cairney injured, kalas suspended..... only need one more problem and we will struggle although odoi at the CB and norwood are good replacements.... but we should have been better with 10 men and ayite ( a manager favourite) fails to impress far too often).
we have a new center forward that doesn't get in the team, clearly something remains foolishly wrong with our squad.
How should we have done better with 10 men??? to get a point with 10 men for 98 minutes is unheard of and very impressive.
Quote from: @jolslover on August 13, 2017, 11:43:45 AM
How should we have done better with 10 men??? to get a point with 10 men for 98 minutes is unheard of and very impressive.
Put on kamara and play 4 4 1, would be my choice. i would have taken off ayite and probably kebano.
as it turned out it worked out but when we go down to 10 joca favours the batten down the hatches and play for a draw, i prefer a little more ambition and with the pace we have we could have exploited their frailties.
It is IMO one of Joca's shortcomings, the 10 men scenario, I do not favour hs approach and against a better team than reading I suspect we would have paid the price.
We'll never know and hopefully we can keep 11 on the pitch for the rest of the season.
Quote from: nose on August 13, 2017, 11:48:50 AM
Quote from: @jolslover on August 13, 2017, 11:43:45 AM
How should we have done better with 10 men??? to get a point with 10 men for 98 minutes is unheard of and very impressive.
Put on kamara and play 4 4 1, would be my choice. i would have taken off ayite and probably kebano.
as it turned out it worked out but when we go down to 10 joca favours the batten down the hatches and play for a draw, i prefer a little more ambition and with the pace we have we could have exploited their frailties.
It is IMO one of Joca's shortcomings, the 10 men scenario, I do not favour hs approach and against a better team than reading I suspect we would have paid the price.
We'll never know and hopefully we can keep 11 on the pitch for the rest of the season.
Isn't 1 point better than zero?
We expertly managed a difficult situation and came through with a great point. Being negative about that is silly talk. Also suggesting that against a better reading team we'd pay the price is hypothetical... if we hadn't lost Kalas early then might have won... both pointless statements. If we'd had gone for it and lost you'd be saying we should have played for a point.
The boys should be applauded for yesterday. Our unbeaten start goes on.
Nose. You are a closet wind-up merchant.
Come out of the closet. Let it go.
We'll support you and help you through it
my OP was about squad size when down rto 10 players we had insufficient options on the bench, we copuld have done better if the squad was up to full compliment
as it was a point was excellent but a better team would have made us pay
I am a joca fan but feel when down to 10 men he lacks a little ambition, we still could have won. not sure what your issues are. I do beliweve there are about half a dozen on the MB that will say black just because I say white.
to state again the OP is about squad size and that causes lack of options, hardly rocket science!
I think realistically all you can expect in a squad for a club our size are four CB's who could be in contention for the two positions. With Siggurdson gone we all really expect another in and Djalo to be 5th choice and give him time to settle in.
Yesterday without Madl and Kalas gone in a minute I think Odoi was good choice to go there ahead of Djalo. Would have been a big call to throw him into a hostile environment. Odoi had played CB a handful of times last season after substitutions so not a total shock.
Every fan and club wants everything in place, but it's real world here and it just does not happen.
Are we short? Yes but still time to fill those requirements.
As for expecting ten men for a whole game against a team in the same division to actually win, I'm sorry that just not realistic. This is a tough league with nit a massive amount between teams. Against a lower division team maybe, but Reading at their place. Sorry you are just wrong on this occasion.
Dig out a Roy Hodgson video he did with UEFA about playing with ten men, that's quite enlightening.
Quote from: nose on August 13, 2017, 11:48:50 AM
Quote from: @jolslover on August 13, 2017, 11:43:45 AM
How should we have done better with 10 men??? to get a point with 10 men for 98 minutes is unheard of and very impressive.
Put on kamara and play 4 4 1, would be my choice. i would have taken off ayite and probably kebano.
as it turned out it worked out but when we go down to 10 joca favours the batten down the hatches and play for a draw, i prefer a little more ambition and with the pace we have we could have exploited their frailties.
It is IMO one of Joca's shortcomings, the 10 men scenario, I do not favour hs approach and against a better team than reading I suspect we would have paid the price.
We'll never know and hopefully we can keep 11 on the pitch for the rest of the season.
like when we battened down the hatches away to Norwich with ten men and spanked them 3 1. Yes it's consistently well negative under slavisa. Maybe, just maybe that a weaker team from last season, just didn't have the ability to dominate with a player off the field
The debate really is how many first team players do we have in a very thin squad that would improve on last season. Yesterdays game proved how resilient and how some of us may well under estimate the squad and its potential.
But there can be few who can honestly say we have improved the team from last season. Which we will need to do unless we are relying on the same fortune and form we had then. Yes the team needs improving and the longer it takes the harder any improvement will be. Equally praise must go for the players who did play the 90 minutes yesterday. But we still need what we needed in January and the good form or yesterdays brilliant performance shouldn't cloud that issue.
Just prefer to take the positives from a great squad performance,we are better unit from this time last year,they are growing.
Yes, it was a great performance. No, I don't see Joka as negative, quite the opposite. Yes the squad is way too thin but we've all known that for a long time.
The proof of the pudding is in the eating and yesterday we took a point away to the team that were in the play off final a few matches ago and had beaten us on the way.
That tastes pretty good to me.
The last two matches we have had ten men for most of the game, we have won one and drawn one, and both were away. So no complaints from me there, and nobody should either. When
your one man shy, you still have two banks of four, with a player up front to hold the ball up.
Play the percentages and slow down the tempo and let the ball do the work, as the ball never gets tired.
You can either stick or twist thats the decision.
The rub of the green, a referee or linesmans decision, a moment of individual brilliance, or a sloppy mistake, can all influence the outcome of any match.
When you have ten men, I think the players automatically concentrate more, but you also have to make sure that your opponents march to the beat of our drum, and not the other way round.
We are all in the gutter but some of us are looking at the stars.... me.
Unfortunately i cannot readilly deal with justifying what is wrong.
Ibvoiced an opinion re tactics, that is one thing. The team under joca has brilliant work ethic, but with a couple more in the squad, with 10 against a poor reading, that was a chance missed. Clearlly 11 v 10 is toughbut not impossible....
Tactics we can disagree about the squad as it is is ridiculous if the management are serious.
Quote from: BedsFFC on August 13, 2017, 12:23:13 PM
Nose. You are a closet wind-up merchant.
Come out of the closet. Let it go.
We'll support you and help you through it
:plus one:
Yes the squad is understrength for a club who say they have aspirations of promotion. We knew that quite a while ago. But due to recent developments, this necessity has grown rapidly.
Of course it can all change with the recruitment of the right players who will cost money. You get what you pay for.
What I don't want to see happen, which is generally what happens. Is that if we are lucky we may get a couple of loan players in at the last minute, as the club panics, who already carrying an injury and sit on the bench for 6 months.
This underwhelming feeling I get when this happens, reminds of watching the Keystone Cops in action, but at least they are a lot funnier.
Article about playing again ten men.
Is it really harder to play against 10 men? - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34350828
Quote from: MJG on August 13, 2017, 10:03:07 PM
Article about playing again ten men.
Is it really harder to play against 10 men? - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34350828
Interesting theories, and certainly food for thought.
Quote from: nose on August 13, 2017, 11:42:48 AM
cairney injured, kalas suspended..... only need one more problem and we will struggle although odoi at the CB and norwood are good replacements.... but we should have been better with 10 men and ayite ( a manager favourite) fails to impress far too often).
we have a new center forward that doesn't get in the team, clearly something remains foolishly wrong with our squad.
Why read the answers to the original post when i agree with Mr Nose.
We've been lacking a striker.......... get Kamara on (i refuse to call him AK47). He causes concern and is the unknown quantity.
As for Ayite... my opinion differs slightly because he performs best in his recognised position with a recognised striker, so let's not berate him for playing a role he's not suited to.
Quote from: Barrett487 on August 13, 2017, 10:52:03 PM
Quote from: nose on August 13, 2017, 11:42:48 AM
cairney injured, kalas suspended..... only need one more problem and we will struggle although odoi at the CB and norwood are good replacements.... but we should have been better with 10 men and ayite ( a manager favourite) fails to impress far too often).
we have a new center forward that doesn't get in the team, clearly something remains foolishly wrong with our squad.
Why read the answers to the original post when i agree with Mr Nose.
We've been lacking a striker.......... get Kamara on (i refuse to call him AK47). He causes concern and is the unknown quantity.
As for Ayite... my opinion differs slightly because he performs best in his recognised position with a recognised striker, so let's not berate him for playing a role he's not suited to.
fair point re ayite, for me when he performs to his best in his proper position he is occasionally breathtakingly good but equally he can be over elaborate. I think he needs, like others a longer run in his own position to try and get some, for me, consistency. I like him as a trier but think he has a bit to learn yet. His potential is very great.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 13, 2017, 09:49:31 PM
Yes the squad is understrength for a club who say they have aspirations of promotion. We knew that quite a while ago. But due to recent developments, this necessity has grown rapidly.
Of course it can all change with the recruitment of the right players who will cost money. You get what you pay for.
What I don't want to see happen, which is generally what happens. Is that if we are lucky we may get a couple of loan players in at the last minute, as the club panics, who already carrying an injury and sit on the bench for 6 months.
This underwhelming feeling I get when this happens, reminds of watching the Keystone Cops in action, but at least they are a lot funnier.
'Yes the squad is understrength for a club who say they have aspirations of promotion. '
That is the whole issue. the management say we have aspirations, but the actions do not match. we play wonderful football, have a great work ethic, just see the last game, but the squad should have been improved to the point we all would have been agreed the board has at least tried hard. I honestly do not see that at the moment and find the words and actions do not align.
Quote from: nose on August 14, 2017, 01:42:46 PM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 13, 2017, 09:49:31 PM
Yes the squad is understrength for a club who say they have aspirations of promotion. We knew that quite a while ago. But due to recent developments, this necessity has grown rapidly.
Of course it can all change with the recruitment of the right players who will cost money. You get what you pay for.
What I don't want to see happen, which is generally what happens. Is that if we are lucky we may get a couple of loan players in at the last minute, as the club panics, who already carrying an injury and sit on the bench for 6 months.
This underwhelming feeling I get when this happens, reminds of watching the Keystone Cops in action, but at least they are a lot funnier.
'Yes the squad is understrength for a club who say they have aspirations of promotion. '
That is the whole issue. the management say we have aspirations, but the actions do not match. we play wonderful football, have a great work ethic, just see the last game, but the squad should have been improved to the point we all would have been agreed the board has at least tried hard. I honestly do not see that at the moment and find the words and actions do not align.
We may have some answers in the next couple of weeks, or we may have more questions than answers.
