Being in the PL last year I didnt follow the Championship and am therefore a bit ignorant to Konsa.
I do know he's tall, relatively fast and had a few England u21 appearances. Brentford are getting in two new CB apparently. Are these upgrades or to replace Konsa leaving? If it's the former and we're looking to win the league, surely we can do better?
We'd probably pay more than £5 million for Konsa, so it'd be a replacement.
Brentford have done well in managing to replace their sold players. Last year they sold Mepham and Egan and managed to replace them with Konsa and Janvier. Now Konsa is rumoured to be going for three times as much as they got him for.
I'd personally rate Jansson higher than Konsa, but I can't say I've seen a lot of Brentford games over the last year.
Konsa is better on the ball and in interceptions which is better with the way we play better than say jansson who is more vocal and physical. Konsa is young so has a lot of upside to him. I would be going all out of this guy, played very well against the top 6 in the championship
I know nothing about any of the 3 CBs but the maths seems wrong to me. If the speculation is correct, Brentford buy 2x good CBs then ask us to pay more than their outlay on 2 to buy 1. It has been said before on here, we should consider acquiring Brentford's scouting network as they seem to unearth gems every year
Also. I thought their Chairman has previously said he will not sell to us. If so we can forget about any incoming from Brentford
Quote from: FFC73 on July 07, 2019, 04:30:53 PM
Also. I thought their Chairman has previously said he will not sell to us. If so we can forget about any incoming from Brentford
Never heard that myself. Not sure why they'd be against it, we haven't screwed them on any transfers and they've sold to teams competing with them before.
Quote from: Tabby on July 07, 2019, 04:43:05 PM
Quote from: FFC73 on July 07, 2019, 04:30:53 PM
Also. I thought their Chairman has previously said he will not sell to us. If so we can forget about any incoming from Brentford
Never heard that myself. Not sure why they'd be against it, we haven't screwed them on any transfers and they've sold to teams competing with them before.
Plus the Button transfer
Quote from: FFC73 on July 07, 2019, 04:30:53 PM
I know nothing about any of the 3 CBs but the maths seems wrong to me. If the speculation is correct, Brentford buy 2x good CBs then ask us to pay more than their outlay on 2 to buy 1. It has been said before on here, we should consider acquiring Brentford's scouting network as they seem to unearth gems every year
Also. I thought their Chairman has previously said he will not sell to us. If so we can forget about any incoming from Brentford
I find that hard to believe , I bet if we got the amount high enough they wouldn't be bothered about the colour of the money.
Quote from: filham on July 07, 2019, 06:46:54 PM
Quote from: FFC73 on July 07, 2019, 04:30:53 PM
I know nothing about any of the 3 CBs but the maths seems wrong to me. If the speculation is correct, Brentford buy 2x good CBs then ask us to pay more than their outlay on 2 to buy 1. It has been said before on here, we should consider acquiring Brentford's scouting network as they seem to unearth gems every year
Also. I thought their Chairman has previously said he will not sell to us. If so we can forget about any incoming from Brentford
I find that hard to believe , I bet if we got the amount high enough they wouldn't be bothered about the colour of the money.
Think he has a release clause in his contract and them Brentford scout use a lot of stats
Quote from: Nero on July 07, 2019, 10:41:15 PM
Quote from: filham on July 07, 2019, 06:46:54 PM
Quote from: FFC73 on July 07, 2019, 04:30:53 PM
I know nothing about any of the 3 CBs but the maths seems wrong to me. If the speculation is correct, Brentford buy 2x good CBs then ask us to pay more than their outlay on 2 to buy 1. It has been said before on here, we should consider acquiring Brentford's scouting network as they seem to unearth gems every year
Also. I thought their Chairman has previously said he will not sell to us. If so we can forget about any incoming from Brentford
I find that hard to believe , I bet if we got the amount high enough they wouldn't be bothered about the colour of the money.
Think he has a release clause in his contract and them Brentford scout use a lot of stats
Correct, £12 million
Quote from: Riversider on July 07, 2019, 10:54:28 PM
Quote from: Nero on July 07, 2019, 10:41:15 PM
Quote from: filham on July 07, 2019, 06:46:54 PM
Quote from: FFC73 on July 07, 2019, 04:30:53 PM
I know nothing about any of the 3 CBs but the maths seems wrong to me. If the speculation is correct, Brentford buy 2x good CBs then ask us to pay more than their outlay on 2 to buy 1. It has been said before on here, we should consider acquiring Brentford's scouting network as they seem to unearth gems every year
Also. I thought their Chairman has previously said he will not sell to us. If so we can forget about any incoming from Brentford
I find that hard to believe , I bet if we got the amount high enough they wouldn't be bothered about the colour of the money.
Think he has a release clause in his contract and them Brentford scout use a lot of stats
Correct, £12 million
Would we be better off getting a both CB and RB for £12 million combined?
Didnt their chairman state a few seasons back that they would never sell to us, cant see him changing his views on that
Quote from: FFC73 on July 07, 2019, 04:30:53 PM
I know nothing about any of the 3 CBs but the maths seems wrong to me. If the speculation is correct, Brentford buy 2x good CBs then ask us to pay more than their outlay on 2 to buy 1. It has been said before on here, we should consider acquiring Brentford's scouting network as they seem to unearth gems every year
Also. I thought their Chairman has previously said he will not sell to us. If so we can forget about any incoming from Brentford
Read a fascinating article about how they got rid of their academy and replaced it with signing up and giving second chances to the best young players that get let go from premiership academies which may explain their better squad and pipeline of players.
Apparently Mepham came through this model
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2017/apr/05/brentford-ditched-their-academy-premier-league-outcasts
I've always been left slightly at odds with the value of academies and always also thought it'd be good to introduce an open trials for premier league clubs over the summer for scouting purposes as there's a lot more talent and age becomes a bit more of a negligible thing.
Didn't evra and or vidic get plucked out of obscurity and a similar story with Drogba?
One of the players Brentford have purchased is a lad called Pinnock from Barnsley. If they got him for £3M as reported he's a steal. Has Prem quality written all over him.
For people unfamiliar to players, it's perhaps easiest to make a player comparison. The most fitting is probably Rio Ferdinand (and that's been mentioned before), he's a little shorter but has really good pace and athleticism for the position and a comfortable ball player (third in the division for passing accuracy and sixth for passes completed - both in terms of the centre back position).
I'm local to Charlton, have Charlton supporting family and live near their training ground, I've been aware of Konsa for years and thought he was an excellent signing for Brentford a year ago. Same applies to Joe Aribo who moved to Rangers this summer (he'll be a stud) and Karlan Grant (who moved to Huddersfield in January and finished their top scorer). Konsa has a higher ceiling than Jansson or Hector but isn't as polished right now. He only turns 22 in October which is a baby for the position and would be one of the younger players in the squad.
And I think the owner not selling to us is a myth, since he's been there they've had Marcello Trotta on loan and sold David Button to us.
We have over recent years signed centre backs that have failed us, we need to be certain that the next centre back signing really is an outstanding player. There has to be no doubt that he is clearly better than Ream, Le Marchand, Mawson and Odoi.
We really do not need a bench warmer.
Quote from: General on July 08, 2019, 02:24:18 PM
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2017/apr/05/brentford-ditched-their-academy-premier-league-outcasts
I've always been left slightly at odds with the value of academies and always also thought it'd be good to introduce an open trials for premier league clubs over the summer for scouting purposes as there's a lot more talent and age becomes a bit more of a negligible thing.
Didn't evra and or vidic get plucked out of obscurity and a similar story with Drogba?
This does happen but can't comment on actual in-house club trial days.
Players who are released do attend a weeks trial session usually at St. George's park where club scouts are in attendance. There is also a number of privatised trial days for players in a similar situation. It happens for US college scholarship trials so would be a good model for player pipeline.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Quote from: filham on July 08, 2019, 07:05:47 PM
We have over recent years signed centre backs that have failed us, we need to be certain that the next centre back signing really is an outstanding player. There has to be no doubt that he is clearly better than Ream, Le Marchand, Mawson and Odoi.
We really do not need a bench warmer.
Absolutely. All 4 mentioned are probably good Championship players. Any signings should be intended to improve the squad, not simply fill it out. And Brentford supporters I know do not rate him highly. That doesn't mean he isn't that good, but very often supporters who go every week can offer good insight.
Quote from: fulhamben on July 08, 2019, 02:00:30 PM
Didnt their chairman state a few seasons back that they would never sell to us, cant see him changing his views on that
If there's a release clause I believe he doesn't have a choice?
Quote from: Dr Quinzel on July 09, 2019, 10:45:20 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 08, 2019, 02:00:30 PM
Didnt their chairman state a few seasons back that they would never sell to us, cant see him changing his views on that
If there's a release clause I believe he doesn't have a choice?
Hasn't this been brought up before and there was no evidence of it? Including deals done with us whilst he was there?
Quote from: MikeW on July 08, 2019, 04:23:26 PM
One of the players Brentford have purchased is a lad called Pinnock from Barnsley. If they got him for £3M as reported he's a steal. Has Prem quality written all over him.
Pinnock played at the 3rd level last season so is not included in Khan's statistical model. I don't know if that's still relevant but I fail to understand how a 2nd Division player in Belgium better than a 3rd Division player in England.
Yes, we've done deals with Brentford recently so it doesn't seem to be true.
Quote from: Two Ton Ted on July 09, 2019, 11:47:26 AM
Quote from: MikeW on July 08, 2019, 04:23:26 PM
One of the players Brentford have purchased is a lad called Pinnock from Barnsley. If they got him for £3M as reported he's a steal. Has Prem quality written all over him.
Pinnock played at the 3rd level last season so is not included in Khan's statistical model. I don't know if that's still relevant but I fail to understand how a 2nd Division player in Belgium better than a 3rd Division player in England.
I've had the same question myself.
If Konsa joins Fulham, how quickly should Scotty be playing him in the Matchday 18 and then Starting XI? How long before he is picked ahead of Denis Odoi and/or Tim Ream?
I'm probably the one person that's not worried about players coming in as I don't trust the recruitment department at the club to get it right.
Quote from: hovewhite on July 10, 2019, 06:31:53 AM
I'm probably the one person that's not worried about players coming in as I don't trust the recruitment department at the club to get it right.
Much depends on "Second Season Recruits" that make up the back four
Cyrus Christie
Alfie Mawson
Maxime Le Marchand
Joe Bryan
Quote from: The Rational Fan on July 10, 2019, 07:21:39 AM
Quote from: hovewhite on July 10, 2019, 06:31:53 AM
I'm probably the one person that's not worried about players coming in as I don't trust the recruitment department at the club to get it right.
Much depends on "Second Season Recruits" that make up the back four
Cyrus Christie
Alfie Mawson
Maxime Le Marchand
Joe Bryan
We have to replace Christie surely?....Fredricks was vital to so much of our build up play in our last 2 Championship campaigns and we never replaced him with anyone similar. Christie never filled that role and is not good enough unfortunately.
So many on here say that there's ability in the youngsters but at the same time they want TK to buy replacements,Christie is very good at championship level also any incoming players then it should be and informed decision rubber stamped by Parker.
Quote from: hovewhite on July 10, 2019, 06:31:53 AM
I'm probably the one person that's not worried about players coming in as I don't trust the recruitment department at the club to get it right.
Actually the more I think about it, the more I am feeling the same way as you about it.
Only 24 days to go before the first League match, the less players transferred out the better, and the sands of time being reduced as each day goes by.
However, I am convinced we need another CB, but he has to be better than what we already have. Another winger with plenty of pace.
My biggest concern is our weaknesses at set pieces which I hope are being addressed.
The lack of height and physicality is a worry as is not having enough leaders on the pitch. These issues also need to be addressed as well as a strong mentality.
So there are many other ways we can help strengthen the team to make up for the players TK brought in who were mentally and physically weak, and lacked the will to win, who extinguished the heart beat of the team last season, and did not play within the framework of the team. Instead at the time sacking himself, he sacked Slavisa the one man that got us promoted, despite having nuisance number one the owners son interfering, which tells you more about TK than it does Slavisa, yes the same TK who tried to cover up his best mate CK intolerable arrogant inadequacies at the expense of Fulham, until CK fell on his own sword in a fit of tantrums one Monday afternoon at MP which caused the Constabulary to be called by CK himself, yes that's right the same TK.
But I fully agree with your statement, and therefore come August 3rd, with the odd quality additions, if lessons have been learned, we may stand a chance of a decent start, but a week in football can be a long time. .
It's all academic now - he's gone to Villa for 21m
Thou
Quote from: Mike the White on July 10, 2019, 10:12:40 PM
It's all academic now - he's gone to Villa for 21m
Thought it was 12 million. Release clause was that so they'd be mental to pay almost double.
He got the 1 n 2 in wrong way round.😵
You're correct - finger trouble I meant 12 M
Quote from: BigbadBillyMcKinley on July 10, 2019, 10:18:11 PM
ThouQuote from: Mike the White on July 10, 2019, 10:12:40 PM
It's all academic now - he's gone to Villa for 12m
Thought it was 12 million. Release clause was that so they'd be mental to pay almost double.
It seems clear every club thinks he is worth 12m, so it's really just which club he wants to play for. If he wants to play premier league, another team will get him.
Quote from: Maidstone Lee on July 10, 2019, 10:21:00 AM
Quote from: The Rational Fan on July 10, 2019, 07:21:39 AM
Quote from: hovewhite on July 10, 2019, 06:31:53 AM
I'm probably the one person that's not worried about players coming in as I don't trust the recruitment department at the club to get it right.
Much depends on "Second Season Recruits" that make up the back four
Cyrus Christie
Alfie Mawson
Maxime Le Marchand
Joe Bryan
We have to replace Christie surely?....Fredricks was vital to so much of our build up play in our last 2 Championship campaigns and we never replaced him with anyone similar. Christie never filled that role and is not good enough unfortunately.
we have to replace Christie
Quote from: St Eve on July 11, 2019, 01:43:06 AM
Quote from: Maidstone Lee on July 10, 2019, 10:21:00 AM
Quote from: The Rational Fan on July 10, 2019, 07:21:39 AM
Quote from: hovewhite on July 10, 2019, 06:31:53 AM
I'm probably the one person that's not worried about players coming in as I don't trust the recruitment department at the club to get it right.
Much depends on "Second Season Recruits" that make up the back four
Cyrus Christie
Alfie Mawson
Maxime Le Marchand
Joe Bryan
We have to replace Christie surely?....Fredricks was vital to so much of our build up play in our last 2 Championship campaigns and we never replaced him with anyone similar. Christie never filled that role and is not good enough unfortunately.
we have to replace Christie
Slavisa obviously doesn't think there is a huge difference between Fredericks and Christie at RB, as he played both players in three of the last six championship games (including the Aston Villa playoff final). I'll beat anything our defense and midfield solidity won't be our problem this season. Unless we can strengthen the squad see our major problem will be bringing on attacking talent at the end of games to break deadlocks.
My biggest concern is Kebano and Fonte will be bench players every game and when there is one injuries will be in the starting XI, they are good squad players not more. Rui Fonte is a component player and can be relied upon especially if we are already ahead to get us further ahead, but he is not a player to breakdown teams that are "parking the bus" (which is what lower table championship teams do), because he is not good enough to score while double marked.
Rui Fonte statistics for 17/18 Rui Fonte (available not required) PL 14 W 10 D 3 L 1 Pts 33 Pts/Game 2.36 (estimated position 1st)
Rui Fonte (sub on) PL 11 W 7, D 1, L 3 Pts 22 Pts/Game 2.00 (estimated position 2nd)
Rui Fonte (starting XI) PL 16 W 7, D 5, L 4 Pts 26 Pts/Game 1.65 (estimated position 6th)
Rui Fonte (not available) PL 5 W 1 D 4 L 0 Pts 7 Pts/Game 1.40 (estimated position 12th)
So Fonte when starting or sub he helped us stay on track for a playoff place, but when we don't need him at all we are championship winners.
Quote from: St Eve on July 11, 2019, 01:43:06 AM
Quote from: Maidstone Lee on July 10, 2019, 10:21:00 AM
Quote from: The Rational Fan on July 10, 2019, 07:21:39 AM
Quote from: hovewhite on July 10, 2019, 06:31:53 AM
I'm probably the one person that's not worried about players coming in as I don't trust the recruitment department at the club to get it right.
Much depends on "Second Season Recruits" that make up the back four
Cyrus Christie
Alfie Mawson
Maxime Le Marchand
Joe Bryan
We have to replace Christie surely?....Fredricks was vital to so much of our build up play in our last 2 Championship campaigns and we never replaced him with anyone similar. Christie never filled that role and is not good enough unfortunately.
we have to replace Christie
If we have to replace Christie because he wasn't PL level, we best go about replacing our whole defence.
Shame about this one, really wanted this one over the line but we need to get hector over line now
Think Villa could struggle this season:
Mings - always likely to lose his head
Konsa - prone to lapses of concentration
Both of these will be puinished severly in the premier league
Quote from: Facts Not Fiction on July 11, 2019, 09:47:18 AM
Quote from: St Eve on July 11, 2019, 01:43:06 AM
Quote from: Maidstone Lee on July 10, 2019, 10:21:00 AM
Quote from: The Rational Fan on July 10, 2019, 07:21:39 AM
Quote from: hovewhite on July 10, 2019, 06:31:53 AM
I'm probably the one person that's not worried about players coming in as I don't trust the recruitment department at the club to get it right.
Much depends on "Second Season Recruits" that make up the back four
Cyrus Christie
Alfie Mawson
Maxime Le Marchand
Joe Bryan
We have to replace Christie surely?....Fredricks was vital to so much of our build up play in our last 2 Championship campaigns and we never replaced him with anyone similar. Christie never filled that role and is not good enough unfortunately.
we have to replace Christie
If we have to replace Christie because he wasn't PL level, we best go about replacing our whole defence.
Not sure he is championship level. Derby and Boro moved him on. As for the defence hopefully Mawson and Bryan will work out but there is a big question mark over the others
Quote from: dgnffc on July 11, 2019, 10:47:56 AM
Think Villa could struggle this season:
Mings - always likely to lose his head
Konsa - prone to lapses of concentration
Both of these will be puinished severly in the premier league
Doubt they'll struggle on set pieces. Unfortunately with our current squad I can't say the same.
On the day Fulham made their first signings last season, Villa are about to conclude their 8th.
I know we had the World Cup to contend with, but never the less, it's a stark contrast.
