MERGED: Without Berbatov with Berbatov

[CanadianCottager]

i agree re the edge of our area, but the he should be left where he is best up top and doing his thing. when he did that at the start he was dynamite. for me it highlights we need some players in moidfield to create so he can do what he does best

If it is the manager telling him to play on the edge of his own box and not run and not make a run after he passes I will let him off but I have a feeling it is the man himself choosing to do this. Berba is a hard one for me. I love his ability but just not sure his work rate suits a mid to bottom table club.

To be fair iirc Jol has been asking him to play creative mid ever since Ruiz got injured, what I don't get is why Jol is still expecting Berba to pull the strings when he's clearly not as good at Ruiz at it, even shifting Ruiz to holding mid against Wigan to accomodate Berba at the 10 position.

[God The Mechanic]

He did get clobbered a few times in he match against Wigan, think one of them was when Rami got injured too.

[Bassey the warrior]

All i was meaning to suggest is that with Berba in the side all of our play revolves around him...perhaps with him being absent more players will try a few inventive things to score.

Disagree. Him and Ruiz share the play. They are the only creative players, it's natural they will dominate the ball. If you recall Murphy used to as well but he never got all this criticism for it.

[God The Mechanic]

All i was meaning to suggest is that with Berba in the side all of our play revolves around him...perhaps with him being absent more players will try a few inventive things to score.

Disagree. Him and Ruiz share the play. They are the only creative players, it's natural they will dominate the ball. If you recall Murphy used to as well but he never got all this criticism for it.

Murphy also gave the ball away an absolute truckload last year and didn't get any criticism.  Granted he did have a fair amount of goodwill on his side :P

[Bassey the warrior]

He runs around a lot actually and he hasn't had a rest. He's not used to running around as much as he has had to in his role here. The Berba bashing is just a bit daft, even when he's having one of his poorer games he's still one of our top players.

[Riverside]

Would have liked to see Ruiz behind Petric again .

[Enter the Frei]

Our best players will get the most of the ball, thats the way it goes and I think everyone would admit that our most talented players are Ruiz and Berbs so they will get most of the ball.

[Admin]

Massive gamble but Jol again tonight. That's quite a strong team on paper and if we lose, I think the pressure will mount. At least he's got balls to try it, lets hope the 11 on the pitch turn up!

[Humbled]

All i was meaning to suggest is that with Berba in the side all of our play revolves around him...perhaps with him being absent more players will try a few inventive things to score.

Disagree. Him and Ruiz share the play. They are the only creative players, it's natural they will dominate the ball. If you recall Murphy used to as well but he never got all this criticism for it.

Murphy also gave the ball away an absolute truckload last year and didn't get any criticism.  Granted he did have a fair amount of goodwill on his side :P

this is my problem... we are comparing Murphy (a midfielder) with Berba ( a striker).......
all i want is him to play as a striker and see him try as hard as he did against West Brom (home game)!!!

cant disagree Enter the Frei they are our best players on the ball but when Berba drops deep or Even lays it out wide then doesnt follow up with a run into the box we are non penetrative

[Fulham bob]

Moose get of the pills there not working.explain when he has run he should have been subbed Saturday and Yol didn't have the balls to do it.he thinks the club revolve around him wrong we are bigger than him

[God The Mechanic]

But if there's no other creativity in the team, who is going to make the passes for him to get on the end of?  That's where the current issue is - no ball playing midfielder to link to the top two who should (imo) always be Berba and Ruiz and no one making real runs ahead of them if/when they drop deep.

The MF is basically the crux of the problem both defensively and attackingwise.

[Enter the Frei]

Moose get of the pills there not working.explain when he has run he should have been subbed Saturday and Yol didn't have the balls to do it.he thinks the club revolve around him wrong we are bigger than him

He runs a lot more than you think, either way there is a lot more to football than just running around.

On the substitution thing he wasn't having his best game, but he's a player that can come up with a goal out of nothing. On performance on the day he probably deserved to go off, but if anyone is going to get us a winning goal he is the most likely.

[Humbled]

i agree re the edge of our area, but the he should be left where he is best up top and doing his thing. when he did that at the start he was dynamite. for me it highlights we need some players in moidfield to create so he can do what he does best

If it is the manager telling him to play on the edge of his own box and not run and not make a run after he passes I will let him off but I have a feeling it is the man himself choosing to do this. Berba is a hard one for me. I love his ability but just not sure his work rate suits a mid to bottom table club.

To be fair iirc Jol has been asking him to play creative mid ever since Ruiz got injured, what I don't get is why Jol is still expecting Berba to pull the strings when he's clearly not as good at Ruiz at it, even shifting Ruiz to holding mid against Wigan to accomodate Berba at the 10 position.

which is why when the Bent rumors were flying around i would have taken him... you have to accept Berba will drop deep and also make a pass then stand still so having him and Ruiz as the 2 attackers i think it is floored. on their day they are a pleasure to watch but stats dont lie and we havent had many shots on goal recently

[God The Mechanic]

Moose get of the pills there not working.explain when he has run he should have been subbed Saturday and Yol didn't have the balls to do it.he thinks the club revolve around him wrong we are bigger than him

There was a stat floating round when him and Tevez were both at Old Trafford that Berba routinely covered more ground than Tevez did - I'd be surprised if much has changed.  While he doesn't look like he does he really does move a fair amount.  As for being subbed, yeh he was ineffective but odds are he is more likely to create something than pretty much anyone else other than Ruiz (and Karagounis seemingly) at the moment.

[JackyFulham90]

Berbatov is a quality player he has won us points like against West Brom, he can't play well every game & when he doesn't its up to someone else to step up

[JackyFulham90]

We are weaker without Berbatov, he can't play well every game but he is a top player & if he plays like he did against West Brom he will make the difference

[Bassey the warrior]

All i was meaning to suggest is that with Berba in the side all of our play revolves around him...perhaps with him being absent more players will try a few inventive things to score.

Disagree. Him and Ruiz share the play. They are the only creative players, it's natural they will dominate the ball. If you recall Murphy used to as well but he never got all this criticism for it.

Murphy also gave the ball away an absolute truckload last year and didn't get any criticism.  Granted he did have a fair amount of goodwill on his side :P

True.

[Bassey the warrior]

Moose get of the pills there not working.explain when he has run he should have been subbed Saturday and Yol didn't have the balls to do it.he thinks the club revolve around him wrong we are bigger than him

He runs far more than you seem to recognize. Both Ruiz and Berba cover a lot of ground, they just both move languidly so it's less obvious.

[Bassey the warrior]

But if there's no other creativity in the team, who is going to make the passes for him to get on the end of?  That's where the current issue is - no ball playing midfielder to link to the top two who should (imo) always be Berba and Ruiz and no one making real runs ahead of them if/when they drop deep.

The MF is basically the crux of the problem both defensively and attackingwise.

Bingo. That's why he needs to drop deep.