Firstly, I couldn't make it today, but did watch the whole game on a live stream. Surely we can't blame Martin Jol for Brede sometimes not even trying to jump for some headers and even when he did, getting out-jumped by Campbell who must be 7-8" shorter. Then there were several times that he just seemed to dwell on the ball without seeming to know what to do next with it. A Captain, a leader - not today. Before we all slate him I just think that he looked like a player whose mind was on other things. Maybe he has personal problems, I don't know. It was probably his worst performance ever in a Fulham shirt, but let's give him the benefit of the doubt and hope that the real Brede returns next week.
Neither he nor amorebieta can play on that side..... We have two incompatible centre halves..... Bring back Hughes or senderos. Maybe put amorebieta to left back.....
As the problem last season, Hangeland can't concentrate on being the captain and being a effect CB
Senderos has consistently outplayed Hangeland this season. Forget the past and look at what is happening now. Sidwell has stepped up.
Quote from: Berserker on September 28, 2013, 09:39:43 PM
As the problem last season, Hangeland can't concentrate on being the captain and being a effect CB
And also isnt he up for yhe pfa player respective for the premier league or something like that
Below par today of course..central defenders are however much more comfortable when they have a commanding keeper who patrols the penalty area with conviction.
coyw
Since he got handed the armband 20 games ago it has been CRAP!! I know you all love him but it is a bizarre co-incidence.
Quote from: Robbie on September 28, 2013, 10:13:56 PM
Since he got handed the armband 20 games ago it has been CRAP!! I know you all love him but it is a bizarre co-incidence.
To be honest, he's been living off his reputation for some time. He doesn't make a good captain at all - not a motivator. He gets forgiven his mistakes because he's such a great guy, and has done so much for us in the past.
Senderos should've started alongside him today with Amorebieta at left back. Harsh on Richardson I know, given that he's been playing great recently and put in a lot of effort today. Amorebieta also had a poor game which was disappointing.
I'm going to turn the table on all of you and suggest perhaps Hangeland's performance comes down to not believing in Jol. It has been clear to me for well over a season, Jol is not a motivator and has limited man management skills. His reported skills are man management but I haven't seen him motivate anyone since being here. A player like Hangeland has played for the great tactician Sir Roy, and he probably see's Jol as a joke and can't be fussed to put the effort in. Now, some may say this is not a professional way to go about your business but he may be so out of sorts with Jol, that it is effecting his play.
The sooner Jol leaves, the better.
We have had to watch this tripe for far too long. Hangeland is still a good player and plays well when motivated. He did a very good job against Everton last week, but I suspect you can chalk that up to the rumors that Parker gave them a half-time rousing in the dressing room at the half, was the likely reason Hangeland and the rest of the team came to life....they are still sportsman after all.
I think Brede is badly affected , as he was last season, by all the criticism of the team. He was the same last year when the team was being booed - his game began to go to pieces, and it only recovered when the team put a couple of decent results together, and the booing and criticism stopped.
I think the whole team is affected by all the criticism and conjecture around Jol, including Jol himself.
So critics and boo boys - this is what you are doing - undermining a decent team.
Should have started Senderos, if Hangeland doesn't improve then he needs to be dropped, thats why you have a squad to keep players on their toes, don't perform you go to the bench, perform and you keep your place. same goes for Reither, he was much better today, anything to do with his replacements performance against Everton?
.......but he gets asked to do so much! Too often he is left trying to defend against 2 or 3 on-rushing attackers. Today he was switched from his usual 'side' at centre back. I honestly think he was thinking 'well if you lot can't be @rsed to defend, then neither can I'.
He was exceptional against Everton on Tuesday and is still a quality Centre Back. Agree with Pluto though, it should have been Senderos and Hangerland at Centre Back, with Reither and Amorebieta at full backs.
Quote from: RidgeRider on September 28, 2013, 10:51:59 PM
I'm going to turn the table on all of you and suggest perhaps Hangeland's performance comes down to not believing in Jol. It has been clear to me for well over a season, Jol is not a motivator and has limited man management skills. His reported skills are man management but I haven't seen him motivate anyone since being here. A player like Hangeland has played for the great tactician Sir Roy, and he probably see's Jol as a joke and can't be fussed to put the effort in. Now, some may say this is not a professional way to go about your business but he may be so out of sorts with Jol, that it is effecting his play.
The sooner Jol leaves, the better.
We have had to watch this tripe for far too long. Hangeland is still a good player and plays well when motivated. He did a very good job against Everton last week, but I suspect you can chalk that up to the rumors that Parker gave them a half-time rousing in the dressing room at the half, was the likely reason Hangeland and the rest of the team came to life....they are still sportsman after all.
I just don't get this - that the team needs to be permanently motivated,as if they are a bunch of schoolboys.
They are elite pros, and if they can't feel motivated to give their all given the current predicament of the team, they don't deserve to call themselves pro footballers.
Frankly, i find all this talk of 'motivation' ridiculous.
I think it's confidence the team lacks , not motivation.
Jol has a perfectly good record of communicating with players in his career anyway - if he couldn't , no one would ever employ him as a top level manager.
Sadly Brede has been a liability for most of the last twelve months and his dire performance today a culmination of that. Also he is far too low key a personality to be captain. I would seriously consider giving Parker the armband.
...perhaps as club captain he had been asked about how he saw Jol's management and had had to cast the first stone..?
Yep, as I've said since the end of last season, he's a shirt-hanger, who has no interest in playing for Fulham, and cannot - in any dimension - be classed as a Captain. He cannot motivate himself, let alone others around him. He cannot pass with any skill, he lumps it up field with a hit-and-hope attitude, he gets outj-umped by a guy who is just a couple of inches taller that the Greek Urn on the field, turns his back whenever someone shoots anywhere near him, and shows no passion at anything.
If Jol cannot see this, then Jol needs to make a decision, whether he goes or Brede does.
Quote from: LBNo11 on September 28, 2013, 11:58:05 PM
...perhaps as club captain he had been asked about how he saw Jol's management and had had to cast the first stone..?
You mean as the total unprofessional person he is?
I'm surprised so many of you thought Amorebieta had a bad game, he looked very comfortable with the ball at his feet and his positioning was generally good.
Quote from: RaySmith on September 28, 2013, 11:01:46 PM
Quote from: RidgeRider on September 28, 2013, 10:51:59 PM
I'm going to turn the table on all of you and suggest perhaps Hangeland's performance comes down to not believing in Jol. It has been clear to me for well over a season, Jol is not a motivator and has limited man management skills. His reported skills are man management but I haven't seen him motivate anyone since being here. A player like Hangeland has played for the great tactician Sir Roy, and he probably see's Jol as a joke and can't be fussed to put the effort in. Now, some may say this is not a professional way to go about your business but he may be so out of sorts with Jol, that it is effecting his play.
The sooner Jol leaves, the better.
We have had to watch this tripe for far too long. Hangeland is still a good player and plays well when motivated. He did a very good job against Everton last week, but I suspect you can chalk that up to the rumors that Parker gave them a half-time rousing in the dressing room at the half, was the likely reason Hangeland and the rest of the team came to life....they are still sportsman after all.
I just don't get this - that the team needs to be permanently motivated,as if they are a bunch of schoolboys.
They are elite pros, and if they can't feel motivated to give their all given the current predicament of the team, they don't deserve to call themselves pro footballers.
Frankly, i find all this talk of 'motivation' ridiculous.
I think it's confidence the team lacks , not motivation.
Jol has a perfectly good record of communicating with players in his career anyway - if he couldn't , no one would ever employ him as a top level manager.
I agree with your point regards motivation vs confidence. However, although we will never know for sure, I rather doubt your statement that Jol has a perfectly good record of communicating with his players - his post match communications have been laughable so if that is representative of his communications skills?.....
Its as if the captain's armband has numbed his brain he was rank yesterday
