Has been a big disappointment and wouldn't be surprised to see him leave in the summer.
2 wins is awful. Get Warburton in in the summer.
Yes and when Warburton doesn't win we can sack him after 2 months and get in Neil Warnock, and then Brian McDermot, then Lee Curbishly, and then Danny Murphy.
Please say this post is a joke.... I worry about our fans sometimes.
This has to be a wind up so ?I won't waste my time
Ridiculous. He's came into a right mess. He had a transfer embargo so couldn't sign players he wanted. He has also had to inherit a squad which doesn't work in any systems not just ones he likes to implement. He's just been experimenting with players deciding who he wants to keep and he said that himself so he's definitely staying. There has been improvements in defence structure bar individual errors and players are improving. We will stay up and this season was a right off from taking taking so long to get him in. He won promotion last season and when he gets rid of all the dead wood and brings in players he wants and gets his system in place over pre season results will come.
Two things. First of all it wasn't a right mess but is now.
Secondly,we can't keep sacking managers. That is the reason it is a right mess now.
Curious how many managers we have to run through before we can accept that there are issues with the squad that will limit what any can do. Give the man a chance please.
A joke surely, judge the man in a years time, he does not have a magic wand, we need a re build
joca is going to be brilliant
somebody should make a note of who is againmst him because this time next season we will be oin the verge of promotion.... the squad is poor, i soaid so from the start, I also said we were bound to finish in the bottom few. not saying i am clever or clairvoiant but it was obvious how many poor players and overated players we have
but this manager is a breath of fresh air and you jjust have to look to see the changes.... with new players in the summer and a proper forward capable of holding the ball and with a first touch, we are going to be going up. just watch
Quote from: Statto on March 05, 2016, 10:57:56 PM
Quote from: Lighthouse on March 05, 2016, 08:06:56 PM
Two things. First of all it wasn't a right mess but is now.
Secondly,we can't keep sacking managers. That is the reason it is a right mess now.
This time last year we were 20th.
We'd just lost 5-1 at home.
We were 8 pts from the relegation zone, having played a game more than everyone else.
We had 1 win in our last 9 games
So if it's a mess now then it has been for a long time
Since then we had a Summer of yet more change and were doing much better if still inconsistent. So it wasn't a mess when Joka took over or at least when the club decided the ill timed sacking was a good idea.
I know it is hard to face the actual facts of the situation but it does help if we want to stop making the same mistakes. In fact your own well researched results prove that we are doing worse than this time last season even with yet more changes at the top.
I tend to agree with Nose, particularly re. a front-man who can win and/ control the ball so as to take pressure off us and place it on the oppo. Also feel we need two good full backs (Grimmer may be one) and a midfield Dynamo/playmaker, which hopefully Hyndman might develop into when we're no longer in weekly dogfights!
Just need to hobble over the line then look forward to summer improvements.
The hard facts of the situation are that we now have a better manager but no matter how hard he tries we continue to effectively commit suicide on the pitch. Until he gets his player we are unlikely to improve . End of.
the OP is clearly trolling. he also said he hopes we get relegated in a diff thread
The OP cannot be serious?
Quote from: J on March 06, 2016, 02:45:27 AM
the OP is clearly trolling. he also said he hopes we get relegated in a diff thread
:plus one:
Quote from: mike_corkcity12 on March 05, 2016, 06:18:53 PM
Has been a big disappointment and wouldn't be surprised to see him leave in the summer.
2 wins is awful. Get Warburton in in the summer.
TOOL!
Od course Jocanovic has to be given time to build his team and we really musn't start thinking of yet another change of manager,
However it is a results orientated business and the hard fact of life is that Jaconovic isn't getting results and the big question is how long will we have to wait before we see an improvement in results. Surely we all expected at least a small improvement to have kicked in by now.
Quote from: nose on March 05, 2016, 11:05:27 PM
joca is going to be brilliant
somebody should make a note of who is againmst him because this time next sfeason we will be oin the verge of promotion.... the squad is poor, i soaid so from the start, I also said we were bound to finish in the bottom few. not saying i am clever or clairvoiant but it was obvious how many poor players and overated players we have
but this manager is a breath of fresh air and you jjust have to look to see the changes.... with new players in the summer and a proper forward capable of holding the ball and with a first touch, we are going to be going up. just watch
:plus one: Spot on Nose
We need stability and any manager needs time to build and develop his team. I didn't want Kit to go when he did, and I certainly think it would be crazy to even think of getting rid of Jokanovic.
I'm confident the results will come. We just need to stick with the manager - something we've found hard to do in the last couple of years.
I seriously believe the reason we are where we are is not because the club sacked Kit, but because they didn't find a good replacement soon enough.
Quote from: nose on March 05, 2016, 11:05:27 PM
joca is going to be brilliant
somebody should make a note of who is againmst him because this time next season we will be oin the verge of promotion.... the squad is poor, i soaid so from the start, I also said we were bound to finish in the bottom few. not saying i am clever or clairvoiant but it was obvious how many poor players and overated players we have
but this manager is a breath of fresh air and you jjust have to look to see the changes.... with new players in the summer and a proper forward capable of holding the ball and with a first touch, we are going to be going up. just watch
I completely agree.
Quote from: mike_corkcity12 on March 05, 2016, 06:18:53 PM
Has been a big disappointment and wouldn't be surprised to see him leave in the summer.
2 wins is awful. Get Warburton in in the summer.
yes and become a laughing stock like leeds. sj just needs time and his own squad and we will be up next year.
Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
Quote from: nose on March 05, 2016, 11:05:27 PM
joca is going to be brilliant
somebody should make a note of who is againmst him because this time next season we will be oin the verge of promotion.... the squad is poor, i soaid so from the start, I also said we were bound to finish in the bottom few. not saying i am clever or clairvoiant but it was obvious how many poor players and overated players we have
but this manager is a breath of fresh air and you jjust have to look to see the changes.... with new players in the summer and a proper forward capable of holding the ball and with a first touch, we are going to be going up. just watch
my thoughts exactly
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Quote from: Berserker on March 06, 2016, 11:35:25 AM
I seriously believe the reason we are where we are is not because the club sacked Kit, but because they didn't find a good replacement soon enough.
Couldn't agree more. I was pro kit and thought his sacking was a mistake. However I can see Jokanovic is a class above. The issue is the 10 games between the 2 appointments.
Quote from: nose on March 05, 2016, 11:05:27 PM
joca is going to be brilliant
somebody should make a note of who is againmst him because this time next season we will be oin the verge of promotion.... the squad is poor, i soaid so from the start, I also said we were bound to finish in the bottom few. not saying i am clever or clairvoiant but it was obvious how many poor players and overated players we have
but this manager is a breath of fresh air and you jjust have to look to see the changes.... with new players in the summer and a proper forward capable of holding the ball and with a first touch, we are going to be going up. just watch
Funny how opinions change. A few moths ago the general opinion on this board was that we had a talented squad of players but that the manager and the tactics he employed were at fault. Now we have a manager that is admired but those talented players have become unsuitable.
Quote from: filham on March 06, 2016, 05:25:05 PM
Quote from: nose on March 05, 2016, 11:05:27 PM
joca is going to be brilliant
somebody should make a note of who is againmst him because this time next season we will be oin the verge of promotion.... the squad is poor, i soaid so from the start, I also said we were bound to finish in the bottom few. not saying i am clever or clairvoiant but it was obvious how many poor players and overated players we have
but this manager is a breath of fresh air and you jjust have to look to see the changes.... with new players in the summer and a proper forward capable of holding the ball and with a first touch, we are going to be going up. just watch
Funny how opinions change. A few moths ago the general opinion on this board was that we had a talented squad of players but that the manager and the tactics he employed were at fault. Now we have a manager that is admired but those talented players have become unsuitable.
You may have felt that we had a talented squad but I am not sure that everyone on this MB was of that view. Admittedly most of us reached a point where we felt that, sadly, Kit had to go but a lot of us also argued that those who felt we had a talented squad were a bit deluded.
"A few moths ago the general opinion on this board was that we had a talented squad of players but that the manager and the tactics he employed were at fault."
The second part is spot on, but the first part too indiscriminate.
While most of us thought most of the Summer signings were decent, not many included Richards in that and most knew we had inadequate full backs. That remains the case and can't be remedied until next Summer.
That considerable weakness apart, the squad was, and is, good enough to hold its own in this division. But J needs time to get over the weaknesses in squad management under Kit - namely the lack of work on defensive drills and the relative lack of fitness of the players. Kit condemned himself when he admitted his training was tailored to what the players liked, which is certainly not the same as what they needed. It will take J more than a few weeks to remedy the deficiencies of training under Kit.
Quote from: Twig on March 06, 2016, 05:36:03 PM
Quote from: filham on March 06, 2016, 05:25:05 PM
Quote from: nose on March 05, 2016, 11:05:27 PM
joca is going to be brilliant
somebody should make a note of who is againmst him because this time next season we will be oin the verge of promotion.... the squad is poor, i soaid so from the start, I also said we were bound to finish in the bottom few. not saying i am clever or clairvoiant but it was obvious how many poor players and overated players we have
but this manager is a breath of fresh air and you jjust have to look to see the changes.... with new players in the summer and a proper forward capable of holding the ball and with a first touch, we are going to be going up. just watch
Funny how opinions change. A few moths ago the general opinion on this board was that we had a talented squad of players but that the manager and the tactics he employed were at fault. Now we have a manager that is admired but those talented players have become unsuitable.
You may have felt that we had a talented squad but I am not sure that everyone on this MB was of that view. Admittedly most of us reached a point where we felt that, sadly, Kit had to go but a lot of us also argued that those who felt we had a talented squad were a bit deluded.
No, I always felt that under Kit the team was short of good full backs, a com
Quote from: Oakeshott on March 06, 2016, 05:42:29 PM
"A few moths ago the general opinion on this board was that we had a talented squad of players but that the manager and the tactics he employed were at fault."
The second part is spot on, but the first part too indiscriminate.
While most of us thought most of the Summer signings were decent, not many included Richards in that and most knew we had inadequate full backs. That remains the case and can't be remedied until next Summer.
That considerable weakness apart, the squad was, and is, good enough to hold its own in this division. But J needs time to get over the weaknesses in squad management under Kit - namely the lack of work on defensive drills and the relative lack of fitness of the players. Kit condemned himself when he admitted his training was tailored to what the players liked, which is certainly not the same as what they needed. It will take J more than a few weeks to remedy the deficiencies of training under Kit.
I always thought that Kit's squad was short of good full backs, an outstanding centre half and pacey wide players. These problems still exist although the new manager has beefed up the squad with five loan signings and employed a lot of different tactics.
Sure we need players in certain positions but shouldn't the new manager with his loan players , by now, have given us some improvements in results.
Quote from: filham on March 06, 2016, 07:38:58 PM
Sure we need players in certain positions but shouldn't the new manager with his loan players , by now, have given us some improvements in results.
We all want to see better results and you would hope to see change. But as I showed the other day, if 50 of your transfers work thats great, god even 1 in 3 would be a result
But lets compare to another manager who had his first 11 games from new years onwards...how did he do?
(http://i65.tinypic.com/fawqyt.jpg)
Different players , different league, 8 years ago. But shows its not always an instant change in results
Burnley have not lost for 12 games. 9 wins in last 12.
If we loose today is it because they are a better team or because Joka is the wrong man?
This manager has arrived with an excellent record but a club with serious restrictions in bringing in new players, so he does need time to bring in new players. A courtesy we allowed Kit.
Also if you keep sacking managers all you will get is journeymen who keep getting sacked from other clubs.
So to paraphrase the modern saying, KEEP CALM AND HAVE FAITH AND CHEER THE TEAM. It was like a morgue against Boro.
Jokanovic, and all at the club, know he is just seeing out this season. Then, over the summer, he can build his team.
He has referred to many times the lack of ability in this squad to suit his style of play. Kit Symons made an absolute mis-match of a squad.
I have faith, and I presume Khan, that SJ will be given the funding he needs to build a playoff pushing squad.
We only need 6 first teams starters. The rest of our squad currently would be more than capable back up.
Plus, there will be a lot of players departing. Not Magath-esque, but certainly 10+ players, who need to go, will leave.
I have no worries about relegation, as there is enough games in which we will get wins, and the teams below us are a whole different class down.
Quote from: Hoppus on March 08, 2016, 11:03:50 AM
Burnley have not lost for 12 games. 9 wins in last 12.
If we loose today is it because they are a better team or because Joka is the wrong man?
Or both even!
The OP is a very silly boy!
Mr Jokanovic is the best man we could of employed as a Head coach/Manager.
Maybe there's someone else out there as good but otherwise, recruiting him is one big tick in the box regarding that Job.
There's plenty of other things of concern that need attention but not this one.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on March 08, 2016, 02:43:12 PM
Quote from: bill taylors apprentice on March 08, 2016, 02:36:19 PM
The OP is a very silly boy!
Mr Jokanovic is the best man we could of employed as a Head coach/Manager.
Maybe there's someone else out there as good but otherwise, recruiting him is one big tick in the box regarding that Job.
There's plenty of other things of concern that need attention but not this one.
Yes your right. Like for instance, the Door of the Managers Office needs a fresh coat of paint, and Gladys the Tea Lady, hasn't had a holiday for 5 years.
The op is clearly a troll people should ignore him!
Regardless of how good he may be, his first job was to keep us up and has to do that - anything else is a failure. Looking beyond that at this moment is pointless, although if we do go down, sacking him may be pointless too. In 2 and half months we have2 wins and he hasn't really improved the defence despite trying every defender in the club. Maybe he should decide who his best defenders are and play them.
Quote from: mike_corkcity12 on March 05, 2016, 06:18:53 PM
Has been a big disappointment and wouldn't be surprised to see him leave in the summer.
2 wins is awful. Get Warburton in in the summer.
I had high hopes for him but I fail to see any improvement. I would at least give him one transfer window though to see if he can improve the team.
Quote from: CorkCity on March 09, 2016, 11:07:33 AM
Quote from: mike_corkcity12 on March 05, 2016, 06:18:53 PM
Has been a big disappointment and wouldn't be surprised to see him leave in the summer.
2 wins is awful. Get Warburton in in the summer.
I had high hopes for him but I fail to see any improvement. I would at least give him one transfer window though to see if he can improve the team.
Really? I can see substantial improvement, a plan, and a method, but the quality of the squad is killing us at the moment. If given a proper chance to improve the squad I think we will be top of the pile next season, I remain totally confident about that.
I'm also seeing a huge difference, we look less ragged moving the ball around and as if our defence vaguely knows what they're doing.
The big difference is that when we don't have the ball the midfield don't seem to drift completely out of games, or allow the ball just to be played through them without a noise of complaint.
Yes we're on a dire run of form but our performances (Blackburn aside) have not merited those results
I'm seeing periods of sustained quality on the pitch. Unfair to trash the new man this early.
How can we play so well, and still lose, I know, it's the penalty decision but I thought it was one of our best performances all season
Have you seen our squad?
There answers your question.
When Kit Symons was here, we blamed the manager for the results, and claimed we had a good enough squad for the play offs.
Now with Jokanovic, we blame the squad for the results, and claim that the manager is good enough for the play offs.
Perhaps the squad was to blame all along?
It must be said that in hindsight, if we are being fair, Symons was doing a cracking job with the exact same players available to SJ.
Have every confidence in Jokanovic - even watching him animated on the touch line is refreshing. We can't deny the football has improved roll on the summer transfer window.
Jokanovic has to be given a chance to go through a transfer window in his own right. He came in and inherited the leftovers from previous mis-management and then the transfer embargo was put on the club.
Why does everyone keep mentioning Warburton? Yes, he's probably a decent manager (it's hard to tell with Scottish league football!) , but why would he leave a club with 40,000 at every home game and almost certainly, European football possibilities in a year's time!!!
I'd worry more about the people at the top of our club and not the current management!
Quote from: Chutney on March 10, 2016, 09:32:13 AM
When Kit Symons was here, we blamed the manager for the results, and claimed we had a good enough squad for the play offs.
Now with Jokanovic, we blame the squad for the results, and claim that the manager is good enough for the play offs.
Perhaps the squad was to blame all along?
It must be said that in hindsight, if we are being fair, Symons was doing a cracking job with the exact same players available to SJ.
I believe the problem is with the squad and, sadly, that is what did Kit in - in that it was incapable of meeting the benchmark set for him. So, everyone who had a hand in the signing of the players had a hand in his demise. I don't believe Rigg ever wanted Kit to be manager (not saying there was sabotage) but, he had to let the situation play itself out.
Individually, these players are all more than capable and have every right to play in this league and succeed. But, somehow, together, they become less than the sum of the parts more often than more. Perhaps that's all a mentality that's been born out of the last three or so seasons. Perhaps it's just that the partnerships on the field (CB to CB, CM to CM, LM to LB, etc) weren't considered as they should have been during Kit's build out of the squad.
But, the squad has to be rebuilt yet again.
I hope that Jokanovic can do it and I sincerely hope that he gets a long term deal with the club. It's time to stick with one man to try and build something.
