usual non event (I don't have a problem with that per say) but he let one thing slip
he said we anticipated having 4 more points at this stage of the season
that is 16 points from 10 games..... Wow, that is pathetic using the word correctly
it means he doesn't think we were ever good enough and set the bar very low...no wonder the players look less thaqn comitted far too often.
aim low and you will fail to achieve. shoot for the stars and believe every game is winnable.... as oscar said, we are all lying in the gutters but some of us looking at the stars..... unfortunately our manager is looking at the gutter.
I was completely shocked by that admission, of thinking 16 points from 10 games was acceptable, that must mean the board and khan think it good enough too.... MAF would have hated that.... as i have said like a broken record so many times we lack leadership...no ambition we are doomed to fail!
Very disheartening, again.
we aren't going back to the prem any time soon, hope i am still alive but doubt it now with thisentire regime from the top down
16 points from 10 games would only see us 8th at the minute, and we are even failing to manage to do that
defeat tomorrow will see the same old platitudes about boro being a good team, hard to break down....yada yada yada.... i want to hear we had a go at them and their goalkeeper played a blinder was the only reason we failed! Kit is not on planet winner i am afraid.
16/17 pts was always my target. Do that every ten games and you will hit the average needed for sixth or better 73 plus.
18 pts is above the average and would see sixth place have 83 and last year was the highest ever at 79. That number will drop.
So im fine with 16 from ten, but in the end he's 25% short of that target.
Embarrassingly kit managed to get 18 points from his first ten games last season with the squad that felix had so called decimated. But at least we are progressing.
I think it wasn't a target to achieve as such but was a minimum expected, that why the rumours of the chop are circulating he's behind the minimum for a top 6 finish
That is a very embarrassing interview for me. He is on his way out I would say. So so out of his depth.
Quote from: Nero on October 16, 2015, 09:05:30 PM
I think it wasn't a target to achieve as such but was a minimum expected, that why the rumours of the chop are circulating he's behind the minimum for a top 6 finish
Exactly
I just never get a sense of confidence from Kit when he talks. This isn't a dig at him personally, but his overall posture never gives me any hope. It's hard to explain it, he's always grining, but when he speaks about doing well at Boro', improving results, having a great group of lads etc, you just know we're going to get dicked up at the Riverside. I feel really horrible writing this, but that's just how I feel.
Quote from: MJG on October 16, 2015, 08:46:54 PM
16/17 pts was always my target. Do that every ten games and you will hit the average needed for sixth or better 73 plus.
18 pts is above the average and would see sixth place have 83 and last year was the highest ever at 79. That number will drop.
So im fine with 16 from ten, but in the end he's 25% short of that target.
do you actually mean it was your expectation?
i have to confess we are ahead of where i expected but i do expect our leadership to be aiming hire than that. they spent plenty, keep telling us how good the squad is and all i can see is inconsistent mediocrity witha very poorly disciplined defence and our best center half relegated to the subs bench.
I am still anticipating a very good performance tomorrow.... i am always an optimist
i am a little surpised nobody has said they agree with me, our management have set the bar incredibly low, 16 points is a pathetic total for 10 games if you have serious aspirations.
that means complete lack of ambition, at least aim high must be the starting point.
Quote from: nose on October 16, 2015, 09:39:27 PM
Quote from: MJG on October 16, 2015, 08:46:54 PM
16/17 pts was always my target. Do that every ten games and you will hit the average needed for sixth or better 73 plus.
18 pts is above the average and would see sixth place have 83 and last year was the highest ever at 79. That number will drop.
So im fine with 16 from ten, but in the end he's 25% short of that target.
do you actually mean it was your expectation?
i have to confess we are ahead of where i expected but i do expect our leadership to be aiming hire than that. they spent plenty, keep telling us how good the squad is and all i can see is inconsistent mediocrity witha very poorly disciplined defence and our best center half relegated to the subs bench.
I am still anticipating a very good performance tomorrow.... i am always an optimist
It's what I wanted as a minimum to be I a good place after ten games. And in all honesty looking at fixtures prior to season i expected at least 14.
So like I said 16 is a decent target given that I think we should be 4th to 8th kind of position and I've seen nothing in the league to say that with the players we have we shouldn't be in that group.
Quote from: nose on October 16, 2015, 09:42:09 PM
i am a little surpised nobody has said they agree with me, our management have set the bar incredibly low, 16 points is a pathetic total for 10 games if you have serious aspirations.
that means complete lack of ambition, at least aim high must be the starting point.
Not unless they are telling porkies, and this season is being used as another consolidation season. Can't remember where I heard the quote, but I quite clearly remember Rigg saying that within the business plan, a promotion push wouldn't realistically happen until season 3. Maybe they will keep Kit until the end of the season, and really go for it next. I don't know.
Quote from: nose on October 16, 2015, 09:42:09 PM
i am a little surpised nobody has said they agree with me, our management have set the bar incredibly low, 16 points is a pathetic total for 10 games if you have serious aspirations.
that means complete lack of ambition, at least aim high must be the starting point.
Because most are realistic in looking at how a league pans out. Why is 16 from ten which equates to 73 pts and more times than not sixth place showing g a lack of ambition? It's the clubs mantra that top six is what's expected by Khan.
And it would give a good Base going forward.
Of course every team wants 30 from ten but that's not going to happen.
If we can get to 32 pts from 20 games I'll bet that would give a team top eight at least.
Quote from: nose on October 16, 2015, 09:42:09 PM
i am a little surpised nobody has said they agree with me, our management have set the bar incredibly low, 16 points is a pathetic total for 10 games if you have serious aspirations.
that means complete lack of ambition, at least aim high must be the starting point.
I agree with you, but give up on harping on about it.
I said, when Kit was appointed, that he is not the right man for the job, but got well and truely slated!
We are sh@te and going nowhere, but according to many - still building! 090.gif
I still think we can get something from the boro though, but that is all papering over the cracks.
Quote from: MJG on October 16, 2015, 08:46:54 PM
16/17 pts was always my target. Do that every ten games and you will hit the average needed for sixth or better 73 plus.
18 pts is above the average and would see sixth place have 83 and last year was the highest ever at 79. That number will drop.
So im fine with 16 from ten, but in the end he's 25% short of that target.
Blimey Jim, your maths are good and I am an accountant, so what you say is certified correct!!
Quote from: nose on October 16, 2015, 09:42:09 PM
i am a little surpised nobody has said they agree with me, our management have set the bar incredibly low, 16 points is a pathetic total for 10 games if you have serious aspirations.
that means complete lack of ambition, at least aim high must be the starting point.
I will agree with you, our management (what management) set the bar at a level which the players should easily have been able to achieve, but as I said what Management?
Quote from: davew on October 16, 2015, 10:08:19 PM
Quote from: MJG on October 16, 2015, 08:46:54 PM
16/17 pts was always my target. Do that every ten games and you will hit the average needed for sixth or better 73 plus.
18 pts is above the average and would see sixth place have 83 and last year was the highest ever at 79. That number will drop.
So im fine with 16 from ten, but in the end he's 25% short of that target.
Blimey Jim, your maths are good and I am an accountant, so what you say is certified correct!!
Believe me I know those championship table averages almost off by heart.
If the forecast accumulated points had been done on an individual match assessment (revised monthly, say) then the progress wouldn't necessarily be in a straight line, i.e. it might take into account easier or more difficult matches in that particular period. So you can't necessarily extrapolate the season's expected total based on the first ten matches. Then again, 10 matches is not an unreasonable basis for an ongoing forecast.
It is per se, not per say.
Quote from: nose on October 16, 2015, 09:42:09 PM
i am a little surpised nobody has said they agree with me, our management have set the bar incredibly low, 16 points is a pathetic total for 10 games if you have serious aspirations.
that means complete lack of ambition, at least aim high must be the starting point.
Maybe you're in a minority, albeit a growing one? I presume our management reckoned it may take new players a while to learn each other's game and the Manager's requirements. So perhaps they were aiming for 16 from the first 10 games, 18 from the next 10 and then 20 from each of the following 10. That would probably get us promoted (MJG?)
Doesn't seem that shocking to me.
Points per game is more important than anything. However I have seen a style of play that blinds me to these points. Kit has had us play the best football I've seen since Hughes and that was a long time ago. I was against kit keeping his job when last season ended. I was pretty much against kit for a long time but now I have changed. Why? Who knows? I'd now give him longer. Do you want to know why? I will tell you but you have to be able to answer back.
Why would any manager want to work for us?
It will be the third season in a row where we have sacked the manager! 4 managers in 3 seasons. Robespierre would be proud of Khan, chopping people like it is going out of fashion.
Kit, as poor as most of us may think he is WOULD like to work with us. He may be not the best man for the job but I feel Rigg is the man with the power. Kits failures have been by minutes or by a late sub. I'm no kit sympathiser but we blame him for the last ten against charlton without giving him credit for the 80 we dominated. The 80 mins was a fluke but the ten plus injury was all down to him? This doesn't sit with me. Kit is lacking, but after sitting behind him for a cup game and seeing how much he cares I think it's very unfair to blame one man for the mistakes others make. He has made mistakes. He is a nice guy. He cares. Everything we do well is because we have good players. Everything wrong is his fault? He isn't a great manager. But is he at fault for all our downfalls? Rationally no. Knee jerk yes.
Quote from: MJG on October 16, 2015, 08:46:54 PM
16/17 pts was always my target. Do that every ten games and you will hit the average needed for sixth or better 73 plus.
18 pts is above the average and would see sixth place have 83 and last year was the highest ever at 79. That number will drop.
So im fine with 16 from ten, but in the end he's 25% short of that target.
I was always hoping that we would do better then 16 points but 16 points is where I set my bar for Kit and team. As I have said before the games up to Leads will be my litmus test.
Quote from: Scrumpy on October 16, 2015, 10:51:14 PM
Quote from: nose on October 16, 2015, 09:42:09 PM
i am a little surpised nobody has said they agree with me, our management have set the bar incredibly low, 16 points is a pathetic total for 10 games if you have serious aspirations.
that means complete lack of ambition, at least aim high must be the starting point.
Maybe you're in a minority, albeit a growing one? I presume our management reckoned it may take new players a while to learn each other's game and the Manager's requirements. So perhaps they were aiming for 16 from the first 10 games, 18 from the next 10 and then 20 from each of the following 10. That would probably get us promoted (MJG?)
Doesn't seem that shocking to me.
It's like any kind of long distance race, you can do a Brighton and sprint off. They will fall off form wise but have enough in the tank to get over the line in top six I reckon.
Or you pace yourself. Aiming for 73 pts and doing it constantly over the season.
There is the way that you get 12 from ten then 20 from ten and then 15 from ten etc etc. Short bursts of form to keep you around.
Anyway take a snapshot of the top eight now and I'll bet anyone that 6 of them will be in top eight at end of season.
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk
Quote from: Jonaldiniho 88 on October 16, 2015, 11:40:39 PM
Kit, as poor as most of us may think he is WOULD like to work with us. He may be not the best man for the job but I feel Rigg is the man with the power. Kits failures have been by minutes or by a late sub. I'm no kit sympathiser but we blame him for the last ten against charlton without giving him credit for the 80 we dominated. The 80 mins was a fluke but the ten plus injury was all down to him? This doesn't sit with me. Kit is lacking, but after sitting behind him for a cup game and seeing how much he cares I think it's very unfair to blame one man for the mistakes others make. He has made mistakes. He is a nice guy. He cares. Everything we do well is because we have good players. Everything wrong is his fault? He isn't a great manager. But is he at fault for all our downfalls? Rationally no. Knee jerk yes.
Rigg or Khan don't make Subs. That is down to Symons and that is what has cost us so many points this season. Giving away late goals and costing us points. That is down to one persons inability to understand the game and what to do when the big decisions need to be made.
I like Kit as a bloke, but I do not believe in his ability to move Fulham forward.
I have still gone for Fulham to win 0-1 today, Mac to score the winner. Big test for Kit today.
We shall see.
COYW
Remember newly assembled teams take time to gel, Kit has only had his new back four in place for 5 matches , it is therefore reasonable to expect to see gradual improvement as the season progresses.
A reasonable target could have been 17 points first ten games, 20 points then next ten games
then with a really good key player brought into a settled team, early in the window, a massive 38 points from the remaining 26 games in order for us to sneak into the play offs by which time we would be performing like no other team and would enjoy a money spinning victory in a play off final.
The plan would be based on us running like a well oiled machine after Christmas and the Cottage being a place where we witnessed win after win.
Now has anyone heard Kit tell the one about Goldylocks and the three bears, its just as convincing.
Quote from: Fulham Tup North on October 17, 2015, 10:52:15 AM
Quote from: Jonaldiniho 88 on October 16, 2015, 11:40:39 PM
Kit, as poor as most of us may think he is WOULD like to work with us. He may be not the best man for the job but I feel Rigg is the man with the power. Kits failures have been by minutes or by a late sub. I'm no kit sympathiser but we blame him for the last ten against charlton without giving him credit for the 80 we dominated. The 80 mins was a fluke but the ten plus injury was all down to him? This doesn't sit with me. Kit is lacking, but after sitting behind him for a cup game and seeing how much he cares I think it's very unfair to blame one man for the mistakes others make. He has made mistakes. He is a nice guy. He cares. Everything we do well is because we have good players. Everything wrong is his fault? He isn't a great manager. But is he at fault for all our downfalls? Rationally no. Knee jerk yes.
Rigg or Khan don't make Subs. That is down to Symons and that is what has cost us so many points this season. Giving away late goals and costing us points. That is down to one persons inability to understand the game and what to do when the big decisions need to be made.
I like Kit as a bloke, but I do not believe in his ability to move Fulham forward.
I have still gone for Fulham to win 0-1 today, Mac to score the winner. Big test for Kit today.
We shall see.
COYW
I didn't say khan or Rigg make the substitutions and I did say kit isn't blameless. He seems to do what some managers do and make a mandatory substitution at the hour mark. He was blamed recently for not making subs, now he is blamed for making subs. It seems he is making the wrong subs. It does come down to luck. I could put a donkey on the pitch and if the ball deflected of it's backside and in i'd be a genius. Obviously if you make a clever sub or tactical change the element of luck is reduced. I think garbut was shocking and to blame for our draw against charlton. Kit put him on but didn't tell him to be selfish and not track back. Or maybe he did. In which case kit is to blame.
wow, and i amk accused of being negative quite so often.
the issue isn't what you might realistically expect, it is what mind set you have. 16 is a dreadful low total and speaks volumes. i can cope with achieving little but not at aiming at quite such a poor standard. I anm stunned how many think kit's target is acceptable as an aim.
ME
I think you should aim to win every game, and set the target at 30 points from 10 games. i agree it unrealistic in practice but not as a target... a low target is infectious in any business... perhaps that is why I am successful, i actually challenge my staff to exceed expectaion and not allow mediocrity....
i am sorry i started this thread because i am shocked how many have thought it OK to aim low.
Well we all want 138 pts but that's not going to happen. That's doesn't make me negative but realistic. Does me targeting at least 73 pts negative?
It's a target and nothing more than that. Exceed that and playoffs almost guaranteed.
So I think your being unfair to everyone who has responded to your post.
10 is dreadfully low as a target, 16 is reasonable and 20 plus would be great.
Quote from: MJG on October 17, 2015, 09:47:45 PM
Well we all want 138 pts but that's not going to happen. That's doesn't make me negative but realistic. Does me targeting at least 73 pts negative?
It's a target and nothing more than that. Exceed that and playoffs almost guaranteed.
So I think your being unfair to everyone who has responded to your post.
10 is dreadfully low as a target, 16 is reasonable and 20 plus would be great.
you are not the issue I understand you feel 16 was realistic... and i am talking about our manager, aiming low. he will go home and look at the table and feel he is on target, nearly.... but in truth it is just not good enough, poor management however the cards are cut.... just the same as khan allowing a failed board to remain in place and rigg saying we may go up in some season in the distance.... that is preparing to fail. nothing to do with what i expect, it is trying, it is the art of the possible, it is aiming for the stars.... better to have a positive frame and shoot for the stars, IMO
As it is we have a boiard and manager that seem to be content with mid tab mediocrity.
