Just looking at the players we signed in the summer ,we did some very good business it has to be said . Dont care how the process worked and who signed who ,just what the players have delivered so far:
Buttons. Hes a definite upgrade on what we had last year, but has yet to convince us that he has what it takes to be our number 1 for too long.I want to like him ,but strugglling a bit. 6/10
Malone. Great signing and what a swop deal for us. Great going forward and at last a full back who can win the ball in the air, someone who has a good left foot and pretty good delivery from wide positions.Has his moments of sloppy defending ,but now he is fit looks like a real asset to the side. 8/10
Kalas. A very good loan signing. Solid ,aggressive and apart for one or two lapses has been really solid at centre back. With right centre half alongside him is premiership class imo.8/10
Sigardsson. A good solid centre back . unspectacular but fairly reliable. Not really suited to playing out from the back the way the way Joka wants. Shame he wasnt about 3 inches taller . Got found out against sheff weds (as did Kalas) by a side using borderline cheating tactics of pushing , pulling and generally bullying and outmuscling thier opponnents. 7/10
Odoi. opinion is maybe a bit divide ,but I like him. I think he has done well for the most part, but is competeing with a rejuvinated fredriks. 7/10
Ayete . great signing. quick ,hard working,and dangerous going forward ,but always covering back too. 8/10
Aluko. A revelation. creative ,hard working and ball winning forward. always a threat . Ok he misses plenty of half chances , but if he had better quality in his finishing he would be in a top premiership side. 9 /10
Johansen .Brendan Rogers eat your heart out. Siging of the year Imo. Has skill,vision and what an engine ! runs and runs and has even started adding goals . At last we have a box to box midfielder of class.9/10
Martin. Very astute clever touches have given our atticking midfielders a reason to get into good positions .Underrated by many who dont appreciate what he brings to the table. Has scored goals but can have patches where he loses form slightly. Get him on a permanent deal 7.5/10
Piason. excellent player. Hard working ,skillful with good vision and can score goals. 7.5/10
Kebano yet to convince me .Has skill and speed is hit and miss. Either beats his man or loses the ball if you know what I mean. The jury is still out on him. 6/10
Macdonald .Good solid player who also provides our midfield with a bit of physicallity . excellent signing 8/10
Jozabed .good player but probably a bit lightweight. Hope he comes good but have afeeling it may take time. Cant fairly rate him.
just a few thoughts, but what is apparant is that we got it right in the summer and now we can all see that we need a new striker in January to compete for that forward slot and maybe provide a difffernt type of alternative to our forward play, with a plan B that doesnt mean we hoof the ball into the opponents box.
I want to congratulate the club on the above signings and implore the powers that be to back Jokanovic in the transfer market in january and of cousre get him signed up on along term contract.
Hear, hear!
Good post Colin.
Ayite- 7/10
Aluko- 7/10
Odoi- 5/10
Malone- 6/10
Button- 5/10
McDonald- 8/10
Johansen- 7/10
Sigurdsson- 5/10
Kebano- 4/10
Jozabed- 3/10
Kalas- 9/10
Piazon- 6/10
Martin- 7/10
Agree, on the whole our most successful window since I can remember. I'd go with these scores so far. Johansen and Kalas being the picks, both could play in the Prem. Just behind them Malone has been an excellent bit of business.
Ayite- 7/10
Aluko- 8/10
Odoi- 5/10
Malone- 8/10
Button- 6/10
McDonald- 8/10
Johansen- 9/10
Sigurdsson- 5/10
Kebano- 5/10
Jozabed- N/A
Kalas- 9/10
Piazon- 7/10
Martin- 7/10
Quote from: Horsfield_No9 on December 15, 2016, 11:12:18 AM
Agree, on the whole our most successful window since I can remember. I'd go with these scores so far. Johansen and Kalas being the picks, both could play in the Prem. Just behind them Malone has been an excellent bit of business.
Ayite- 7/10
Aluko- 8/10
Odoi- 5/10
Malone- 8/10
Button- 6/10
McDonald- 8/10
Johansen- 9/10
Sigurdsson- 5/10
Kebano- 5/10
Jozabed- N/A
Kalas- 9/10
Piazon- 7/10
Martin- 7/10
You can tell this guy goes to games. Odoi and Sigurdsson have been so average.
Agree with most of this, out of curiosity - why the low score for Odoi? Been impressed with him at the games I've been to.
Might have been the Sheffield Wednesday game, but not sure - he came on with Parker and turned the game. Looks classy, and of huge class for a backup player
Quote from: Statto on December 15, 2016, 12:33:55 PM
As I've said a lot on here... If you're talking about our balance, style, work rate, coaching, consistency... all these things have improved massively. And yes certain players signed this summer are massive upgrades on what we had before. But IMO, not as many as people think.
Had we only signed Kalas, Ayite and McDonald this summer but kept the best of what we had before, I don't think we'd be much worse than we are now
Player for player my analysis of the current first team would be as follows...
Fredericks, Madl, Ream, Parker, Cairney... all players who were already here last year
Button, Martin, Aluko... all good players but IMO not much better (arguably no better at all, or even worse) than Bettinelli, McCormack and Dembele
Johansen - very good but is he any better than LVC when Symons got the best out of him?
Malone - much better than Jazz yes, but is he any better than Husband?
Every man and his dog was saying on here last season we need a commanding CB, and holding midfielder and a winger - and in Kalas, McDonald and Ayite that's where the big improvements have been made IMO.
So a reasonably good summer in which we've clearly improved the team but we shouldn't go OTT
That LVC hasn't been seen in a while so not sure that's a fair swap. Johansen is a definite upgrade.
Some fair points, but we were never gonna be able to keep Dembele, and evidently Ross too really so think we must say that getting in Martin and Aluko is good work. Not had a good winger like Aluko in ages, and now we've got 2 - with him alongside Ayite
Statto I would take Martin over Ross and Aluko over Dembelle. Both are team players who do the work for the side and arent just playing for themselves, but fit into a team. Not necessarily better players , but not luxury players either.
Ross and Moussa are history so lets not get bogged down in them.
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 15, 2016, 11:20:40 AM
Quote from: Horsfield_No9 on December 15, 2016, 11:12:18 AM
Agree, on the whole our most successful window since I can remember. I'd go with these scores so far. Johansen and Kalas being the picks, both could play in the Prem. Just behind them Malone has been an excellent bit of business.
Ayite- 7/10
Aluko- 8/10
Odoi- 5/10
Malone- 8/10
Button- 6/10
McDonald- 8/10
Johansen- 9/10
Sigurdsson- 5/10
Kebano- 5/10
Jozabed- N/A
Kalas- 9/10
Piazon- 7/10
Martin- 7/10
You can tell this guy goes to games. Odoi and Sigurdsson have been so average.
Forgive me Mr Perkins but that is an uneccessary and irrelivant comment,and not a great way to put your point across.
Ayite- 7/10
Aluko- 8/10
Odoi- 6/10
Malone- 7/10
Button- 7/10
McDonald- 8/10
Johansen- 9/10
Sigurdsson- 6/10
Kebano- 5/10
Jozabed- N/A
Kalas- 9/10
Piazon- 7/10
Martin- 7/10
To be honest even Kebano who I gave a 5 too I think is a good player. Just rating that on the impact they have had.
More importantly the summer signings have given us much greater strength in depth. You only need to look at each bench to see that.
Quote from: colinwhite on December 15, 2016, 01:37:53 PM
Statto I would take Martin over Ross and Aluko over Dembelle. Both are team players who do the work for the side and arent just playing for themselves, but fit into a team. Not necessarily better players , but not luxury players either.
Ross and Moussa are history so lets not get bogged down in them.
Likewise. I think McCormack in particular shaped how we played far too much and we suffered as a result. Martin I feel is a better player for the team - is stronger at bringing people into the game and holding a higher line. I felt at times McCormack drifted into midfield too often.
I would've liked to have kept Dembele.
I think what people don't acknowledge perhaps is the competition that's now available. The players we have on the bench aren't bad now whereas last year they were weak. Richards and Husband... one of those was good. Malone, Odoi, Fredericks and Sessgnon- I would say none are bad.
Not only that but we're seeing our players more consistently offer up value in terms of assists and goals from everywhere - I think we've got goalscorers in every position, which for an opposition manager is a nightmare to plan against - something we didn't have at all last season.
We also got rid of a lot of dead weight last summer... players like O'hara, Lonegran, Burn and Richards just weren't good enough to be anywhere near our first team squad.
Quote from: J.Perkins on December 15, 2016, 11:20:40 AM
Quote from: Horsfield_No9 on December 15, 2016, 11:12:18 AM
Agree, on the whole our most successful window since I can remember. I'd go with these scores so far. Johansen and Kalas being the picks, both could play in the Prem. Just behind them Malone has been an excellent bit of business.
Ayite- 7/10
Aluko- 8/10
Odoi- 5/10
Malone- 8/10
Button- 6/10
McDonald- 8/10
Johansen- 9/10
Sigurdsson- 5/10
Kebano- 5/10
Jozabed- N/A
Kalas- 9/10
Piazon- 7/10
Martin- 7/10
You can tell this guy goes to games. Odoi and Sigurdsson have been so average.
[/b]
I go to games as well ! But I would give Odoi and Sigurdsson at least 6 and probably disagree with the majority of the scores given by a point at least either way.
IMO sometimes a player is a vital part of making the team work but goes under the radar when listing top players, such as Bjarne Goldbaek. Finnan was top class but Goldbaek made it all work better down the RH side.
The like of Odoi, Malone and Piazon fit in and make the team tick so deserve better than the 6 you gave.
Ayite- 7.5/10
Aluko- 9/10
Odoi- 4/10
Malone- 8/10
Button- 6/10
McDonald- 8/10
Johansen- 9/10
Sigurdsson- 6/10
Kebano- 2/10
Jozabed- 2/10
Kalas- 9/10
Piazon- 6/10
Martin- 7/10
Tried to take into account the actual deal as well as performances. Basically value for money which in some cases made me a bit generous.
The high marks speak for themselves. The low marks speak for themselves. Jozabed and Kebano to date have been a massive waste of money.
Malone is what he is but the fact he was swapped on a free for Jazz makes it an unbelievable deal in the circumstances. Otherwise it may be just a 6 for his inconsistency.
Same with Martin. For a striker with his CV a loan fee of 2.5million for the season is ridiculous but that's on paper. In reality he has been very good on occasions but in the main non existent and a bit disappointing. So other than the actual deal it's less than the 7 I gave him.
Overall I think we had a very good window and the best one for quite a long time. Probably since the great escape when we signed Stalteri, Hangeland, Andreasen and Nevland which had a big impact on us acting out the great escape.
Window as a whole- 8/10
1500.gif Got to raise a ? there DB. I fully agree with your assessment of 'Overall' 8/10. But to give Odoi only 4/10?
Very mean DB, Very mean! :hook:
Quote from: Fulham Tup North on December 15, 2016, 10:12:02 PM
1500.gif Got to raise a ? there DB. I fully agree with your assessment of 'Overall' 8/10. But to give Odoi only 4/10?
Very mean DB, Very mean! :hook:
Our season hit a blip after about 7 or so games. We had no penetration from the wings. Since Fredericks came in we have looked a much better more balanced side.
Maybe 4 is harsh but he cost double what Fredericks did and in 5 months of football the only amazing thing I remember is his back trick vs Newcastle.
I think hes very average at best and defensively has awful positioning. Not the worst by any means but not great either. I'll make it a 5 for you tubs since I like you lol.
Yes, most of them have turned out well but I am disappointed in the two most expensive Martin and Sigurdsson, both of whom we expected a lot from.
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 15, 2016, 10:30:09 PM
Quote from: Fulham Tup North on December 15, 2016, 10:12:02 PM
1500.gif Got to raise a ? there DB. I fully agree with your assessment of 'Overall' 8/10. But to give Odoi only 4/10?
Very mean DB, Very mean! :hook:
Our season hit a blip after about 7 or so games. We had no penetration from the wings. Since Fredericks came in we have looked a much better more balanced side.
Maybe 4 is harsh but he cost double what Fredericks did and in 5 months of football the only amazing thing I remember is his back trick vs Newcastle.
I think hes very average at best and defensively has awful positioning. Not the worst by any means but not great either. I'll make it a 5 for you tubs since I like you lol.
[/b]
Yes Fredericks has done well since his return but Odoi had to play in a new team that was developing and changing which couldn't have been easy. On a personal level Odoi played well enough for a 6 or 7 some games, I think he just dosen't catch the eye as much.
Also, complicating the points scoring by taking into account how much we bought them for is bizarre, the fee on a players head counts for nothing on the pitch.
Its like saying "I cant give so and so man of the match because he cost a lot and its what we expect !
A player either plays well or he doesn't, the price tag is a different argument.
Fredericks can stay in the team as long as he's doing well, I'm happy with him but people under estimate Odoi
Quote from: Statto on December 15, 2016, 11:22:32 PM
Quote from: bill taylors apprentice on December 15, 2016, 11:10:52 PM
Quote from: dannyboi-ffc on December 15, 2016, 10:30:09 PM
Quote from: Fulham Tup North on December 15, 2016, 10:12:02 PM
1500.gif Got to raise a ? there DB. I fully agree with your assessment of 'Overall' 8/10. But to give Odoi only 4/10?
Very mean DB, Very mean! :hook:
Our season hit a blip after about 7 or so games. We had no penetration from the wings. Since Fredericks came in we have looked a much better more balanced side.
Maybe 4 is harsh but he cost double what Fredericks did and in 5 months of football the only amazing thing I remember is his back trick vs Newcastle.
I think hes very average at best and defensively has awful positioning. Not the worst by any means but not great either. I'll make it a 5 for you tubs since I like you lol.
[/b]
Yes Fredericks has done well since his return but Odoi had to play in a new team that was developing and changing which couldn't have been easy. On a personal level Odoi played well enough for a 6 or 7 some games, I think he just dosen't catch the eye as much.
Also, complicating the points scoring by taking into account how much we bought them for is bizarre, the fee on a players head counts for nothing on the pitch.
Its like saying "I cant give so and so man of the match because he cost a lot and its what we expect !
A player either plays well or he doesn't, the price tag is a different argument.
Fredericks can stay in the team as long as he's doing well, I'm happy with him but people under estimate Odoi
I can see where DB is coming from. If the thread is about transfer "business" then whether or not something is good "business" involves looking at the fee just as much as how good the player is. But then if the thread is just about how good the player is then yes it's unfair to look as the fee. Above there is a perfect example, a criticism of Sigurdsson based on expectations and the fee we paid for him. Sig is someone i feel gets a lot of unfair stick on here. To me he seems comparable to kalas when they play together, can't really see one being better than the other. But yet Kalas always comes top of the player ratings and sig gets criticised, which IMO is just because people judge sig against the fee paid, which is harsh.
Fair comment.
And I agree about Sigurdsson as well.
We seem much better as a team with our new signings, and under this manager now.
I'm not sure if it's fair to slag off players yet, who've all had promising, as well as poor performances in the team, I think. EG Kebano, on his debut, which I witnessed, and Odoi, who was seen as brilliant at first, and not just because of his 'trick.'
I think things are definitely looking good for the current Fulham squad.
I really rely on peoples opinions about both team and players to keep up with what is going on with FFC. It's always nice to see how people see players completely differently.
For example I thought Ream played well in his recent appearance and was disappointed to see him completely left off the bench of late. Harsh as I think, from what I saw in the replays, that he had good games and showed class on the ball with excellent passing out of the back.
On another note..... not to stir the pot but ......loads of people on here gave stats boy Kline crap over being involved with player signings. Now I think most would agree this team and the summer signings are a big improvement over the last few seasons. I realize that the improvements could be due to current coaching management, but I still think overall we have a vast improvement on our players. I just can't help but wonder how much Kline was involved with the player recruitment?
For me this years team selection, however they have come to FFC, has shown that Khan and company are moving forward. It may not be in leaps and bounds but FFC is moving forward without breaking the bank yet staying competitive.
For that I say well done to both Khan and Club. 051 049:gif
Looking forward to seeing what business the club will do in the January window xmascheer1
Bill, Statto explained why I took into account the actual transfer deal. The title of the thread is summer signings and how we've rated them. If it had been best player so far then I would have scored it slightly different for certain players.
But I get what you're saying. We just interpreted the point of the thread differently.
Interesting point Statto about Sig and Kalas. When they play together I suppose there isn't a great deal of difference. But overall Kalas has been the better player.
I'd expect that though, he is based across the road so knows and lives local, knows the championship from last season too so there wasn't really a settling in period. For Sig it's completely different and I don't think he's quite got to the pace of the league yet.
If it's any conciliation to you I don't think Sig will get worse. I can only see his rating and performances getting better with time.
good points by one and all. I dont think we actually have made any poor signings. Jozabed and Kebano havent been given game time so they havent delivered anything as yet,but we cant say they are rubbish because we havent seen them play enough.
Incidentally I give slavisa 8/10 ,. For me he has done a very good job and i repeat lets get him signed up on a new contract !
Going back to the OP
The signings are generally a step up in quality. however they arenot in the class that tigs brought in, but even f his signings were not all successful.
Malone has been a revelation and IMO miles better than Husband (somebody mentioned him above). Kalas is a class act unlike so many others I think the goalkeeper is pretty good and I have no real complaints, all GKs make errors and I think this one has saved us more than let us down by a mile.
The others such as Ayite and Aluko are talented but very wasteful and eratic, for aluko to fulfil his potential he really needs some end product, he is quick and skillful but it tends to lead nowhere.
Macdonald is excellent when not alongside parker, they do not compliment each other is the problem and johansen has burst into life after a very shaky start.
So that all good, some of the others like kebanno do not seem to have had enough of a chance, i suspect he is a very good player if given the opportunity, jozabed, not keen so far. Martin? I would think we can do better for the same money and I feel he is not suited to our style.
The real star for me is the manager who has obviously turned things round and we are looking a very decent side and if he is allowd to strengthen again in January, without inteference from our second rate board, then we may yet make top two (perhaps a trifle optimistic but not impossible). If the board do intefere we may demoralise the manager and that will be a big negative.
Merry christmas.
agree with most of that . I do think Martin is part of slavisa s game plan and suits our style .But as I and many others have said it would be good to have another option to be able t change both personel and style around .And Im not talking about a Smith type of player.
Going back to the Kalas and sig comparison. Kalas was definitely more noticeable during his injury enforced absence than sig has been when either Madl or Ream has played. That's for me why he rates higher, he makes his CB partner better.
I agree kalas has been the best defender ,not perfect but very important for the team
