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Dempsey's 90th Minute Goal Against ManU

Started by Forever Fulham, January 21, 2013, 07:36:28 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

HatterDon

Quote from: RaySmith on January 21, 2013, 03:39:24 PM
Clint had been saying for some time that his ambition was to play for a club with a chance of Champions League football - read 'bigger ' club than Fulham - and after his great season last year - with him getting so much publicity for his scoring -

then the end of last season was a good time to move for a player of his age, who had give his all for Fulham for some years, and been such a crucially important player for us.

I don't see anything wrong with this - it was inevitable, very sad as I was to see him go. Why wouldn't he want a crack at winning something in the English game, or playing in the Champions league, when he had the chance?

I don't hold any animosity to Clint, though obviously there was a difficult period before he moved to Spurs, caused by Liverpool, and wish him well.

But now he know longer plays for Fulham like so many other top players we took to our hearts, and  we just have to move on - Clint Dempsey is no longer a Fulham player, and that's it.

yup. Nothing left to see here. Move along.
"As long as there is light, I will sing." -- Juana, la Cubana

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Apprentice to the Maestro

Quote from: EJL on January 21, 2013, 03:35:27 PM
Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 03:27:03 PM
One benefit of Dempsey having moved on is we have fewer posts about how Dempsey wasn't appreciated by Fulham and English fans, how he was mistreated Jol, Mo, the club and the board, how the `truth' will come out.

Fulham and most of the fans have moved on. McBridefan1 and HatterDon would be better off defending Dempsey on the Spurs site where again he seems under-appreciated.
Posts like HD's always seem to be necessary with the sporadic returns of Dempsey bashing. Yes, he might not play for Fulham anymore but, whether you like it or not, he's a big part of the club's history.


Dempsey is a modest part of the club's PL history and even then he would come behind players like vdS, Schwarzer, Murphy and McBride and others. Across the whole history he slips even further into the background.

I get that you are fans of his but the continuing effort to tell us that we under-appreciate him and how important he was is grating. We have seen his career. We have seen the contributions of others. We can make up our own minds.

FulhamMic

He played under five different managers; he improved season on season with regards to his goal return and he finished off his tenure at Fulham by becoming our leading goal scorer in the Premier League. He has played his part in both securing our Premier League status with that goal against Liverpool (under Sanchez) and our march to the final of the Europa League (the goal against Juventus being the pick of the bunch).

Love him or loathe him, the guy is a club legend.


Apprentice to the Maestro

Quote from: HatterDon on January 21, 2013, 03:31:42 PM
Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 03:27:03 PM
One benefit of Dempsey having moved on is we have fewer posts about how Dempsey wasn't appreciated by Fulham and English fans, how he was mistreated Jol, Mo, the club and the board, how the `truth' will come out.

Fulham and most of the fans have moved on. McBridefan1 and HatterDon would be better off defending Dempsey on the Spurs site where again he seems under-appreciated.

Well, who could have predicted a comment like this? I am completely bumfuzzled in surprise. What insight!

Now I know who FofF put in charge of determining who is and who isn't a Fulham supporter.

By "Fulham and most of the fans have moved on. McBridefan1 and HatterDon would be better off defending Dempsey on the Spurs site where again he seems under-appreciated" I mean that Dempsey needs support at his current club rather than more speculation here.

I would expect you to continue to make contributions about Fulham here on FoF.

Enter the Frei

Quote from: HatterDon on January 21, 2013, 03:02:35 PM
"After what Dempsey did for the club ... ." Here's what Dempsey did for the club last year: He papered over the cracks in Jol's style by scoring goals that moved us from the relegation zone to the top 10. His opportunism and willingness to "try sh1t" is what made last season and what is missing this season.

Here's what happened AFTER the last match last season.
1. Dempsey asked for a 4 year contract extension.
2. The club said no.
3. Dempsey decided his future lay elsewhere.
4. Liverpool made an offer to the board. They were willing. Dempsey was willing.
5. Liverpool agreed to keep the agreement silent so that we wouldn't be in a weakened position in acquiring new players.
6. Some idiot at NESN's web site posted that Dempsey had signed with Liverpool.
7. MAF got incredibly angry and looked for revenge.
8. Believing that Dempsey had something to do with the link, MAF had Jol send Deuce to Coventry.
9. He then got his revenge on Liverpool by waiting until the last 2 or 3 days of the transfer period before telling them that they were NOT getting Dempsey. As a matter of fact, we waited until they had loaned out their #9 to West Ham and then we hung them out to dry.
10. We wound up transferring Dempsey to Tottenham for about half of what we could have gotten from Liverpool -- either cash or cash plus Charlie Adam or Jordan Henderson.

MAF got his revenge, Dempsey got to stay in London. Spurs got the bargain of the year. Everybody wins! Well, except for a bunch of Fulham supporters, most of whom didn't like Dempsey when he was winning matches for us, and almost all of whom despise him now.

No links. Just information I've picked up here and there and some analysis.

how much of that do you know to be true and how much have you inferred? The point at the end about the fans response to the saga I completely agree with, but the rest of it I don't get. It's come out that Liverpool did not make an offer to the club until the last days of the transfer window and this offer was believed to be around 4 million.

We ended up selling him for more to Tottenham than we were offered by Liverpool and Jol is quoted as saying we offered him the biggest contract in Fulham history and he still wanted to go.

Can you link me your information? Because it seemed to me that throughout the whole summer Liverpool where trying to hold us to ransom and take Dempsey on the cheap. I for one am happy for Dempsey for moving to Spurs, they're a club that will most likely be playing champions league football next season unlike Liverpool and I'm proud of the club for sticking by it's guns and not letting ourselves get bullied by Liverpool.

Apprentice to the Maestro

#25
Quote from: FulhamMic on January 21, 2013, 03:52:21 PM
He played under five different managers; he improved season on season with regards to his goal return and he finished off his tenure at Fulham by becoming our leading goal scorer in the Premier League. He has played his part in both securing our Premier League status with that goal against Liverpool (under Sanchez) and our march to the final of the Europa League (the goal against Juventus being the pick of the bunch).

Love him or loathe him, the guy is a club legend.

Let's consider your statements as being about player X rather than Dempsey because that seems to make all discussion too emotive:

- played under five different managers - so what?
- improved season on season . . . - well you might hope that for any player given that he was with us from his mid to late twenties
- leading PL scorer - fair enough but he was (for these times) long serving
- securing our PL status - you could say that of several players: Murphy, Kamara, McBride
- march to Europa League final: similarly Etuhu, Gera, Zamora, Davies

Legend - so overused that it is meaningless.


Enter the Frei

Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 04:06:48 PM
Quote from: FulhamMic on January 21, 2013, 03:52:21 PM
He played under five different managers; he improved season on season with regards to his goal return and he finished off his tenure at Fulham by becoming our leading goal scorer in the Premier League. He has played his part in both securing our Premier League status with that goal against Liverpool (under Sanchez) and our march to the final of the Europa League (the goal against Juventus being the pick of the bunch).

Love him or loathe him, the guy is a club legend.

Let's consider your statements as being about player X rather than Dempsey:

- played under five different managers - so what?
- improved season on season . . . - well you might hope that for any player given that he was with us from his mid to late twenties
- leading PL scorer - fair enough but he was (for these times) long serving
- securing our PL status - you could say that of several players: Murphy, Kamara, McBride
- march to Europa League final: similarly Etuhu, Gera, Zamora, Davies

Legend - so overused that it is meaningless.

but how many players have done all of those things. That goal against Juve and the fact that he is our leading premier league scorer are enough for me.

This is has debatably been the most successful period in the clubs history and Dempsey has been one of our longest serving and most successful players in that time.

Forever Fulham

Apprentice, come on, now.  If someone said Christ walked on water, would you say, "He can't swim"? 

RidgeRider

It pays sometimes to just skip on by posters who are disrespectful and just like to wind people up. I've seen the same disrespect in multiple threads by the same poster. If I were the rest of you, I just wouldn't bite.


Apprentice to the Maestro

#29
Quote from: RidgeRider on January 21, 2013, 04:47:19 PM
It pays sometimes to just skip on by posters who are disrespectful and just like to wind people up. I've seen the same disrespect in multiple threads by the same poster. If I were the rest of you, I just wouldn't bite.

Presumably you are referring to me. I do not post in a disrespectful frame of mind but in threads like this with posts like some of the above I will challenge the content of posts.

HatterDon puts up 10 points that may or may not be true but which don't seem to have any backing evidence when challenged by others and I ask how that affects the situation. Someone else makes a claim for Dempsey's legend status on weak grounds to which I offer counterarguments.

What kind of forum protects posters who put up unsubstantiated comments and claims by damning posts that challenge them as disrespectful?

LordNelson

Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 05:10:10 PM
Quote from: RidgeRider on January 21, 2013, 04:47:19 PM
It pays sometimes to just skip on by posters who are disrespectful and just like to wind people up. I've seen the same disrespect in multiple threads by the same poster. If I were the rest of you, I just wouldn't bite.

Presumably you are referring to me. I do not post in a disrespectful frame of mind but in threads like this with posts like some of the above I will challenge the content of posts.

HatterDon puts up 10 points that may or may not be true but which don't seem to have any backing evidence when challenged by others and I ask how that affects the situation. Someone else makes a claim for Dempsey's legend status on weak grounds to which I offer counterarguments.

What kind of forum protects posters who put up unsubstantiated comments and claims by damning posts that challenge them as disrespectful?

Through the woodland, through the valley
Comes a horseman wild and free
Tilting at the Windmills passing
Who can this young horseman be?
"The Right Honorable Lord Viscount Nelson K.B., Vice-Admiral of the WHITE ... Fulham expects that every man will do his duty!"


hn4fulham

Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 05:10:10 PM
Quote from: RidgeRider on January 21, 2013, 04:47:19 PM
It pays sometimes to just skip on by posters who are disrespectful and just like to wind people up. I've seen the same disrespect in multiple threads by the same poster. If I were the rest of you, I just wouldn't bite.

Presumably you are referring to me. I do not post in a disrespectful frame of mind but in threads like this with posts like some of the above I will challenge the content of posts.

HatterDon puts up 10 points that may or may not be true but which don't seem to have any backing evidence when challenged by others and I ask how that affects the situation. Someone else makes a claim for Dempsey's legend status on weak grounds to which I offer counterarguments.

What kind of forum protects posters who put up unsubstantiated comments and claims by damning posts that challenge them as disrespectful?

HatterDon's post does indeed still serve a benefit to us Fulham fans. Maybe not you but I am a Fulham fan and I will tell you that it benefited me. I have been waiting to hear from anyone who has any bit of information of what and how the whole situation happened with dempsey. Whether it was backed by proof or not, it is up to the fans reading as to whether to believe it or not. You can always choose to disregard it and move on if it doesn't fit your frame of mind.

Dempsey is and will be a part of Fulham's success in recent years in my mind and in many fans' minds. You can downplay his contributions all you want if that is how you feel about dempsey but be respectful to others who do value his contributions. We don't have to be spurs fans to still value his contributions on this board. For me, I don't think Fulham would have achieved what we achieved without him.


YankeeJim

Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 03:27:03 PM
One benefit of Dempsey having moved on is we have fewer posts about how Dempsey wasn't appreciated by Fulham and English fans, how he was mistreated Jol, Mo, the club and the board, how the `truth' will come out.

Fulham and most of the fans have moved on. McBridefan1 and HatterDon would be better off defending Dempsey on the Spurs site where again he seems under-appreciated.

My dear daddy, may he RIP, always told me that one should look at every situation, regardless of how it started and ask yourself, what did I do to start or prolong this situation? I often fail in this regard. I find that I get irrated at this sort of senseless bashing and often respond with sarcasm. In the end, I'm simply lowering myself to that level. That being said, and having thought about it, I'd suggest that my dear friend Apprentice to the Maestro, work on his xenophobia while I'll work on my patience.  That will better able the both of us to be called Friends of Fulham since I'll have less temptation and he'll become more open minded.   
Sorry pop.
Its not that I could and others couldn't.
Its that I did and others didn't.

FulhamMic

#33
Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 04:06:48 PM
Let's consider your statements as being about player X rather than Dempsey because that seems to make all discussion too emotive:

- played under five different managers - so what?

Perhaps I should have been clearer; Dempsey has played under five different Fulham managers. That's five different managers, with five different backgrounds and five very different playing styles yet each and every one recognised the qualities in Dempsey. When each of these five managers went about putting their own stamp on the team, Dempsey remained a constant. Surely you can understand the significance of this? As of last season, Simon Davies was the only other Fulham player who had this in common with Dempsey.

- improved season on season - well you might hope that for any player given that he was with us from his mid to late twenties

Hope yes; guaranteed? No. Eddie Johnson ring any bells? Bjorn Helge Riise? Collins John? And these are just recent examples of prospects with bright futures, who played for Fulham. And Dempsey not only improved as a player, but his goals increased every single year.

- leading PL scorer - fair enough but he was (for these times) long serving

He also holds the record for the most Premier League goals scored in a season by a Fulham player. Tenure doesn't factor into this record since you only need to single season to break it.

- securing our PL status - you could say that of several players: Murphy, Kamara, McBride

Whilst they all played their parts for sure (Murphy and Kamara in a different season), and that can't be underestimated, Dempsey's goal was the definitive moment that saved that season because it was that 1-0 win over Liverpool that GUARANTEED our safety. In much the same way as Murphy's goal against Portsmouth.

- march to Europa League final: similarly Etuhu, Gera, Zamora, Davies

True; but none match that goal against Juventus. Sorry.

Legend - so overused that it is meaningless.

Legend. A title Dempsey rightly earned through his significant contribution to the cause during his tenure here at Fulham.

St Eve

i liked Dempsey and we certainly miss him. I will always remember that goal agains Juventus.However, he was as good for Fulham as Fulham were for him. He certainly isn't a legend (Haynes and Cohen come to mind). I respect his decision for wanting to play champions league football but Liverpool could not give it to him and neither can Spurs currently. I cannot forgive him for refusing to play. That is just unprofessional.


Apprentice to the Maestro

#35
Quote from: hn4fulham on January 21, 2013, 06:24:21 PM
Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 05:10:10 PM
Quote from: RidgeRider on January 21, 2013, 04:47:19 PM
It pays sometimes to just skip on by posters who are disrespectful and just like to wind people up. I've seen the same disrespect in multiple threads by the same poster. If I were the rest of you, I just wouldn't bite.

Presumably you are referring to me. I do not post in a disrespectful frame of mind but in threads like this with posts like some of the above I will challenge the content of posts.

HatterDon puts up 10 points that may or may not be true but which don't seem to have any backing evidence when challenged by others and I ask how that affects the situation. Someone else makes a claim for Dempsey's legend status on weak grounds to which I offer counterarguments.

What kind of forum protects posters who put up unsubstantiated comments and claims by damning posts that challenge them as disrespectful?

HatterDon's post does indeed still serve a benefit to us Fulham fans. Maybe not you but I am a Fulham fan and I will tell you that it benefited me. I have been waiting to hear from anyone who has any bit of information of what and how the whole situation happened with dempsey. Whether it was backed by proof or not, it is up to the fans reading as to whether to believe it or not. You can always choose to disregard it and move on if it doesn't fit your frame of mind.

Dempsey is and will be a part of Fulham's success in recent years in my mind and in many fans' minds. You can downplay his contributions all you want if that is how you feel about dempsey but be respectful to others who do value his contributions. We don't have to be spurs fans to still value his contributions on this board. For me, I don't think Fulham would have achieved what we achieved without him.

No wonder the standards of journalism and posts are so low if this is an indication of people's expectations.

O.K., I didn't want to reveal it because the governments of the world want to keep it a secret to avoid panic. Dempsey's leaving was all a plot by the Royal family to get back at MAF over his comments about the death of Dodi and Diana. As David Icke says the Duke of Edinburgh is an alien lizard and he arranged for Dempsey to be abducted by his alien friends, probed and have a transceiver implanted in his brain which made him turn down the best contract Fulham had ever made and burn his bridges with the club so he had to be sold by Fulham at below the market price of £25m.

There, I've said it. As a fan I am entitled to say it. And as a poster on this board, keeping within the traditions of etiquette, I expect it to be treated with the utmost reverence and respect.

BarryP

Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 05:10:10 PM
Quote from: RidgeRider on January 21, 2013, 04:47:19 PM
It pays sometimes to just skip on by posters who are disrespectful and just like to wind people up. I've seen the same disrespect in multiple threads by the same poster. If I were the rest of you, I just wouldn't bite.

Presumably you are referring to me. I do not post in a disrespectful frame of mind but in threads like this with posts like some of the above I will challenge the content of posts.

HatterDon puts up 10 points that may or may not be true but which don't seem to have any backing evidence when challenged by others and I ask how that affects the situation. Someone else makes a claim for Dempsey's legend status on weak grounds to which I offer counterarguments.

What kind of forum protects posters who put up unsubstantiated comments and claims by damning posts that challenge them as disrespectful?


Would you not file this in the unsubstantiated claims and comments bin?

Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro

Dempsey is a modest part of the club's PL history and even then he would come behind players like vdS, Schwarzer, Murphy and McBride and others.

Amoung the many opinions that float about regarding Dempsey within the FOF family the one fact that would be difficult to argue against is the man does tend to stir up passionate sentiment when he is discussed on this board.
"Never give in. Never give in. Never, never, never, never--in nothing, great or small, large or petty--never give in, except to convictions of honor and good sense."

CanadianCottager

Facts of the matter.
Clint Dempsey is one of the key contributors to Fulham's recent spell in England's top flight and various achievements such as Fulham's Europa league run and Great Escape.
Clint Dempsey is the club's best ever Premier League scorer.
Clint Dempsey spoke increasingly about moving on from Fulham towards the end of his career in the white and black.
Liverpool tapped up Dempsey.
Jol did not select Dempsey for any match squad this (pre-)season.
Tottenham bought Dempsey.

Everything else is he-said-she-said conjecture and shouldn't be treated like fact. Whether or not Dempsey is a club legend is ultimately an opinion that fans are entitled to have, and as opinions tend to do they sometimes drag in emotional reasons, which are perfectly fine but shouldn't be treated like fact. Personally, as a human being, I completely sympathize with Dempsey's desire to test himself in a different context. In my OPINION, there is nothing wrong wanting to try new pastures, and in my OPINION all the squabbling about who was in wrong about the way he left is not only completely unverifiable but also kind of useless. As a Fulham fan, I'm unhappy about him leaving as he was an important part of the team. I don't know who to be unhappy at, and finger pointing is useless unless Jol, MAF, and Dempsey all decide to have a press conference and explain to us a consistent story of what really happen, as well as telling us where the aliens from Roswell are and who the second shooter was.
Until then, I will watch his past achievements with Fulham with fondness and hope that he doesn't conjure anything up when he plays against Fulham.


YankeeJim

Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 08:24:12 PM
Quote from: hn4fulham on January 21, 2013, 06:24:21 PM
Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 05:10:10 PM
Quote from: RidgeRider on January 21, 2013, 04:47:19 PM
It pays sometimes to just skip on by posters who are disrespectful and just like to wind people up. I've seen the same disrespect in multiple threads by the same poster. If I were the rest of you, I just wouldn't bite.

Presumably you are referring to me. I do not post in a disrespectful frame of mind but in threads like this with posts like some of the above I will challenge the content of posts.

HatterDon puts up 10 points that may or may not be true but which don't seem to have any backing evidence when challenged by others and I ask how that affects the situation. Someone else makes a claim for Dempsey's legend status on weak grounds to which I offer counterarguments.

What kind of forum protects posters who put up unsubstantiated comments and claims by damning posts that challenge them as disrespectful?

HatterDon's post does indeed still serve a benefit to us Fulham fans. Maybe not you but I am a Fulham fan and I will tell you that it benefited me. I have been waiting to hear from anyone who has any bit of information of what and how the whole situation happened with dempsey. Whether it was backed by proof or not, it is up to the fans reading as to whether to believe it or not. You can always choose to disregard it and move on if it doesn't fit your frame of mind.

Dempsey is and will be a part of Fulham's success in recent years in my mind and in many fans' minds. You can downplay his contributions all you want if that is how you feel about dempsey but be respectful to others who do value his contributions. We don't have to be spurs fans to still value his contributions on this board. For me, I don't think Fulham would have achieved what we achieved without him.

No wonder the standards of journalism and posts are so low if this is an indication of people's expectations.

O.K., I didn't want to reveal it because the governments of the world want to keep it a secret to avoid panic. Dempsey's leaving was all a plot by the Royal family to get back at MAF over his comments about the death of Dodi and Diana. As David Icke says the Duke of Edinburgh is an alien lizard and he arranged for Dempsey to be abducted by his alien friends, probed and have a transceiver implanted in his brain which made him turn down the best contract Fulham had ever made and burn his bridges with the club so he had to be sold by Fulham at below the market price of £25m.

There, I've said it. As a fan I am entitled to say it. And as a poster on this board, keeping within the traditions of etiquette, I expect it to be treated with the utmost reverence and respect.

As often happens, the student learns from the teacher's actions, rather than from what is said. Hence, we have sacarsm. My dear pops was a smart guy.
Its not that I could and others couldn't.
Its that I did and others didn't.

Apprentice to the Maestro

Quote from: YankeeJim on January 21, 2013, 08:52:16 PM
Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 08:24:12 PM
Quote from: hn4fulham on January 21, 2013, 06:24:21 PM
Quote from: Apprentice to the Maestro on January 21, 2013, 05:10:10 PM
Quote from: RidgeRider on January 21, 2013, 04:47:19 PM
It pays sometimes to just skip on by posters who are disrespectful and just like to wind people up. I've seen the same disrespect in multiple threads by the same poster. If I were the rest of you, I just wouldn't bite.

Presumably you are referring to me. I do not post in a disrespectful frame of mind but in threads like this with posts like some of the above I will challenge the content of posts.

HatterDon puts up 10 points that may or may not be true but which don't seem to have any backing evidence when challenged by others and I ask how that affects the situation. Someone else makes a claim for Dempsey's legend status on weak grounds to which I offer counterarguments.

What kind of forum protects posters who put up unsubstantiated comments and claims by damning posts that challenge them as disrespectful?

HatterDon's post does indeed still serve a benefit to us Fulham fans. Maybe not you but I am a Fulham fan and I will tell you that it benefited me. I have been waiting to hear from anyone who has any bit of information of what and how the whole situation happened with dempsey. Whether it was backed by proof or not, it is up to the fans reading as to whether to believe it or not. You can always choose to disregard it and move on if it doesn't fit your frame of mind.

Dempsey is and will be a part of Fulham's success in recent years in my mind and in many fans' minds. You can downplay his contributions all you want if that is how you feel about dempsey but be respectful to others who do value his contributions. We don't have to be spurs fans to still value his contributions on this board. For me, I don't think Fulham would have achieved what we achieved without him.

No wonder the standards of journalism and posts are so low if this is an indication of people's expectations.

O.K., I didn't want to reveal it because the governments of the world want to keep it a secret to avoid panic. Dempsey's leaving was all a plot by the Royal family to get back at MAF over his comments about the death of Dodi and Diana. As David Icke says the Duke of Edinburgh is an alien lizard and he arranged for Dempsey to be abducted by his alien friends, probed and have a transceiver implanted in his brain which made him turn down the best contract Fulham had ever made and burn his bridges with the club so he had to be sold by Fulham at below the market price of £25m.

There, I've said it. As a fan I am entitled to say it. And as a poster on this board, keeping within the traditions of etiquette, I expect it to be treated with the utmost reverence and respect.

As often happens, the student learns from the teacher's actions, rather than from what is said. Hence, we have sacarsm. My dear pops was a smart guy.

That's it. Be disrespectful.

It fits the facts. I want to believe it. It makes Dempsey an innocent victim of higher powers. Can you prove it is not true?

Satire and humour are all that's left to the powerless when facts and reason are left behind.