'When you dig deeper... who has more "REAL" quality...

[Chesh]

Just because we beat a side a couple of times in a season does not make us suddenly a better team than them.

You can't ignore history, because a lot of Liverpool's history also gives them far superior potential than us.

Yes, we have a chance of beating them on the pitch, but I disagree that we are on a season long par with them, or in terms of current potential. You only have to look at the bookies odds for the coming season to demonstrate that (and they are not always far wrong).

I have always stood up for me team and would gladly argue our position with any like minded QPR fan for example, but sorry not Liverpool just yet.  

[ImperialWhite]

Goal difference... and we beat them both times...

Also, not saying it is right but who in the Prem actually cares about the FA and League Cup anymore unless you actually make it to the semis and can smell a chance at European place...

Does winning the League Cup and smelling (tasting?) European football count?

[MJG]

Here's the two first team squads, make your own mind up

[Jack Fulham]

I don't really understand this argument? who has a better playing squad?

It's quite clear that Liverpool have a better squad than us and yes we did beat them at the Cottage but we're capable of beating most teams at Craven Cottage regardless of whether they have a better squad than us. The Anfield victory was good but we did face quite a weak Liverpool team as they had the cup final at the weekend.

To put it simply just get our h2h record vs Liverpool and league table finishes vs Liverpool during our time in the prem and you will establish who is better.

I don't think you should accuse people of 'drinking a media koolaide' when accepting that Liverpool are in a better position than us at the moment and more likely to achieve success. It is fairly reasonable analysis.

[mccscratch]

Most you have completely clouded the argument which was set forth on the original post... in a way it has sort of proven my theory...

all of you just assume that they are better than us on the pitch.... I asked you to throw out history and ignore the flashy names that are shoved down your throat by the media who cover them 5-10 times more than us... but you can't do it... and instead call me delusional because I think outside of the striker position... our squad is just as capable as theirs...

You brought up Agger and Skrtel... oh what golden god footballers they are.... actually they are no better than Brede and I would certainly take Brede for the money...

You brought up Lucas... he is bloody brilliant, I would have him any day... actually he is recovering from cruciate injury and I doubt he will be anywhere near as good this season....

You brought up Reina.... he is world class.... well guess what so is Schwarzer

I just think we at Fulham have so many supporters with a giant inferiority complex.... except when it comes to Hull, QPR, Brentford and the like....

Those days of the club are over.... we are not relegation fodder anymore... we are an established top 10 side, we have one of the most talented teams that club has had...certainly in the Premier League era

We are on the way up... they are on the way down.... obviously their history and ambition will be different but in the here and now.... I feel we are nearly just as strong and for a half or even a quarter of the money...

[zzamora]

Most you have completely clouded the argument which was set forth on the original post... in a way it has sort of proven my theory...

all of you just assume that they are better than us on the pitch.... I asked you to throw out history and ignore the flashy names that are shoved down your throat by the media who cover them 5-10 times more than us... but you can't do it... and instead call me delusional because I think outside of the striker position... our squad is just as capable as theirs...

You brought up Agger and Skrtel... oh what golden god footballers they are.... actually they are no better than Brede and I would certainly take Brede for the money...

You brought up Lucas... he is bloody brilliant, I would have him any day... actually he is recovering from cruciate injury and I doubt he will be anywhere near as good this season....

You brought up Reina.... he is world class.... well guess what so is Schwarzer

I just think we at Fulham have so many supporters with a giant inferiority complex.... except when it comes to Hull, QPR, Brentford and the like....

Those days of the club are over.... we are not relegation fodder anymore... we are an established top 10 side, we have one of the most talented teams that club has had...certainly in the Premier League era

We are on the way up... they are on the way down.... obviously their history and ambition will be different but in the here and now.... I feel we are nearly just as strong and for a half or even a quarter of the money...

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[ImperialWhite]

mccscratch I bet £10 (or $15) that Liverpool finish higher than Fulham next season. On?

[mccscratch]

mccscratch I bet £10 (or $15) that Liverpool finish higher than Fulham next season. On?

why bet you when I am getting better odds with the bookies...

Also to whomever said... just look at the books and see who is favored....Bookies are not always judging who is better overall when they put up pre-season place and win total futures... they are setting a number where they think the public will bet evenly on both sides... Man United, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and City will always have inflated numbers compared with other teams because they are everyone's "favorite" clubs in the UK and abroad... bandwagon fans normally pick on of those 5 to support...

[west kowloon white]

And Manager-know who I would rate-no disrespect to the Reading reject-he's got the almost impossible job n wish him well as long as they finish well below us-which IS possible...will dream on...In Jol I trust..

[ImperialWhite]

...Liverpool have finished... above us... for virtually every season in their history... including... every... season... since we were most recently... promoted... finished in two cup finals last... season... won a trophy... fill Anfield... greater capacity to pay wages... on par last season... but was still a bad season for them... good for us....

...

Liverpool 11/12 - bad season the manager is sacked and the team is ridiculed.
Fulham 11/12 - great season after a difficult start Jol is praised for his work.

BOTH finished on 52 points. What does that say?

It says that Liverpool FC had a poorer than average season and can be expected to do better, and that Fulham had a decent season, about par. I.e. that Liverpool's par is higher than Fulham's par. Because they have better players. And can afford to buy better players.

mccscratch I bet £10 (or $15) that Liverpool finish higher than Fulham next season. On?

Also to whomever said... just look at the books and see who is favored....Bookies are not always judging who is better overall when they put up pre-season place and win total futures... they are setting a number where they think the public will bet evenly on both sides... Man United, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and City will always have inflated numbers compared with other teams because they are everyone's "favorite" clubs in the UK and abroad... bandwagon fans normally pick on of those 5 to support...

True but irrelevant.

The better side still gets shorter odds. Punters aren't that biased.

[mccscratch]

...Liverpool have finished... above us... for virtually every season in their history... including... every... season... since we were most recently... promoted... finished in two cup finals last... season... won a trophy... fill Anfield... greater capacity to pay wages... on par last season... but was still a bad season for them... good for us....

...

Liverpool 11/12 - bad season the manager is sacked and the team is ridiculed.
Fulham 11/12 - great season after a difficult start Jol is praised for his work.

BOTH finished on 52 points. What does that say?

It says that Liverpool FC had a poorer than average season and can be expected to do better, and that Fulham had a decent season, about par. I.e. that Liverpool's par is higher than Fulham's par. Because they have better players. And can afford to buy better players.

mccscratch I bet £10 (or $15) that Liverpool finish higher than Fulham next season. On?

Also to whomever said... just look at the books and see who is favored....Bookies are not always judging who is better overall when they put up pre-season place and win total futures... they are setting a number where they think the public will bet evenly on both sides... Man United, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool and City will always have inflated numbers compared with other teams because they are everyone's "favorite" clubs in the UK and abroad... bandwagon fans normally pick on of those 5 to support...

True but irrelevant.

The better side still gets shorter odds. Punters aren't that biased.

Considering I work in the sports betting business... I can tell you that true non-biased punters only make up about 1/4 of the betting public... hence the reason the books inflate prices on more popular teams as they know they can and have to raise the numbers a bit higher...

So say we expect Chelsea to end on 70... they would put them at almost 80 because they know at 70 pts they would get a ton more action on them to achieve more than 70 and thus put themselves at risk if they did it... (as it turns out they are listed at 78, did not know that actually, I say well under that)

[HatterDon]

If Liverpool had had Rodgers or Hodgson last season, they'd have finished well up the table. You can use any yardstick you like, but the results are the same.

1. Liverpool are a bigger club than we are.
2. Liverpool is 1000 times more likely to get into the Champions League within the next 3 seasons than we are.

McS, I love my club, but just because I think Fulham is the greatest sporting franchise in the world doesn't mean that I think we can accomplish more than any sporting franchise in the world. I HATE the Yankees and the RedSox, but I have to admit that they are much more likely to succeed each season than the Orioles and the Astros, the two teams I follow.

[mccscratch]

If Liverpool had had Rodgers or Hodgson last season, they'd have finished well up the table. You can use any yardstick you like, but the results are the same.

1. Liverpool are a bigger club than we are.
2. Liverpool is 1000 times more likely to get into the Champions League within the next 3 seasons than we are.

McS, I love my club, but just because I think Fulham is the greatest sporting franchise in the world doesn't mean that I think we can accomplish more than any sporting franchise in the world. I HATE the Yankees and the RedSox, but I have to admit that they are much more likely to succeed each season than the Orioles and the Astros, the two teams I follow.

First off, congrats to your O's for being only 1.5 games back in the wild card race. I used the D Rays example earlier. They have become almost a mainstay in the AL East race each year despite being much smaller than the Yanks. Fulham can be that. Maybe not every year because of our size and ambition but I think we are almost as good as Liverpool are THIS season.

[west kowloon white]

That we are even comparing the two clubs says alot about how far we have come.
They have not done much business, as yet, in the market (and Dempsey not a world beater).Believe we have a better manager in Jol-but wouldn't put much more than a fiver on us finishing higher.Interesting discussion though-and a very interesting season to come-the top few apart-bottom half will be very very interesting-and we will prob be amongst that lot....

[Terry Angus]

That we are even comparing the two clubs says alot about how far we have come.
They have not done much business, as yet, in the market (and Dempsey not a world beater).Believe we have a better manager in Jol-but wouldn't put much more than a fiver on us finishing higher.Interesting discussion though-and a very interesting season to come-the top few apart-bottom half will be very very interesting-and we will prob be amongst that lot....

agreed.

people are being a little unfair on the original poster who was talking about our respective current players only--not which of us is the bigger club. personally, if i had to pick a best xi from our combined squads, i'd probably have dembele, ruiz, dempsey, hangeland and maybe schwarzer and riise in there, making it about 4-6 fulham and 5-7 liverpool, which isn't a huge difference

[SmithyFFC]

Sorry, but no way Brede is better than Agger. Agger is up there with the world's best.

and Brede isn't?...

[Mr Fulham]

Sorry, but no way Brede is better than Agger. Agger is up there with the world's best.

and Brede isn't?...

Nope. I think he isn't. Don't get me wrong, I love Brede, he's great, but to say he's one of the world's best CBs is quite ridiculous IMHO.

[Terry Angus]

-------------------schwarzer/reina

--johnson--------agger-------hangeland---jose enrique/riise

--------------lucas-------------dembele

----ruiz---------------gerrard-------------dempsey

------------------suarez

liv: 5-7 players
ful: 4-6 players

fact

[Mr Fulham]

fact

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[EJL]

fact

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