Fans sitting down

[Berserker]

If you want to stand at the back, phone the ticket office and ask for a seat at the back. I always book by phone and ask for a seat at the front so my 2 young children can see.

As for looking bad because we sit down and therefore shouldn't go, we only normally have between 50 and 100 standing up - How bad would it look if we only took 50 - 100 to each match?

I've tried booking by phone for away matches and get told they have no say in what Ticketmaster allocates. Can you let me know what you do to get certain seats?

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

[_Putney_]

Away games should be 'sit where you like'.  Those who sit go to the front, those who stand go to the back.

[AnEssexFan]

If you want to stand at the back, phone the ticket office and ask for a seat at the back. I always book by phone and ask for a seat at the front so my 2 young children can see.

As for looking bad because we sit down and therefore shouldn't go, we only normally have between 50 and 100 standing up - How bad would it look if we only took 50 - 100 to each match?

I've tried booking by phone for away matches and get told they have no say in what Ticketmaster allocates. Can you let me know what you do to get certain seats?

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

I just phone the Fulham ticket office - the phone number changed this season - and I just ask if I can have seats near the front due to having young children.

[filham]

Our games are so tight these days that all true supporters should be on their knees for those nail biting last ten minutes.

[gang]

It is the law of the land, should we pick and choose which laws to abide by; we have a parliament to determine the laws, contact your MP and persuade him/her to change it if you don't agree with it.

Yes we should break it. It's a bad law and should be changed - the widespread flouting off this law is the best way to change it, writing to your MP is only a small part of it. People just shouldn't do it in an inconsiderate way to others by standing in front of the old and kids. The mass standing at the back though should be commended. It adds to the atmosphere.

Which other laws do you disagree with? I don't like the idea that someone is richer than me, should I then go and rob them?

[alfie]

Away games should be 'sit where you like'.  Those who sit go to the front, those who stand go to the back.

trouble is I do not want to sit at the front, I like to see what's going on all over the pitch not just what's in front of me.

[rogerpbackinMidEastUS]

I suspect the OP is sat reading our responses and muttering  "Tee Hee, that got them at it"
and it's only my 6th post.

I can't remember ever going to an away game where I had to remain seated/standing in my assigned 'space'

[Samjack]

It is the law of the land, should we pick and choose which laws to abide by; we have a parliament to determine the laws, contact your MP and persuade him/her to change it if you don't agree with it.

Yes we should break it. It's a bad law and should be changed - the widespread flouting off this law is the best way to change it, writing to your MP is only a small part of it. People just shouldn't do it in an inconsiderate way to others by standing in front of the old and kids. The mass standing at the back though should be commended. It adds to the atmosphere.

Which other laws do you disagree with? I don't like the idea that someone is richer than me, should I then go and rob them?

There are no other laws at the moment that I think are sufficiently bad to go against and the example you give is certainly not one. Historically though, the non payment of poll tax or in America the sit-in movement in segregated cafes are two famous examples of constructively disobeying the law... Come on mate, it's not remotely controversial to say that civil disobedience has a place in a democratic society when it doesn't harm others.

[bucksfulham]

 
:

What is wrong with our fanbase, everyone sitting down at the game today, if your gonna sit you shouldn't come plain and simple

What about those of us that dfind it difficult to stand, or is it all about you.

well said Alfie, exactly my sentiments it actually stops me attending away games due I'm mildly disabled and very unable to stand a whole match. So have some consideration for the likes of me coz I'm not alone there are plenty of others.

:plus one:

[mcbride5912]

I was towards the back during the game (at the boundary of sitting/standing ) and think I saw the OPs "incident" - they were half way up the stand instead of at the back as stated and there were plenty of spare seats among the "standees" just behind me. We aren't famed for our away support and there are often spare seats to be found if you want to move - for instance the guys next to me weren't in their allocated seats. That way as many people as possible are happy.

Every fan matters no matter what they prefer to do in a match.

[RaySmith]

There are more likely to be spare seats  at the front, where most people stay seated, than at the back, where the  young ones go.

Personally, I usually just sit in my allotted seat - I prefer to sit down the front anyway, but don't mind standing if I'm nearer the back, though this could change as I get older I suppose.

I suppose the point is that you can't stipulate where you want to sit, and someone who is small and female,  frail or infirm might not feel able to go  wandering around the stand looking for spare seats, and these days we do take a decent  support to quite a few games - thus with less spare seats available.

[Kent Cassandra]

Luckily I was not too far from the front and coincidentally sat next to an old time Fulham boy who I discovered had been supporting to team since 1945, took the wind out of my sails as I have only been supporting the team since 1948. Having a choice of tickets for away games should be pursued, I have been to Reading away three times in the last year and was put right at the top in the last row. At 81 my body still does what I want it to do, but unfortunately balance is a bit of an issue on these very steep steps. 

[f321ffc]

, At 81 my body still does what I want it to do

Lucky fella certain parts of mine have forgotten what is for, apart from weeing.  092.gif  064.gif

[Logicalman]

It is the law of the land, should we pick and choose which laws to abide by; we have a parliament to determine the laws, contact your MP and persuade him/her to change it if you don't agree with it.

Yes we should break it. It's a bad law and should be changed - the widespread flouting off this law is the best way to change it, writing to your MP is only a small part of it. People just shouldn't do it in an inconsiderate way to others by standing in front of the old and kids. The mass standing at the back though should be commended. It adds to the atmosphere.

Many people speed dangerously, drink and drive, park where they shouldn't, perhaps even pay nothing or less than they should do, 'If they can get away with it'.

So perhaps we should do away with all laws we don't agree with. I don't agree with paying taxes, do you? Why don't you use civil disobedience in that way?

Without laws, the ability to elect those to make and repeal them, we would have absolute chaos, is that what you're proposing?

Closer to home, perhaps you're OK with others who wish to invade the pitch when their team is losing to get the match abandoned? I mean it's just a rule, isn't it?

[Samjack]

It is the law of the land, should we pick and choose which laws to abide by; we have a parliament to determine the laws, contact your MP and persuade him/her to change it if you don't agree with it.

Yes we should break it. It's a bad law and should be changed - the widespread flouting off this law is the best way to change it, writing to your MP is only a small part of it. People just shouldn't do it in an inconsiderate way to others by standing in front of the old and kids. The mass standing at the back though should be commended. It adds to the atmosphere.

Many people speed dangerously, drink and drive, park where they shouldn't, perhaps even pay nothing or less than they should do, 'If they can get away with it'.

So perhaps we should do away with all laws we don't agree with. I don't agree with paying taxes, do you? Why don't you use civil disobedience in that way?

Without laws, the ability to elect those to make and repeal them, we would have absolute chaos, is that what you're proposing?

Closer to home, perhaps you're OK with others who wish to invade the pitch when their team is losing to get the match abandoned? I mean it's just a rule, isn't it?

No mate I'm not proposing any of that. I'm talking about standing up to watch a football match. It is permitted at rugby and other big events and should be allowed at football. People should be able to choose - which would make this whole debate redundant because one group would no longer inconvenience the other. Until that is the case though, people should continue to stand where it doesn't inconvenience others who want to sit (i.e at the back). In actual fact it is not illegal to stand at football anyway. See this link for further details on the legal situation...

http://www.fsf.org.uk/campaigns/safe-standing/the-legalities-of-standing/

[RaySmith]

Clubs charge so much for tickets, yet they often ignore the  needs and wants of paying customers, and seem to treat them like rubbish.

There's nothing wrong with fans standing if they are not blocking the view of others. Surely it should be possible to enable fans to choose to buy tickets in  parts  of the ground where they can stand or sit, whatever they wish to do, without inconveniencing others.

I've actually been told off by a steward at the Cottage for standing - I was  right down the front of the Hammy End. I just kept getting carried away when we attacked, jumping to my feet then sitting back down. If I was standing the whole time it would be different.

I come from the days of standing on the terraces, and whirling a rattle about, and generally expressing emotion supporting the club I love.

[Logicalman]

It is the law of the land, should we pick and choose which laws to abide by; we have a parliament to determine the laws, contact your MP and persuade him/her to change it if you don't agree with it.

Yes we should break it. It's a bad law and should be changed - the widespread flouting off this law is the best way to change it, writing to your MP is only a small part of it. People just shouldn't do it in an inconsiderate way to others by standing in front of the old and kids. The mass standing at the back though should be commended. It adds to the atmosphere.

Many people speed dangerously, drink and drive, park where they shouldn't, perhaps even pay nothing or less than they should do, 'If they can get away with it'.

So perhaps we should do away with all laws we don't agree with. I don't agree with paying taxes, do you? Why don't you use civil disobedience in that way?

Without laws, the ability to elect those to make and repeal them, we would have absolute chaos, is that what you're proposing?

Closer to home, perhaps you're OK with others who wish to invade the pitch when their team is losing to get the match abandoned? I mean it's just a rule, isn't it?

No mate I'm not proposing any of that. I'm talking about standing up to watch a football match. It is permitted at rugby and other big events and should be allowed at football. People should be able to choose - which would make this whole debate redundant because one group would no longer inconvenience the other. Until that is the case though, people should continue to stand where it doesn't inconvenience others who want to sit (i.e at the back). In actual fact it is not illegal to stand at football anyway. See this link for further details on the legal situation...

http://www.fsf.org.uk/campaigns/safe-standing/the-legalities-of-standing/

At least we agree on one point, and the main one I believe, people should continue to stand where it doesn't inconvenience others who want to sit (i.e at the back). If it doesn't inconvenience others is the main point here. The OP was that those who don't wish to stand shouldn't attend the match.

As for Law and rules, seems we both see the interchangeability of their meanings, given that you can be ejected from a stadium as it is, quoting from the same publication you refer to, "Standing in seated areas, is, however, contrary to ground regulations. For example, the Football League's model set of ground regulations states: 'Nobody may stand in any seating area whilst play is in progress. Persistent standing in seated areas whilst play is in progress is strictly forbidden and may result in ejection from the ground'." Thus, as far as regulations are concerned in respect of the conduct of fans in grounds where seating is the only condition, you are breaking the rules, and, if you then determine what provides the standing (pun) for that ejection regulation, it is the regulations which are made under the section 11 of the Football Spectators Act 1989. No, it is not a criminal act, neither are many offences against laws, but, as it is actionable under law, it could be reasonably argued that the basis is in law, as it might well be a civil law matter.

Either way, the bottom line is, and the ONLY point that this discussion is about, is whether you are, or are not, permitted to stand in an all-seater stadium, and the simple answer is no. The simple fact that some clubs might readily allow people to flaunt this condition when it doesn't affect others, does not mean it either isn't or shouldn't be enforced.

Like everything else in this world, Laws, rules or regulations, flouting or breaking them does have consequences, and none of us should decide which we personally wish to adhere to, at the expense of others, or wish not to, without some come back on us.

[Andy S]

In the old days of standing up we had a lovely crash barrier to lean against. You could sit young children on the barrier and hey we could all see the game safely. Then came the politicians.....

[Logicalman]

In the old days of standing up we had a lovely crash barrier to lean against. You could sit young children on the barrier and hey we could all see the game safely. Then came the politicians.....

.. yup, and the bloody money!

[Samjack]

It is the law of the land, should we pick and choose which laws to abide by; we have a parliament to determine the laws, contact your MP and persuade him/her to change it if you don't agree with it.

Yes we should break it. It's a bad law and should be changed - the widespread flouting off this law is the best way to change it, writing to your MP is only a small part of it. People just shouldn't do it in an inconsiderate way to others by standing in front of the old and kids. The mass standing at the back though should be commended. It adds to the atmosphere.

Many people speed dangerously, drink and drive, park where they shouldn't, perhaps even pay nothing or less than they should do, 'If they can get away with it'.

So perhaps we should do away with all laws we don't agree with. I don't agree with paying taxes, do you? Why don't you use civil disobedience in that way?

Without laws, the ability to elect those to make and repeal them, we would have absolute chaos, is that what you're proposing?

Closer to home, perhaps you're OK with others who wish to invade the pitch when their team is losing to get the match abandoned? I mean it's just a rule, isn't it?

No mate I'm not proposing any of that. I'm talking about standing up to watch a football match. It is permitted at rugby and other big events and should be allowed at football. People should be able to choose - which would make this whole debate redundant because one group would no longer inconvenience the other. Until that is the case though, people should continue to stand where it doesn't inconvenience others who want to sit (i.e at the back). In actual fact it is not illegal to stand at football anyway. See this link for further details on the legal situation...

http://www.fsf.org.uk/campaigns/safe-standing/the-legalities-of-standing/

At least we agree on one point, and the main one I believe, people should continue to stand where it doesn't inconvenience others who want to sit (i.e at the back). If it doesn't inconvenience others is the main point here. The OP was that those who don't wish to stand shouldn't attend the match.

As for Law and rules, seems we both see the interchangeability of their meanings, given that you can be ejected from a stadium as it is, quoting from the same publication you refer to, "Standing in seated areas, is, however, contrary to ground regulations. For example, the Football League's model set of ground regulations states: 'Nobody may stand in any seating area whilst play is in progress. Persistent standing in seated areas whilst play is in progress is strictly forbidden and may result in ejection from the ground'." Thus, as far as regulations are concerned in respect of the conduct of fans in grounds where seating is the only condition, you are breaking the rules, and, if you then determine what provides the standing (pun) for that ejection regulation, it is the regulations which are made under the section 11 of the Football Spectators Act 1989. No, it is not a criminal act, neither are many offences against laws, but, as it is actionable under law, it could be reasonably argued that the basis is in law, as it might well be a civil law matter.

Either way, the bottom line is, and the ONLY point that this discussion is about, is whether you are, or are not, permitted to stand in an all-seater stadium, and the simple answer is no. The simple fact that some clubs might readily allow people to flaunt this condition when it doesn't affect others, does not mean it either isn't or shouldn't be enforced.

Like everything else in this world, Laws, rules or regulations, flouting or breaking them does have consequences, and none of us should decide which we personally wish to adhere to, at the expense of others, or wish not to, without some come back on us.

Yes, I'm pleased we agree on the point that 'standing should continue but people should be considerate'. However, what I think is annoying me about your position is that you seem to be in favour of standing and a return to stadia which incorporate standing and yet you keep hammering this point of people having a legal responsibility to sit down. Yet the law is only what we, as a society, collectively agree it should be and nearly 90% of football fans consistently state they want a return to standing (non football fans presumably don't have a strong opinion). So there seems to be a certain cognitive dissonance in your position that we should obey a law/ ruling/ directive that we nearly all agree to be a bad one and by disobeying it (even in a considerate way) you are somehow a selfish individual with no concern for wider society; yet at the same time wanting to change that law. I think the return of standing areas in stadiums will improve the experience at football immeasurably for everyone and to overturn that it requires continued flouting of the rule otherwise people will say there is no need for it to change. Your position of supporting standing but at the same time being a cheerleader for the current legal framework I find baffling in the extreme.