Honestly... what do we think of Slav now?

[toshes mate]

Fascinating.

but only averagely so....

[Southcoastffc]

I do like the statement that "Slav is being carried by the players".  Isn't that what should happen? 

[Woolly Mammoth]

To a large extent Managers are only as good as the players they have under them.
He clearly is not being supported by the club in obtaining the players he thinks he needs, hence the reason why if we don't make the promised land this year, he will go, and the club will be shooting itself in the foot if that happened.
One of the few concerns I have is that I am not sure Jok can attract players the way some managers can, and I am not talking about financial inducements.

[Carborundum]

Why a silly thread? It has highlighted the fact that some think he is an amazing manager and the best since Tigana. While others differ in varying degrees. I think it has been interesting. Shows how, with no evidence at all, we either make heroes of very average performers or villains out of very average performers. Fascinating.

Agree with you. This has been a brilliant thread, not least because brawn is such a good sport, with some patient responses to the unfurling discourse whilst choosing not to dignify other aspects.  If a newcomer wanted to get a good idea what this board is like, perhaps this would be the ideal thread to gauge how things are.

All I know is that difference of view and difference in many other respects is a fact of life.  How one reacts to difference defines a person like practically nothing else.

[Woolly Mammoth]

Why a silly thread? It has highlighted the fact that some think he is an amazing manager and the best since Tigana. While others differ in varying degrees. I think it has been interesting. Shows how, with no evidence at all, we either make heroes of very average performers or villains out of very average performers. Fascinating.

Agree with you. This has been a brilliant thread, not least because brawn is such a good sport, with some patient responses to the unfurling discourse whilst choosing not to dignify other aspects.  If a newcomer wanted to get a good idea what this board is like, perhaps this would be the ideal thread to gauge how things are.

All I know is that difference of view and difference in many other respects is a fact of life.  How one reacts to difference defines a person like practically nothing else.

You have taken the words right out of my mouth.

[davew]

I do like the statement that "Slav is being carried by the players".  Isn't that what should happen? 

Only when we win a trophy!

[The Old Count]

Why a silly thread? It has highlighted the fact that some think he is an amazing manager and the best since Tigana. While others differ in varying degrees. I think it has been interesting. Shows how, with no evidence at all, we either make heroes of very average performers or villains out of very average performers. Fascinating.

What! The manager that got us to the playoffs despite being hampered in his choices of players, who could have walked but chose to stay, who has started to get us on a run that may lead to promotion despite still being hampered by transfer policy, who has more to do with Sess and Cairney staying here than is credited, who has had us playing the best in years.
What does Brawn suggest - we sack him? Rowett and Birmingham spring to mind. That's why I think it's silly.

Yes Slav is not a perfect manager but not many are.  I for one would rather he stays.

[colinwhite]

Actually Brawn The old un has a point. You makes lots of criticism but what are you actually getting off your chest? You surely arent suggesting that Jokanovic should be sacked ?
We all get frustrated but that tends to go away when we start playing some great football ,go on a fantastic run and even start grinding out smash and grabs! So what was the point of your post ? Just curious.

[@jolslover]

Initial thoughts = Burn and Grimmer both no where near good enough for a top 6 champ club, Why would they sign new deals just to be loaned out again ? Also Kalas and Ream are two of the fastest CBs in the league. Selling Adeniran was probably not his decision and LVC was no where near our first team squad so probably wanted to leave.
I'm a big Slavisa fan. 
Lastly agree with this post about Jol from Gloucester White -- Martin Jol's transfer policy was not to recruit 'ageing plodders', he wasn't given the money and every interview he gave he was saying the club should invest in younger players. His team were playing well until his best players were sold and replaced by donkeys.

[BedsFFC]

How is this still a thing

[choice_of_ends]

Jokanovic will get rid of some more players, he didn't want to have, this January window.
Jokanovic won't get any addition to his squad this January window. Maybe another winger?!
Jokanovic will get us promoted.
Jokanovic will be master of efficiency!
COYW!

[Brawn]

Right, let me reply to a few points as I've not had the time over the last couple of days:

Why a silly thread? It has highlighted the fact that some think he is an amazing manager and the best since Tigana. While others differ in varying degrees. I think it has been interesting. Shows how, with no evidence at all, we either make heroes of very average performers or villains out of very average performers. Fascinating.

Agree with you. This has been a brilliant thread, not least because brawn is such a good sport, with some patient responses to the unfurling discourse whilst choosing not to dignify other aspects.  If a newcomer wanted to get a good idea what this board is like, perhaps this would be the ideal thread to gauge how things are.

All I know is that difference of view and difference in many other respects is a fact of life.  How one reacts to difference defines a person like practically nothing else.

I particularly agree with the last sentence here. If we all agreed on everything there wouldn't be much point of a forum!

Initial thoughts = Burn and Grimmer both no where near good enough for a top 6 champ club, Why would they sign new deals just to be loaned out again ? Also Kalas and Ream are two of the fastest CBs in the league. Selling Adeniran was probably not his decision and LVC was no where near our first team squad so probably wanted to leave.
I'm a big Slavisa fan. 
Lastly agree with this post about Jol from Gloucester White -- Martin Jol's transfer policy was not to recruit 'ageing plodders', he wasn't given the money and every interview he gave he was saying the club should invest in younger players. His team were playing well until his best players were sold and replaced by donkeys.

To repeat what I said earlier, the fact that we've had/got players such as Sessegnon and Roberts - played who are playing at such a great standard at such a young age - has led people to forget that players like Burn and Grimmer weren't exactly old. A defender peaks in their career in their late 20s, I would say, possibly even their early 30s, and Burn is (still) some years off that yet. I would have kept Burn if he wanted to stay; a loan move out to a Championship or L1 club if need be (remember he did win promotion from L1 with Yeovil and might do it again with Wigan), but such is our lack of depth at the present moment at centre back, we're starting to miss him. The mere fact that Dan Burn's performances was such a topic of contention for a player who was only 23 years old at the time of his departure shows, I think, that he has promise, because some of us (and indeed, Rene and Kit) could see it. With regard to Grimmer, I can't think of any glaring errors. He was definitely better than Zverotic despite being 19. I think he's another lost opportunity. I felt Burn's performances in 2015-16 were well above Tim Ream's, so it's good to see Ream having come on so strongly recently.

To that extent, Sean Kavanagh needs another 2 or 3 years before we decide what to do with him. If he can't be a second-choice player by the age of 25, then, yes, let go of him.

I don't think Slavisa should be sacked right now. I've accepted that. Like Martin Jol, I just don't like him for the reasons I stated in the OP. A failure to finish in the top 6, however, and I think it would be time to let him go; he'd have had a good innings after all.

Anything else?

[mrmicawbers]

In General I like and want to keep him.Having said that his stubbornness in not giving certain players a chance doesdo him any favours.

[EastEndWhite]

I don't think Slavisa should be sacked right now. I've accepted that. Like Martin Jol, I just don't like him for the reasons I stated in the OP. A failure to finish in the top 6, however, and I think it would be time to let him go; he'd have had a good innings after all.

Anything else?

Just a couple of things.

Are you saying you'd be happy for Slavisa to stay if we finish in a playoff spot but fail to win promotion? (I would be happy for him to stay in this situation)

Is it hard watching Fulham win with a Head Coach in place whom you don't like?  Does it take away some of the pleasure of Fulham winning?

[Brawn]

I don't think Slavisa should be sacked right now. I've accepted that. Like Martin Jol, I just don't like him for the reasons I stated in the OP. A failure to finish in the top 6, however, and I think it would be time to let him go; he'd have had a good innings after all.

Anything else?

Just a couple of things.

Are you saying you'd be happy for Slavisa to stay if we finish in a playoff spot but fail to win promotion? (I would be happy for him to stay in this situation)

Is it hard watching Fulham win with a Head Coach in place whom you don't like?  Does it take away some of the pleasure of Fulham winning?

I'm not "happy" for Slav to stay at all, I'm merely resigned to the fact he is here, and so I'm basically putting up with it for now. If we don't make the playoffs, then I will call for his head.

No, it's not "hard" to see us win. I never want to see us lose, even if I despise the manager. I've had to watch some appalling performances under Sanchez, Jol, Magath, and now Slav (all of whom I basically hated from game 1). To paraphrase Thatcher, I make up my mind about managers and players within about 10 seconds, and very rarely do I change it. I've had three Fulham players who I've hated and then grown to like, but it took forever: Chris Baird (only really liked him in his final days with the club); Zoltan Gera (couldn't stand the bloke until the Europa semi); Tim Ream (although I'm still not completely sold on him).

[RaySmith]

How can you dislike people  you've presumably never even met.

All I care about is performance on the pitch, or the team's performance in the case of a manager.

Slavisa will be judged on results, like all managers, not on whether or not he smiled much.

[The Old Count]

How can you dislike people  you've presumably never even met.

All I care about is performance on the pitch, or the team's performance in the case of a manager.

Slavisa will be judged on results, like all managers, not on whether or not he smiled much.

+ 1

[Brawn]

I didn't say I dislike Slav as a person. I dislike Slav as a manager.

[toshes mate]

I didn't say I dislike Slav as a person. I dislike Slav as a manager.

SJ 'manages' people just as we all do even when we are not titular 'managers', if you can understand my clumsy use of words.

You opened up an interesting thread but, even when offered chances, you haven't, in my humble opinion, chosen to 'open up' and explain your reasoning.  Indeed, in using the Thatcher 'paraphrase' you seem to be trying to commend yourself with having good judgement and yet 'psychologically' all humans make rapid intuitive and largely subliminal pictures of others available to themselves on meeting any one for the first time.  The information you picture in your head depends a great deal on 'your own state of mind at that instant of time' for its accuracy, imagery and usefulness.  Women tend to be much better with this than men (note the word 'tend').     

I don't know if you ever met Thatcher but. if you had, what do you suspect you may have thought of her?  No response required just a thought.

I have enjoyed this thread and so thank you for starting it. 

[VancouverWhite]

I thought that his handling of the Chris Martin situation last season would've endeared him to even fans like you Brawn?