, I still think he'll come good.
Greaves and Delap looked really good for Ipswich, and I noticed Marco Silva shook Delap's hand as he walked off.
I think Nelson will fit in on the left which will allow ESR to start down the middle. Even though I think he's a good player it wouldn't surprise me to see Iwobi sit a few games out
Another thing, I'm still not a fan of Andreas as an 8. He has too many defensive lapses which leaves our back 4+Lukic exposed. I'd either swap Berge for him, or Berge for one of ESR/Iwobi/Traore and move Andreas to the 10 role.
Quote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 07:43:25 PMAnother thing, I'm still not a fan of Andreas as an 8. He has too many defensive lapses which leaves our back 4+Lukic exposed. I'd either swap Berge for him, or Berge for one of ESR/Iwobi/Traore and move Andreas to the 10 role.
I didn't watch today but my overall feeling towards the end of last season and start of this is that Iwobi doesn't really contribute enough so would bringing Andreas into 10 and ESR wide left be an alternative.
I'd keep ESR as 10, drop Andreas though and bring in Berge, and see how Nelson does in regards to wing options
Quote from: jayffc on August 31, 2024, 05:44:35 PMJust on the train back
The better team first half, looked exhausted and slow in the second. Frustratingly poor decision making.
Another good game from Sasha
Periera very poor, his passing as all over the place
Robinson very poor
Diop has been the best of our CBs this year. Hard to drop him on this form Bassey has looked very shaky so far. Another game like that and Cuencas in. Andersen's passing range could be really helpful to unlocking runs in behind or out wide when we get stuck
Tetes been good but we do sometimes miss castagnes overlaps
Esr looks knackered, no where near fit yet and doesn't press like andreas does yet at CAM because of it
Adama was very good first half, a beast... our most potent threat... And For some reason we just, stopped using the right side second half. Ridiculous
Muniz doing plenty up top, goals will come, but we lost it in and around him today. Should have gone in up a goal at half time
Iwobi was average
Berge was decent in his minutes
Harrison reed was a bizarre choice of sub... Id drop him and put king on the bench for games like this
Leno did well enough
Raul did nothing
Look very lacking in fitness as a whole. Looking forward to these players getting fitness levels up + the addition of reiss nelson to add a spark too.
Ipswich looked decent and may well stay up, omari the chelsea kid was great. A disappointing result but a point away and now we integrate and get our fitness u for 2 weeks. Well need to be ready for west ham who will pose a bigger threat.
Agree with all of this. As I said the match thread I really got what Marco said when he stated that "we've lost a lot of maturity and leadership" today. We desperately miss the calm demeanor of Ream, who would trick a pressing attacker with such ease and seeming safety, or the unplayable Willian that frustrated opposition, or the in-your-face Palhinha, or the bust-a-gut-never-give-up energy of BDR. We simply have no players now that terrifies any of the opposition with that no nonsense attitude of those above.
Iwobi plays at 40% of his full repertoire on the left so for the love of God get him on his right side. And he has zero connection and chemistry with Robinson. Get ESR on the left immediately, that way we won't need him to backtrack to our box the entire game and he won't be knackered at 60 minutes either, like today. Ffs he isn't match fit as is, that was horrible instructions from Marco.
And personally I want Reed and Wilson out, completely out. Thanks for your service, you've been great. As starters in Championship. They are both so clearly confidence players and neither have contributed with anything at all as subs from what I can remember. But they still keep on getting subbed in, again and again and again.
Quote from: Rambler on August 31, 2024, 08:21:22 PMQuote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 07:43:25 PMAnother thing, I'm still not a fan of Andreas as an 8. He has too many defensive lapses which leaves our back 4+Lukic exposed. I'd either swap Berge for him, or Berge for one of ESR/Iwobi/Traore and move Andreas to the 10 role.
I didn't watch today but my overall feeling towards the end of last season and start of this is that Iwobi doesn't really contribute enough so would bringing Andreas into 10 and ESR wide left be an alternative.
I'd keep ESR as 10, drop Andreas though and bring in Berge, and see how Nelson does in regards to wing options
Agggggh I keep reading play ESR wide left if we do that where do you think Nelson is going to play?
Nelson will play left wing in the next game, where you play all the others is anyone's guess.
Quote from: C Block on August 31, 2024, 08:45:35 PMQuote from: Rambler on August 31, 2024, 08:21:22 PMQuote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 07:43:25 PMAnother thing, I'm still not a fan of Andreas as an 8. He has too many defensive lapses which leaves our back 4+Lukic exposed. I'd either swap Berge for him, or Berge for one of ESR/Iwobi/Traore and move Andreas to the 10 role.
I didn't watch today but my overall feeling towards the end of last season and start of this is that Iwobi doesn't really contribute enough so would bringing Andreas into 10 and ESR wide left be an alternative.
I'd keep ESR as 10, drop Andreas though and bring in Berge, and see how Nelson does in regards to wing options
Agggggh I keep reading play ESR wide left if we do that where do you think Nelson is going to play?
Nelson will play left wing in the next game, where you play all the others is anyone's guess.
Nelson and our current wingers will battle it out to start. Im up for trying out ESR LW at some point though. Hes linking some nice touches but isnt pressing anywhere near as much as andreas atm at CAM
after today Id try out Nelson wide left for Iwobi even though hes been mostly RW at arsenal of late. Only because Adama is making himself undroppable at the moment, hes really stepping up this season.
Can and will im sure then rotate these players around mid match as we need to
Quote from: C Block on August 31, 2024, 08:45:35 PMNelson will play left wing in the next game
Not sure about that. Marco tends to bed in players very slowly, unless he abolutely has no other option.
Were definitely going to be improved with Andersen, berge and Nelson coming into the side.
I really hope king gets more opportunities on the bench as Harrison Reed is just dreadful.
Quote from: demeant0r on August 31, 2024, 05:58:05 PMOnce again, Andreas was poor. For all the chances he provides, they are rarely clear cut ones and rarely accurately reach an attacker. Please, please drop him.
And his overall free kicks have been poor too.
Quote from: Deeping_white on August 31, 2024, 05:24:42 PMPereira dropped a 0/10 the day after we turned down €35m for him, but I expect after the international break we'll make at least 2 changes and can see a situation where we have Cuenca and Andersen starting the next game with Berge replacing likely Lukic over AP although I know I'd drop AP, with Nelson likely out wide and Iwobi benched
Harsh on AP, he makes lots of really creative balls that get overlooked. Also a delicious ball in that was crying for a flick on late in second half.
Thing is, he's instructed to play ambitious balls I think and if he loses it it creates a transition. But think he get's undue criticism. He's not an 8 though, don't love him and Lukic together
Quote from: jayffc on August 31, 2024, 05:44:35 PMJust on the train back
The better team first half, looked exhausted and slow in the second. Frustratingly poor decision making.
Another good game from Sasha
Periera very poor, his passing as all over the place
Robinson very poor
Diop has been the best of our CBs this year. Hard to drop him on this form Bassey has looked very shaky so far. Another game like that and Cuencas in. Andersen's passing range could be really helpful to unlocking runs in behind or out wide when we get stuck
Tetes been good but we do sometimes miss castagnes overlaps
Esr looks knackered, no where near fit yet and doesn't press like andreas does yet at CAM because of it
Adama was very good first half, a beast... our most potent threat... And For some reason we just, stopped using the right side second half. Ridiculous
Muniz doing plenty up top, goals will come, but we lost it in and around him today. Should have gone in up a goal at half time
Iwobi was average
Berge was decent in his minutes
Harrison reed was a bizarre choice of sub... Id drop him and put king on the bench for games like this
Leno did well enough
Raul did nothing
Look very lacking in fitness as a whole. Looking forward to these players getting fitness levels up + the addition of reiss nelson to add a spark too.
Ipswich looked decent and may well stay up, omari the chelsea kid was great. A disappointing result but a point away and now we integrate and get our fitness u for 2 weeks. Well need to be ready for west ham who will pose a bigger threat.
Enjoyed this summary and agree with most of it. I wasn't at the game, watched on tc so a slightly different viewpoint.
The only bits I disagree on are Muniz - think he gets given more grace than others. That header was really weak and should have done better, but feels starved of service.
Also think harsh on Raul who did well on the fast break to drive into the box and get a shot off. Can't ask for much more based on limited minutes.
As striker options, I don't love it. Muniz is still a bit of an unknown and reluctant to be overly effusive or critical on him, but I don't know how comfortable I feel depending on him as a no1 striker.
Quote from: hopper on August 31, 2024, 11:09:44 PMQuote from: jayffc on August 31, 2024, 05:44:35 PMJust on the train back
The better team first half, looked exhausted and slow in the second. Frustratingly poor decision making.
Another good game from Sasha
Periera very poor, his passing as all over the place
Robinson very poor
Diop has been the best of our CBs this year. Hard to drop him on this form Bassey has looked very shaky so far. Another game like that and Cuencas in. Andersen's passing range could be really helpful to unlocking runs in behind or out wide when we get stuck
Tetes been good but we do sometimes miss castagnes overlaps
Esr looks knackered, no where near fit yet and doesn't press like andreas does yet at CAM because of it
Adama was very good first half, a beast... our most potent threat... And For some reason we just, stopped using the right side second half. Ridiculous
Muniz doing plenty up top, goals will come, but we lost it in and around him today. Should have gone in up a goal at half time
Iwobi was average
Berge was decent in his minutes
Harrison reed was a bizarre choice of sub... Id drop him and put king on the bench for games like this
Leno did well enough
Raul did nothing
Look very lacking in fitness as a whole. Looking forward to these players getting fitness levels up + the addition of reiss nelson to add a spark too.
Ipswich looked decent and may well stay up, omari the chelsea kid was great. A disappointing result but a point away and now we integrate and get our fitness u for 2 weeks. Well need to be ready for west ham who will pose a bigger threat.
Enjoyed this summary and agree with most of it. I wasn't at the game, watched on tc so a slightly different viewpoint.
The only bits I disagree on are Muniz - think he gets given more grace than others. That header was really weak and should have done better, but feels starved of service.
Also think harsh on Raul who did well on the fast break to drive into the box and get a shot off. Can't ask for much more based on limited minutes.
As striker options, I don't love it. Muniz is still a bit of an unknown and reluctant to be overly effusive or critical on him, but I don't know how comfortable I feel depending on him as a no1 striker.
Yeh, nice summary but I do have to also disagree on Muniz. Just not doing enough for me. If the instruction is, he doesn't need to do the press as much, I feel he needs to bring some better link up play, or more goals to his game. He's been let down by our midfield at times, I don;t disagree he's sometimes isolated or not supported enough, but some of his build up play seems to have fallen short compared to last years standards.
I'd probably give Raul a go at this stage. Its too many games without a goal from a striker at this level.
Fair enough
Dunno how it came across on telly but his hold up play, workrate and general quality was all pretty evidently there for me despite being isolated a fair bit
Many around me saying as much, hes just not getting the right service for me yet... Hes best with his feet.
Header could have done better with but jist that touch behind him to make getting that extra power and direction right
...But again hes better with it as his feet
Not sure if intentional but his presence (dummy) and opening up his body seemed to contribute to pulling the defender and adama having the space to finish too
Definitely get a different insight at the game and everyone there is saying the same. I think there's a system issue, none of our players get close to him.
Ipswich's first winnable game, at their ground, point to prove and bit in-between their teeth.. First half we had 65%, and their goal was very good.
We hit back relatively quickly.
We still have three first teamers to come in to the team in andersen, Nelson and berge.. we will be and get better.
This early on in the season is rusty, but given the dynamics and how poor our away form was last season the potential was definitely there.
Look at villa vs Leicester today and they won 2-1 like we did, though they were at Leicester and we beat them at home.
I'm not going to get too worried this soon, I think there were enough positives to take and areas that we could improve on, which I think we will do when we integrate Andersen (passing through the lines and forward), berge (to anchor midfield and also play passes through the lines( and Nelson (to play across the front line and add value in passes/crosses and score goals) that will make us better.
We're showing signs of a very good team with things not yet clicking for the full 90.
I expect as the season kicks on, the team gels more and gets full fitness, we'll see stronger performances, like the first half, but for the full 90.
Time will tell, but reasons for cautious optimism.
Now to get Muniz firing properly and giving him the service he deserves.
Firstly got to give Ipswich some credit. Their high press was just way better than ours and as always we just couldn't cope with it. Berge and Andersen should massively help that and although very harsh on Diop who has been one of the better players first 3 Andersen has to come in. Should also dramatically improve Bassey as won't be on him to pass out. Every time a team presses us high we look useless and either the new players coming in have to solve this or Marco needs to find a solution as been an issue since we came up.
One thing that really grinds my gears with this is when we change up and go long from Leno. No issue with doing that at all and I think it is sensible when we are struggling to pass out but the way we do it is madness. Every other team when not playing short the keeper gives the sign and the whole team moves up. When we do it Bassey and Diop are still stood next to Leno and no one moves up. Consequently it goes long, there is barely anyone near Muniz to pick up the second ball and when they then inevitably win it we have massive spaces between the defence, midfield and attack for them to exploit so completely on the back foot again. That is schoolboy stuff and I just don't get it as we do it constantly. If Leno is going long signal it and get the whole frigging team up the pitch. Moan over. Lol
To our structure some big issues with the current set up. ESR is class but the back room staff need to do massive work on his fitness during the international break. He looked absolutely stuffed second half but even first, if he's going to play 10, he has to be able to press like AP used to there. Their high press was twice as good as ours which was why they dominated the start of the second half and considering their keeper is a calamity with his feet we barely put any pressure on him at all. A lot of that is because ESR doesn't have the engine there yet from what I can see. Not blaming him as barely played but if he plays 10 in our system he needs to be fitter than he's ever been. He for me is also dropping too deep from there when we need him creating around the box. Finally he's also getting a bit swamped by bodies in there today and against United not giving him the space to use his magic. Loads of Arsenal fans think he is better off the left. I can imagine with more space out there for him to run with the ball and cut inside with Robinson overlapping it could be brilliant.
I've quite liked AP in the 8 for much of the 3 games. His stats as always suggest he is doing well and the level of criticism is harsh. He does a load of good stuff but with some garbage mixed in which is what some folk always remember. Some of his corners were excellent but really concerning that we have lost Mitro/JP and Tosin who were all brilliant at attacking them and we scored loads from set pieces. Really hoping Berge and Andersen can step up here as no good having AP s delivery if no one can frigging win an attacking header. Know Andersen is certainly a threat. Was a bad pass that started the move for their goal and he then couldn't recover but fair play to Delap as pretty class. Although AP has done okay as an 8 for me, if Berge plays to his potential I think we are way more solid defensively and way better transitioning the ball with him and Lukic so praying Berge is good as that is the two for me that become settled starters. If a weaker team does not press us high I think there is still an option to play AP 8 but in the main I am hoping Berge and Lukic settle as a strong pair.
Which then questions what do we do with the 10? Considering ESR s current difficulties in pressing high and him being crowded out in the middle a bit I'd be really tempted to put AP back to 10 and try ESR left. Iwobi looked class in pre season and good against Leicester but was dreadful against United and so many bad final balls today as well. I'd give this a go then with Lukic, Berge behind AP, ESR left and Adama right. Think it could solve a lot of the issues seen today. Once ESR fully fit could move him back to 10 with Iwobi or Nelson LW if AP isn't contributing enough.
Re Muniz some of his hold up and link up play was excellent today. Won a fair bit in the air as well. He does play a big part in the goal as draws 2 defenders for the cross into the challenge leaving Adama free. The header wasn't a sitter. There wasn't much pace on the ball at all so he had to generate it all but his mistake was not going back across the keeper. There was one move first half were he protected the ball, turned, put Adama in right and the burst to get in the box and was free and despite another excellent game it was a shocking pass from Adama behind him. That is how it is going for him at the mo. Wasn't just that one...our crossing from open play was in the main woeful constantly hitting the front man so he is getting little service. He is getting in good positions but just not happening. So I think the comments saying he did nothing etc are harsh but don't get me wrong...he is a striker and has to find a way to start scoring soon. You do feel he is a massive confidence player so praying for one the next few games to get him going.
Having said all of these issues our XG was 1.33 and theirs was 0.56 and they scored with a 25 yarder. I think a draw was a fair result overall. Tete and Adama excellent again so a recurring theme down the right. Thought Lukic was very solid in there so again a recurring theme. Robinson very good defensively and my god his crossing has improved but did also struggle under their press (another who is not great at it and Willian used to support him a lot here). We are a new team with so many changes in personnel/set up still finding its way. We have two, what should be top class players coming in with Berge and Andersen and perhaps Nelson find form with us too. We do desperately need Muniz to come good again. If he does it could be a great season. If he doesn't could well be very similar to last seasons low mid table finish I think.
Quote from: jayffc on September 01, 2024, 12:08:59 AMFair enough
Dunno how it came across on telly but his hold up play, workrate and general quality was all pretty evidently there for me despite being isolated a fair bit
Many around me saying as much, hes just not getting the right service for me yet... Hes best with his feet.
Header could have done better with but jist that touch behind him to make getting that extra power and direction right
...But again hes better with it as his feet
Not sure if intentional but his presence (dummy) and opening up his body seemed to contribute to pulling the defender and adama having the space to finish too
On TV it looks like the other front players are having trouble linking with him consistently and the CBs aren't getting good service into his head or feet. Not sure how much of that is down to him.
Quote from: jayffc on September 01, 2024, 12:08:59 AMFair enough
Dunno how it came across on telly but his hold up play, workrate and general quality was all pretty evidently there for me despite being isolated a fair bit
Many around me saying as much, hes just not getting the right service for me yet... Hes best with his feet.
Header could have done better with but jist that touch behind him to make getting that extra power and direction right
...But again hes better with it as his feet
Not sure if intentional but his presence (dummy) and opening up his body seemed to contribute to pulling the defender and adama having the space to finish too
Agree with a lot of that. I'd just add that he has to be much more of a problem solver in the box. Can't just stand between the two tall central defenders and hope that it's going to miraculously dip at the perfect time to his head. It happened one time in a looping fashion, but how many other crosses before that he never got in front of a defender.
Regardless, he needs to finish his chances, no matter how few. Start getting them on frame. Raul had one chance and nearly scored the winner after taking on 3 players. There's good competition between the two, and I won't be surprised if Marco changes things up to keep them on their toes.
Quote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 07:43:25 PMAnother thing, I'm still not a fan of Andreas as an 8. He has too many defensive lapses which leaves our back 4+Lukic exposed. I'd either swap Berge for him, or Berge for one of ESR/Iwobi/Traore and move Andreas to the 10 role.
Thought your boy had another excellent game SL.
Quote from: Neutral Zone Ultra on August 31, 2024, 05:32:53 PMQuote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 05:30:22 PMThought Bassey, Andreas, Robinson were quite poor. Adama, Tete and Leno were excellent, rest were okay with ESR slightly above the remaining players though. We did okay overall and the game could have gone either way. After two routine losses in the first two games, Ipswich was always going to play excellent. The positive thing for me is that even though we played average and the opponent played an excellent game, we still got a draw.
Leno should have saved their goal imo. He got a hand to it so it should be staying out.
to be fair, as an ex keeper, he got his finger tips to it and no way are you stopping a 25 yrd screamer out of the blue like that as his position was anticipating further development, so slightly off balance and aside from that, was MOM for me. he clawed out that looping header for starters plus the one on one and just thank god that Arsenal released him to us as he is pure quality.
Quote from: iansthailand on September 01, 2024, 03:47:51 AMQuote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 07:43:25 PMAnother thing, I'm still not a fan of Andreas as an 8. He has too many defensive lapses which leaves our back 4+Lukic exposed. I'd either swap Berge for him, or Berge for one of ESR/Iwobi/Traore and move Andreas to the 10 role.
Thought your boy had another excellent game SL.
I'm happy for him, as he's finally getting recogniton from Fulham's fans for his efforts. He's a really nice, humble, hard-working guy who always gives his all, and obviously he's a quality player too (you don't really get to captain a mid-table Serie A side if you're not).
I think he'd be even better alongside someone who has more defensive ability than Andreas. That's why I hope him and Berge become a partnership in the future. Berge is slightly less capable defensively than Lukic, but the two of them together could potentialy give us that stability in midfield. I don't think Lukic-Andreas or Berge-Andreas is good. Maybe against Leicester and Southampton...
Feel just with Berge's height and defensive minded approach that Ipswich's goal yesterday wouldn't have happened. He's 6ft 4? and his extra stride would've seen him tackle/disrupt Delap way before he scored. Pereira lost out on a foot race and gave up fighting for the ball which gave Delap the space he needed. It's the small details.
some very interesting comments there. There is still much to be hopeful about going forward. Ya, I felt myself that we are only three games in and have not really clicked or gelled yet. Or as someone else said, some legs are still rusty yet.
Thats an interesting point, because shouldnt that also mean that our opposition are rusty too - thats not what I saw yesterday?
This is how I see it. In the weeks leading up to yesterdays game, it was a fixture most on this site had pencilled in as win, myself included. By the time of our equaliser, that was still an ambitious probability but by early second half the doubts started creeping in, and before long it was no longer a matter of whether we could or would win it. in the end we had to settle for the next best option, to prevent them from winning it.
Yes of course there will always be days like this. But I'm still confident with our new additions, and fitness levels rise and players begin to gel together, we will kick on and deliver as we had hoped. but the last thing we need this season, like the last, is to rely on winning just our home games.
I know we are better than that!
Looking forward it is hard to see an easier away game and hard to see a striker who is going to score goals for us.
We just havn't replaced Mitro.
I suspect MS will not be pleased with this outcome. However, as a fan, I'm happy with the road point. Could have left that game with nothing. Ipswich are no mugs, they could very well be one of the promoted survivors this season. They were definitely a much better team than the team we beat earlier for our first win. Sure, it's a game that we should win if we're thinking top ten this season, but a road point is still a good result. This is a tough league, every game is a challenge.
Quote from: SerbianLad on August 31, 2024, 05:34:59 PMQuote from: Neutral Zone Ultra on August 31, 2024, 05:32:53 PMLeno should have saved their goal imo. He got a hand to it so it should be staying out.
Yes, maybe. But he was world-class apart from that.
Agreed he should have done better on the goal scored. Also looked a bit dodgy on a simple header he punched out to the middle of the box inviting an easy rebound chance when he should have simply caught the ball. So for me, a bit dodgy. That said, he did make several nice saves to keep us in the game.
This is a really good analysis of why we struggled yesterday and highlights it's not just on AP and Muniz. Pretty much sums up what many of us have been saying:
https://x.com/CottageTactico/status/1830275161477496956
Let's pray Berge and Andersen can massively help us when teams press high well.
AP was awful all game yesterday, gave the ball away too many times, couldn't win the ball or get close to their attacking players, poor passing and shite set pieces as usual.
If we play him deep all season we will be hit for 6 or 7 against any decent team. His lack of play was forcing ESR to come deeper for the ball which effected our attacking options.
Should of sold him to forest honestly, we may as well of played with 10 men yesterday for all it was worth
For someone who stated he is best played deeper he certainly hasn't showed it, issue is he's not great going forward either......
Quote from: Fulham Mike on August 31, 2024, 09:14:43 PMWere definitely going to be improved with Andersen, berge and Nelson coming into the side.
I really hope king gets more opportunities on the bench as Harrison Reed is just dreadful.
Certainly not disagreeing with you, but who would you replace? I assume Diop for Andersen, but Diop has played well. Berge for Lucik? Nelson for Iwobi?
Watched the highlights and gotta say Muniz needs to be burying that header.
Muniz working hard doing ok hopefully the goals will come.But please be a nasty No 9 don't keep picking up Defenders from the floor surprised he never brushed the Goalie down after saving he's header.
Quote from: Benny on September 01, 2024, 06:15:11 PMAP was awful all game yesterday, gave the ball away too many times, couldn't win the ball or get close to their attacking players, poor passing and shite set pieces as usual.
If we play him deep all season we will be hit for 6 or 7 against any decent team. His lack of play was forcing ESR to come deeper for the ball which effected our attacking options.
Should of sold him to forest honestly, we may as well of played with 10 men yesterday for all it was worth
For someone who stated he is best played deeper he certainly hasn't showed it, issue is he's not great going forward either......
He made one bad pass in the first half, it led to their goal. If you rewatch the moment, he's playing a forward ball to Adama to run onto, not square. Adama is on his heels though. If Adama is ready for that, he's got the LB beat to cut inside and take on one center back. Another time he tries to play a wall-pass to Adama, but the big man is blocked off the route to the ball and it's cleared away. He makes one more "bad" pass in the second half and again Adama slips and doesn't reach the driven pass to him. Then a little bit later, he tries to play a reverse through ball to Adama on the counter, but Ipswich recovered well and somehow got ahead of Adama. It's not like he's passing blatantly to the other team intended for different receiving players.
Each of his corners in the first half reach a Fulham head. He doesn't make a bad pass like the one that led to the goal ever again in the match. His crosses are with pace and in the direction of our forward, who doesn't move off from between the two center backs for all of them.
ESR dropping deep wasn't a reflection on AP. It was a solid strategy to keep Jedi wide and Iwobi narrow and high. Ipswich pressed with 3 men so we have to match that. In the goal we scored, it's ESR dropping deep to balance their press so Bassey can find Iwobi and we can switch the ball.
Much like last season with Pereira and Cairney, when we were routing West Ham, we let our 8 and 10 become pivot points up and down the pitch rather than side-to-side. It's not a matter of making up one another's slack, it's by design.
I like what Marco did with our press. We set it with a wide 4-1-4-1 where ESR and AP can stay right behind Muniz to set the press, while Adama can basically free-roam, but chose mainly to stay on the right side. In some instances, you can see AP setting the press and let ESR catch his breath. I think it needs more time though because if Ipswich were successful in getting the ball out wide, those runs into the half-space were tough to cover.
Once Berge comes in for ESR, AP is back to the 10 role. While he was in the 8, there was no threat on his right hand side. He didn't have to defend desperately from being off the pace either. He and Lukic cleaned up and maintained possession just fine.
I think the ESR-AP combination is much stronger than anyone is giving credit for. However, as I've said before, I'm a massive fan of Berge and I'd love to see him on the pitch beside Lukic. Iwobi moves out of the lineup and we just move that ESR-AP combo higher up the pitch to do what they have been doing. I think AP and Adama need to have words to get on the same page, but it's by far not as bad as people make it out to be.
Our away form last season wasn't all that was it! A point was good bearing mind we definitely haven't clicked yet.
4 points from three games, and only one home game so far is ok.
Agree with the last post. No starter has stood out to me as poor so far, especially considering the squad has yet to gel this early in the season with many new players.
Some sensible posts and good analysis near the end of this threat. Ipswich would have targeted this game as their first win. They proved first half v Liverpool they are no mugs. Liverpool then destroyed Man U.
We have some challenges for sure:
1. Get ESR fit
2. Get Andersen and Berg in the team
3. Still utilise talents like Iwobi and Andreas
4. Muniz need to get a break, he is doing fine but need a goal and must become more clinical
5. Get Bassey playing to his strengths which is not a ball player.
Lukic, Tete and Adama have started the season well and we will have real strengh off the bench. Reed and Cairney are going to be less involved which sad though it is will make us stronger.
It's really early days, we have 4 points on the board and a very decent squad. If Muniz does note fire we have enough money to go all out for a goal scorer in January.
I think we're still getting up to speed and there were long periods of the game where we were in complete control. Sadly we didn't do nearly enough when we were in control, but I think that will come as the new players bed in.
Also wanted to mention the lovely moment in the first half as Lukic travelled across the pitch in their half from right to left. In acres of space and as one of the Ipswich players finally headed towards him he almost imperceptibly twitched a shoulder and utterly sold the bloke a gorgeous dummy. Made me smile on a pretty average day.
Quote from: Drewry66 on September 01, 2024, 05:56:21 PMThis is a really good analysis of why we struggled yesterday and highlights it's not just on AP and Muniz. Pretty much sums up what many of us have been saying:
https://x.com/CottageTactico/status/1830275161477496956
Let's pray Berge and Andersen can massively help us when teams press high well.
It's good, but it's missing context again. I had to comment about the point (#2) he makes about where Palhinha would be on the goal. Well, if Palhinha would be there to back up Lukic, then that moment wouldn't have occurred because we'd have noone receiving the ball that prompted Tete and Adama to move up in the first place.
The other thing I noticed, (and we had this last season,) not enough decent tempo to our play. When we moved the ball at speed at times Ipswich struggled imo.
That's so craven podcast from today.