The FA covered up a "Super White Army" banner at Tranmere before the women's world cup qualifier this week. Will we be banned from supporting our whites?
COYW!
Tell me this is because it was obstructing the view of other supporters and not because some idiot thought it was a white supremacy banner.
It certainly wasn't obstructing any views...
For years I have been waiting for some of this nonsense to come to football. Are to have the end of the chant 'Come on you whites'?
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Quote from: bog on September 21, 2017, 02:02:48 PM
For years I have been waiting for some of this nonsense to come to football. Are to have the end of the chant 'Come on you whites'?
092.gif
It wont be long before white space on websites is a racist hate crime. The problem it's usually about 5% of people who kick off who ruin it for the rest of it.
OMG
This was reported in the local Liverpool newspaper (quoting a Tranmere supporter)
"I suspect the banner was removed because it is Tranmere-specific (for want of a better phrase) and therefore at odds with it being an England home venue, same way they usually replace the host club's pitch side perimeter adverts with the FA's advertising partners.
"If the suggestion is it was removed because of racist connotations then it wouldn't be allowed to go on display at any game, not just an England game."
Many of us grew up with collectible paper golliwogs on jars of jam and marmalade. There were golliwogs in Noddy and Big Ears. There was a childrens story about Brer rabbit and The Tar Baby. There was the Saturday Night entertainment show. The Black and White Minstrel show. They released LPs of the songs sung.
All of the above no longer exist in popular culture. Some would say that is a good thing. Others would say that we have become so outwardly correct and yet happily spout bile in chat rooms that we would have never had the nerve to do in the old days.
By throwing out the baby with the bath water. We have become a crueler and less accepting culture. Yes we can all agree that some things have improved. But overall the dictates of the political correct people have made this a much scarier place to live. Universities not wanting to allow debate in case it upsets the students. We live in ugly times that by putting on black tape to hide everything has just made us intolerant of everything. Pulling down statues and not listening does not make a better World.
Quote from: Lighthouse on September 21, 2017, 02:33:18 PM
Many of us grew up with collectible paper golliwogs on jars of jam and marmalade. There were golliwogs in Noddy and Big Ears. There was a childrens story about Brer rabbit and The Tar Baby. There was the Saturday Night entertainment show. The Black and White Minstrel show. They released LPs of the songs sung.
All of the above no longer exist in popular culture. Some would say that is a good thing. Others would say that we have become so outwardly correct and yet happily spout bile in chat rooms that we would have never had the nerve to do in the old days.
By throwing out the baby with the bath water. We have become a crueler and less accepting culture. Yes we can all agree that some things have improved. But overall the dictates of the political correct people have made this a much scarier place to live. Universities not wanting to allow debate in case it upsets the students. We live in ugly times that by putting on black tape to hide everything has just made us intolerant of everything. Pulling down statues and not listening does not make a better World.
Never has a truer word been spoken. +10000000000000000000000000000
The New Zealand rugby team must be laughing
What is this country were living in tottaly barmy!
Quote from: Marcel_Gecov on September 21, 2017, 02:35:30 PM
Quote from: Lighthouse on September 21, 2017, 02:33:18 PM
Many of us grew up with collectible paper golliwogs on jars of jam and marmalade. There were golliwogs in Noddy and Big Ears. There was a childrens story about Brer rabbit and The Tar Baby. There was the Saturday Night entertainment show. The Black and White Minstrel show. They released LPs of the songs sung.
All of the above no longer exist in popular culture. Some would say that is a good thing. Others would say that we have become so outwardly correct and yet happily spout bile in chat rooms that we would have never had the nerve to do in the old days.
By throwing out the baby with the bath water. We have become a crueler and less accepting culture. Yes we can all agree that some things have improved. But overall the dictates of the political correct people have made this a much scarier place to live. Universities not wanting to allow debate in case it upsets the students. We live in ugly times that by putting on black tape to hide everything has just made us intolerant of everything. Pulling down statues and not listening does not make a better World.
Never has a truer word been spoken. +10000000000000000000000000000
Not enough zeros on this tweet!
Quote from: Statto on September 21, 2017, 07:52:33 PM
hmmm, personally i think you devalue the argument a bit if you suggest there's nothing wrong with gollywogs and and the black and white minstrel show. i don't generally sympathise with the liberal snowflakes who complain about these sorts of things but i am with them on those particular items. quite right they've been phased out.
As a white person I find snowflake offensive but I don't suppose we are allowed to complain
A few years back, I was sampling the delights of a dreary game at Wigan when a few late-comers told me they'd been held by police at Wigan railway station after a lady on their train accused them of being racists.
The song they were singing was 'Come on you whites'!
Thankfully, I think common sense prevailed and they were actually quite pleased to have missed some of the most boring game I have ever witnessed.
Quote from: Scrumpy on September 21, 2017, 10:15:08 PM
A few years back, I was sampling the delights of a dreary game at Wigan when a few late-comers told me they'd been held by police at Wigan railway station after a lady on their train accused them of being racists.
The song they were singing was 'Come on you whites'!
Thankfully, I think common sense prevailed and they were actually quite pleased to have missed some of the most boring game I have ever witnessed.
They should have burst into a chorus of " black and white army",
The problems for the FA and facing up to the challenges of being seen to be equal, fair and just to all their charges continues to unravel with Martin Glenn now saying he 'deliberately chose a black lawyer to deal with the racism investigations' when the FA's solicitors had categorically denied such a thing in writing to the media. Being equal, fair, and just is so much easier than pretending to be.
Quote from: toshes mate on September 22, 2017, 08:12:34 AM
The problems for the FA and facing up to the challenges of being seen to be equal, fair and just to all their charges continues to unravel with Martin Glenn now saying he 'deliberately chose a black lawyer to deal with the racism investigations' when the FA's solicitors had categorically denied such a thing in writing to the media. Being equal, fair, and just is so much easier than pretending to be.
Your dam right it is. 👍
Quote from: toshes mate on September 21, 2017, 02:26:12 PM
"I suspect the banner was removed because it is Tranmere-specific (for want of a better phrase) and therefore at odds with it being an England home venue, same way they usually replace the host club's pitch side perimeter adverts with the FA's advertising partners.
"If the suggestion is it was removed because of racist connotations then it wouldn't be allowed to go on display at any game, not just an England game."
That (hopefully) makes more sense.
The gollywog thing is quite frankly, racist. And no, I'm not a 'snowflake'.
I had a golliwog soft toy when I was very, very young. Had been in the family for generations but is now long gone. I can remember enjoying the Black and White Minstrels on BBC TV too. I do understand the offence they caused when, clearly, to be non-white was a big disadvantage in life, but, as Lighthouse says, the reaction to race issues by pretending you can deal with it in set ways is misguided. Respect needs to be fostered within each and every one of us as I am still learning even now, and it is never to be taken for granted.
For the record I have been in relationships (as friends and closer) with many non-white people from many different cultures. I have been to families, social events and parties where I was the only white and have, at times, felt the same things I imagine a non-white feels in an all white environment. It is never easy to be the odd one out especially when someone else is making a point of letting you know so, but when you learn to accept that people are all the same deep down inside then there is so much warmth in knowing it has always been that way. I just wish we could all accept each other as we are but sometimes it seems such a really tough ask.
Respectfully, the rest of the world doesn't always see and know what Fulham fans and football fans know. Many of their life experiences are quite different. And some things don't cross the Pond all that well. I know my fave football club's history, and expressions Lily Whites and Come on you Whites! don't carry any racist impressions when used in England. The colour of the shirt is what it is. But in the States, with its history, I have to catch myself at times from freely shouting out certain exhortations in public. I don't go around walking on egg shells. But there are times and places where things get lost in translation, and your audience assumes something not intended. So you pick your words more carefully, not wanting misunderstanding and upset. May sound silly to those who grew up in a football-saturated environment. But the States carries its own baggage from the past to this day. It's funny and sad at the same time how people are prisoners of what they don't know. I used to drop in from time to time at a great old timey bar in Berkeley, Michigan, a suburb north of Detroit, called the Gay 20s, a reference to the hedonistic high times decade in the States that preceded the Great Depression of the '30s. Before Prohibition. The bar food was really good. The place had an authentic saloon atmosphere. It had been there so long, with its distinctiive "Gay '20s" neon sign, the locals had a common understanding: It was time/place evocative. But then "gay" became the new acceptable expression in lieu of homosexual. And a younger demographic grew up less aware if at all about the Roaring '20s, that period in history. It was no longer cool to go to that bar. Stigmatised. And so it became a sports bar. TVs everywhere. Awful food. Totally remodeled in Early Bland. No longer a period piece, it looked like just another totally forgettable and uninteresting watering hole/pick up joint. I can't remember the name they gave it. Duffy's or P.J.'s or something meant to seem folksy, but more importantly, without the word "Gay" in it. The word got hijacked. Historic definition be damned. Oh, well. Come on you Whites!/
Forever Fulham makes a good point.
My late Mum would often say how beautiful black babies were when they were young. When she was told she couldn't say things like that. She said that she was sorry and she meant coloured babies. You see it was racism but it belonged to a different time without any racist hostility. Now we have far more hostility but the pretence of correctness. Historical context shouldn't be ignored and swept under the carpet and we shouldn't become over sensitive to the past.
Quote from: sunburywhite on September 21, 2017, 09:25:37 PM
Quote from: Statto on September 21, 2017, 07:52:33 PM
hmmm, personally i think you devalue the argument a bit if you suggest there's nothing wrong with gollywogs and and the black and white minstrel show. i don't generally sympathise with the liberal snowflakes who complain about these sorts of things but i am with them on those particular items. quite right they've been phased out.
As a white person I find snowflake offensive but I don't suppose we are allowed to complain
So do I, so can we refrain from using such terms.
There was nothing wrong with those terms, as there was nothing wrong in the reciprocal terms used by those of others races towards us in response,
in those times.
What is interesting is another term, used here in the states without reproach, referring to both Political party and animal alike, but now not used in the UK due to it's disparaging reference towards a black person. I will not say the word, but it is the shortened version Davy Crockett's hat!
That word has been around ever since I was a kid, LM and that was a long time ago!
I'm confused now!
Davy Crocketts hat wasn't a snowflake..
The older you get the more difficult this all becomes, attitudes change, words change meaning, humour disappears so I have decided it is best stay clear particularly when different age groups are invoved.
Quote from: Statto on September 22, 2017, 06:16:48 PM
Quote from: Logicalman on September 22, 2017, 05:04:17 PM
Quote from: sunburywhite on September 21, 2017, 09:25:37 PM
Quote from: Statto on September 21, 2017, 07:52:33 PM
hmmm, personally i think you devalue the argument a bit if you suggest there's nothing wrong with gollywogs and and the black and white minstrel show. i don't generally sympathise with the liberal snowflakes who complain about these sorts of things but i am with them on those particular items. quite right they've been phased out.
As a white person I find snowflake offensive but I don't suppose we are allowed to complain
So do I, so can we refrain from using such terms.
There was nothing wrong with those terms, as there was nothing wrong in the reciprocal terms used by those of others races towards us in response, in those times.
What is interesting is another term, used here in the states without reproach, referring to both Political party and animal alike, but now not used in the UK due to it's disparaging reference towards a black person. I will not say the word, but it is the shortened version Davy Crockett's hat!
Sorry, maybe we are reading from different dictionaries of slang, or maybe I've just misunderstood your and Sunbury's posts, but can I just clarify, "snowflake" is not a reference to white people but, as wikipedia puts it, "a neologistic term used to characterize the young adults of the 2010s as being more prone to taking offence and less resilient than previous generations, or as being too emotionally vulnerable to cope with views that challenge their own."
I've never in my life heard it used to refer specifically to white people and that includes searching on Google just now for any such references.
I assumed Sunbury was being ironic but now you've said the same thing I assume you're serious.
One way or another this is surely the most ironic exchange of posts in the history of the forum.
Snowflake was often used on 'Love Thy Neighbour' ! Mind you, that's not on regular TV anymore.
Its a nightmare trying to keep up! Is there somewhere you can log-in to get regular updates?
Am I mistaken but didn't the English education authority ban the use of black as in baa baa black sheep, and they had to use rainbow instead? So rainbows are black?? Oh dear
Quote from: kiwian on September 22, 2017, 11:32:31 PM
Am I mistaken but didn't the English education authority ban the use of black as in baa baa black sheep, and they had to use rainbow instead? So rainbows are black?? Oh dear
I've children in three different schools and I've never heard of anything like this. Who told you? Nigel Farage?
