Is he 1st choice keeper to start?
Quote from: NJFulham on July 12, 2015, 10:14:35 PM
Is he 1st choice keeper to start?
got to have a look at him at some point, from yesterday alone, id still say betts is number one
As betts had only just returned to training this week, where as lonegran had a week or so more
I reckon Kit wanted to get a closer look at him in person, he's had 8 months of seeing what Betts can do.
Also, I highly doubt that was anywhere near our first team, so I'm not reading too much into it
Betts only arrived the day before and Rodak and Lonegan shared duties against Millwall.
So 30 mins for Betts who hasn't played for over a month is fine.
I happen to think that Lonergan will surprise people and be number 1 choice.
I am in a minority. :028:
would make much more sense to have a true competition for the spot rather than anoint one or the other from the start. the team will be better off for it and competition like it all over the pitch.
the name of the game is promotion to the PL and not promote so and so because we all like him
Quote from: Scrumpy on July 12, 2015, 10:34:15 PM
I happen to think that Lonergan will surprise people and be number 1 choice.
I am in a minority. :028:
I also think Lonergan will start as No.1 also
Quote from: SouthfieldWhite on July 12, 2015, 11:03:30 PM
Quote from: Scrumpy on July 12, 2015, 10:34:15 PM
I happen to think that Lonergan will surprise people and be number 1 choice.
I am in a minority. :028:
I also think Lonergan will start as No.1 also
Why? That would surprise me. Also surprised that Kit didn't bring Freddy Plumain or Cassasola with the squad to Portugal. Clearly neither are in his plans. Have the u18's signed anyone decent?
I don't know what all the fuss is about. This is all about getting the whole squad fit
Quote from: Scrumpy on July 12, 2015, 10:34:15 PM
I happen to think that Lonergan will surprise people and be number 1 choice.
I am in a minority. :028:
Wouldn't surprise me either. He is very experienced at Championship level and knows what is required of a keeper at that level.
Bets will come out of the tunnel as first choice on opening day. We do have a good player to take the reigns if things get sticky. We did not have that last season. There was maybe a 3-4 match spell where I would have preferred to take Bets out of the firing line, but then we had Kiraly.
Quote from: Wingnut on July 12, 2015, 11:36:23 PM
Quote from: Scrumpy on July 12, 2015, 10:34:15 PM
I happen to think that Lonergan will surprise people and be number 1 choice.
I am in a minority. :028:
Wouldn't surprise me either. He is very experienced at Championship level and knows what is required of a keeper at that level.
like stopping the ball from going in the goal. we just need to pick the best keeper who ever that may be. both played about the same amount of games last season, both let in too many goals.both are 6ft4. betts has actually played more games in the last 3 seasons. either lonergan had an off day or his distribution is some what lacking. personally dont think experience counts for much in a goal keeper, especially when your other keeper has played more regularly of late. so yes id be suprised if betts is dropped for a keeper who isnt a massive upgrade.
How can we predict this? Lonergan has vast experience, but Bettinelli has had an impressive season despite his lack of his years. It's a no-brainer, Kit and his coaching team work with both guys, so let them select the man that impresses. I don't understand the obsession of picking players despite not having seen them perform in training.
Quote from: Barrett487 on July 13, 2015, 12:21:04 AM
How can we predict this? Lonergan has vast experience, but Bettinelli has had an impressive season despite his lack of his years. It's a no-brainer, Kit and his coaching team work with both guys, so let them select the man that impresses. I don't understand the obsession of picking players despite not having seen them perform in training.
how does training count more than what happens on a match day though?
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 12:25:16 AM
Quote from: Barrett487 on July 13, 2015, 12:21:04 AM
How can we predict this? Lonergan has vast experience, but Bettinelli has had an impressive season despite his lack of his years. It's a no-brainer, Kit and his coaching team work with both guys, so let them select the man that impresses. I don't understand the obsession of picking players despite not having seen them perform in training.
how does training count more than what happens on a match day though?
It doesn't Ben, but 60 minutes of a meaningless friendly, playing with new team-mates and letting in a faultless goal doesn't exclude Lonergan from selection.
Quote from: Barrett487 on July 13, 2015, 12:29:23 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 12:25:16 AM
Quote from: Barrett487 on July 13, 2015, 12:21:04 AM
How can we predict this? Lonergan has vast experience, but Bettinelli has had an impressive season despite his lack of his years. It's a no-brainer, Kit and his coaching team work with both guys, so let them select the man that impresses. I don't understand the obsession of picking players despite not having seen them perform in training.
how does training count more than what happens on a match day though?
It doesn't Ben, but 60 minutes of a meaningless friendly, playing with new team-mates and letting in a faultless goal doesn't exclude Lonergan from selection.
nor does it put him inline to replace our number one.
Unless he's better. I would ask you to judge him once he's settled in. I hope Betts is confirmed as our no.1 based on his great performances last season, however i'm open-minded about Lonergan, and i would expect all fair-minded Fulham fans to be. After all we'd never be small-minded enough to judge a GK on his leggings would we?
Quote from: Barrett487 on July 13, 2015, 12:37:53 AM
Unless he's better. I would ask you to judge him once he's settled in. I hope Betts is confirmed as our no.1 based on his great performances last season, however i'm open-minded about Lonergan, and i would expect all fair-minded Fulham fans to be. After all we'd never be small-minded enough to judge a GK on his leggings would we?
we were spot on with the leggins though. and lets not forget betts was linked with chelsea earlier, so given the choice would you rather sit on chelseas bench or ours. just think it would be harsh to bench betts after last season, especially as lonergans wasnt better. at andys age, he isnt going to get better, although he could stick around for 5 to6 years without much decline. where as betts could go all the way. especially now when we already have the uncertainties of roberts and dembeles, do we really want to risk upsetting another youngster who has already shinned for us
You misunderstand me Ben, i'm not championing Lonergan, i'm just asking people to let Kit decide. You obviously want Betts to start.... so do i, but not to the point of 'blind faith'.
Quote from: Barrett487 on July 13, 2015, 12:58:12 AM
You misunderstand me Ben, i'm not championing Lonergan, i'm just asking people to let Kit decide. You obviously want Betts to start.... so do i, but not to the point of 'blind faith'.
its not blind though.
Its a good chance to see if he's up for the job. Competition for places is always good. Yes, Bettinelli is talented and home grown but if Lonergan is better then we should play him.
I don't think Lonergan would've signed for us without the guarantee of first team football.
Bettinelli is better and younger than lonergan. Lonergan gives us a solid back up option, something we didn't have last season, we're making progress!
Quote from: Chutney on July 13, 2015, 03:50:31 AM
Bettinelli is better and younger than lonergan. Lonergan gives us a solid back up option, something we didn't have last season, we're making progress!
Debatable
Quote from: Barrett487 on July 13, 2015, 12:29:23 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 12:25:16 AM
Quote from: Barrett487 on July 13, 2015, 12:21:04 AM
How can we predict this? Lonergan has vast experience, but Bettinelli has had an impressive season despite his lack of his years. It's a no-brainer, Kit and his coaching team work with both guys, so let them select the man that impresses. I don't understand the obsession of picking players despite not having seen them perform in training.
how does training count more than what happens on a match day though?
It doesn't Ben, but 60 minutes of a meaningless friendly, playing with new team-mates and letting in a faultless goal doesn't exclude Lonergan from selection.
What players do in training especially pre season dose have an impact with the majority of managers as what team to start The season off with
How many fans have watch Lonergan play live more than half a dozen times?
But unfair to judge him so far if you havnt
I'm all for giving the youngsters a chance but like Kit, he also realises he needs to be picking his best side
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 12:04:58 AM
Quote from: Wingnut on July 12, 2015, 11:36:23 PM
Quote from: Scrumpy on July 12, 2015, 10:34:15 PM
I happen to think that Lonergan will surprise people and be number 1 choice.
I am in a minority. :028:
Wouldn't surprise me either. He is very experienced at Championship level and knows what is required of a keeper at that level.
like stopping the ball from going in the goal. we just need to pick the best keeper who ever that may be. both played about the same amount of games last season, both let in too many goals.both are 6ft4. betts has actually played more games in the last 3 seasons. either lonergan had an off day or his distribution is some what lacking. personally dont think experience counts for much in a goal keeper, especially when your other keeper has played more regularly of late. so yes id be suprised if betts is dropped for a keeper who isnt a massive upgrade.
Really???
Quote from: bill taylors apprentice on July 13, 2015, 08:41:46 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 12:04:58 AM
Quote from: Wingnut on July 12, 2015, 11:36:23 PM
Quote from: Scrumpy on July 12, 2015, 10:34:15 PM
I happen to think that Lonergan will surprise people and be number 1 choice.
I am in a minority. :028:
Wouldn't surprise me either. He is very experienced at Championship level and knows what is required of a keeper at that level.
like stopping the ball from going in the goal. we just need to pick the best keeper who ever that may be. both played about the same amount of games last season, both let in too many goals.both are 6ft4. betts has actually played more games in the last 3 seasons. either lonergan had an off day or his distribution is some what lacking. personally dont think experience counts for much in a goal keeper, especially when your other keeper has played more regularly of late. so yes id be suprised if betts is dropped for a keeper who isnt a massive upgrade.
Really???
yes, name the two best goal keepers in the prem, then tell me how much combined experience they have. its about agility, positional sense, and ability. just because you have been around longer doesnt make you a better keeper, or chelsea would still have chech on their books
I would like to think that no positions are gauranteed. That is the best way to run any sports team. Everyone is competing for a place in the squad all of the time. you are never given anything, it is always earned. Last season is last season, and today is a new day. That said, I hope our young keeper wins the starting job at keeper, but prefer that he has to earn it. If Lonergan shows in practice and preseason that he is in better form, than i would advocate that he starts. This is across the board at every position. Competition will make our squad better.
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 10:48:26 AM
Quote from: bill taylors apprentice on July 13, 2015, 08:41:46 AM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 12:04:58 AM
Quote from: Wingnut on July 12, 2015, 11:36:23 PM
Quote from: Scrumpy on July 12, 2015, 10:34:15 PM
I happen to think that Lonergan will surprise people and be number 1 choice.
I am in a minority. :028:
Wouldn't surprise me either. He is very experienced at Championship level and knows what is required of a keeper at that level.
like stopping the ball from going in the goal. we just need to pick the best keeper who ever that may be. both played about the same amount of games last season, both let in too many goals.both are 6ft4. betts has actually played more games in the last 3 seasons. either lonergan had an off day or his distribution is some what lacking. personally dont think experience counts for much in a goal keeper, especially when your other keeper has played more regularly of late. so yes id be suprised if betts is dropped for a keeper who isnt a massive upgrade.
Really???
yes, name the two best goal keepers in the prem, then tell me how much combined experience they have. its about agility, positional sense, and ability. just because you have been around longer doesnt make you a better keeper, or chelsea would still have chech on their books
Of course experience helps, you will always get exceptions to the rule, but most gk don't get a run in the first team in the top 2 divisions until they are about 25
They go out on loan of learn from the experience keepers at their club.
Betts is a decent keeper but still got a lot to learn, like all youngsters.
Goal keeping is a specialise subject .
Both my boys are goalkeepers and ive been too hundred of sessions with a top goal keeping coach, but I still wouldn't say I know everything about goal keeping
Quote from: Chutney on July 13, 2015, 03:50:31 AM
Bettinelli is better and younger than lonergan. Lonergan gives us a solid back up option, something we didn't have last season, we're making progress!
How many did longergan let in last year?
How many did Betts let in?
If Lonergan is to be our first choice, it makes not signing a keeper in January or on loan last season even more baffling.
We gave Bettinelli a full season (pretty much) as our number 1, got him into the England U21 squad, it would be a crazy decision if Lonergan was to become our number 1 after he barely played (in relation to Betts) last season.
Betts has to be number 1 for me.
Number 1 will be which ever keeper plays the best hopefully. Lonegran said in his interview he knows Betts has the shirt atm and he needs to fight him for it.
I've not seen enough of him to say he should be No1, but it's healthy to have competition and GK's tend to have a different mindset about being a sub and supporting the man in goal.
Quote from: MJG on July 13, 2015, 05:36:55 PM
Number 1 will be which ever keeper plays the best hopefully. Lonegran said in his interview he knows Betts has the shirt atm and he needs to fight him for it.
I've not seen enough of him to say he should be No1, but it's healthy to have competition and GK's tend to have a different mindset about being a sub and supporting the man in goal.
not according to david james, he was on radio the other day talking about his liverpool days. cant remember who the other keeper was, but he said he hated him and never spoke to him purely because he was a rival for the number 1 jersey.
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 06:09:17 PM
Quote from: MJG on July 13, 2015, 05:36:55 PM
Number 1 will be which ever keeper plays the best hopefully. Lonegran said in his interview he knows Betts has the shirt atm and he needs to fight him for it.
I've not seen enough of him to say he should be No1, but it's healthy to have competition and GK's tend to have a different mindset about being a sub and supporting the man in goal.
not according to david james, he was on radio the other day talking about his liverpool days. cant remember who the other keeper was, but he said he hated him and never spoke to him purely because he was a rival for the number 1 jersey.
Well that showed good team spirit didn't it?
it was essentially a training game so team selection is meaningless. Bets will be first choice no question
The fact Fulham signed "Donny" Lonegan indicates Symons feels Bette-not-on-your-nelli wasn't quite up to the mark.
I'd start with the experienced Lonegan, but his kicking needs to improve.
Quote from: MJG on July 13, 2015, 06:11:20 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 06:09:17 PM
Quote from: MJG on July 13, 2015, 05:36:55 PM
Number 1 will be which ever keeper plays the best hopefully. Lonegran said in his interview he knows Betts has the shirt atm and he needs to fight him for it.
I've not seen enough of him to say he should be No1, but it's healthy to have competition and GK's tend to have a different mindset about being a sub and supporting the man in goal.
not according to david james, he was on radio the other day talking about his liverpool days. cant remember who the other keeper was, but he said he hated him and never spoke to him purely because he was a rival for the number 1 jersey.
Well that showed good team spirit didn't it?
obviously not, but i should imagine that most of the time the keeper on the bench hopes the number one has a stinker or picks up a knock.
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 06:45:30 PM
Quote from: MJG on July 13, 2015, 06:11:20 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 06:09:17 PM
Quote from: MJG on July 13, 2015, 05:36:55 PM
Number 1 will be which ever keeper plays the best hopefully. Lonegran said in his interview he knows Betts has the shirt atm and he needs to fight him for it.
I've not seen enough of him to say he should be No1, but it's healthy to have competition and GK's tend to have a different mindset about being a sub and supporting the man in goal.
not according to david james, he was on radio the other day talking about his liverpool days. cant remember who the other keeper was, but he said he hated him and never spoke to him purely because he was a rival for the number 1 jersey.
Well that showed good team spirit didn't it?
obviously not, but i should imagine that most of the time the keeper on the bench hopes the number one has a stinker or picks up a knock.
Well let's be honest, we have all been there when a sub.
Quote from: EJL on July 13, 2015, 02:25:59 AM
I don't think Lonergan would've signed for us without the guarantee of first team football.
This one often crops up. I have never believed that such a guarantee could (or would) be given.
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 06:09:17 PM
not according to david james, he was on radio the other day talking about his liverpool days. cant remember who the other keeper was, but he said he hated him and never spoke to him purely because he was a rival for the number 1 jersey.
When James first got to Liverpool Bruce Grobbelaar was his main rival, not a difficult man to dislike.
I doubt that the presence of Tony Warner on the books caused him many sleepless nights!
Quote from: cmg on July 13, 2015, 06:52:55 PM
Quote from: EJL on July 13, 2015, 02:25:59 AM
I don't think Lonergan would've signed for us without the guarantee of first team football.
This one often crops up. I have never believed that such a guarantee could (or would) be given.
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 06:09:17 PM
not according to david james, he was on radio the other day talking about his liverpool days. cant remember who the other keeper was, but he said he hated him and never spoke to him purely because he was a rival for the number 1 jersey.
When James first got to Liverpool Bruce Grobbelaar was his main rival, not a difficult man to dislike.
I doubt that the presence of Tony Warner on the books caused him many sleepless nights!
it was neither of them,
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 07:00:40 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 06:09:17 PM
not according to david james, he was on radio the other day talking about his liverpool days. cant remember who the other keeper was, but he said he hated him and never spoke to him purely because he was a rival for the number 1 jersey.
When James first got to Liverpool Bruce Grobbelaar was his main rival, not a difficult man to dislike.
I doubt that the presence of Tony Warner on the books caused him many sleepless nights!
it was neither of them,
[/quote]
He didn't have much competition after that until Brad Friedel turned up.
Still, James was maybe a bit insecure, in more ways than one.
Quote from: cmg on July 13, 2015, 07:18:34 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 07:00:40 PM
Quote from: fulhamben on July 13, 2015, 06:09:17 PM
not according to david james, he was on radio the other day talking about his liverpool days. cant remember who the other keeper was, but he said he hated him and never spoke to him purely because he was a rival for the number 1 jersey.
When James first got to Liverpool Bruce Grobbelaar was his main rival, not a difficult man to dislike.
I doubt that the presence of Tony Warner on the books caused him many sleepless nights!
it was neither of them,
He didn't have much competition after that until Brad Friedel turned up.
Still, James was maybe a bit insecure, in more ways than one.
[/quote]might have been brad, but i thought it was more of a foriegn sounding name, anyhow my point was that i doubt andy and marcus will forge a great bromance whilst they are fighting it out for a starting place
