On the Five Live this evening they said that Seri gave the ball away allowing Leicester player through on goal . Thankfully Rico saved the shot.
How many more times will Seri give the ball away.
I think it was a horrendous pass from Vietto. Didn't do anything wrong otherwise.
Nope, wasn't his fault at all. Vietto gets stuck with 3 guys on him and sends a hospital pass in Seri's direction, which gets picked up and pounced upon.
Did any player not give the ball away at some point in the 94 minutes?
How many more times will i see crap seri posts?
As has been pointed out he was dropped in it so not his fault. Vietto has a very disappointing game, although he did well to create his chance to shoot. He's not a number 10 for me, he seems most dangerous in the box.
Quote from: Statto on December 05, 2018, 10:16:08 PM
Did any player not give the ball away at some point in the 94 minutes?
How many more times will i see crap seri posts?
Hear hear. So annoying.
How many times will Seri receive hospital passes when he has 3 men around him?
thought seri played well today
Perhaps refrain from posting another accusatory post about a player if you didn't go to the game because as the rest of the people have pointed out on this thread, he was sold up poo creek without a paddle
Quote from: fulhamben on December 05, 2018, 10:27:42 PM
thought seri played well today
He did, but I saw him give the ball away early on, think I mentioned that on the match day thread, he is wrongly now being singled out as our weakest link, he isn't and tbh I am not sure there is 1? Our team are simply not good enough to compete with most of the other 19 teams in the PL and maybe still won't be able to even after the next transfer window. Perhaps what we should do is lower our expectations and just try and enjoy our time in the PL (me included), I never thought I would still be alive when we got back there, but now we are, I too will try and enjoy the time we are still in the league! I have posted this on my desktop to remind me of what I am saying. Got to say I prefer the pre social media days when we used to go home after a disappointing performance and defeat and just share it with a few friends, all this analytical and often counter productive debate does not improve results, just means we have to replace our keyboard on our laptops once a year (lol)!
Quote from: Deeping_white on December 05, 2018, 10:28:54 PM
Perhaps refrain from posting another accusatory post about a player if you didn't go to the game because as the rest of the people have pointed out on this thread, he was sold up poo creek without a paddle
You don't need to go to a game to give an opinion but it helps, certainly you can't give an opinion based on listening to our Gentleman Jim and Jamie otherwise we should be 8 points clear by now and in the Champions League maybe, but the people who are able to watch matches on the internet or Sky/BT (including tape them on those channels) are able to comment and in fact have better footage and time to analyse what has happened than people at a game with no action replays!
Quote from: davew on December 05, 2018, 10:38:59 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 05, 2018, 10:27:42 PM
thought seri played well today
He did, but I saw him give the ball away early on, think I mentioned that on the match day thread, he is wrongly now being singled out as our weakest link, he isn't and tbh I am not sure there is 1? Our team are simply not good enough to compete with most of the other 19 teams in the PL and maybe still won't be able to even after the next transfer window. Perhaps what we should do is lower our expectations and just try and enjoy our time in the PL (me included), I never thought I would still be alive when we got back there, but now we are, I too will try and enjoy the time we are still in the league! I have posted this on my desktop to remind me of what I am saying. Got to say I prefer the pre social media days when we used to go home after a disappointing performance and defeat and just share it with a few friends, all this analytical and often counter productive debate does not improve results, just means we have to replace our keyboard on our laptops once a year (lol)!
and your drinks cabinet
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on December 05, 2018, 10:47:21 PM
Quote from: davew on December 05, 2018, 10:38:59 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 05, 2018, 10:27:42 PM
thought seri played well today
He did, but I saw him give the ball away early on, think I mentioned that on the match day thread, he is wrongly now being singled out as our weakest link, he isn't and tbh I am not sure there is 1? Our team are simply not good enough to compete with most of the other 19 teams in the PL and maybe still won't be able to even after the next transfer window. Perhaps what we should do is lower our expectations and just try and enjoy our time in the PL (me included), I never thought I would still be alive when we got back there, but now we are, I too will try and enjoy the time we are still in the league! I have posted this on my desktop to remind me of what I am saying. Got to say I prefer the pre social media days when we used to go home after a disappointing performance and defeat and just share it with a few friends, all this analytical and often counter productive debate does not improve results, just means we have to replace our keyboard on our laptops once a year (lol)!
and your drinks cabinet
That is below the belt Woolly, do you know how much it costs me to replace my drinks cabinet, let alone the contents inside it?
I thought Seri did OK - but watching him live he just seems to be going through the motions - often a yard off pace - woth both TC and RS in the middle there is too much covering for Chambers to do ... need another tough midfielder-m - imagine TC up against Pogba, Pogba will eat him alive
Quote from: davew on December 05, 2018, 10:38:59 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on December 05, 2018, 10:27:42 PM
thought seri played well today
He did, but I saw him give the ball away early on, think I mentioned that on the match day thread, he is wrongly now being singled out as our weakest link, he isn't and tbh I am not sure there is 1? Our team are simply not good enough to compete with most of the other 19 teams in the PL and maybe still won't be able to even after the next transfer window. Perhaps what we should do is lower our expectations and just try and enjoy our time in the PL (me included), I never thought I would still be alive when we got back there, but now we are, I too will try and enjoy the time we are still in the league! I have posted this on my desktop to remind me of what I am saying. Got to say I prefer the pre social media days when we used to go home after a disappointing performance and defeat and just share it with a few friends, all this analytical and often counter productive debate does not improve results, just means we have to replace our keyboard on our laptops once a year (lol)!
Disagree profoundly with the bolded part. I believe our team as it stands now has the potential to be better than at least Burnley, Cardiff, Huddersfield, Southampton Crystal Palace and Newcastle. Whether or not we will finish above at least three of them is another question, but it is not quality in our players that is lacking.
Don't think we need reinforcements, and should only go for players that is an instant improvement on the current ones. Such players are hard to come by in January, but it is of course possible. Like Clyne for example should be an improvement on Christie, and if those rumors are true I would be happy.
Quote from: Baszab on December 05, 2018, 10:55:57 PM
I thought Seri did OK - but watching him live he just seems to be going through the motions - often a yard off pace - woth both TC and RS in the middle there is too much covering for Chambers to do ... need another tough midfielder-m - imagine TC up against Pogba, Pogba will eat him alive
If he does that, it would constitute a red card! Chambers (at last in a better position that suits him) does need more support, it isn't TC and it certainly isn't RS, so I hope our scouts have somebody in mind to bring in January!
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
Quote from: Baszab on December 05, 2018, 10:55:57 PM
I thought Seri did OK - but watching him live he just seems to be going through the motions - often a yard off pace - woth both TC and RS in the middle there is too much covering for Chambers to do ... need another tough midfielder-m - imagine TC up against Pogba, Pogba will eat him alive
I do not understand this. Did you watch the game today? Seri was everywhere, winning tackles, making passes and harassing opponents into giving the ball up. I think he is a great complement to Chambers.
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
The fee we paid is irrelevant when discussing if he is good enough. We have already paid it so we will never get anything better for those millions. It doesn't matter if he plays like a big money signing. At this point it matters whether he plays good enough. I think he does most of the time, and I do get that you think he doesn't.
Seri grew in confidence after the early mix up and as the game progressed was both energetic and considered with his range of passing.
He needed that performance.
Well done Seri.
coyw
Quote from: Sting of the North on December 05, 2018, 11:07:33 PM
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
The fee we paid is irrelevant when discussing if he is good enough. We have already paid it so we will never get anything better for those millions. It doesn't matter if he plays like a big money signing. At this point it matters whether he plays good enough. I think he does most of the time, and I do get that you think he doesn't.
Off subject and what was your opinion about Rui Fonte just to give me a better insight to FFC recent signings?
Played one particularly lovely pass to Vietto I think later in the first half.
The fourth minute incident was horrible. Yes the pass he received was difficult. But here's the thing. A lot of players would instinctively know that getting something on the ball and booting to safety is non-negotiable. He didn't. He's just not comfortable with the rabid dog aggression served up in this league.
Got better though and didn't let head drop.
Quote from: davew on December 05, 2018, 11:36:22 PM
Quote from: Sting of the North on December 05, 2018, 11:07:33 PM
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
The fee we paid is irrelevant when discussing if he is good enough. We have already paid it so we will never get anything better for those millions. It doesn't matter if he plays like a big money signing. At this point it matters whether he plays good enough. I think he does most of the time, and I do get that you think he doesn't.
Off subject and what was your opinion about Rui Fonte just to give me a better insight to FFC recent signings?
I liked Rui early on, but he never seemed to really get into things. Good movement, but very little end product and got easily pushed off the ball. Never really looked like a class player in my opinion. Don't know if my opinion should matter though, but that's how I remembered it.
Seri played. better today ,but their goal was down to his get caught way out of position on the sideline,pressing the ball when he should have left that to others.Odoi is also ball watching so even this criticism is a bit harsh.
Quote from: colinwhite on December 06, 2018, 06:58:48 AM
Seri played. better today ,but their goal was down to his get caught way out of position on the sideline,pressing the ball when he should have left that to others.Odoi is also ball watching so even this criticism is a bit harsh.
I think I counted something like 6/7 players just running towards the ball, almost the whole team's positioning was terrible unfortunately
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
I think this is an excellent summary. James Maddison was 20m in comparison and will most likely be on lower wages
For sure Seri makes mistakes in a team of players who make mistakes, in a game of players who make mistakes, run by officials who make mistakes. Seri, unfortunately, now has form for his mistakes costing us goals against. Last night the early comedy of errors was a result of players not concentrating on what they need to do (indivdually and collectively as a team) to tighten up and stop making mistakes when in possession, but didn't, thanks to Rico, cost us a goal. Cannot fault Seri's workrate last night but I still struggle to justify him his place against a better natural ball winner in midfield.
This team is, IMO, still 'between managers' but we need to start regularly winning games both home and away if we are to have a chance of staying up. Our current PPG under Ranieri is right where it needs to be if we are to survive, but some of the games coming up are much tougher propositions than last night's affair. I am still waiting for signs of improvement in the cohesion of team partnerships (which is what the play between Vietto and Seri demonstrated in its absence). Chambers meanwhile pushes on relentlessly towards making football a one man show and I hope he gets the goal he deserves at Old Trafford.
Quote from: Statto on December 05, 2018, 10:16:08 PM
Did any player not give the ball away at some point in the 94 minutes?
How many more times will i see crap seri posts?
Agree Statto so many on this forum seem to have it in for Seri, he is not perfect but he tries his heart out in every game, Sess is not perfect but everyone thinks he is the 2nd Coming at times!!!
Give it a rest on the Seri front and get behind the guy 049:gif
It was Seris best game in a while for us, Thought he looked good. It's good Ranieri is keeping faith in him as I think he will only improve the more games he plays and I think come the end of the season he will be key to whether we have stayed up or not.
Seri was good. Vietto's poor pass gave the ball away.
He did, although he received it in a bad position. He does that a lot - not sure if it's him making up for others, or his own poor awareness when receiving the ball. Almost as embarrassing was Odoi falling over his own feet trying to get back. Thank goodness for Rico.
Too many of our players are not good enough for the PL and Seri is one of those, he was not responsible for early mistake but he is so light weight he is just bounced off the play so often. Vietto and Christie are also not good enough IMO.
I still think it was Seri's fault against Chelsea but it wasn't really his fault against Leicester. Poor ball to him and not really near him unlike Chelsea pass.
I decided last night to wipe the slate clean with Seri and forget his recent performances, his transfer fee and his reputation.
He worked hard had a reasonable game but gave the ball away at times but then that seems to be a trait with most of our players. Seri has yet to fully adjust to the premier league but I still wonder if we wouldn't be better of with a tough ball wining player in that deep position.
Quote from: Sting of the North on December 05, 2018, 11:54:27 PM
Quote from: davew on December 05, 2018, 11:36:22 PM
Quote from: Sting of the North on December 05, 2018, 11:07:33 PM
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
The fee we paid is irrelevant when discussing if he is good enough. We have already paid it so we will never get anything better for those millions. It doesn't matter if he plays like a big money signing. At this point it matters whether he plays good enough. I think he does most of the time, and I do get that you think he doesn't.
Off subject and what was your opinion about Rui Fonte just to give me a better insight to FFC recent signings?
I liked Rui early on, but he never seemed to really get into things. Good movement, but very little end product and got easily pushed off the ball. Never really looked like a class player in my opinion. Don't know if my opinion should matter though, but that's how I remembered it.
Admittedly a bit irrelevant but given his passion and enthusiasm I was always a big Rui fan, even if he wasn't that good. Him celebrating Mitro's goal vs Sunderland in front of the Hammy end like mad was one of last season's more underrated moments.
Yes he did lose the ball in the fourth minute - yet again, and though he was slightly better in this game than previously still think he is a very ordinary player. Cannot see a single indication of where his massive reputation comes from.
The return of players getting back their confidence will be crucial in reviving the team. But there is only so far that can take us.
We need quality reinforcements in January to avoid the trap door.
Quote from: BarneyTravers on December 05, 2018, 11:22:43 PM
Seri grew in confidence after the early mix up and as the game progressed was both energetic and considered with his range of passing.
He needed that performance.
Well done Seri.
coyw
Agree with this post, challenged back and made tackles. Did some nice touches and gave a great through ball in the second half.
Quote from: Sting of the North on December 05, 2018, 11:07:33 PM
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
The fee we paid is irrelevant when discussing if he is good enough. We have already paid it so we will never get anything better for those millions. It doesn't matter if he plays like a big money signing. At this point it matters whether he plays good enough. I think he does most of the time, and I do get that you think he doesn't.
Actually the fee and reputation do matter. They matter because somebody thought it was a good idea to aquire him and a bunch of other players that have spectacularly failed to impress. Seri was announced with a fanfare as a coup, beating others to the punch, and he was a few moments from joining Barca. Well unfortunately i think we can see why the others diodn't tru harder and Barca changed their mind.
Without his reputation I would suggest seri would be a fringe player at best. He has contributed little, loses possesion through poor first touch, being slow to react and poor passing far too often. It seems to me the pace of the prem just does not suit him, he is not used to it. Last night he was almost OK, but for a player with that price tag and fanfare I expect him to be able to stand out and make a difference.
The issue is the purchasing policy, it has been wrong since we were in our last season in the prem, it remains so. It is a pity that lessons have not been learned, I really love the owner and can see how determined he is and committed he is, but I cannot understand why he does not correct this obvious shortcoming at the club.
Quote from: ffcthereligion on December 06, 2018, 08:01:39 AM
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
I think the comparison with maddison is brilliant. We would never have purchased maddison, our recruitment team would not have managed to see him as a brilliant acquisition. It is a shame.
I think this is an excellent summary. James Maddison was 20m in comparison and will most likely be on lower wages
Quote from: fulhamben on December 05, 2018, 10:27:42 PM
thought seri played well today
Agree. Finding his feet and playing with more confidence. The fact the Cairney can count on having an outlet next to him helped Tom yesterday as well as if the pass forward isn't on he now has another option.
Whether we like it or not, we need to persevere with Cairney and Seri in the same team. At least at the commencement of the match, and see how they pan out, then if changes are necessary, then so be it.
Injuries permitting, we have to have some kind of consistent structure throughout the team, but also being mindful of not carrying passengers, we are bottom for a reason, and there is no room for feint hearts.
Quote from: nose on December 06, 2018, 12:27:30 PM
Quote from: Sting of the North on December 05, 2018, 11:07:33 PM
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
The fee we paid is irrelevant when discussing if he is good enough. We have already paid it so we will never get anything better for those millions. It doesn't matter if he plays like a big money signing. At this point it matters whether he plays good enough. I think he does most of the time, and I do get that you think he doesn't.
Actually the fee and reputation do matter. They matter because somebody thought it was a good idea to aquire him and a bunch of other players that have spectacularly failed to impress. Seri was announced with a fanfare as a coup, beating others to the punch, and he was a few moments from joining Barca. Well unfortunately i think we can see why the others diodn't tru harder and Barca changed their mind.
Without his reputation I would suggest seri would be a fringe player at best. He has contributed little, loses possesion through poor first touch, being slow to react and poor passing far too often. It seems to me the pace of the prem just does not suit him, he is not used to it. Last night he was almost OK, but for a player with that price tag and fanfare I expect him to be able to stand out and make a difference.
The issue is the purchasing policy, it has been wrong since we were in our last season in the prem, it remains so. It is a pity that lessons have not been learned, I really love the owner and can see how determined he is and committed he is, but I cannot understand why he does not correct this obvious shortcoming at the club.
Do you mean that he gets in the 11 because he was expensive and not because the managers prefer him? That would really be to question the integrity of Joca and Ranieri.
Otherwise it is still irrelevant whether or not someone cost 50 million or arrived on a free when discussing the actual performances in the light of whether or not someone is is performing well enough to deserve a spot in the team. You are instead discussing the purchasing policies. Maybe you are also discussing whether or not Seri is meeting expectations. That could be an interesting discussion, but still a completely different discussion.
I've watched the replay a couple times, and I can't help but see he actually tried to trap the ball or block off Madison. I think he needs to learn to sweep that away or slide right into the ball as he is not going to win any foot races. The pass was terrible, but in those situations it needs to be less about composure from Seri, and more about hoofing it out of danger.
he was played into trouble again . but once again he didn't hide he kept showing and kept going . still not the player that started the season though .
Quote from: filham on December 06, 2018, 10:03:31 AM
I decided last night to wipe the slate clean with Seri and forget his recent performances, his transfer fee and his reputation.
He worked hard had a reasonable game but gave the ball away at times but then that seems to be a trait with most of our players. Seri has yet to fully adjust to the premier league but I still wonder if we wouldn't be better of with a tough ball wining player in that deep position.
This.
Except for the early mistake I thought Seri had one of his better overall games.
Like you said though, a tough ball winning player in front of the defensive back four would help the teams defense overall. And with both Cairney and Chambers taking part in our attacks I don't see how a stronger defender wouldn't be preferred to Seri.
That said...Seri wasn't defensively poor yesterday. He was ok...and he had good effort.
I'm starting to think that if he starts instead of Cairney yet the team has a dedicated CDM (Chambers is playing box to box a lot) the team will be fine.
My position on Seri has changed to one of ...if he's going to play you need a player to cover more defensively. I'm going to stand by that because he's played almost every game and we still have yet to hold a clean sheet, and teams love attacking our defense right up the middle.
The goal wasn't Seri's mistake, but the ball was crossed to a position where I'd think Seri was suppose to be. Odoi and Christie were more at fault though.
Dreadful pass from vietto. So technically yes, but this time not to blame imo
Quote from: AnOldBrownie on December 06, 2018, 08:14:39 PM
Quote from: filham on December 06, 2018, 10:03:31 AM
I decided last night to wipe the slate clean with Seri and forget his recent performances, his transfer fee and his reputation.
He worked hard had a reasonable game but gave the ball away at times but then that seems to be a trait with most of our players. Seri has yet to fully adjust to the premier league but I still wonder if we wouldn't be better of with a tough ball wining player in that deep position.
This.
Except for the early mistake I thought Seri had one of his better overall games.
Like you said though, a tough ball winning player in front of the defensive back four would help the teams defense overall. And with both Cairney and Chambers taking part in our attacks I don't see how a stronger defender wouldn't be preferred to Seri.
That said...Seri wasn't defensively poor yesterday. He was ok...and he had good effort.
I'm starting to think that if he starts instead of Cairney yet the team has a dedicated CDM (Chambers is playing box to box a lot) the team will be fine.
My position on Seri has changed to one of ...if he's going to play you need a player to cover more defensively. I'm going to stand by that because he's played almost every game and we still have yet to hold a clean sheet, and teams love attacking our defense right up the middle.
The goal wasn't Seri's mistake, but the ball was crossed to a position where I'd think Seri was suppose to be. Odoi and Christie were more at fault though.
The last line - Seri was drawn utterly out of position and was stuck miles out on the left when Maddison scored, so yes he was partially to fault with yet another goal and in my opinion is a defensive liability.
Quote from: Spirit of 2000 on December 07, 2018, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: AnOldBrownie on December 06, 2018, 08:14:39 PM
Quote from: filham on December 06, 2018, 10:03:31 AM
I decided last night to wipe the slate clean with Seri and forget his recent performances, his transfer fee and his reputation.
He worked hard had a reasonable game but gave the ball away at times but then that seems to be a trait with most of our players. Seri has yet to fully adjust to the premier league but I still wonder if we wouldn't be better of with a tough ball wining player in that deep position.
This.
Except for the early mistake I thought Seri had one of his better overall games.
Like you said though, a tough ball winning player in front of the defensive back four would help the teams defense overall. And with both Cairney and Chambers taking part in our attacks I don't see how a stronger defender wouldn't be preferred to Seri.
That said...Seri wasn't defensively poor yesterday. He was ok...and he had good effort.
I'm starting to think that if he starts instead of Cairney yet the team has a dedicated CDM (Chambers is playing box to box a lot) the team will be fine.
My position on Seri has changed to one of ...if he's going to play you need a player to cover more defensively. I'm going to stand by that because he's played almost every game and we still have yet to hold a clean sheet, and teams love attacking our defense right up the middle.
The goal wasn't Seri's mistake, but the ball was crossed to a position where I'd think Seri was suppose to be. Odoi and Christie were more at fault though.
The last line - Seri was drawn utterly out of position and was stuck miles out on the left when Maddison scored, so yes he was partially to fault with yet another goal and in my opinion is a defensive liability.
If you watcgh the replay he has to close the guy down on the wing as the ball had got behind marchend and Okazaki who he was close to passed the ball to Gray, his momentum to close down Gray was the right thing to do as Mawson was deeper and would not have bbeen able to close him down and as I say MLM was further away.
(https://i.ibb.co/1dTHNb0/pic1.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/SdZZpg1/pic2.png)
Quote from: MJG on December 07, 2018, 09:39:00 AM
Quote from: Spirit of 2000 on December 07, 2018, 08:48:32 AM
Quote from: AnOldBrownie on December 06, 2018, 08:14:39 PM
Quote from: filham on December 06, 2018, 10:03:31 AM
I decided last night to wipe the slate clean with Seri and forget his recent performances, his transfer fee and his reputation.
He worked hard had a reasonable game but gave the ball away at times but then that seems to be a trait with most of our players. Seri has yet to fully adjust to the premier league but I still wonder if we wouldn't be better of with a tough ball wining player in that deep position.
This.
Except for the early mistake I thought Seri had one of his better overall games.
Like you said though, a tough ball winning player in front of the defensive back four would help the teams defense overall. And with both Cairney and Chambers taking part in our attacks I don't see how a stronger defender wouldn't be preferred to Seri.
That said...Seri wasn't defensively poor yesterday. He was ok...and he had good effort.
I'm starting to think that if he starts instead of Cairney yet the team has a dedicated CDM (Chambers is playing box to box a lot) the team will be fine.
My position on Seri has changed to one of ...if he's going to play you need a player to cover more defensively. I'm going to stand by that because he's played almost every game and we still have yet to hold a clean sheet, and teams love attacking our defense right up the middle.
The goal wasn't Seri's mistake, but the ball was crossed to a position where I'd think Seri was suppose to be. Odoi and Christie were more at fault though.
The last line - Seri was drawn utterly out of position and was stuck miles out on the left when Maddison scored, so yes he was partially to fault with yet another goal and in my opinion is a defensive liability.
If you watcgh the replay he has to close the guy down on the wing as the ball had got behind marchend and Okazaki who he was close to passed the ball to Gray, his momentum to close down Gray was the right thing to do as Mawson was deeper and would not have bbeen able to close him down and as I say MLM was further away.
(https://i.ibb.co/1dTHNb0/pic1.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/SdZZpg1/pic2.png)
Agreed. Mawson should've closed down a bit quicker. Where was Chambers at this point, Maddison was in his zone when he scored? I'm sure Chambers was probably defending too but I'd be interested to know this.
Quote from: KJS on December 06, 2018, 08:18:59 AM
Quote from: Statto on December 05, 2018, 10:16:08 PM
Did any player not give the ball away at some point in the 94 minutes?
How many more times will i see crap seri posts?
Agree Statto so many on this forum seem to have it in for Seri, he is not perfect but he tries his heart out in every game, Sess is not perfect but everyone thinks he is the 2nd Coming at times!!!
Give it a rest on the Seri front and get behind the guy 049:gif
Whatever Seri's strengths and weaknesses he emphatically was not trying his heart out every game. Be honest he was one of those who switched off in SJ's later weeks.
These stills, while interesting are misleading.
They don't show Chambers, behind Okazaki (i.e. nearer to the half-way line than Okazaki). Nor do they show the one Leicester player in the box, well marked by Christie, and Odoi near the penalty spot, frantically calling for reinforcements to cover the huge space Iborra and Maddison had to exploit.
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
(If anyone wants to view, the abbreviated highlights on the club site show the situation at around 4 mins 20)
I said on another post. He gave away or lost the ball 3 times in the first 5 minutes, I was watching him specifically how he was playing. I'm not wanting to crucify the lad , I want nothing more than him to be better than he is right now. Because I'm struggling to see any justification for what we supposed to have paid for him or how he was attracting the attention of bigger clubs than us.
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
These stills, while interesting are misleading.
They don't show Chambers, behind Okazaki (i.e. nearer to the half-way line than Okazaki). Nor do they show the one Leicester player in the box, well marked by Christie, and Odoi near the penalty spot, frantically calling for reinforcements to cover the huge space Iborra and Maddison had to exploit.
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
(If anyone wants to view, the abbreviated highlights on the club site show the situation at around 4 mins 20)
Except you are digging him out, and really rather pointlessly too. Some people want to blame every single goal on him, however tenuous the link and it's getting really boring. If he doesn't close down Gray then it gives him even more time to play in Okazaki, and you'd probably be moaning at him for not doing that if it'd been the other way round. Point is that Mawson should really have recognised the danger of the strikers movement and tracked him whilst Seri continued to close down Gray, but really it's splitting hairs because overall the play is moving at such a pace that you get a split second to make a decision, and somehow with a collective group of players who are potentially culpable, you lay the blame with one guy, probably because it's easy to scapegoat someone rather than think about it properly
Quote from: Deeping_white on December 07, 2018, 11:12:26 AM
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
These stills, while interesting are misleading.
They don't show Chambers, behind Okazaki (i.e. nearer to the half-way line than Okazaki). Nor do they show the one Leicester player in the box, well marked by Christie, and Odoi near the penalty spot, frantically calling for reinforcements to cover the huge space Iborra and Maddison had to exploit.
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
(If anyone wants to view, the abbreviated highlights on the club site show the situation at around 4 mins 20)
Except you are digging him out, and really rather pointlessly too. Some people want to blame every single goal on him, however tenuous the link and it's getting really boring. If he doesn't close down Gray then it gives him even more time to play in Okazaki, and you'd probably be moaning at him for not doing that if it'd been the other way round. Point is that Mawson should really have recognised the danger of the strikers movement and tracked him whilst Seri continued to close down Gray, but really it's splitting hairs because overall the play is moving at such a pace that you get a split second to make a decision, and somehow with a collective group of players who are potentially culpable, you lay the blame with one guy, probably because it's easy to scapegoat someone rather than think about it properly
:plus one:
Quote from: Deeping_white on December 07, 2018, 11:12:26 AM
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
These stills, while interesting are misleading.
They don't show Chambers, behind Okazaki (i.e. nearer to the half-way line than Okazaki). Nor do they show the one Leicester player in the box, well marked by Christie, and Odoi near the penalty spot, frantically calling for reinforcements to cover the huge space Iborra and Maddison had to exploit.
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
(If anyone wants to view, the abbreviated highlights on the club site show the situation at around 4 mins 20)
Except you are digging him out, and really rather pointlessly too. Some people want to blame every single goal on him, however tenuous the link and it's getting really boring. If he doesn't close down Gray then it gives him even more time to play in Okazaki, and you'd probably be moaning at him for not doing that if it'd been the other way round. Point is that Mawson should really have recognised the danger of the strikers movement and tracked him whilst Seri continued to close down Gray, but really it's splitting hairs because overall the play is moving at such a pace that you get a split second to make a decision, and somehow with a collective group of players who are potentially culpable, you lay the blame with one guy, probably because it's easy to scapegoat someone rather than think about it properly
Read my post again and try to understand please. I am not unfairly criticising him, I am saying that he made a mistake which led to a goal, and pointing out that the restricted images above are just that, restricted. That's all. All players make mistakes. eg Tom Cairney's slip and miss, AK blasting over. (And then you 'dig out' Mawson!)
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
These stills, while interesting are misleading.
They don't show Chambers, behind Okazaki (i.e. nearer to the half-way line than Okazaki). Nor do they show the one Leicester player in the box, well marked by Christie, and Odoi near the penalty spot, frantically calling for reinforcements to cover the huge space Iborra and Maddison had to exploit.
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
(If anyone wants to view, the abbreviated highlights on the club site show the situation at around 4 mins 20)
My thoughts exactly. He was only vidicated if by going wide if he stopped the attack & in his mind had a better then even chance of doing so. Otherwise his responsibility lays with staying in position and trying to get back to mark potential targets for the cross. He lacks the awareness and tactical nous for a midfielder being asked to play in a deepish role. I've said many times he's not a bad player per se - he has technical ability and would profer playing further forward in a good team that are enjoying the lions share of possession and who are usually in the ascendency during matches rather than one fighting for their lives at the wrong end of the table, in short he's the wrong player for us. If we can shift out TFM, maybe Vietto even from their loans and look to get a Drinkwater or Wanyama in - neither of which are featuring for their clubs, then that's more like what we need. I've even got hopes Anguissa may develop under Ranieri as a box to box player, but currently Chambers is undroppable at DM.
Quote from: bobbo on December 07, 2018, 11:08:31 AM
I said on another post. He gave away or lost the ball 3 times in the first 5 minutes, I was watching him specifically how he was playing. I'm not wanting to crucify the lad , I want nothing more than him to be better than he is right now. Because I'm struggling to see any justification for what we supposed to have paid for him or how he was attracting the attention of bigger clubs than us.
Some players need other good players in their team in order to play their best. Case in point Shaqiri. Also Pogba, much better when playing for France.
He's getting better and better because his team mates are too.
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
These stills, while interesting are misleading.
They don't show Chambers, behind Okazaki (i.e. nearer to the half-way line than Okazaki). Nor do they show the one Leicester player in the box, well marked by Christie, and Odoi near the penalty spot, frantically calling for reinforcements to cover the huge space Iborra and Maddison had to exploit.
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
(If anyone wants to view, the abbreviated highlights on the club site show the situation at around 4 mins 20)
If Seri didn't close him down, who would? Mawson pretty far from stopping the cross.
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
I agree Seri's decision to rush towards Gray was wrong - he should have stayed with Okazaki (it's elementary that you are supposed to keep close to the player instead of running after the ball).
But seeing it from video, Seri was running back to defend with really fast pace and would have never managed to stop right next to Okazaki, therefore made the only correct choice to pressure Gray. Chambers (who was behind Okazaki) should have tracked Okazaki but missed the moment where Gray released his pass.
Overall, as you said, it was a collective responsibility.
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 11:27:59 AM
Quote from: Deeping_white on December 07, 2018, 11:12:26 AM
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
These stills, while interesting are misleading.
They don't show Chambers, behind Okazaki (i.e. nearer to the half-way line than Okazaki). Nor do they show the one Leicester player in the box, well marked by Christie, and Odoi near the penalty spot, frantically calling for reinforcements to cover the huge space Iborra and Maddison had to exploit.
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
(If anyone wants to view, the abbreviated highlights on the club site show the situation at around 4 mins 20)
Except you are digging him out, and really rather pointlessly too. Some people want to blame every single goal on him, however tenuous the link and it's getting really boring. If he doesn't close down Gray then it gives him even more time to play in Okazaki, and you'd probably be moaning at him for not doing that if it'd been the other way round. Point is that Mawson should really have recognised the danger of the strikers movement and tracked him whilst Seri continued to close down Gray, but really it's splitting hairs because overall the play is moving at such a pace that you get a split second to make a decision, and somehow with a collective group of players who are potentially culpable, you lay the blame with one guy, probably because it's easy to scapegoat someone rather than think about it properly
Read my post again and try to understand please. I am not unfairly criticising him, I am saying that he made a mistake which led to a goal, and pointing out that the restricted images above are just that, restricted. That's all. All players make mistakes. eg Tom Cairney's slip and miss, AK blasting over. (And then you 'dig out' Mawson!)
I would advise to rewatch the match and see the behavior of our CMs when the ball is on the sidelines. They are instructed to pressure the wing...because our wings are not instructed to track back. We do this so we can counter. This is why you see Sess just stand there, and AK on the other side as well not tuck in.
Watch the video again, he's in motion running to Okazaki who passes to Gray, Seri doesn't have to stop, turn or anything socontinues to follow the path of ball towards Gray to close down (Mawson wasnt on his toes to close down and had to guard teh space around him and MLM was pretty static).
IF he had suddenly stopped then I can 100% guarantee people would be moaning he didn't run to close Gray down. Its fair play to Gray with his quick pass back to a player who still had to get past Chambers and Mawson to get cross in and he did.
Quote from: Moltobueno on December 07, 2018, 11:35:24 AM
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
I agree Seri's decision to rush towards Gray was wrong - he should have stayed with Okazaki (it's elementary that you are supposed to keep close to the player instead of running after the ball).
But seeing it from video, Seri was running back to defend with really fast pace and would have never managed to stop right next to Okazaki, therefore made the only correct choice to pressure Gray. Chambers (who was behind Okazaki) should have tracked Okazaki but missed the moment where Gray released his pass.
Overall, as you said, it was a collective responsibility.
This
Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on December 07, 2018, 11:32:22 AM
Quote from: Southcoastffc on December 07, 2018, 10:55:01 AM
These stills, while interesting are misleading.
They don't show Chambers, behind Okazaki (i.e. nearer to the half-way line than Okazaki). Nor do they show the one Leicester player in the box, well marked by Christie, and Odoi near the penalty spot, frantically calling for reinforcements to cover the huge space Iborra and Maddison had to exploit.
I am not 'digging out' Seri, but he was wrong to rush in to try and close down Gray (No 7). He left his man (Okazaki) and Gray simply dinked the ball past him to Okazaki, and Seri's momentum took him beyond Gray and out of the game.
Seri was culpable for the goal, we had 3 (arguably 4 with Chambers a little behind the play) players covering 2. Once he rushed past Gray it was 2 on 2 with one of those 2 Leicester players in the clear.
It was a collective responsibility but had Seri been more composed we might have contained the situation.
(If anyone wants to view, the abbreviated highlights on the club site show the situation at around 4 mins 20)
If Seri didn't close him down, who would? Mawson pretty far from stopping the Cross.
But my point is THE WAY he tried to close him down. It was a bit like someone rashly diving into a tackle instead of standing off until the right moment. He lost composure. It happens.
Well we appear to have selected our scape goat for the season.
Quote from: Sting of the North on December 06, 2018, 01:12:43 PM
Quote from: nose on December 06, 2018, 12:27:30 PM
Quote from: Sting of the North on December 05, 2018, 11:07:33 PM
Quote from: nose on December 05, 2018, 11:04:29 PM
seri came with a massive reputation...
in reality at best he is ordinary and under pressure has no fist touch. loses possesion with alarming regularity
when he has space and time and under no pressure can pick a pass and flatters to decieve
IMO he is a waste of money, i have seen much worse than seri but for the reported fee surely there is much better
the fact tonight was a better/improved performance speaks volumes for how poor he has been rather than a measure of how good he is.
that is my opinion based on seeing him in the flesh all season.
The fee we paid is irrelevant when discussing if he is good enough. We have already paid it so we will never get anything better for those millions. It doesn't matter if he plays like a big money signing. At this point it matters whether he plays good enough. I think he does most of the time, and I do get that you think he doesn't.
Actually the fee and reputation do matter. They matter because somebody thought it was a good idea to aquire him and a bunch of other players that have spectacularly failed to impress. Seri was announced with a fanfare as a coup, beating others to the punch, and he was a few moments from joining Barca. Well unfortunately i think we can see why the others diodn't tru harder and Barca changed their mind.
Without his reputation I would suggest seri would be a fringe player at best. He has contributed little, loses possesion through poor first touch, being slow to react and poor passing far too often. It seems to me the pace of the prem just does not suit him, he is not used to it. Last night he was almost OK, but for a player with that price tag and fanfare I expect him to be able to stand out and make a difference.
The issue is the purchasing policy, it has been wrong since we were in our last season in the prem, it remains so. It is a pity that lessons have not been learned, I really love the owner and can see how determined he is and committed he is, but I cannot understand why he does not correct this obvious shortcoming at the club.
Do you mean that he gets in the 11 because he was expensive and not because the managers prefer him? That would really be to question the integrity of Joca and Ranieri.
Otherwise it is still irrelevant whether or not someone cost 50 million or arrived on a free when discussing the actual performances in the light of whether or not someone is is performing well enough to deserve a spot in the team. You are instead discussing the purchasing policies. Maybe you are also discussing whether or not Seri is meeting expectations. That could be an interesting discussion, but still a completely different discussion.
I honestly do see what you are saying and there is no easy and straightforward answer because in the end we are all supporters and emotion kicks in. For me it is two part. First is he worth the money? the answer is clearly so far absolutely not. Then your point kicks in in that are the managers picking him because of the fee and I do not think so. I suspect they are seeing things that do not make sense to me. I do also know in games that seri was subsituted, we got worse. But he surely is not making the impact his reputation and fee suggested he would.
I think in trying to sensibly answer your point, if I ignore the fee/reputation do I think he is worth his place in the first 11, the answer is no, not really. There are always players that are selected by various managers that leave supporters wondering how they get selected. I think seri may be one such. He is O, a squad player aat best based on whta he has done so far, and we are well into the season.
I didn't think much of chambers, but in moving to central midfield he made an immediate difference, we all saw that. seri has not made a difference, a couple of decent and clever passes does not a regular first teamer make. he is caught in possession far too often, gives the ball away far too often and rarely makes a proper challenge. He also tends to give up far too often when we lose the ball and that is unforgiveable.
Maybe if he has a better game or two he will get his mojo back, but he hasn't sparkled.
