BHAFC v Fulham Under 21s on YouTube tonight

[Shredhead]

I was thinking of going but only STHs (presumably Albion) can purchase tickets. Booo. So this will have to do.
https://www.youtube.com/live/_tNSccabrig?si=GCWHQk2o9ZmzDV_1

[TheOnionBag]

Thank for sharing.
I half watched while minding the grandson, it was a good watch, we seemed to be reasonably in control but were 2 down then 4 2 up, it ended 4 3 with a few decent goals the pick a curler into the top corner by Ali wahid (not for the first time is he the u21's harry Wilson only scoring crackers ?).
A

[demeant0r]

If we don't give ALB and Ali Wahid some senior game time next season, especially as we don't seem to be renewing Raul, then we might as well pack up the academy.

[jayffc]

Brilliant goals from kusi Asare and Ali wahid again.

[jayffc]

If we don't give ALB and Ali Wahid some senior game time next season, especially as we don't seem to be renewing Raul, then we might as well pack up the academy.

Tbf
Did Josh king literally not just start Vs west ham?

Before that stanno started to get minutes but decided to go to Brum for 20m+

Sess is back in our team currently

Carvalho was good for us

Rodak was vital in promotion season

Harris got minutes but never took his chances.

We always take youth away to summer cap, if they perform at stand out high level they do get a shot

Our academy is producing enough talent easily to justify itself and players will generally get a shot IF they prove themselves capable of it.

Ali wahid is tiny, but quality, would be interested to see him get minutes off bench in cup IF we're up by 2/3 goals for a cameo, trickier for obvious reason to take such risks with more defensive players.

ALB not pulling up trees on limited minutes at Walsall at the moment but was on fire for academy

Ahead of ALB is kusi Asare currently but question is will we sign him or not.

 Regardless we're almost certainly signing Pepi it seems as Raul replacement. So it's which youth takes the third spot -ALB or sign JKA

[Southcoastffc]

Is it not the case that we must have an academy?  That being the case, whether or not players come through to our first team then we can at least attempt to use it as a source of income.

[demeant0r]

If we don't give ALB and Ali Wahid some senior game time next season, especially as we don't seem to be renewing Raul, then we might as well pack up the academy.

Tbf
Did Josh king literally not just start Vs west ham?

Before that stanno started to get minutes but decided to go to Brum for 20m+

Sess is back in our team currently

Carvalho was good for us

Rodak was vital in promotion season

Harris got minutes but never took his chances.

We always take youth away to summer cap, if they perform at stand out high level they do get a shot

Our academy is producing enough talent easily to justify itself and players will generally get a shot IF they prove themselves capable of it.

Ali wahid is tiny, but quality, would be interested to see him get minutes off bench in cup IF we're up by 2/3 goals for a cameo, trickier for obvious reason to take such risks with more defensive players.

ALB not pulling up trees on limited minutes at Walsall at the moment but was on fire for academy

Ahead of ALB is kusi Asare currently but question is will we sign him or not.

 Regardless we're almost certainly signing Pepi it seems as Raul replacement. So it's which youth takes the third spot -ALB or sign JKA

Yes, you have a point. We are starting to take our academy more seriously. But in my 25+ years supporting Fulham, I remember maybe 15 academy players promoted to the senior team: Sean Davis, Neil Etheridge, Matt Briggs, Kakaniklic, Betts, Lasse Vigen, Woodrow, George Williams, Dembele II, Roberts and the ones you listed. (There may be more but I sometimes don't remember what I ate the previous week.)

Less than one promoted a season doesn't seem like we were making effective use of the academy.

Also ALB has only played 120 mins so far for Walsall, kind of difficult to know how good he is if he's not getting minutes.

[demeant0r]

Is it not the case that we must have an academy?  That being the case, whether or not players come through to our first team then we can at least attempt to use it as a source of income.

Yes, I believe so. I remember reading that Brentford used to not have an academy?

[jayffc]

If we don't give ALB and Ali Wahid some senior game time next season, especially as we don't seem to be renewing Raul, then we might as well pack up the academy.

Tbf
Did Josh king literally not just start Vs west ham?

Before that stanno started to get minutes but decided to go to Brum for 20m+

Sess is back in our team currently

Carvalho was good for us

Rodak was vital in promotion season

Harris got minutes but never took his chances.

We always take youth away to summer cap, if they perform at stand out high level they do get a shot

Our academy is producing enough talent easily to justify itself and players will generally get a shot IF they prove themselves capable of it.

Ali wahid is tiny, but quality, would be interested to see him get minutes off bench in cup IF we're up by 2/3 goals for a cameo, trickier for obvious reason to take such risks with more defensive players.

ALB not pulling up trees on limited minutes at Walsall at the moment but was on fire for academy

Ahead of ALB is kusi Asare currently but question is will we sign him or not.

 Regardless we're almost certainly signing Pepi it seems as Raul replacement. So it's which youth takes the third spot -ALB or sign JKA

Yes, you have a point. We are starting to take our academy more seriously. But in my 25+ years supporting Fulham, I remember maybe 15 academy players promoted to the senior team: Sean Davis, Neil Etheridge, Matt Briggs, Kakaniklic, Betts, Lasse Vigen, Woodrow, George Williams, Dembele II, Roberts and the ones you listed. (There may be more but I sometimes don't remember what I ate the previous week.)

Less than one promoted a season doesn't seem like we were making effective use of the academy.

Also ALB has only played 120 mins so far for Walsall, kind of difficult to know how good he is if he's not getting minutes.

Is this much worse than other teams our size in the prem?

As I see it our academy regularly out performs many top teams and is more often than not near top of the academy leagues most seasons.

We got lots of youth internationals etc too... So if ours isn't producing 1 a season I doubt many are that arent Chelsea who buy thousands of youth players more than they train them from early...then the top 2/3 who have the pick of youth players.

I doubt most premier league clubs churn out 1 regular starter every year. For most academies the vast majority of players never make it at the top level with a small chunk making a few first team appearances, far fewer making regular first team start and a very miniscule amount making it to the top level of football. We also sold godo last year who's doing very well now in france, he got chances to impress here but didn't take them.

Luc DF is a full international for Canada men's team already. Harvey Elliot went to liverpool.

I honestly doubt we're producing less in that time than most teams

[TheOnionBag]

I have to say I do enjoy watching the u21's play (live or on Fulham TV) there isn't the same anxiety over the result as when I am watching the first team, but that is part of the problem, imagine playing one of the youngsters and they don't perform, it's all the kid and Marcos fault we lost to X Y or Z it is perhaps much easier for wolves to throw in youngsters as they have nothing to lose and the supporters are likely to cut such a player on £500 a week more slack than a player on £50,000. Likewise Man city aren't overly weakening Thier team by playing the odd youth player.
I was really fed up we lost Osmund to Celtic in the summer to me he seemed to be another Stansfield hard working with a knack of being on the end of things, he was in and around the first team but has disappeared of late, I would have loved for him to have stuck around and got game time with us.
With a fair few of our players (u21's) out on loan we have had a great season being near the top of the league throughout the season.

[Hatch007]

I used to view our academy in the same binary way; how many players make the first team against those that don't.

But we should also consider the number of players we sell to lower league clubs.

In addition to Stansfield, Sess, Elliott and Carvalho that went for 7/8 figure sums, we've also sold a few in the last couple of seasons for c. £500,000.

I don't know how much the academy costs to run on an annual basis but the aforementioned sales of players that never made our first team must go a long way to self-sustainability or even turning a profit.

Players not successfully transitioning to regular first team status does not necessarily = failure 👍

[Southcoastffc]

Is it not the case that we must have an academy?  That being the case, whether or not players come through to our first team then we can at least attempt to use it as a source of income.

Yes, I believe so. I remember reading that Brentford used to not have an academy?

I think that PL academy rules changed 4 or 5 years ago.

[SG]

If we don't give ALB and Ali Wahid some senior game time next season, especially as we don't seem to be renewing Raul, then we might as well pack up the academy.

Tbf
Did Josh king literally not just start Vs west ham?

Before that stanno started to get minutes but decided to go to Brum for 20m+

Sess is back in our team currently

Carvalho was good for us

Rodak was vital in promotion season

Harris got minutes but never took his chances.

We always take youth away to summer cap, if they perform at stand out high level they do get a shot

Our academy is producing enough talent easily to justify itself and players will generally get a shot IF they prove themselves capable of it.

Ali wahid is tiny, but quality, would be interested to see him get minutes off bench in cup IF we're up by 2/3 goals for a cameo, trickier for obvious reason to take such risks with more defensive players.

ALB not pulling up trees on limited minutes at Walsall at the moment but was on fire for academy

Ahead of ALB is kusi Asare currently but question is will we sign him or not.

 Regardless we're almost certainly signing Pepi it seems as Raul replacement. So it's which youth takes the third spot -ALB or sign JKA

Yes, you have a point. We are starting to take our academy more seriously. But in my 25+ years supporting Fulham, I remember maybe 15 academy players promoted to the senior team: Sean Davis, Neil Etheridge, Matt Briggs, Kakaniklic, Betts, Lasse Vigen, Woodrow, George Williams, Dembele II, Roberts and the ones you listed. (There may be more but I sometimes don't remember what I ate the previous week.)

Less than one promoted a season doesn't seem like we were making effective use of the academy.

Also ALB has only played 120 mins so far for Walsall, kind of difficult to know how good he is if he's not getting minutes.

They've also been playing him in a midfield role which I am not sure suits him
Incidentally George Wickens played for Lincoln today in their win over Cardiff to go top of the table

[Hatch007]

There was over 27,000 at Cardiff for today's match

[jayffc]

If we don't give ALB and Ali Wahid some senior game time next season, especially as we don't seem to be renewing Raul, then we might as well pack up the academy.

Tbf
Did Josh king literally not just start Vs west ham?

Before that stanno started to get minutes but decided to go to Brum for 20m+

Sess is back in our team currently

Carvalho was good for us

Rodak was vital in promotion season

Harris got minutes but never took his chances.

We always take youth away to summer cap, if they perform at stand out high level they do get a shot

Our academy is producing enough talent easily to justify itself and players will generally get a shot IF they prove themselves capable of it.

Ali wahid is tiny, but quality, would be interested to see him get minutes off bench in cup IF we're up by 2/3 goals for a cameo, trickier for obvious reason to take such risks with more defensive players.

ALB not pulling up trees on limited minutes at Walsall at the moment but was on fire for academy

Ahead of ALB is kusi Asare currently but question is will we sign him or not.

 Regardless we're almost certainly signing Pepi it seems as Raul replacement. So it's which youth takes the third spot -ALB or sign JKA

Yes, you have a point. We are starting to take our academy more seriously. But in my 25+ years supporting Fulham, I remember maybe 15 academy players promoted to the senior team: Sean Davis, Neil Etheridge, Matt Briggs, Kakaniklic, Betts, Lasse Vigen, Woodrow, George Williams, Dembele II, Roberts and the ones you listed. (There may be more but I sometimes don't remember what I ate the previous week.)

Less than one promoted a season doesn't seem like we were making effective use of the academy.

Also ALB has only played 120 mins so far for Walsall, kind of difficult to know how good he is if he's not getting minutes.

They've also been playing him in a midfield role which I am not sure suits him
Incidentally George Wickens played for Lincoln today in their win over Cardiff to go top of the table

Just seen George has had 14 clean sheets in 35 games this season

Fair play to the lad

[jayffc]

https://x.com/i/status/2030274768838996161

Aforementioned goal from JKA

[demeant0r]

I used to view our academy in the same binary way; how many players make the first team against those that don't.

But we should also consider the number of players we sell to lower league clubs.

In addition to Stansfield, Sess, Elliott and Carvalho that went for 7/8 figure sums, we've also sold a few in the last couple of seasons for c. £500,000.

I don't know how much the academy costs to run on an annual basis but the aforementioned sales of players that never made our first team must go a long way to self-sustainability or even turning a profit.

Players not successfully transitioning to regular first team status does not necessarily = failure 👍

It doesn't necessarily mean it's a failure but the more academy players good enough to be part of the first team means the fewer players we need to buy, which is ultimately good for our SCR

[jayffc]

I used to view our academy in the same binary way; how many players make the first team against those that don't.

But we should also consider the number of players we sell to lower league clubs.

In addition to Stansfield, Sess, Elliott and Carvalho that went for 7/8 figure sums, we've also sold a few in the last couple of seasons for c. £500,000.

I don't know how much the academy costs to run on an annual basis but the aforementioned sales of players that never made our first team must go a long way to self-sustainability or even turning a profit.

Players not successfully transitioning to regular first team status does not necessarily = failure 👍

It doesn't necessarily mean it's a failure but the more academy players good enough to be part of the first team means the fewer players we need to buy, which is ultimately good for our SCR

Of course but again,are we doing below average in this regard?

Chat gpt seems to think we're right around the average or just higher for a club our size (I.e not arsenal Chelsea or city)

[demeant0r]

I used to view our academy in the same binary way; how many players make the first team against those that don't.

But we should also consider the number of players we sell to lower league clubs.

In addition to Stansfield, Sess, Elliott and Carvalho that went for 7/8 figure sums, we've also sold a few in the last couple of seasons for c. £500,000.

I don't know how much the academy costs to run on an annual basis but the aforementioned sales of players that never made our first team must go a long way to self-sustainability or even turning a profit.

Players not successfully transitioning to regular first team status does not necessarily = failure 👍

It doesn't necessarily mean it's a failure but the more academy players good enough to be part of the first team means the fewer players we need to buy, which is ultimately good for our SCR

Of course but again,are we doing below average in this regard?

Chat gpt seems to think we're right around the average or just higher for a club our size (I.e not arsenal Chelsea or city)

I don't really know but last season we were well below average even if you remove the top 6 clubs:

https://www.givemesport.com/number-of-academy-graduates-used-by-every-premier-league-club-this-season/?utm_source=chatgpt.com

Is there similar data for previous seasons?

[jayffc]

I used to view our academy in the same binary way; how many players make the first team against those that don't.

But we should also consider the number of players we sell to lower league clubs.

In addition to Stansfield, Sess, Elliott and Carvalho that went for 7/8 figure sums, we've also sold a few in the last couple of seasons for c. £500,000.

I don't know how much the academy costs to run on an annual basis but the aforementioned sales of players that never made our first team must go a long way to self-sustainability or even turning a profit.

Players not successfully transitioning to regular first team status does not necessarily = failure 👍

It doesn't necessarily mean it's a failure but the more academy players good enough to be part of the first team means the fewer players we need to buy, which is ultimately good for our SCR

Of course but again,are we doing below average in this regard?

Chat gpt seems to think we're right around the average or just higher for a club our size (I.e not arsenal Chelsea or city)

I don't really know but last season we were well below average even if you remove the top 6 clubs:

https://www.givemesport.com/number-of-academy-graduates-used-by-every-premier-league-club-this-season/?utm_source=chatgpt.com

Is there similar data for previous seasons?

Not sure

TBF I was looking at players over a decade + period who have been in academy minutes 3years + and started 5+ games for a premier league club...that way was trying to not get warped by players who made 5minute cameos here and there never to be seen again etc but those giving meaningful minutes, players actually brought through the academy and not bought at 16-18.

Data not overly easy to come by though tbh