Seems like we may have got some goodish players.
Unfortunately TK, the cluless one, didn't spot we more desparately need a bunch of defenders, we will not outscre teams and we are very unbalanced, that is very bad.
I do not know these new players so cannot make a proper value judgement but i am guessing my previous prediction of bottom 8 is more likely than less as a result of not getting a proper defence. I still think scott will be blamed and replaced in november if things do not go well. I had really hoped we might just get a proper right back and a way better left back.
The issue with Parker has not been his control of the defence, but the lack of goals.
If he can't find a system that works with Mitro, Reid, Cavaleiro, Knockaert, Kamara, Ayite and more, he'll deserve the sack.
But we haven't had decent defenders even in our promotion year. TK can't buy a decent defender. However by all means continue to point out the obvious all the time but also remember to enjoy the game once in a while. It is frustrating but we need to start enjoying following the club again. Good or bad.
Quote from: Facts Not Fiction on August 08, 2019, 10:08:45 PM
The issue with Parker has not been his control of the defence, but the lack of goals.
If he can't find a system that works with Mitro, Reid, Cavaleiro, Knockaert, Kamara, Ayite and more, he'll deserve the sack.
there are two issues. one as you say we are not looking potent and one has to wonder if it is the system not suiting.
But we have such a poor defence and so far the supply line to the front men is poor too so we shall see. In the end the squad once again IMO is far from right and that is not scott's fault the man that needs replacing is TK he is shooting us in the foot.
There aren't really any great defenders out there. We're fortunate just to have Mawson.
Only six teams (Leeds, Middlesbrough, WBA, Huddersfield, Stoke and Fulham) have three or more £3m+ defenders, the rest of the teams didn't acquire a defence on the transfer market and relying on passion to keep clean sheets. And, we have five £3m+ defenders which is one more than Huddersfield and Stoke; two more than Leeds, Middlesbough and WBA; plus three more than everyone else.
Interesting that you pin it all on Tk . He gets blamed for the signings that we dont bring in ,but never any credit for the ones we actually do sign. They are either down to someone else or just good fortune !!
Quote from: colinwhite on August 09, 2019, 05:39:06 AM
Interesting that you pin it all on Tk . He gets blamed for the signings that we dont bring in ,but never any credit for the ones we actually do sign. They are either down to someone else or just good fortune !!
Spot on unfortunately thr TK haters wear blinkers
Let's be clear I don't hate TK. I have never met him and am unlikely to. This does not stop me or others being objective and critical of his performance. His transfer record is patchy at best. Of course he has brought in some good signings although the jury is out until we see this latest batch perform in our team. But surely nobody can deny that there are a high number of glaringly obvious expensive failures, particularly in the most recent few windows. Currently in the squad, being paid are Fabri, Fonte, Cisse and Djalo. Some £20m of fees for players that don't appear to be in this Manager's or previous managers plans. A handful of first team appearances between them. We have got until the end of the month to move them on overseas. To those four can be added the string of expensive failures from last season that we are still paying for in some instances. Totalling up the cost of his failures is eyewateringly painful and without doubt in my view most other people in his role would have been sacked. There is only one reason why he retains his position and that in my view is the biggest stain on SKs tenureship of our club.
Quote from: KJS on August 09, 2019, 05:41:45 AM
Quote from: colinwhite on August 09, 2019, 05:39:06 AM
Interesting that you pin it all on Tk . He gets blamed for the signings that we dont bring in ,but never any credit for the ones we actually do sign. They are either down to someone else or just good fortune !!
Spot on unfortunately thr TK haters wear blinkers
I think this team is better than the 2nd half of 17/18, because we have Knockaert at RW and Bobby Reid is backup AM (instead of Norwood) and backup CF (instead of Fonte), plus we have Mawson at CB for some of the season. Fredricks is a loss but he he only delivered seven assists and Christie will probably give four assists.
Rational criticism is fine with me ,its the constant blaming and superior attitude of some posters who think they know it all, that gets on my wick !!
Quote from: colinwhite on August 09, 2019, 06:14:22 AM
Rational criticism is fine with me ,its the constant blaming and superior attitude of some posters who think they know it all, that gets on my wick !!
I would agree with you on that. There are a number who appear to know it all. I just skip over their comments
Quote from: SG on August 09, 2019, 06:04:13 AM
Let's be clear I don't hate TK. I have never met him and am unlikely to. This does not stop me or others being objective and critical of his performance. His transfer record is patchy at best. Of course he has brought in some good signings although the jury is out until we see this latest batch perform in our team. But surely nobody can deny that there are a high number of glaringly obvious expensive failures, particularly in the most recent few windows. Currently in the squad, being paid are Fabri, Fonte, Cisse and Djalo. Some £20m of fees for players that don't appear to be in this Manager's or previous managers plans. A handful of first team appearances between them. We have got until the end of the month to move them on overseas. To those four can be added the string of expensive failures from last season that we are still paying for in some instances. Totalling up the cost of his failures is eyewateringly painful and without doubt in my view most other people in his role would have been sacked. There is only one reason why he retains his position and that in my view is the biggest stain on SKs tenureship of our club.
The trouble is the TK haters only criticize him and don't give him credit for the work he and his team did in our promotion season
Adding another point, all our signings have come from the PL or the Championship, and all have at least 50 games experience at this level.
Add that to the fact that all our loans have options, Tony Khan has learnt his lesson from precious windows.
Quote from: KJS on August 09, 2019, 06:31:11 AM
Quote from: SG on August 09, 2019, 06:04:13 AM
Let's be clear I don't hate TK. I have never met him and am unlikely to. This does not stop me or others being objective and critical of his performance. His transfer record is patchy at best. Of course he has brought in some good signings although the jury is out until we see this latest batch perform in our team. But surely nobody can deny that there are a high number of glaringly obvious expensive failures, particularly in the most recent few windows. Currently in the squad, being paid are Fabri, Fonte, Cisse and Djalo. Some £20m of fees for players that don't appear to be in this Manager's or previous managers plans. A handful of first team appearances between them. We have got until the end of the month to move them on overseas. To those four can be added the string of expensive failures from last season that we are still paying for in some instances. Totalling up the cost of his failures is eyewateringly painful and without doubt in my view most other people in his role would have been sacked. There is only one reason why he retains his position and that in my view is the biggest stain on SKs tenureship of our club.
The trouble is the TK haters only criticize him and don't give him credit for the work he and his team did in our promotion season
Any good work in that season was undone the following season with our spectacularly awful relegation. Let's hope that these new signings click and we see a repeat of the promotion season
Quote from: SG on August 09, 2019, 06:41:30 AM
Quote from: KJS on August 09, 2019, 06:31:11 AM
Quote from: SG on August 09, 2019, 06:04:13 AM
Let's be clear I don't hate TK. I have never met him and am unlikely to. This does not stop me or others being objective and critical of his performance. His transfer record is patchy at best. Of course he has brought in some good signings although the jury is out until we see this latest batch perform in our team. But surely nobody can deny that there are a high number of glaringly obvious expensive failures, particularly in the most recent few windows. Currently in the squad, being paid are Fabri, Fonte, Cisse and Djalo. Some £20m of fees for players that don't appear to be in this Manager's or previous managers plans. A handful of first team appearances between them. We have got until the end of the month to move them on overseas. To those four can be added the string of expensive failures from last season that we are still paying for in some instances. Totalling up the cost of his failures is eyewateringly painful and without doubt in my view most other people in his role would have been sacked. There is only one reason why he retains his position and that in my view is the biggest stain on SKs tenureship of our club.
The trouble is the TK haters only criticize him and don't give him credit for the work he and his team did in our promotion season
Any good work in that season was undone the following season with our spectacularly awful relegation. Let's hope that these new signings click and we see a repeat of the promotion season
The good work of the promotion season even after relegation has allowed us to extended contracts, buy new players and justifiy upgrading our stadium. Norwich have got promoted and will get relegated but they will be better off even after relegation.
Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 09, 2019, 05:05:57 AM
Only six teams (Leeds, Middlesbrough, WBA, Huddersfield, Stoke and Fulham) have three or more £3m+ defenders, the rest of the teams didn't acquire a defence on the transfer market and relying on passion to keep clean sheets. And, we have five £3m+ defenders which is one more than Huddersfield and Stoke; two more than Leeds, Middlesbough and WBA; plus three more than everyone else.
and we still cannot keep a clean sheet, or pass to our own players in defensive areas.
Quote from: colinwhite on August 09, 2019, 05:39:06 AM
Interesting that you pin it all on Tk . He gets blamed for the signings that we dont bring in ,but never any credit for the ones we actually do sign. They are either down to someone else or just good fortune !!
This!
Quote from: colinwhite on August 09, 2019, 06:14:22 AM
Rational criticism is fine with me ,its the constant blaming and superior attitude of some posters who think they know it all, that gets on my wick !!
I don't think I know it all but I do think I, and for that matter you, and most on this forum, could do a much better job than TK and possibly even AM (in relation to transfers)
TK is in the job,he's not going to go anywhere else anytime soon so we have to accept it!
No excuse for no defensive signings. Parker said he expected some so we know he felt the need to strengthen. We then saw how Odoi and CC did at right back against mighty Barnsley and MLM at CB in case some were saying we'll be fine at a lower level.
Pretty clear Tone/Ally screwed it up and then leaked the Levy Sess stuff to deflect attention and culpability.
Quote from: WayneKerrins on August 09, 2019, 09:02:25 AM
No excuse for no defensive signings. Parker said he expected some so we know he felt the need to strengthen. We then saw how Odoi and CC did at right back against mighty Barnsley and MLM at CB in case some were saying we'll be fine at a lower level.
Pretty clear Tone/Ally screwed it up and then leaked the Levy Sess stuff to deflect attention and culpability.
Yep, that's how I see it. Can't get my head around yet another window where our no.1 required position isn't addressed again.
Quote from: SG on August 09, 2019, 06:04:13 AM
Let's be clear I don't hate TK. I have never met him and am unlikely to. This does not stop me or others being objective and critical of his performance. His transfer record is patchy at best. Of course he has brought in some good signings although the jury is out until we see this latest batch perform in our team. But surely nobody can deny that there are a high number of glaringly obvious expensive failures, particularly in the most recent few windows. Currently in the squad, being paid are Fabri, Fonte, Cisse and Djalo. Some £20m of fees for players that don't appear to be in this Manager's or previous managers plans. A handful of first team appearances between them. We have got until the end of the month to move them on overseas. To those four can be added the string of expensive failures from last season that we are still paying for in some instances. Totalling up the cost of his failures is eyewateringly painful and without doubt in my view most other people in his role would have been sacked. There is only one reason why he retains his position and that in my view is the biggest stain on SKs tenureship of our club.
The perfect description of the problem which also suggests the solution.
I liken our recruitment team to a blindfold game of sticking the donkey's tail where it belongs except in this case the DoF doesn't need a blindfold to make it difficult.
Quote from: KJS on August 09, 2019, 05:41:45 AM
Quote from: colinwhite on August 09, 2019, 05:39:06 AM
Interesting that you pin it all on Tk . He gets blamed for the signings that we dont bring in ,but never any credit for the ones we actually do sign. They are either down to someone else or just good fortune !!
Spot on unfortunately thr TK haters wear blinkers
I'll give him all the credit for the good signings, but then I say to myself - wait, if he's able to bring in players like Bobby Reid, Knockaert, Cavaleiro who are arguably some of the best attackers in the league, then it's not his inability to bring in and attract top players.. so if it's not his inability to bring in the top players, then why hasn't he brought in top defenders too? It's been our core weakness for almost a decade now... We now go into the season, with the transfer window closed (unless we sign a few more players today on delayed deal sheets), with only SIX recognised defenders. That's asking for trouble in this league - especially as one of them is a sick note, one of them did poorly against a team just promoted to be substituted off last match and we only have two full backs, with an additional makeshift one.
We are ridiculously low on defensive options.
Quote from: Statto on August 09, 2019, 08:03:57 AM
Quote from: colinwhite on August 09, 2019, 06:14:22 AM
Rational criticism is fine with me ,its the constant blaming and superior attitude of some posters who think they know it all, that gets on my wick !!
I don't think I know it all but I do think I, and for that matter you, and most on this forum, could do a much better job than TK and possibly even AM (in relation to transfers)
My dear old chap. Having you as DoF would be no different, you have no experience of the job. Could you handle the flak no matter what you did?
Quote from: General on August 09, 2019, 09:22:25 AM
Quote from: KJS on August 09, 2019, 05:41:45 AM
Quote from: colinwhite on August 09, 2019, 05:39:06 AM
Interesting that you pin it all on Tk . He gets blamed for the signings that we dont bring in ,but never any credit for the ones we actually do sign. They are either down to someone else or just good fortune !!
Spot on unfortunately thr TK haters wear blinkers
I'll give him all the credit for the good signings, but then I say to myself - wait, if he's able to bring in players like Bobby Reid, Knockaert, Cavaleiro who are arguably some of the best attackers in the league, then it's not his inability to bring in and attract top players.. so if it's not his inability to bring in the top players, then why hasn't he brought in top defenders too? It's been our core weakness for almost a decade now... We now go into the season, with the transfer window closed (unless we sign a few more players today on delayed deal sheets), with only SIX recognised defenders. That's asking for trouble in this league - especially as one of them is a sick note, one of them did poorly against a team just promoted to be substituted off last match and we only have two full backs, with an additional makeshift one.
We are ridiculously low on defensive options.
If the best argument you can give for suggesting TK only gets criticism and none of the praise, you're completely lacking perspective of the fan base. He was absolutely lauded for his EPL transfer window, suggesting it was the best in our history, what a fantastic job he did and how amazing it all was (i was wrapped up in thus furore too). It then went south as a lot of the signings and managerial changes didn't work out, hence the criticism.
Now lets go further back, when we got promoted, he was again lauded for his fantastic signings of Targett and Mitrovic, i'll grant a vocal minority to this day still claim it was nothing to do with him and all to do with Slav, but I'll disregard that as its nonsense. Slav helped but TK has spoken openly about his positive role in it and his positive role in getting Mitro to sign up again for this season.
Long and short, lets not belittle debate with the tripe that TK can do no right and only gets criticism. It adds nothing to debate and is demonstrably false.
