What did you expect after Wembley?

[toshes mate]

I expected something different to what happened after 26th May.  I didn't expect the US trip since time for activity and preparation was already foreshortened by the window itself and the inevitable difficulties caused by the World Cup.  The lateness of signings was the moment that made me want us to do well if only to give Jokanovic a chance to show his worth.  He was denied a opre-season, suffered coaching personnel changes, injured, unfit, unsuitable, or inadequate transfers in, and an eight game shorter time to turn things around as is his style.  He must have known the Khans were coming for his jugular.   The contract situation was pure misdirection and distraction by the Khans.
I don't believe there was a list of targets which is why we bought or loaned the players we did.   The incomers smacked of being within easy grasp because others were chasing sensible targets first. These easily gettable players were nobody else's target and represented poor value while others were harder to prise away because their value was hiked the moment clubs saw how ineffective we were at judging value.  The recruitment emphasis was still locked into 'we will prove to be nobody's fool' syndrome and succeeded as it became 'everybody's fool'.
The sacking of Jokanovic made my blood curdle since it was Ranieri who was already lined up and would take over as a much, much, much worse purveyor of overall coaching skills than the Serbian.  The Khan s had removed one problem and only had to watch the Italian supremo take a few games before Fulham performed like a mid-table side, impressively surviving a season in the top tier for the first time.   We all know how that little gamble went.   

Cynical truth or cynical fiction?  You tell me where the evidence says any different.   

[Statto]

I didn't expect the US trip since time for activity and preparation was already foreshortened by the window itself and the inevitable difficulties caused by the World Cup. 

A good point TM, one which someone else made on here the other day. The players deserved a break of course, but is it any wonder our transfer business was so late when our DoF decided he deserved to go with them?

[Woolly Mammoth]

I expected something different to what happened after 26th May.  I didn't expect the US trip since time for activity and preparation was already foreshortened by the window itself and the inevitable difficulties caused by the World Cup.  The lateness of signings was the moment that made me want us to do well if only to give Jokanovic a chance to show his worth.  He was denied a opre-season, suffered coaching personnel changes, injured, unfit, unsuitable, or inadequate transfers in, and an eight game shorter time to turn things around as is his style.  He must have known the Khans were coming for his jugular.   The contract situation was pure misdirection and distraction by the Khans.
I don't believe there was a list of targets which is why we bought or loaned the players we did.   The incomers smacked of being within easy grasp because others were chasing sensible targets first. These easily gettable players were nobody else's target and represented poor value while others were harder to prise away because their value was hiked the moment clubs saw how ineffective we were at judging value.  The recruitment emphasis was still locked into 'we will prove to be nobody's fool' syndrome and succeeded as it became 'everybody's fool'.
The sacking of Jokanovic made my blood curdle since it was Ranieri who was already lined up and would take over as a much, much, much worse purveyor of overall coaching skills than the Serbian.  The Khan s had removed one problem and only had to watch the Italian supremo take a few games before Fulham performed like a mid-table side, impressively surviving a season in the top tier for the first time.   We all know how that little gamble went.   

Cynical truth or cynical fiction?  You tell me where the evidence says any different.   

Quality Post, and 100% Fact, and for the D of F and Recruitment to take that trip over to the otherside of the pond, instead of getting his priorities in the right order is just another case to place in the Buffoonary File. Under the heading, "how not to prepare for preseason".

[filham]

I hoped the club had a list of players we had targeted for recruitment before Wembley.
I'd hoped we would have 2 lists depending on the result at Wembley and we had already been in contact to sound them out.

The number of loan players in last seasons squad was always going to make things difficult but I expected us to recognise that and act ASAP.

The teams weakness defending had finally been solved by the style introduced by Jokanovic but thinking we could play that in the PL was always a mistake.
It worked in the Championship because it bamboozled teams but thinking these players could play that way in the PL would always make us fragile.

If the recruitment had understood what was needed, been realistic we could have brought in decent players early, moulded them into a team and survived.

My heart said if this £100 million is well spent and they click we will do OK but my head said we will struggle.
When I saw the pace, power & team work of an average team like Palace with my own eyes on the first day of the season I knew we were in big trouble.

I too thought that our attractive tactics would have to be adjusted to something more mundane for the premier league.
Jocanovic thought differently and persisted for game after game with the same tactics. Ranieri came in and immediately introduced a completely opposite stile and he too is refusing to adjust  his tactics which are just not suited to the players available.
A little more flexibility from our two managers this season may have helped us.

[cookieg]

£100m should have bought survival but all it bought was humiliation and relegation. There are still games to go I know but even the Lord Almighty would struggle to bring us back from the dead. Cue the miraculous turn around and resurrection by Easter.

[Fulham 442]

Some really good posts on here and we all seem to be mostly in agreement.  I said at the start of the season that I would take 17th and then build for the next season from there.  I think a major problem for us, as I have stated before, is that when we got promoted to the top flight last time we already had a Premiership team in place and this time we bought too many players in too short a time period with a lot of them lacking the qualities we needed.  It quickly became clear that we would struggle.  I didn't think though, like a lot of us, that it would be this bad and we would be relegated well before the end of the season.

[Woolly Mammoth]

Some really good posts on here and we all seem to be mostly in agreement.  I said at the start of the season that I would take 17th and then build for the next season from there.  I think a major problem for us, as I have stated before, is that when we got promoted to the top flight last time we already had a Premiership team in place and this time we bought too many players in too short a time period with a lot of them lacking the qualities we needed.  It quickly became clear that we would struggle.  I didn't think though, like a lot of us,  that it would be this bad and we would be making repetitive replies that aren't funny!  well before the end of the season.

I will say it for you, " we would be Doome d well before the end of the season."

[Sting of the North]

I expected something different to what happened after 26th May.  I didn't expect the US trip since time for activity and preparation was already foreshortened by the window itself and the inevitable difficulties caused by the World Cup.  The lateness of signings was the moment that made me want us to do well if only to give Jokanovic a chance to show his worth.  He was denied a opre-season, suffered coaching personnel changes, injured, unfit, unsuitable, or inadequate transfers in, and an eight game shorter time to turn things around as is his style.  He must have known the Khans were coming for his jugular.   The contract situation was pure misdirection and distraction by the Khans.
I don't believe there was a list of targets which is why we bought or loaned the players we did.   The incomers smacked of being within easy grasp because others were chasing sensible targets first. These easily gettable players were nobody else's target and represented poor value while others were harder to prise away because their value was hiked the moment clubs saw how ineffective we were at judging value.  The recruitment emphasis was still locked into 'we will prove to be nobody's fool' syndrome and succeeded as it became 'everybody's fool'.
The sacking of Jokanovic made my blood curdle since it was Ranieri who was already lined up and would take over as a much, much, much worse purveyor of overall coaching skills than the Serbian.  The Khan s had removed one problem and only had to watch the Italian supremo take a few games before Fulham performed like a mid-table side, impressively surviving a season in the top tier for the first time.   We all know how that little gamble went.   

Cynical truth or cynical fiction?  You tell me where the evidence says any different.   

Quality Post, and 100% Fact, and for the D of F and Recruitment to take that trip over to the otherside of the pond, instead of getting his priorities in the right order is just another case to place in the Buffoonary File. Under the heading, "how not to prepare for preseason".

I agree that this was a well argued and interesting post. However to state "100 % fact" about something that is in parts purely speculative (however reasonable) is not something that anyone should agree on. Speculation should never be seen as facts.

[Woolly Mammoth]

I expected something different to what happened after 26th May.  I didn't expect the US trip since time for activity and preparation was already foreshortened by the window itself and the inevitable difficulties caused by the World Cup.  The lateness of signings was the moment that made me want us to do well if only to give Jokanovic a chance to show his worth.  He was denied a opre-season, suffered coaching personnel changes, injured, unfit, unsuitable, or inadequate transfers in, and an eight game shorter time to turn things around as is his style.  He must have known the Khans were coming for his jugular.   The contract situation was pure misdirection and distraction by the Khans.
I don't believe there was a list of targets which is why we bought or loaned the players we did.   The incomers smacked of being within easy grasp because others were chasing sensible targets first. These easily gettable players were nobody else's target and represented poor value while others were harder to prise away because their value was hiked the moment clubs saw how ineffective we were at judging value.  The recruitment emphasis was still locked into 'we will prove to be nobody's fool' syndrome and succeeded as it became 'everybody's fool'.
The sacking of Jokanovic made my blood curdle since it was Ranieri who was already lined up and would take over as a much, much, much worse purveyor of overall coaching skills than the Serbian.  The Khan s had removed one problem and only had to watch the Italian supremo take a few games before Fulham performed like a mid-table side, impressively surviving a season in the top tier for the first time.   We all know how that little gamble went.   

Cynical truth or cynical fiction?  You tell me where the evidence says any different.   

Quality Post, and 100% Fact, and for the D of F and Recruitment to take that trip over to the otherside of the pond, instead of getting his priorities in the right order is just another case to place in the Buffoonary File. Under the heading, "how not to prepare for preseason".

I agree that this was a well argued and interesting post. However to state "100 % fact" about something that is in parts purely speculative (however reasonable) is not something that anyone should agree on. Speculation should never be seen as facts.

Ok oh wise one, I shall amend it to 99.9% recurring and nailed on.

[Luka]

After Wembley I had realistic hopes.
Not of a top half finish or even mid table but that we would at least compete.
Unfortunately even that looks to have been to much of an ask.
The appointment of Ranieri was totally underwhelming and I'm left incredulous by the sheer incompetence of the senior management to identify the real problem.

[ffcne]

I expected something different to what happened after 26th May.  I didn't expect the US trip since time for activity and preparation was already foreshortened by the window itself and the inevitable difficulties caused by the World Cup.  The lateness of signings was the moment that made me want us to do well if only to give Jokanovic a chance to show his worth.  He was denied a opre-season, suffered coaching personnel changes, injured, unfit, unsuitable, or inadequate transfers in, and an eight game shorter time to turn things around as is his style.  He must have known the Khans were coming for his jugular.   The contract situation was pure misdirection and distraction by the Khans.
I don't believe there was a list of targets which is why we bought or loaned the players we did.   The incomers smacked of being within easy grasp because others were chasing sensible targets first. These easily gettable players were nobody else's target and represented poor value while others were harder to prise away because their value was hiked the moment clubs saw how ineffective we were at judging value.  The recruitment emphasis was still locked into 'we will prove to be nobody's fool' syndrome and succeeded as it became 'everybody's fool'.
The sacking of Jokanovic made my blood curdle since it was Ranieri who was already lined up and would take over as a much, much, much worse purveyor of overall coaching skills than the Serbian.  The Khan s had removed one problem and only had to watch the Italian supremo take a few games before Fulham performed like a mid-table side, impressively surviving a season in the top tier for the first time.   We all know how that little gamble went.   

Cynical truth or cynical fiction?  You tell me where the evidence says any different.   

Quality Post, and 100% Fact, and for the D of F and Recruitment to take that trip over to the otherside of the pond, instead of getting his priorities in the right order is just another case to place in the Buffoonary File. Under the heading, "how not to prepare for preseason".

I agree that this was a well argued and interesting post. However to state "100 % fact" about something that is in parts purely speculative (however reasonable) is not something that anyone should agree on. Speculation should never be seen as facts.

Ok oh wise one, I shall amend it to 99.9% recurring and nailed on.

Nice one Woolly.
The opinions  of Toshes mate are 99.9% fact  and a quality post.

[toshes mate]

I agree that this was a well argued and interesting post. However to state "100 % fact" about something that is in parts purely speculative (however reasonable) is not something that anyone should agree on. Speculation should never be seen as facts.

All I asked for, S-O-T-N, was contradictory evidence. 

You can claim my beliefs are misguided - as in, there was a list of targets but it posed initial and apparently insurmountable difficulties (e.g. Targett and Mitrovic) and so, in the interests of expediency, less difficult 'unlisted' targets were sought instead.  Either way the list was meaningless.   You can claim the Khans were not after Jokanovic's blood, but why the coaching personnel changes, the seeking or searching out of Ranieri even before the season had begun?  You can claim I am being cynical with the 'evidence' and I would accept that criticism as a point of view.  However, I would expect you to provide evidence which is much more convincing of another truth which cannot also be treated to cynical opposing views.

Everybody on here speculates and that should be a given in any post unless the poster proves to us, chapter and verse, that what they claim really happened. Then it is evidence to be looked at in other ways including the more cynical view.   

[Sting of the North]

Ok oh wise one, I shall amend it to 99.9% recurring and nailed on.

Nice one Woolly.
The opinions  of Toshes mate are 99.9% fact  and a quality post.
[/quote]

This post is just amazing. The word fact is obviously completely obsolete on here.

[Sting of the North]

I agree that this was a well argued and interesting post. However to state "100 % fact" about something that is in parts purely speculative (however reasonable) is not something that anyone should agree on. Speculation should never be seen as facts.

All I asked for, S-O-T-N, was contradictory evidence. 

You can claim my beliefs are misguided - as in, there was a list of targets but it posed initial and apparently insurmountable difficulties (e.g. Targett and Mitrovic) and so, in the interests of expediency, less difficult 'unlisted' targets were sought instead.  Either way the list was meaningless.   You can claim the Khans were not after Jokanovic's blood, but why the coaching personnel changes, the seeking or searching out of Ranieri even before the season had begun?  You can claim I am being cynical with the 'evidence' and I would accept that criticism as a point of view.  However, I would expect you to provide evidence which is much more convincing of another truth which cannot also be treated to cynical opposing views.

Everybody on here speculates and that should be a given in any post unless the poster proves to us, chapter and verse, that what they claim really happened. Then it is evidence to be looked at in other ways including the more cynical view.   

I have no idea why you ask me for contradictory evidence. I didn't even say I disagreed with your post in any way whatsoever. I actually said that it was both interesting and well argued, and did not disagree on anything really. If unclear, my post was directed at another posters way of using the word "fact" about something that is indeed not fact but speculation/opinion. You can agree with an opinion without taking it for fact.

[WindyCity]

After the dust had settled, and before we had started signing players, I'm sure most of us thought it would be a tough battle to stay up. We were the 3rd placed team to come up, so it was always going to be hard.

It's hardly a shock we're going back down. For me, I just hope Cardiff do as well as it will make it a little easier to bear.

Finishing 3rd had nothing to do with it.  FFC almost finished 2nd, fell just short on last game of season.  After all the money spent and the "talent" secured for the new season, and there was a lot of optimism in this forum at the time, I knew it would be tough, but I fully expected a much better season, and was hopeful for somewhere around 11 - 15 as a reasonable expectation. 

[Lyle from Hangeland]

I expected a relegation fight. We weren't a strong enough squad to compete in the Premier League as the playoff-winner.

[Steeeeeeeeeed]

Finishing 3rd had nothing to do with it.  FFC almost finished 2nd, fell just short on last game of season.  After all the money spent and the "talent" secured for the new season, and there was a lot of optimism in this forum at the time, I knew it would be tough, but I fully expected a much better season, and was hopeful for somewhere around 11 - 15 as a reasonable expectation.

I pretty much felt the same. I thought we would be a 'comfortable' 12th -15th ish for much of the season, possibly pushing into the top half.

We were the form team in the championship from February to the end. We were on such a good run, playing some excellent quality football. We were being widely lauded in the media and to me it felt like we had things in place (squad, money,chairman, manager) for a long term stay in the prem.

[The Rational Fan]

Well, if i could swap where we are now and before Wembley 2018, i would definitely take now. Many players are locked in long contracts and we have two years of parchate payments to get back up. I am sure we sell Ryan Sessegnon over the summer, but can keep anyone else not on loan we want. I think we have 18 championship players signed already and get 6 more championship players from sessegnon sale. And, if we get promoted our team will be able to get a point a game in its 1st season with current squad and loans.

[Woolly Mammoth]

I hoped the club had a list of players we had targeted for recruitment before Wembley.
I'd hoped we would have 2 lists depending on the result at Wembley and we had already been in contact to sound them out.

The number of loan players in last seasons squad was always going to make things difficult but I expected us to recognise that and act ASAP.

The teams weakness defending had finally been solved by the style introduced by Jokanovic but thinking we could play that in the PL was always a mistake.
It worked in the Championship because it bamboozled teams but thinking these players could play that way in the PL would always make us fragile.

If the recruitment had understood what was needed, been realistic we could have brought in decent players early, moulded them into a team and survived.

My heart said if this £100 million is well spent and they click we will do OK but my head said we will struggle.
When I saw the pace, power & team work of an average team like Palace with my own eyes on the first day of the season I knew we were in big trouble.

Well said.