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Fulham from 3370 miles away

Started by aconnecticutyankee, January 29, 2013, 01:35:44 PM

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aconnecticutyankee

Note to FFC management and owner... watch the movie Moneyball , multiple times if it doesn't sink in at first. It's a true story about the General Manager of the Oakland Athletics MLB franchise and his unconventional (at the time) approach to creating a winning ballclub. Watch and learn. I doesn't matter that it's Baseball.

IMO the two dumbest things MAF has done since he arrived have been to install the Jacko carnival statue, and his prediction that we would be the "Manchester United of the South". Today we are closer to relegation than being on the level of ManU. Most of the contributors to this board understand the problem, why doesn't management?

This club needs to find more players like Dempsey and fewer like Berbatov.

I liked Roy from the start because he knew how to elevate a club/national team with more modest resources, Jol evidently does not. This does not mean Jol is a bad manager, frankly I don't think Wenger or Mourinho would succeed here the way things are now. I remember Roy saying about the team when he arrived that he had too many of the same "type" of player, does that apply now?

We need players who are as angry and desolate when we lose as we the fans are. If a player so much as laughs in the dressing room I'd sit him the next match. Broken fixtures and water coolers in the dressing room are not necessarily a bad thing.

We haven't had a captain since Murphy left so let's find one. Brede a nice guy and a great player but...

The recent acquisition of a player with two ACL tears begs the question, how soon do you think he will do a third?

In 1997 MAF was in relative terms among the wealthiest club owners with great ambition, today he just seems to be just another garden variety rich guy who can't compete at the highest levels with the club he's got.

On a personal note, I own some racehorses (it's a hobby), that run successfully at some of the best tracks in the US. It's folly for me to think we can compete with the likes of the Arab Sheiks et al who's outfits dominate the Keenland sales ring so we have to operate differently, but we get results. I look at FFC today and shake my head. FFC management have become wannabees...




TonyGilroy

Quote from: aconnecticutyankee on January 29, 2013, 01:35:44 PM
IMO the two dumbest things MAF has done since he arrived have been to install the Jacko carnival statue, and his prediction that we would be the "Manchester United of the South".



From the USA you may not appreciate MAF's eccentricities.

The ManU of the south was typical hyperbole believed by no one, almost certainly including MAF as he said it.

The statue is an embarrassment for many but I pass it at every match and it's amazing how many paying punters are photographing it and posing by it. You don't have to like it but it has no relevance to our present position.

A year ago we thought we were a well run club. As we slide into the Championship most of us are doubting that but we simply don't know the truth about MAF's finances and his present day committment to the club. We'll know more at midnight on Thursday.

Roberty

I fail to see what your comments have to do with Moneyball - as I remember it that film demonstrated that the sum of the parts is more important than any individual and that a group of average players can be the answer if they add up to a good team.

I also wonder why you think the clubs management doesn't "understand the problem" - other than adverse comments made here there is no evidence what so ever that this is the case.

Another candidate for dumbest things might be to have invested so much money in a club that currently has a vociferous minority of hostile supporters who make disparaging remarks with knowing any of the facts.
It could be better but it's real life and not a fantasy


rusty shackleford

I feel that those of us sitting up till midnight on Thursday frantically pressing F5 may be left disappointed.

ClarksOriginal

Liverpool tried 'Moneyball' techniques under Dalglish and look where it got them...

£75m down the drain and nothing to show for it.
@sonikkicks on Twitter.

Edwatch_Winston_Malone

Quote from: rusty shackleford on January 29, 2013, 01:55:14 PM
I feel that those of us sitting up till midnight on Thursday frantically pressing F5 may be left disappointed.

We would always be disappointed,  it's only a matter of how disappointed. ..


TonyGilroy

Quote from: Edward_Winston_Malone on January 29, 2013, 01:59:42 PM
Quote from: rusty shackleford on January 29, 2013, 01:55:14 PM
I feel that those of us sitting up till midnight on Thursday frantically pressing F5 may be left disappointed.

We would always be disappointed,  it's only a matter of how disappointed. ..

I'm going with very very very disappointed and really quite depressed.

Roberty

Quote from: TonyGilroy on January 29, 2013, 02:03:34 PM
Quote from: Edward_Winston_Malone on January 29, 2013, 01:59:42 PM
Quote from: rusty shackleford on January 29, 2013, 01:55:14 PM
I feel that those of us sitting up till midnight on Thursday frantically pressing F5 may be left disappointed.

We would always be disappointed,  it's only a matter of how disappointed. ..

I'm going with very very very disappointed and really quite depressed.

I suspect that there are a few rabbits to be pulled out of the hat - if I am wrong I will join you if I am right I expect to hear a loud cheer from you.
It could be better but it's real life and not a fantasy

Edwatch_Winston_Malone



jmh

Quote from: aconnecticutyankee on January 29, 2013, 01:35:44 PM
Note to FFC management and owner... watch the movie Moneyball , multiple times if it doesn't sink in at first. It's a true story about the General Manager of the Oakland Athletics MLB franchise and his unconventional (at the time) approach to creating a winning ballclub. Watch and learn. I doesn't matter that it's Baseball.
Better yet, read the book.

NewYorkYank

Quote from: Roberty on January 29, 2013, 01:50:43 PM
I fail to see what your comments have to do with Moneyball - as I remember it that film demonstrated that the sum of the parts is more important than any individual and that a group of average players can be the answer if they add up to a good team.

I also wonder why you think the clubs management doesn't "understand the problem" - other than adverse comments made here there is no evidence what so ever that this is the case.

Another candidate for dumbest things might be to have invested so much money in a club that currently has a vociferous minority of hostile supporters who make disparaging remarks with knowing any of the facts.


Actually, Moneyball was about the use of pure statistics (some unconventional) to evaluate players rather than their physical tools and traditional statistics.  This permits management to identify overlooked (and therefore underpriced) players who deliver better results than more gifted and seemingly more attractive players.  Clearly, while Liverpool may have talked Moneyball, it did not practice it.

I question whether the use of a pure statistical analysis would apply to soccer.  Baseball, although a team game, is, for the most part, a game of individual effort.  While a player's performance can be affected by those around him ( a hitter surrounded by bad hitters does not get a pitch to hit; a groundball pitcher with a bad defense fares worse than a power pitcher), a baseball team is not as interdependent as a soccer team.

Probably the closest to a Moneyball manager Fulham has had in the past decade is Roy.  He employed seemingly counterintuitive statistics (for example, I recall reading an article in which he noted that statistically, a team is more likely to score when the opposing goalie has possession of the ball than when its own goalie does, although anyone watching Schwarzer might argue this statistic is not couterintuitive).  One could plausibly argue that Zamora was a Moneyball player, one whose conventional statistics were, prior to joining Fulham, were unimpressive, but whose hold-up play produced goals.

I think the point that Connecticut Yankee is making is that Fulham's scouting seems to be in the dark ages, a point frequently made by the Fulham blogger, Phil Milson, at ESPN.com, whose weekly analysis I highly recommend.  The team has no Spanish players, no South American players (Ruiz is North American).  Is this because there are no players of quality, or because Fulham just does not scout those areas?  The team acquired a striker last year, Pogrebnyak, that Jol said he had not seen play, but who came recommended.  Fortunately, that acquisition worked out, but the emphasis is on fortune, rather than design. It's not a way to run a railroad.

Yes, Jol lost his two best players, but Michael Laudrup (whom I would have loved to see replace Hughes) lost his two best players, Sinclair and Allen, over the summer. Swansea has not missed a beat.  One can argue that Swansea had more time top replace them, but Fulham should have been prepared, at a minimum, to replace Dempsey. 

Although I like the Frimpong loan more than most on the board, I am pessimistic that Fulham is going to get anyone before the season ends that is going to change the team.  I hope I am wrong.