http://c.newsnow.co.uk/A/950965238?-11176:824:3
Good news and would prove that he isn't ready to move on :wine:
A most key important sighning that would be.
Fingers crossed this gets sorted ASAP, we do not need any distractions later in the season of this is still not done. Get it done early and we can focus on build a solid PL outfit for the coming years - like we were before!
https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/1006510/Fulham-news-Slavisa-Jokanovic-contract-talks
Slavisa Jokanovic puts contract talks on the back burner - EXCLUSIVE
Fulham news: Slavisa Jokanovic has put off any talks over a new contract until Christmas.
The club have offered the Serb, who led the club to promotion to the Premier League via the play-offs last summer and has one year left on his current contract, a new three-year deal to keep him at Fulham until 2022.
Jokanovic, though, wants to put off any talks until he has steered Fulham through the first few months of their first season back in the top flight for four years.
Fulham owner Shahid Khan has backed his 50 year old manager with a more than £100million spending spree on a dozen new players this summer.
Jokanovic, who walked out of Watford after winning promotion with them in 2015 over a contract dispute, is keen on signing but, after two defeats in his opening two games, he wants to stabilise matters on the pitch before going into any further negotiations.
Makes sense for all parties to delay it IMO. The time to get him tied down was May/June, but that window has passed us by.
Now, whilst we all hope/expect this team will come good shortly, there's no guarantee. If we don't pick up a couple of points in the next two games, we could get a spanking off City and be looking at a Magath-esque start to the season, bottom of the table, confidence at rock bottom, and with Roy Hodgson being unavailable, relegation nailed on. It really could turn that dramatically and that quickly.
In that case the club would want rid of Jokanovic. He'd probably want out as well, spinning the (plausible) narrative that Tony Khan gambled on a lot of expensive egos, a league of nations unaccustomed to the PL, brought in too late (or injured) to prepare for a season where we were only ever going to survive by a fine margin of 3-6 pts.
This season really could go either way.
Too bad but, agree with Statto that it makes sense at this point in time.
Time to concentrate on getting the team in winning form and hopefully mid-table.
i'm a bit more sceptical on this. I just fail to believe that it wouldnt be done already had he wanted it done, or in the upcoming international break. I can however understand SJ waiting until the transfer window closed to see whether the board would back him, they've done that.
Is there also a bit of feeling in players minds that "if he's not commited already does he want to be here with us" etc.
Also not sure how involved Tony Khan is with the Jags, NFL season kicks off in a couple of weeks....
Maybe need a few more responses but I'm surprised at the early replies here and on twitter.
Two weeks ago he was the most important signing we could make, now after two defeats.... Its fine, we can wait, makes sense.
Quote from: MJG on August 22, 2018, 06:33:46 AM
Maybe need a few more responses but I'm surprised at the early replies here and on twitter.
Two weeks ago he was the most important signing we could make, now after two defeats.... Its fine, we can wait, makes sense.
Surely there's a very obvious explanation for that: we've started the season with 2 defeats since then. OK we've played strong opposition, there have been positive signs, and fans of a newly-promoted team always need to be patient, but it's still a little disappointing. The level of transfer spending has probably also raised expectations. We were after all, expected to beat Palace according to the bookies.
Quote from: MJG on August 22, 2018, 06:33:46 AM
Maybe need a few more responses but I'm surprised at the early replies here and on twitter.
Two weeks ago he was the most important signing we could make, now after two defeats.... Its fine, we can wait, makes sense.
Surely social media is one of the first places to look for evidence of the fickleness of human nature, not to mention the conclusion jumping.
Already, on this page, there is an entry saying 'the board has backed SJ' when we all know that personnel would have been incoming no matter who was in charge of the players.
I am happy to wait and see what happens once the new and old players have had a fair chance to settle in together. By October all concerned should have a better idea of how this team fits together.
I have to disagree, plenty of posts on here were about getting him tied down.
IF it true and he doesn't want to talk about it now that's a disappointment in my book. I have 100% faith in him and would want him signed now. I understood the wait till the window is closed view, its closed let's get it done and move on. Two defeats have not changed my mind on Slav.
To me the most important signing we should make.
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Quote from: MJG on August 22, 2018, 08:16:43 AM
I have to disagree, plenty of posts on here were about getting him tied down.
IF it true and he doesn't want to talk about it now that's a disappointment in my book. I have 100% faith in him and would want him signed now. I understood the wait till the window is closed view, its closed let's get it done and move on. Two defeats have not changed my mind on Slav.
OK so hypothetically, out of interest, What if it was 5 defeats?
Bearing in mind that whilst some clubs, eg Palace, have started the season that badly and still survived, it's generally involved a change of manager.
Quote from: Statto on August 22, 2018, 08:28:05 AM
Quote from: MJG on August 22, 2018, 08:16:43 AM
I have to disagree, plenty of posts on here were about getting him tied down.
IF it true and he doesn't want to talk about it now that's a disappointment in my book. I have 100% faith in him and would want him signed now. I understood the wait till the window is closed view, its closed let's get it done and move on. Two defeats have not changed my mind on Slav.
OK so hypothetically, out of interest, What if it was 5 defeats?
Bearing in mind that whilst some clubs, eg Palace, have started the season that badly and still survived, it's generally involved a change of manager.
You are of course always reviewing and no manager is ever unsackable (Well Wenger maybe was), but for me its not about waiting to see if he loses 5 or we are in trouble at Xmas. You have to show faith.
At other end of scale we wait till xmas and we are midtable safe and he's being mentioned for other jobs. You for one, given your views on transfer window activity, would be one of the first on here saying we should have signed him up earlier, as would many others.
I am disappointed he has not signed, which signifies to me that there are seeds of doubt in his mind. But why, maybe he knows something we do not.
Nevertheless, he cannot go from hero to zero in two defeats.
It may of course work out better for both parties if it is adjourned until the end of the year.
But from the players point of view, would they not be wondering why.
No doubt by Christmas we will all have a much better idea how we are shaping up as a Premier team.
But this is no quick fix overnight. The profusion of players brought in at the last minute has added to the difficulties of settling in, with so many new players, whether the majority of the preseason recruitment could have been mastered earlier, we will never know, but in the end we signed a dozen, and a lot of them have shown how valuable they will be.
So it's patience all round, and Jok and his staff have the challenge of moulding them all into a team and a fighting unit.
The quality is there, we have seen examples of it in the first two matches. We have had two tough opening games, both London Derbys.
As for the team, It really is a case of wait and see. As for the Manager, he appears to agree on that analogy.
I have 2 thoughts on this.
1. Managers come and go whatever their contract situation so I really don't think it matters much, if he wants to stay he will, if he wants to go he will. All a long contract does is commit Fulham to paying him more if he is sacked.
2. Slav needs to be given time with these players. Even with a more settled team, he has a consistent record of having much stronger 2nd halves of the season to 1st halves. If we loss the first 5 games we need to hold our nerve and give him time. I will start to properly judge this team after 10 games. Playing his style takes a long time to perfect. Long ball Colin or Sam football is much easier to coach but a technical passing game takes time.
Going to be a tense January window. Two things could happen. First one is if we are adrift at the bottom Slavisa or the Club may feel that a change is required. Slavisa would go followed by a mass exodus of players who came for Slavisa. We would then have to find a new manager & replacement players in this very short & expensive window.
The second scenario is that we are relatively safe in mid table & Slavisa will sign a new contract & tweak the squad to ensure we remain in the PL.
The last thing we need is there to be unrest in the camp with players minds diverted from the job in hand. The Club needs to all pull together.
Quote from: MJG on August 22, 2018, 08:16:43 AM
I have to disagree, plenty of posts on here were about getting him tied down.
IF it true and he doesn't want to talk about it now that's a disappointment in my book. I have 100% faith in him and would want him signed now. I understood the wait till the window is closed view, its closed let's get it done and move on. Two defeats have not changed my mind on Slav.
Spot on - he is the man for the job long term. He has given us an identity , a way of playing, entertaining football and success,
. The step up always requires adjustment and given his mentality he will make it work. It ŵill take time and I want him to stay - he is the most important signing
Well I don't care. I mean I really couldn't give a flying header into the top corner when or if the Coach signs a contract. I thank him for what he has done and thank him for what he wants to do. But if he signed a twenty year deal it would mean nothing anymore than not signing a contract. If we don't win a game by Christmas he will be sacked anyway. If he wins every game other clubs will be happy to take him. Players don't care and are not thinking anything about him wanting to sign or not sign.
He is not a coach who has a great deal of loyalty other than his own project. He has shown he likes and wants to build something at Fulham. What a job he has done. But we get far too bogged down in contracts. It means virtually nothing. He wants to stay or he wants to go and this season will go a long way in deciding what he decides or the club decide to do. Not a bit of paper.
Quote from: Statto on August 22, 2018, 08:28:05 AM
Quote from: MJG on August 22, 2018, 08:16:43 AM
I have to disagree, plenty of posts on here were about getting him tied down.
IF it true and he doesn't want to talk about it now that's a disappointment in my book. I have 100% faith in him and would want him signed now. I understood the wait till the window is closed view, its closed let's get it done and move on. Two defeats have not changed my mind on Slav.
OK so hypothetically, out of interest, What if it was 5 defeats?
Bearing in mind that whilst some clubs, eg Palace, have started the season that badly and still survived, it's generally involved a change of manager.
If it was 5 defeats, I'd refer you to FulhamStu's post above...........our long term consolidation will probably involve a lot of initial growing pains, and I would prefer to look at the bigger picture and trust Slav to get it right in the long term. This is nothing like the de Boer situation at Palace with a brand new man starting at the club. I've seen enough of Slav to trust that even though it will take time for the players to get used to the pace of the Premier League, we will have enough in the end to avoid relegation, and that is all that matters this season. If we don't push on a little bit next season then that would be a different matter.
Hmmm, I think almost any manager goes if they start the season with 5-6 defeats. MJG I think you're being a bit disingenuous because you've said that on here in the past. Jokanovic has built up some credit over the last 2 yrs but this is a new league for him and almost a new team. He's also never managed a weaker team before, ie where the objective is to finish 14th rather than 1st.
To clarify, I have confidence in him and reckon we'll pick up 3-4 points from the next 2 games, but it's quite possible that in 10 days from now it could go the other way and there could be a very strong case for parting ways.
It doesn't make sense to me to extend a contract during such a volatile, uncertain spell. Seems to be a bit like standing next to an empty road for 5 minutes then when you finally see a car coming and will have to quickly jog across the road to avoid it, choosing that moment to cross.
Quote from: Statto on August 22, 2018, 11:30:52 AM
Hmmm, I think almost any manager goes if they start the season with 5-6 defeats. MJG I think you're being a bit disingenuous because you've said that on here in the past. Jokanovic has built up some credit over the last 2 yrs but this is a new league for him and almost a new team. He's also never managed a weaker team before, ie where the objective is to finish 14th rather than 1st.
To clarify, I have confidence in him and reckon we'll pick up 3-4 points from the next 2 games, but it's quite possible that in 10 days from now it could go the other way and there could be a very strong case for parting ways.
It doesn't make sense to me to extend a contract during such a volatile, uncertain spell. Seems to be a bit like standing next to an empty road for 5 minutes then when you finally see a car coming and will have to quickly jog across the road to avoid it, choosing that moment to cross.
I havent said i'd not sack him at five defeats have I? That is the kind of figure you should be looking at and asking whats wrong and why and I wrote that below "You are of course always reviewing and no manager is ever unsackable"
No manger should have a blank cheque on what happens results wise. What I'm more intereted in following this story is how some now want to wait. 2 results and doubts already setting in for some?
Quote from: Statto on August 22, 2018, 11:30:52 AM
Hmmm, I think almost any manager goes if they start the season with 5-6 defeats. MJG I think you're being a bit disingenuous because you've said that on here in the past. Jokanovic has built up some credit over the last 2 yrs but this is a new league for him and almost a new team. He's also never managed a weaker team before, ie where the objective is to finish 14th rather than 1st.
To clarify, I have confidence in him and reckon we'll pick up 3-4 points from the next 2 games, but it's quite possible that in 10 days from now it could go the other way and there could be a very strong case for parting ways.
It doesn't make sense to me to extend a contract during such a volatile, uncertain spell. Seems to be a bit like standing next to an empty road for 5 minutes then when you finally see a car coming and will have to quickly jog across the road to avoid it, choosing that moment to cross.
When would you have liked Slav to sign an extension?
However great SJ is..... this fits his employment history ...for some reason
In my mind it may take more than 4-5 games before everyone starts pulling together, and we start getting results!
Stability is key now! No good sacking anyone until it is clear it's not working!
When the squad have settled, then will be time for a new contract for Slav!
Unless I'm mistaken, the board have offered SJ a contract so are showing they back him.
Breaking it down, Spurs away was never going to be easy to get any points vs a well established TEAM of high quality players. Vs Palace at home, in the context of playing a well organised, comparatively establish Prem team when we are fielding effectively an entirely new back 5 with zero experience of playing together competitively, I don't see that as reason to panic that SJ is not good enough is extremely premature given his track record with us. If we continue to lose then obviously his suitability must be revisited, but SJ being the one to put extension talks on the back burner himself is maybe IMO a LN honest decision from him and putting the club first, rather than anything sinister. I'm a firm believer that patience in the next few games is the way to go as there have been seeds of promise in our performances, and generally how the new guys have played so I'm fairly confident things will click. If they do then I'm sure SJ will be happy
To sign.
My concern was his comments about our longer serving players knocking on his door asking why they are not playing - I don't disagree generally with SJs selections of new players, but hopefully that comment isn't indicative of unrest in the squad causing a rift between the old and new players... If our team spirit is damaged by the sea change in our player roster then I fear that could be our major problem going forwards.
I sincerely hope SJ can manage the situation and that the players can use the competition for places positively to fight harder for the benefit of the team, rather than create a negative atmosphere / create a divide between the two camps.
On reflection , Slavisa waiting till Christmas could be in the best interests of himself & the Club. If it is not working out position & points wise it will give us time to bring in a replacement with the January window to work with. If on the other hand all is as well as can be expected there is no reason why he should not sign a new contract.
Maybe he is so confident that we will get it together and have a great season that he wants to wait and get an even better contract .................or not.
Quote from: grandad on August 22, 2018, 12:58:00 PM
On reflection , Slavisa waiting till Christmas could be in the best interests of himself & the Club. If it is not working out position & points wise it will give us time to bring in a replacement with the January window to work with. If on the other hand all is as well as can be expected there is no reason why he should not sign a new contract.
I agree with this, the only negative being the uncertainty it will instil in the players. If it's not working, or there's player unrest with SJ, it gives the club as many options as Joka.
Of course, if things take a down turn and he leaves, we could see Scotty as caretaker.
Quote from: MJG on August 22, 2018, 11:43:55 AM
When would you have liked Slav to sign an extension?
any time but now, hence my metaphor about crossing the road
any time from the play-off final up to the palace game would have been fine IMO
but i think the next two games, which are against the 3rd and 4th favourites to go down (according to Skybet, and excluding fulham) represent quite an important test. and the last two results, whilst they weren't "bad" viewed in isolation, saw jokanovic missing an opportunity to build himself some credit. if we'd have beaten palace, losing to burnley would surely be forgiven. but as it stands, as i've said, lose the next two and i think there's a real chance he could be gone. so having gone 3 months without signing a new contract, why do it now, before arguably a make-or-break next couple of games?
I'm not saying that's the way it should be, just saying, with the Man City game after these two, the way the stars have aligned, could put him/us in bother
Don't think need to get too paranoid over a bit of speculative journalism in the Express.
Quote from: MJG on August 22, 2018, 08:16:43 AM
I have to disagree, plenty of posts on here were about getting him tied down.
IF it true and he doesn't want to talk about it now that's a disappointment in my book. I have 100% faith in him and would want him signed now. I understood the wait till the window is closed view, its closed let's get it done and move on. Two defeats have not changed my mind on Slav.
I will not be changing my mind about SJ whatever happens - he is an absolute gem of a coach - but that may count for nothing so far as the signals that have actually passed between him and the owners, no matter what appears on social media. The window shutting was obviously not what he was waiting for, and I gather, from the posts above, nobody actually knows what it is he is waiting for. Clearly it isn't just a matter of signing a contract now the window has closed and the season is under way. Does anyone actually know what the delay is?
I find many posts on here quite odd. Bringing in 80% a new team, playing well for significant periods v very good teams then after another few games sack the manager if the results are not good is absolute madness of the highest order. It's the perfect way to totally ruin the club, not strengthen it. Nearly everyone agrees the one thing we need is to give Slav and the team time, how the heck is firing him and most of,the first team coaching staff who have been massively successful for the club over the past 2 or 3 seasons going to help anything. Some of the posts on here are the sort of thing I would expect on TIFF, from the wum and odd posters it attracts but not generally on here.
The Khans are not idiots.
The Khan's now have a better take on football in general and seem to be learning from mistakes of the past few years.
Quote from: FulhamStu on August 22, 2018, 03:39:03 PM
I find many posts on here quite odd. Bringing in 80% a new team, playing well for significant periods v very good teams then after another few games sack the manager if the results are not good is absolute madness of the highest order. It's the perfect way to totally ruin the club, not strengthen it. Nearly everyone agrees the one thing we need is to give Slav and the team time, how the heck is firing him and most of,the first team coaching staff who have been massively successful for the club over the past 2 or 3 seasons going to help anything. Some of the posts on here are the sort of thing I would expect on TIFF, from the wum and odd posters it attracts but not generally on here.
The Khans are not idiots.
Show me all the other PL clubs who have left a manager in charge after starting the season with 5 defeats.
Obvious comparison is de boer last season sacked by palace after 5 games.
it will hopefully never become an issue for us but I can guarantee if he lost the next 3 games, 80% of fans would forget last season and want him out, and so would 90% of chairmen.
if you think otherwise you are very naïve and ignoring the history/facts of these scenarios.
Interesting though that Burnley stood by Dyche and they were relegated - only to come back even stronger and qualify for Europe. Yes history points to trigger happy chairman and fans getting rid of their managers but does not categorically mean that they were always right or that it was a good decision . Yes Palace putting in Roy proved to be the right move - but managers of his quality are few and far between..
A club the size of Fulham requires consistency - whilst we can debate whether a change might be needed if we lost the next three games - for me it would be a mistake of quite epic proportions
Give Slav a new contract asap
Back the man and show confidence in him- the man who led us to promotion against all the odds.
Even IF we were to go on a losing run, sacking him would stll be an idiotic panic move in my opinion.
Remember - one game at a time.
Quote from: Statto on August 22, 2018, 04:27:23 PM
Quote from: FulhamStu on August 22, 2018, 03:39:03 PM
I find many posts on here quite odd. Bringing in 80% a new team, playing well for significant periods v very good teams then after another few games sack the manager if the results are not good is absolute madness of the highest order. It's the perfect way to totally ruin the club, not strengthen it. Nearly everyone agrees the one thing we need is to give Slav and the team time, how the heck is firing him and most of,the first team coaching staff who have been massively successful for the club over the past 2 or 3 seasons going to help anything. Some of the posts on here are the sort of thing I would expect on TIFF, from the wum and odd posters it attracts but not generally on here.
The Khans are not idiots.
Show me all the other PL clubs who have left a manager in charge after starting the season with 5 defeats.
Obvious comparison is de boer last season sacked by palace after 5 games.
it will hopefully never become an issue for us but I can guarantee if he lost the next 3 games, 80% of fans would forget last season and want him out, and so would 90% of chairmen.
if you think otherwise you are very naïve and ignoring the history/facts of these scenarios.
Well I am sorry, the whole of this thread is just ridiculous, talking about sacking the manager after 2 games.
In my humble opinion, naive or not, sacking one of our best, and most successful managers in recent times at any level is madness to me, maybe not to you. Football people whether fans or owners will get what they deserve if this was to happen and I can't promise you it would not be pretty.
Again, in my opinion Khan would not be so stupid. Now if it is really tits up after 10 games you may have no choice. But not 5 games with a brand new team. Teams that change managers often end up like QPR. Changing our manager multiple time helped get us relegated and that was with the idiot Jol starting the season.
So to repeat, if we were all over the place after 10 games, yes you would have to react. After 2 games and not playing that badly, this thread is premature to say the least. Wish I had just scrolled by to be honest but having reacted i now have to see the debate through.
Can I remind people that it is always best to read the whole thread as opposed to just one or two snippets. Our Coach has been rumoured to have been offered a contract and is said to be waiting to decide or see what happens. Having read the thread nobody has said sack him after two matches. I am pretty convinced that the Coach will walk long before he is sacked anyway. He has the reputation in deciding to walk when the project doesn't fit him anymore.
Quote from: HV71 on August 22, 2018, 05:05:06 PM
Interesting though that Burnley stood by Dyche and they were relegated - only to come back even stronger and qualify for Europe. Yes history points to trigger happy chairman and fans getting rid of their managers but does not categorically mean that they were always right or that it was a good decision . Yes Palace putting in Roy proved to be the right move - but managers of his quality are few and far between..
A club the size of Fulham requires consistency - whilst we can debate whether a change might be needed if we lost the next three games - for me it would be a mistake of quite epic proportions
Would be more than happy for SJ to remain at the helm if we got relegated
This debate makes us look so fickle. If we were looking at another club having this debate on their forums we would be declaring them as morons. Of course this post will probably encourage the retort of 'grow up ' but quite frankly I would prefer to stay in the kindergarten than stoop to that level. We have so far lost to a side finishing 11th ( after an appalling start to their season ) and the team finishing 3rd. We face the team that finished 7th last year on Sunday and some see it as a 'given' that we should win. Bonkers - truly bonkers.
'Ditto' Sunburywhite
Quote from: HV71 on August 22, 2018, 06:45:31 PM
This debate makes us look so fickle. If we were looking at another club having this debate on their forums we would be declaring them as morons. Of course this post will probably encourage the retort of 'grow up ' but quite frankly I would prefer to stay in the kindergarten than stoop to that level. We have so far lost to a side finishing 11th ( after an appalling start to their season ) and the team finishing 3rd. We face the team that finished 7th last year on Sunday and some see it as a 'given' that we should win. Bonkers - truly bonkers.
Well said
Supposed to be supporters and think they are because they have a season ticket!
The reason a lot of people no longer post on this site is down to the utter bollocks and negativity that is a constant no matter what!
My concern is when we enter the manager merry go round and a number are shown the door, if we are doing OK will we have other clubs start sniffing around, especially if there is only a remainder of a short contract to pay off.
I will not be happy until he signs.
it's football - enjoy or otherwise, the ride.Am not attracted to someone playing a game- might backfire on him and the club.
Quote from: BestOfBrede on August 22, 2018, 06:57:05 PM
The reason a lot of people no longer post on this site is down to the utter bollocks and negativity that is a constant no matter what!
That's ironic because the thing that ruins this site IMO is people being unable to comprehend that things aren't 100% good or 100% bad and can be somewhere in between, and dismissing reasonable critical analysis as "bollocks and negativity"
What's also ironic is 90% of the times i personally have been called negative, the club's or manager's subsequent actions have ulitmately shown they agree with me.
Slagging off Kline used to get called negativity. Then Jokanovic came out and slagged off Kline. Then the club sacked Kline in disgrace.
I started this summer transfer window by saying we should sign 10-15 players and spend £100m, which I got slagged off for. Then the club signed 12 players and spent £100m.
In this situation, those geniuses saying it's negative to adopt a 'wait-and-see' approach with Jokanovic at this point, please tell me, what do you think is the reason Tony Khan hasn't extended his contract yet? Spoiler alert... it can only be because he's adopting that approach!!!
Quote from: BestOfBrede on August 22, 2018, 06:57:05 PM
Quote from: HV71 on August 22, 2018, 06:45:31 PM
This debate makes us look so fickle. If we were looking at another club having this debate on their forums we would be declaring them as morons. Of course this post will probably encourage the retort of 'grow up ' but quite frankly I would prefer to stay in the kindergarten than stoop to that level. We have so far lost to a side finishing 11th ( after an appalling start to their season ) and the team finishing 3rd. We face the team that finished 7th last year on Sunday and some see it as a 'given' that we should win. Bonkers - truly bonkers.
Well said
Supposed to be supporters and think they are because they have a season ticket!
The reason a lot of people no longer post on this site is down to the utter bollocks and negativity that is a constant no matter what!
Without conflicting views this would be a pretty stagnant forum.
I do draw the line at insults and abuse, but i think that has reduced just recently.
Negativity is extremely closely linked to reality in many cases, and why shouldn't people with reservations air them? Many people are refreshingly positive, but not everyone looks through rose-coloured glasses, as is their prerogative.
As for threads on spurious reporting (i know this point wasn't brought up by you), without them there would be less variation on threads to read and they can lead to interesting debates. The whole point of forums is to discuss subjects of shared interest, usually FFC.
Quote from: Statto on August 22, 2018, 04:27:23 PM
Show me all the other PL clubs who have left a manager in charge after starting the season with 5 defeats.
Obvious comparison is de boer last season sacked by palace after 5 games.
it will hopefully never become an issue for us but I can guarantee if he lost the next 3 games, 80% of fans would forget last season and want him out, and so would 90% of chairmen.
if you think otherwise you are very naïve and ignoring the history/facts of these scenarios.
What 5 defeats?? What are you guys talking about?? Why so much negativity? Fulham will win the next match..PERIOD
I really get tired of the positivity/negativity argument since one cannot exist without the other. When you call a spade a spade you are simply describing an object with its correct name. Of course, you may describing a fork as a spade and hopefully someone will point you in the right direction as to its correct title.
This thread starts with a media rumour. So far so good. The next post attaches a value to it, and we are into positive - negative territory. If he hadn't used the word 'good' then he would have been slated by all those who think/believe/quantify signing a contract as the second coming. Lighthouse points out the folly of such beliefs, and so, in the real world, signing a piece of paper is not really of much consequence but it will make some people sleep better in their beds so it seems.
The thread then gets into reasons for delay - if there is a delay because I haven't seen anywhere the writing saying SJ will sign when the window closes apart from on here - and then we get into the territory of what 'may' happen if our unpromising start (which we all expected) goes on much longer. Well WW3 could break out or the planet could be hit by a large satellite rock which was missed by the not so accurate devices used to track them or Fulham could stick three goals past each of the next five opponents without reply. The Khans could sell FFC in a fit of pique in response to the FA saying they ain't selling Wembley. SJ could resign, be sacked, or retire, hell could freeze over, and pigs may get wings.
My personal view is that SJ is an excellent coach, a true professional, will do an excellent job wherever he goes, and it has been a privilege to have watched his teams play. If he wants to stay but doesn't feel like signing a contract just now then that's okay by me. If FFC want to sack him or if he wants to leave I'll be sad, very interested in the reasons, and rather tense and nervous about how FFC go about replacing him. But life will go on and it will not be the end of the world as we know it. Nothing positive or negative about any of it - just experience.
Quote from: toshes mate on August 22, 2018, 10:28:14 PM
I really get tired of the positivity/negativity argument since one cannot exist without the other. When you call a spade a spade you are simply describing an object with its correct name. Of course, you may describing a fork as a spade and hopefully someone will point you in the right direction as to its correct title.
This thread starts with a media rumour. So far so good. The next post attaches a value to it, and we are into positive - negative territory. If he hadn't used the word 'good' then he would have been slated by all those who think/believe/quantify signing a contract as the second coming. Lighthouse points out the folly of such beliefs, and so, in the real world, signing a piece of paper is not really of much consequence but it will make some people sleep better in their beds so it seems.
The thread then gets into reasons for delay - if there is a delay because I haven't seen anywhere the writing saying SJ will sign when the window closes apart from on here - and then we get into the territory of what 'may' happen if our unpromising start (which we all expected) goes on much longer. Well WW3 could break out or the planet could be hit by a large satellite rock which was missed by the not so accurate devices used to track them or Fulham could stick three goals past each of the next five opponents without reply. The Khans could sell FFC in a fit of pique in response to the FA saying they ain't selling Wembley. SJ could resign, be sacked, or retire, hell could freeze over, and pigs may get wings.
My personal view is that SJ is an excellent coach, a true professional, will do an excellent job wherever he goes, and it has been a privilege to have watched his teams play. If he wants to stay but doesn't feel like signing a contract just now then that's okay by me. If FFC want to sack him or if he wants to leave I'll be sad, very interested in the reasons, and rather tense and nervous about how FFC go about replacing him. But life will go on and it will not be the end of the world as we know it. Nothing positive or negative about any of it - just experience.
Excellent post and the start of this debate you quoted was a media rumour. Well I know what I think of media rumours. NOT A LOT !
Can't quite believe some of the things I'm reading! Slav is THE most important person at the club (playing or coaching staff) right now. You only need to look at Malone, Aluko, Fredricks (so far...) and anyone else who has left under his tenure, to see how his system and coaching makes players appear better than they are and the team more than the sum of its parts.
To even talk about replacing/reviewing at Christmas is ludicrous and disrespectful. He should be given a contract for as long a term as he desires.
Blimey.
(PS. we are going to win on Sunday and all this nonsense will be forgotten and left behind. Feel free to come and buy me a pint at the Lion after whilst I tell you 'I told you so').
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 12:04:19 PM
Feel free to come and buy me a pint at the Lion after whilst I tell you 'I told you so').
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Genitalmen, it was only 3 months ago we were all in that White Wall at Wembley doing handstands and cartwheels all the way down Wembley Way to The Torch Pub rejoicing and celebrating for me our greatest day. With all the Double Decker Buses in the car park full of Fulham Supporters who were delirious. I saw grown men crying with joy.
One bloke came up to me and said this victory felt better than sex, every man to his own trade I suppose, but it probably did.
Since that remarkable and never to be forgotten day, the club have spent in excess of £100,000 English Pounds. To support Slavisa, that is a statement of intent.
He will embrace that as we all should, and be doubly patient, everyone is on the same side
here.
Please remember we are now back on the Premier League. How many of us thought we would see that happen again, as well as not only going back to Wembley and come away victorious, nobody can take that away from us ever.
So I am just grateful we are in the Premier League, but also quietly confident we are here to stay for the long haul, because we have the Manager and the players, and the club is behind them.
So it's onwards and upwards.
Please remember, it's not how tall you are, it's how high you jump.
Thank you and Goodnight
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 23, 2018, 12:27:56 PM
One bloke came up to me and said it felt better than sex, every man to his own trade I suppose, but it probably did.
why on earth would a bloke walk up to someone and say anything feels better than sex.
Quote from: LRCN on August 23, 2018, 12:29:06 PM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 23, 2018, 12:27:56 PM
One bloke came up to me and said it felt better than sex, every man to his own trade I suppose, but it probably did.
why on earth would a bloke walk up to someone and say anything feels better than sex.
He was well oiled and I sent him off to visit a Ms Fifi Pink, 69, Greek Street, Soho, Basement Flat, knock three times and ask for Bubbles.
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 12:04:19 PM
(PS. we are going to win on Sunday and all this nonsense will be forgotten and left behind. Feel free to come and buy me a pint at the Lion after whilst I tell you 'I told you so').
Is there a single poster on this thread who's said they don't think we'll win on Sunday?
Maybe we can all just come to the lion, stand in a circle and say 'i told you so' to the person to our left
Quote from: Statto on August 23, 2018, 01:00:36 PM
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 12:04:19 PM
(PS. we are going to win on Sunday and all this nonsense will be forgotten and left behind. Feel free to come and buy me a pint at the Lion after whilst I tell you 'I told you so').
Is there a single poster on this thread who's said they don't think we'll win on Sunday?
Maybe we can all just come to the lion, stand in a circle and say 'i told you so' to the person to our left
That's neither here nor there, as this is about the wider issue of people saying, like you did yourself, that it 'makes sense for all parties to delay'. As if he hasn't earned the right to see out the season (and next). This short term-ism and nonsense really boils my head. And is of detriment to the club longer term. The guy has an entirely new squad, a squad that have never played in the premier league (either through being lower level and taking us up or being recent signings from abroad) AND has had most of his first choice backline out and hence we've played two games, against good quality opposition, with a back 4 who have barely even met let alone trained together.
So no, in that instance, I don't think you would be justified to join in with (obviously flippant and putting a positive spin on things) the quote of 'I told you so'.
We could lose 5-0 on a Sunday and my viewpoint and points made previously will still stand. I wonder if those who have sat on the fence or not backed him will keep their viewpoint (or, more likely, forget they ever said it) when we are playing teams of the park and making a push for top 10 in the second half of the season?
Still, we're all whites so less not get into petty arguments amongst each other. We're not Brentford (and, thank f*** we're not QPR either!) x
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 02:10:31 PM
Quote from: Statto on August 23, 2018, 01:00:36 PM
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 12:04:19 PM
(PS. we are going to win on Sunday and all this nonsense will be forgotten and left behind. Feel free to come and buy me a pint at the Lion after whilst I tell you 'I told you so').
Is there a single poster on this thread who's said they don't think we'll win on Sunday?
Maybe we can all just come to the lion, stand in a circle and say 'i told you so' to the person to our left
That's neither here nor there, as this is about the wider issue of people saying, like you did yourself, that it 'makes sense for all parties to delay'. As if he hasn't earned the right to see out the season (and next). This short term-ism and nonsense really boils my head. And is of detriment to the club longer term. The guy has an entirely new squad, a squad that have never played in the premier league (either through being lower level and taking us up or being recent signings from abroad) AND has had most of his first choice backline out and hence we've played two games, against good quality opposition, with a back 4 who have barely even met let alone trained together.
So no, in that instance, I don't think you would be justified to join in with (obviously flippant and putting a positive spin on things) the quote of 'I told you so'.
We could lose 5-0 on a Sunday and my viewpoint and points made previously will still stand. I wonder if those who have sat on the fence or not backed him will keep their viewpoint (or, more likely, forget they ever said it) when we are playing teams of the park and making a push for top 10 in the second half of the season?
Still, we're all whites so less not get into petty arguments amongst each other. We're not Brentford (and, thank f*** we're not QPR either!) x
Sorry mate but I've still no idea whether/why I can/can't say "i told you so" if we win on Sunday considering we both, like everyone on this thread, seem to think a Fulham win is the most likely outcome... you've totally lost me there
But one thing at least we can clearly agree to disagree on is whether any manager has "the right to see out the season (and next)". I've been clear above that I don't feel strongly that he should necessarily be sacked even after five defeats (although a few low-foreheads on this thread seem to have had trouble with that part) but one thing I will stick my neck out and say is I definitely don't think he should be keeping his job if we lose all 38 games this season and another 46 games next season. That seems ridiculous to me. But you're entitled to your opinion of course.
Quote from: Statto on August 23, 2018, 02:38:42 PM
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 02:10:31 PM
Quote from: Statto on August 23, 2018, 01:00:36 PM
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 12:04:19 PM
(PS. we are going to win on Sunday and all this nonsense will be forgotten and left behind. Feel free to come and buy me a pint at the Lion after whilst I tell you 'I told you so').
Is there a single poster on this thread who's said they don't think we'll win on Sunday?
Maybe we can all just come to the lion, stand in a circle and say 'i told you so' to the person to our left
That's neither here nor there, as this is about the wider issue of people saying, like you did yourself, that it 'makes sense for all parties to delay'. As if he hasn't earned the right to see out the season (and next). This short term-ism and nonsense really boils my head. And is of detriment to the club longer term. The guy has an entirely new squad, a squad that have never played in the premier league (either through being lower level and taking us up or being recent signings from abroad) AND has had most of his first choice backline out and hence we've played two games, against good quality opposition, with a back 4 who have barely even met let alone trained together.
So no, in that instance, I don't think you would be justified to join in with (obviously flippant and putting a positive spin on things) the quote of 'I told you so'.
We could lose 5-0 on a Sunday and my viewpoint and points made previously will still stand. I wonder if those who have sat on the fence or not backed him will keep their viewpoint (or, more likely, forget they ever said it) when we are playing teams of the park and making a push for top 10 in the second half of the season?
Still, we're all whites so less not get into petty arguments amongst each other. We're not Brentford (and, thank f*** we're not QPR either!) x
Sorry mate but I've still no idea whether/why I can/can't say "i told you so" if we win on Sunday considering we both, like everyone on this thread, seem to think a Fulham win is the most likely outcome... you've totally lost me there
But one thing at least we can clearly agree to disagree on is whether any manager has "the right to see out the season (and next)". I've been clear above that I don't feel strongly that he should necessarily be sacked even after five defeats (although a few low-foreheads on this thread seem to have had trouble with that part) but one thing I will stick my neck out and say is I definitely don't think he should be keeping his job if we lose all 38 games this season and another 46 games next season. That seems ridiculous to me. But you're entitled to your opinion of course.
That's not what I said either... I think we are not actually that fair away then in viewpoint, just the amount of time and so on.
The 'I told you so' will be more about Slav being the best man for the job and this season being an enjoyable one and a great success (in relative terms - people and JCLs will have to get used to not winning every week). Starting on Sunday (and more so when Mawson and Ream are back and the midfield has had time to gel together and get used to the pace of the league - Cairney included).
I just get annoyed as a rival fan looking at this forum would see us as absolute clowns.
It reminds me of Jan where, looking back at my posts there, I defended him speaking out against the owners/putting pressure/playing politics to get the signings we all knew we needed. He was getting abuse on here for, essentially, putting his own neck on the line, to get what is right for the club. What happened next? Oh, the pressure meant the board signed Mitro and Targett and we all know what happened next... So quite a few numpties were very wrong there. The same will happen here.
It really does help if people read the whole thread instead of snippets. Our Coach has been allegedly offered a contract and has decided allegedly to wait to sign it. The fact is players who got us promotion will be replaced by better players if our Coach thinks they are no longer up to it. Our owner will move for another Coach if he thinks another coach could do better. No player or Coach is in a position where he can fail and live off the past. But everybody is happy to get on with the job before signing contracts that will impact on Joka and his family who still live abroad.
No fan has said sack him. But it is simply not correct to suggest the club should give him a life time achievement award if we nose dive. Which I am sure we wont.
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 03:44:41 PM
I think we are not actually that fair away then in viewpoint, just the amount of time and so on.
I agree. I was being a little facetious in my last post.
Lighthouse's post above perfectly sums up my concern about this thread.
Quote from: Statto on August 22, 2018, 04:27:23 PM
Quote from: FulhamStu on August 22, 2018, 03:39:03 PM
I find many posts on here quite odd. Bringing in 80% a new team, playing well for significant periods v very good teams then after another few games sack the manager if the results are not good is absolute madness of the highest order. It's the perfect way to totally ruin the club, not strengthen it. Nearly everyone agrees the one thing we need is to give Slav and the team time, how the heck is firing him and most of,the first team coaching staff who have been massively successful for the club over the past 2 or 3 seasons going to help anything. Some of the posts on here are the sort of thing I would expect on TIFF, from the wum and odd posters it attracts but not generally on here.
The Khans are not idiots.
Show me all the other PL clubs who have left a manager in charge after starting the season with 5 defeats.
Obvious comparison is de boer last season sacked by palace after 5 games.
it will hopefully never become an issue for us but I can guarantee if he lost the next 3 games, 80% of fans would forget last season and want him out, and so would 90% of chairmen.
if you think otherwise you are very naïve and ignoring the history/facts of these scenarios.
As I said earlier, de Boer is a completely different scenario. He was new to England and new to Palace. Slav has been with the club for 2 and a half seasons, and will be better placed than anybody else coming in after 5 straight defeats (imo, given what I have seen and know about him) to eventually turn things round.
This season is going to start slowly, no matter what you would like to happen. or feel should happen, and after last season, we have to show patience, otherwise we will end up back to square one anyway.
Quote from: Lighthouse on August 23, 2018, 03:59:28 PM
No fan has said sack him. But it is simply not correct to suggest the club should give him a life time achievement award if we nose dive. Which I am sure we wont.
You're right, no fan as said 'sack him'. No fan has said the other bit either ;)
I don't think his future should be debated in December (given the massive upheaval, injuries and late arrivals) and, thankfully, I think the owners are of the same mind set as me (hence backing him with a tidy sum of cash). What anyone other than them thinks is largely irrelevant.
I'm stepping out now.
Contracts in football aren't worth the paper they are written on.
Unless you are the person moving on before the contract ends, in which case they can be quite valuable!
Still, if he signed then psychologically it would feel like ambition on the club's part, and commitment on Slav's part.
Quote from: ByTheRiver on August 23, 2018, 04:32:10 PM
thankfully, I think the owners are of the same mind set as me (hence backing him with a tidy sum of cash)
and yet they evidently haven't offered him an extension (or at least, not on terms he considers attractive enough to accept).
so i would strongly query whether the owners are indeed of the same mindset as you
The reason Jokanovic is not signing an improved contract right now can only be that he is mindful it would make a move to a big club easier should one come calling within the next year.
If however we are sitting adrift at the bottom of the table at Christmas we may wish to switch to solid no frills football produced by Roy or Allardyce instead of the pretty , pretty stuff if this is not accompanied with points. A change of manager to fight relegation may then seem attractive to us.
Contracts clubs,managers when it suits part company full stop .
Quote from: hovewhite on August 24, 2018, 03:50:30 PM
Contracts clubs,managers when it suits part company full stop .
[/quote
Yes, but it is easier and less expensive for both parties if the contact has run out or almost run out.
Quote from: filham on August 24, 2018, 06:23:05 PM
Yes, but it is easier and less expensive for both parties if the contact has run out or almost run out.
This presupposes that no one else wants to employ our great leader, which by all accounts is not the case.
As with Fredricks - he can walk for nothing if they let his contract run down as opposed to getting compensation if another club wants to steal him from us
The problem is that apart from SJ's comment about it being a matter for his agent, neither he nor the club have said anything regarding the negotiation or even if there have been any.
Given that we have optional extensions for most of our players now it would seem odd if the club were not trying to protect one of their valuable assets
