The straw that broke the fans back?

[timmyg]

Woah I go away for an evening and this thread turns to fisticuffs!

Here are some stats for you:

• We've already kept more clean sheets so far this season (5) than we did at this point last season (4) and one less than our best season ever two years ago (6). And much more than in '06 and '07 (2 in each).
• We've also scored more (16) than we did by this time in '08 (13) and conceded 8 more (20;12). Last year we scored 4 more goals (20) by this time and conceded 3 less (18) [FWIW 6, or nearly 1/3, of those goals scored came from just two games]
• Lastly, according to physioroom we've had 3 more different players injured so far this season (15) than at this point last (12), 6 more than in '08 (9) and 5 more than in '07 (10)

And ImperialWhite, why the underlining of my name? Did I (finally) make a salient point?

[Burt]

There have been a number of issues:
- New manager, squad need to get used to him.
- Changing tactics, squad need to get used to them.
- Injuries.
- Relatively (ahem) mature players who aren't getting any younger.

Is it too early for the old "Hughes Out" scenario?

Probably... Who would come in his stead? And regardless of who, he will inherit the same situation... So lets see what the January window brings in.

Had one of the numerous chances we had against Sunderland gone in and we picked up the points, would this have been such a hotly debated post?

On the one hand we didn't play too badly at times, and on balance with some luck should have won.

On the other hand it is a worry that we are failing to pick off sides at home who should be viewed as "beatable". A few weeks ago, looking forward, it looked like a decent run of home games but having failed to win any of them so far the doubts are creeping in.

I dunno what to think really. I'm gonna sleep on it.

[Rambling_Syd_Rumpo]

I'm still in the"lets see who comes in & who go's out in Jan" camp,but I am concerned.The thing for me is we have no strikers,AJ may never get his form back,EJ no killer instinct at all-we need 2 on form strikers,we need goals,we have everything else,we are defending well as a team,so it's goals we need,we getting player who can score a few and we will be ok  :clap_hands:

[WHITEwitch]

...I don't give a stuff about liverpool, it is my Fulham that is suffering.


I have heard and understood all the excuses - but I still fail to understand why 95% of our Europa campaign squad have suddenly lost the ability to play as a team...

Zamora was the key to how they functioned.  The back still works.  The mid still works until it gets within striking distance.  We create plenty of chances but the missing link is the front.  Johnson is nothing without Zamora.  Dembele looked like he might fill the gap 75% but he is out.  Kamara just isnt up to it.

[jimog]

Also worth pointing out that last season started in July, finished in June (?) 60+ games and has taken its toll. Duff looked knackered (not just injured) playing for Ireland.
Add that to what's been said here and its another factor. I honestly believe RH might well have taken us down - over loyal to those who served well but are over the hill.
I'm optimistic about Hughes but over here in Ireland I admit I see nothing like as much as ye do. Imagine IF Bellamy & Santa Cruz had been snaffled in the transfer window? I don't think we'd be anywhere near where we are.
Great board by the way

[AlFayedsChequebook]

...sorry, it annoys me when people presume because I am not happy (an understatement) with the performaces and they roll of the mantra "get behind the team", I do get behind the team, every game, I don't boo, I cheer even the most pathetic excuses of players - no matter what  - I give 100%, and usually when we go a goal behind the first voice you will hear is mine singing "Come On Fulham".

Time I saw some return from the pitch, time they got behind me and thousands like me...

why is it that when I question the manager and his piss poor tactical approach to the game that I get accused of 'not getting behind the team' but others call our players 'crap' and 'not good enough' but never get called out?

[Blingo]

8th best record for goals conceded, so it's clear that the defence is working. Our problems are up front and we need a midfielder. How different would the tune be now if BZ and Dembele had been fit? What I do agree with is that we need younger blood at Fulham, yet our academy and reserves are constantly overlooked. Why not give the young forwards a chance? They cant do any worse than our forwards are doing now can they? I also believe that AJ was a big mistake for us.
But anyone talking about us being relegated is talking out of their hat. A couple of wins will do wonders for confidence in the team and suddenly we are up and running again and everyone in the Hammersmith End and all around the ground will be cheering again. Relegation this season? Not as long as we all have holes up our rrr ses. We are far better than our current league placing is suggesting. Watch it all change after the Jan transfer window. MH was not given enough time to settle in, buy players and structure the team properly. Once Jan passes, we will know if he has to go by Feb the latest. I just have a sneaky feeling that he will turn it all around.

[mrska]

Nothing to add..  just a cracking thread..

[Me-ate-Live, innit??]

This is pointless, Mark Hughes is our manager, a manager,  most people believed,  was the best appointed manager ever at Fulham and his appointment showed intent for moving up in the future ..................
So there is a set back, are we not used to those ???? He has alot of pride and he will do us proud,  we only need to support him and the team ........
booing is not an option ...................well it should not be as we will only make it harder for him  and demoralise the team

[Lighthouse]

Until we stop thinking it is all Hughes and nothing to do with the squad. 7 wins in the Prem all Year.

Until we stop thinking that the odd signing will make us anything but average.

We will always expect too much. Let us just hope to survive this season.

[Burt]

We will always expect too much. Let us just hope to survive this season.

Interesting observation.

We have been spoilt for the last two seasons, relative to what we have usually achieved, and the expecation levels have risen accordingly.

Could it be that the natural order of things are being re-established, and a good season for us is one where we avoid relegation?

I hope we have more in us than that, but in all honesty are we really going to be anything other than a selling club where mid-table is good and the odd decent cup run is all we will ever get to cheer about?

Devil's advocate...

[AlFayedsChequebook]

Until we stop thinking it is all Hughes and nothing to do with the squad. 7 wins in the Prem all Year.

Until we stop thinking that the odd signing will make us anything but average.

We will always expect too much. Let us just hope to survive this season.

It isn't all Hughes at all, but he has massively contributed to the shower of sh*** that we saw on Sat.

[Banstead White]

Thought to maybe lighten it up......... for now he's our manager, and just as when sanchez was fu3-1n it up we should still be singing COYW  :clap_hands: as difficult as it is, ones thing for sure MOST of the squad are "fulham" people having been here a while and you just gotta see Brede after a defeat to see that guys commitment.....its still better than hartlepool away>>>I'm livin the dream till that day comes again.. :57: :57: :57:

[ScalleysDad]

...I don't give a stuff about liverpool, it is my Fulham that is suffering.


I have heard and understood all the excuses - but I still fail to understand why 95% of our Europa campaign squad have suddenly lost the ability to play as a team...

Zamora was the key to how they functioned.  The back still works.  The mid still works until it gets within striking distance.  We create plenty of chances but the missing link is the front.  Johnson is nothing without Zamora.  Dembele looked like he might fill the gap 75% but he is out.  Kamara just isnt up to it.

However there is the school of thought that says the absence of AJ was the making of Zamorra.

[Jimpav]

Regardless of our ancient squad Hughes has only managed two wins this season - both against teams in the relegation zone.

Yes Hughes was an exciting prospect- bar Man city he has a good track record but someone of his stature should be doing better regardless of the squad.

We are halfway through the season and yet there is no indication of strategy or tactics apart from a more "attacking/direct" approach. The fans are clueless and so are the players.

We have had injuries but this is not an excuse or the constant changes to the back 4 and the attack. Hodgson achieved stability by playing the same side week in week out regardless of individual errors.

We've got an extremely tough run in so it's no use hoping that BZ will save us and we have a good transfer window.

I repeat myself from earlier. I am not calling for Hughes head- I just want to see a chink of light and something to cling to. 

3 points at West Ham would be a start - if we fail here then perhaps all you "believers" will see it from a "doubters" perspective.

Feel free to name and shame me if we finish comfy mid table but be sure to turn the lights off if Arsenal celebrate their title win by relegating us on the last day.

[ImperialWhite]

Regardless of our ancient squad Hughes has only managed two wins this season - both against teams in the relegation zone.

Yes Hughes was an exciting prospect- bar Man city he has a good track record but someone of his stature should be doing better regardless of the squad.

We are halfway through the season and yet there is no indication of strategy or tactics apart from a more "attacking/direct" approach. The fans are clueless and so are the players.

We have had injuries but this is not an excuse or the constant changes to the back 4 and the attack. Hodgson achieved stability by playing the same side week in week out regardless of individual errors.

We've got an extremely tough run in so it's no use hoping that BZ will save us and we have a good transfer window.

I repeat myself from earlier. I am not calling for Hughes head- I just want to see a chink of light and something to cling to. 

3 points at West Ham would be a start - if we fail here then perhaps all you "believers" will see it from a "doubters" perspective.

Feel free to name and shame me if we finish comfy mid table but be sure to turn the lights off if Arsenal celebrate their title win by relegating us on the last day.

Even as a firm doubter, I know that we will beat West Ham.

A win against West Ham can't even be considered as a start, or turning the corner, or whatever. It's a must win. It's must win, and it should be convincing. They've managed no wins, and only 3 draws, away. They've only scored 4 times away, while conceding 15.

In my opinion it's beat West Ham to save Hughes' job. There's no way his position is safe without the 3pts (if he can't manage a win against West Ham he can't be trusted to spend anymore money).

[Staffs White]

Not read the whole thread (2 young children running around with their mum ill in bed is taking up all my time) I am typing as an outsider really I've only seen the Stoke game in the Carling Cup Live but I am prepared to give MH a chance until this time next season providing we don't get relegated

As I posted in another thread on this last week his record as a manager is good he needs time and some lucky breaks, however I do respect the opinions of those that have watchd us week in week out and are concerned by Hughes management

[BalDrick]

General bottom line is 'don't like him but we'd be idiots to get shot of him now, plus he's had a poo run of luck with injuries' - which pretty well sums up my thoughts at this juncture.

However, he muct be backed heavily in January - blame whoever you like but we had a paper-thin squad at the start of the season and we've lost too many to injuries. There's nobody who could have emulated the last 2 seasons with the players we've had missing. Which doesn't mean Hughes is doing a great job, just that he's had poo luck.

[AlFayedsChequebook]

Regardless of our ancient squad Hughes has only managed two wins this season - both against teams in the relegation zone.

Yes Hughes was an exciting prospect- bar Man city he has a good track record but someone of his stature should be doing better regardless of the squad.

We are halfway through the season and yet there is no indication of strategy or tactics apart from a more "attacking/direct" approach. The fans are clueless and so are the players.

We have had injuries but this is not an excuse or the constant changes to the back 4 and the attack. Hodgson achieved stability by playing the same side week in week out regardless of individual errors.

We've got an extremely tough run in so it's no use hoping that BZ will save us and we have a good transfer window.

I repeat myself from earlier. I am not calling for Hughes head- I just want to see a chink of light and something to cling to. 

3 points at West Ham would be a start - if we fail here then perhaps all you "believers" will see it from a "doubters" perspective.

Feel free to name and shame me if we finish comfy mid table but be sure to turn the lights off if Arsenal celebrate their title win by relegating us on the last day.

Even as a firm doubter, I know that we will beat West Ham.

A win against West Ham can't even be considered as a start, or turning the corner, or whatever. It's a must win. It's must win, and it should be convincing. They've managed no wins, and only 3 draws, away. They've only scored 4 times away, while conceding 15.

In my opinion it's beat West Ham to save Hughes' job. There's no way his position is safe without the 3pts (if he can't manage a win against West Ham he can't be trusted to spend anymore money).

completely agree, losing to West Ham is not an option. I expect a decent performance against Liverpool next week too, since they are hot and cold.