Just watching the Stoke vs. Arsenal game. I can't believe it but Ramsey has just suffered the same fate Eduardo did at Birmingham last season. Horrific, Shawcross and he went in for a challenge and he just lay there, his leg hanging off, looked like a complete break half way up. Terrible for such a young talent, now out of the world cup, one of Wales' brightest talents. Absolutely sickening I wish him all the best, such a shame.
Very ugly! I am watching the game as well. I feel sorry for Ramsey. They took him straight into an ambulance.
Maybe I will be slated for this, but the tackle did NOT deserve a red card. If Ramsey had not been injured so badly, a yellow card *might* have been shown.
In the build up to the challenge there was no bad tackling, or reasons for any payback, and immediately prior to the tackle Shawcross had just won a challenge, fair and square, and the Arsenal player (I could not say exactly who it was) impeded Shawcross from running after the ball. Shawcross immediately sprinted and again went for the ball and it was the force of the coming together of both the players' legs that caused the terrible injury, as Ramsey had just kicked the ball and his leg was on the follow-through. Looking at the tackle a few more times showed that Shawcross actually pulled his leg back a little and was not on the follow-through.
I feel sorry for the lad, both of them, though I must say that Shawcross couldn't have looked more devastated at causing another player such an injury. He was in total shock when the red card was shown, not at receiving it, but because of what he had done. I feel for the lad, totally, and hope that this doesn't have detrimental effects on his future as a footballer.
The same goes for Ramsey, I hope his injury can be and is fixed up and he can also return to top league football.
Watching on Fox Soccer in the States and they would not show any replays of the tackle. The live shot was somewhat screened too. Glad to hear it was more of an accident than a vicious challenge. Up to that point the game was fairly played by both sides. Credit to the Gunners that they didn't retaliate and went on to win it. I hope that Ramsey will recover quickly and get on with what looks to be a very bright future.
Tragic, got to feel sorry for both players. I would be gutted if this happened to any of our boys.
Football is often dismissed by rugby fans but there do seem to be a lot of horiffic injuries. Peter Cech, Eduardo, Terry, Niemi all spring to mind but there are plenty more.
Get well soon Ramsey. Wouldn't mind the Gooners having a shot at the title.
Well, no real surprise that Stoke is involved is it.. The way they play is shocking and now a real talent have to suffer maybe a year or more out.
Quote from: Yarden on February 27, 2010, 08:16:33 PM
Well, no real surprise that Stoke is involved is it.. The way they play is shocking and now a real talent have to suffer maybe a year or more out.
I can understand where you're cming from Yarden, but as I said above, this was not 'one of those' challeges that you obviously infer.
It was a stright 50/50
Might be true, but the point is you play like Stoke these things are going to happend. (Not the first time I have seen Shawcross get a player injured either) Ugly boring football has no place in the PL if you ask me.
Quote from: Yarden on February 28, 2010, 03:09:51 AM
Might be true, but the point is you play like Stoke these things are going to happend. (Not the first time I have seen Shawcross get a player injured either) Ugly boring football has no place in the PL if you ask me.
I think it was quite significant, following this incident and just after Rosicki subbed for Ramsey, that Rosicki then went stright out and fouled a player himself, kicking him.
Arsenal are no strangers to playing it tough, no team, not even our own players are angels, and Shawcross at #11, being one of 2 Stoke players in the top 20 Prem 'dirty player' table this season, compared to 5 Sunderland, 2 Pompey, 2 Birmingham, 2 Bolton, along with 1 player from seven other Prem teams (none being Fulham but one from Arsenal), places Stoke in the top 5 'dirty' teams. Before we get too carried away with our great discipline record, lets remember our very own Dannt M ended last season in =16th place in the dirty players table as well.
Shawcross 23 games 7 Y 1 R
Diao 13 games 7 Y
Fuller 24 games 7 Y
Whelan 18 games 6 Y
Whitehead 24 games 6 Y
Wilkinson 17 games 6 Y
Faye 21 games 4 Y 2 R
Out of all the teams Stoke are alone having 6 players on 6 or more yellows so far this season.
And I bet if we could get some facts on how many players got injured after playing against Stoke, I think you
would find they are top of the list. And for the record, 8 Stoke players got more yellows than the first Fulham player on the list.
I've no idea how, if at all, malicious or reckless the tackle was that injured Ramsey because Sky exercised good taste and didn't replay it. But I would bet quite a short price that if a poll was taken of Premiership team supporters generally, Stoke would be the runaway leader for the team most would like to see out of the Premiership (with Blackburn and the pre Coyle Bolton also high up). Not much of the "beautiful game" about Stoke. By contrast, WBA last season played decent football in the right spirit and might well have been able to establish themselves had they survived, as have poor old Pompey this season.
I do agree with logical man in that I believe that it was 2 legs coming together for a tackle, the problem is that Wenger already has already pulled Stoke for their strong arm tactics.
Having watched the replays, it is clear that Ramsey's leg was bent on contact with the ball. Unfortunately he was just too quick for Shawcross who did try to kick the ball pretty hard but ended up connecting with Ramsey's bent leg instead. As a result, the force of the kick was enough to just completely snap his leg. Terrible for the lad I feel so so sorry for him, out of the world cup and all sorts. But hopefully this will make him a better player and he can come back stronger.
Errrrmmm... Aaron Ramsey is Welsh so I don't think even with a healthy foot World Cup was never an option for the young lad... ;)
Either way, terrible blow for him. I hope he can come back in one piece but Eduardo hasn't looked like his old self since he came back, so this will be a huge setback for Aaron.
Nasty accident. Nobody died.
Good point about the World Cup, my bad, somehow I thought Wales had qualified. Even so, get well soon Aaron
Quote from: epsomraver on February 28, 2010, 10:30:11 AM
I do agree with logical man in that I believe that it was 2 legs coming together for a tackle, the problem is that Wenger already has already pulled Stoke for their strong arm tactics.
Then again, Wenger complained about Delap being allowed to take long throws and believed they should be banned!!!! ;D
Quote from: Logicalman on February 27, 2010, 07:29:58 PM
Maybe I will be slated for this, but the tackle did NOT deserve a red card. If Ramsey had not been injured so badly, a yellow card *might* have been shown.
In the build up to the challenge there was no bad tackling, or reasons for any payback, and immediately prior to the tackle Shawcross had just won a challenge, fair and square, and the Arsenal player (I could not say exactly who it was) impeded Shawcross from running after the ball. Shawcross immediately sprinted and again went for the ball and it was the force of the coming together of both the players' legs that caused the terrible injury, as Ramsey had just kicked the ball and his leg was on the follow-through. Looking at the tackle a few more times showed that Shawcross actually pulled his leg back a little and was not on the follow-through.
I feel sorry for the lad, both of them, though I must say that Shawcross couldn't have looked more devastated at causing another player such an injury. He was in total shock when the red card was shown, not at receiving it, but because of what he had done. I feel for the lad, totally, and hope that this doesn't have detrimental effects on his future as a footballer.
The same goes for Ramsey, I hope his injury can be and is fixed up and he can also return to top league football.
Agree with every word Mr Logicalman. Unfortunatley Wengers spouting off again. Its a shame he doesnt come out like this when Gallas goes over the ball
Obviously it is hard to look at this incedent properly because the TV channels wont show it in close up but looking at the pics in the papers yesterday it looks as if Ramsey's leg may have snapped before the challenge, as if his studs caught in the turf.
Two people have said to me that it also looked like that on MOTD but they didn't delve into it on the program.
Either way, it doesn't help Ramsey but it may take some weight of Shawcross's mind if it is the case. And shut Wenger up,
Wenger will never shut up. He is as bad as Sir Rednose and Rafa the Spanish Waiter
I still haven't seen the tackle and don't plan to. I was in the car listening to Radio5Live and they certainly thought it was a bad one.
I'm sick of virtually every manager (Roy apart) being hopelessly blinkered making their observations on matches tedious and worthless.
For seriously foul play I'd favour very long suspensions but only after serious, expert, independent evaluation of the incident. A mistimed tackle is part of the risk in playing. The sort of assault that for instance Andy Johnson suffered against the Russian team was thuggery and should have been punished as such.
Seen it again and it looked like a 50/50 with (obviously) a dreadful outcome. Many players are never quite the same after such an injury. Let's hope he is ok long term.
Agree with Tony, really bad fouls should result in longer bans.
Other small rule change I would like to see.....when a player goes off for treatment as a result of a foul, the offender should go off too and not return until the injured player comes back.
If they implemented your last suggestion Mr Jarv, any match involving Chelsea would turn into a five a side
Yes Mr. Finn, had to chuckle. I suppose a loophole would be if their best player commited the foul the injured player could just stay off the pitch for the rest of the game.
Quote from: Yarden on February 28, 2010, 07:29:33 AM
Shawcross 23 games 7 Y 1 R
Diao 13 games 7 Y
Fuller 24 games 7 Y
Whelan 18 games 6 Y
Whitehead 24 games 6 Y
Wilkinson 17 games 6 Y
Faye 21 games 4 Y 2 R
Out of all the teams Stoke are alone having 6 players on 6 or more yellows so far this season.
And I bet if we could get some facts on how many players got injured after playing against Stoke, I think you
would find they are top of the list. And for the record, 8 Stoke players got more yellows than the first Fulham player on the list.
Wasn't it Faye that scythed down BZ putting him out for 3 games with the resulting shoulder injury last time we played them?
Stoke, like Blackburn are trained to play crap, violent hoofball.
To be fair to Shawcross he was pretty cut up about it after, I think he didn't go out of his way (Keane style) to do damage as he went in.
Nasty injury though, an interesting piece in the Sunday Times yesterday that basically showed that players picking up such serious injuries either never return to the game or are a shadow of their former selves.
What bugs me more is that it was an accident, i am sure of that, but unfortnately Arsene Wenger always has to have somebody to blame. Why can he not accept that it was not intentional. When i played (going back few years now) i was not a quick right half, and it was only pure luck that i did not seriously injure someone, i used to get detention for always being late, but i never ever intended to hurt anyone.
