For me, given what we have seen so from Arter and then on Saturday from Reed, it's got to be:
Cairney
Arter Reed
Prior to Saturday, I had thought this should be the starting midfield for difficult aways, but Reed can certainly pass the ball as well as being a mobile destroyer. Arter is also very able on the ball and has played slightly further forward previously. Together they would make a very strong and mobile base, giving Cairney the freedom he needs/seems to perform best in, without necessarily taking away creativity either.
That leaves Stef Jo as the first call from the bench every week around 65/70 mins, to freshen things up/give a bit of energy when needed.
I think that is the strongest CM combination in the league and cannot think of a single argument as to why we would deviate from that (other than to rotate in busy weeks/injuries/Arter suspensions... etc).
Thoughts?
Think Artur will get a lot of match bans!! So Steph will get game time.
I believe there is not necessarily much between Arter, Reed and Johansen. And we also have capable players such as Kmac, Reid and possibly Onomah and O'Riley (haven't really seen them much at all). This is a good thing in a long season as you either play well or risk losing your spot. For me only Cairney is an almost certain starter (unless a huge dip in form). I agree that this is most likely the strongest midfield in the division both in terms of quality and in numbers.
A
Quote from: hovewhite on September 18, 2019, 04:17:59 PM
Think Artur will get a lot of match bans!! So Steph will get game time.
Agreed!
I went to put 'suspensions' in my original post but changed it to 'Arter suspensions' for exactly that reason!
Must admit, like with Johansen, I quite like that we now have a couple of players prepared to mix it and employ a bit of the dark arts occasionally...
Quote from: Sting of the North on September 18, 2019, 04:23:36 PM
I believe there is not necessarily much between Arter, Reed and Johansen. And we also have capable players such as Kmac, Reid and possibly Onomah and O'Riley (haven't really seen them much at all). This is a good thing in a long season as you either play well or risk losing your spot. For me only Cairney is an almost certain starter (unless a huge dip in form). I agree that this is most likely the strongest midfield in the division both in terms of quality and in numbers.
Whilst I agree and obviously rotation in this long (and often brutal) league is necessary, I meant more in an 'everyone is fit, no one is knackered from midweek, must win game' kind of way.
I don't think K-Mac is quite at the level of the others anymore (sadly, I bloody love him), I'd have Arter and Reed (on recent evidence) just above Johansen (though it is close) and the others still have a bit to prove to even be considered at K-Mac/SJ's level yet.
But yeah, first choice three - best in league. Overall 6/7 - also best in league. Good times (in theory...)!
This lad Reed looks a find. Let's not forget he's not a novice. Bit of a Sidwell who I always thought did a great job for us.
KMac will be ever present on bench - great cover in mid field and of course in defence.
Quote from: ByTheRiver on September 18, 2019, 04:35:45 PM
AQuote from: hovewhite on September 18, 2019, 04:17:59 PM
Think Artur will get a lot of match bans!! So Steph will get game time.
Agreed!
He certainly did that for the Baggies last season - a little too robust on occasion
I went to put 'suspensions' in my original post but changed it to 'Arter suspensions' for exactly that reason!
Must admit, like with Johansen, I quite like that we now have a couple of players prepared to mix it and employ a bit of the dark arts occasionally...
The two PL MD recruits have shown their quality so far.
They have also shown more commitment than captain Cairney who seems reluctant to tackle when he needs to.
Agree with those 3.
I think Cairney is working harder this season tbh.
But those two with him I think it's strong and there is Stefjo as backup.
Coyw
Not all players have the same playing style. I also can't remember seeing anything from Cairney indicating that he lacks commitment this season, quite the contrary actually as I think he has seemingly worked harder than what we're used to from him. But at the other hand, based on many threads on here, I am starting to believe that I am watching another imaginary team so maybe I know nothing.
The most important midfielder in a 4-3-3 with single pivot is the holding midfielder and it's very physically demanding especially in 270 minute game week. Harrison Reed looked great for 60 minutes last game and then looked average. Harry Arter missed the Ireland game for an operation so is probably not at peak condition. I would be starting with Reed and subbibg Arter on around 55 minutes (either for Reed if we are behind or for Johasen/Reid if we are ahead). Reed did enough to start ahead of Arter in holding midfield, but I would still keep Arter training as the holding midfielder too.
Reed a poor mans Arter. Great back up, but Arter is better.
I thought D Read gave us some much needed thrust and goal threat from midfield.
Definitely more direct with D Read than StefJo and that's been a theme under Parker.
So:
D Read - Arter - Cairney
Starting: Reed, Johasen & Cairney (bench Arter & Reid)
After 65 mins
0-0: Arter, Cairney & Reid (Reed & Johasen off)
1-0 up: Reed, Arter & Cairney (Johasen off)
0-1 down: Reed, Cairney & Reid (Johasen off)
2-0 up: Reed, Arter & Reid (Johasen & Cairney off)
1-1 draw: Arter, Cairney & Reid (Reed & Johasen off)
0-2 down: Arter, Cairney & Reid (Reed & Johasen off)
Recent results have not been good and we now have options in midfield this is the right moment for a change.
Lets try Arter and Reed with Cairney in the more attacking role. Whichever one is looking tired after an hour to be replaced with Johansen.
Johansen key in midfield for me. Gives 100% and excellent at stopping counter attacks by 'accidentally' catching opposition players...
Quote from: The Rational Fan on September 20, 2019, 04:19:50 AM
Starting: Reed, Johasen & Cairney (bench Arter & Reid)
After 65 mins
0-0: Arter, Cairney & Reid (Reed & Johasen off)
1-0 up: Reed, Arter & Cairney (Johasen off)
0-1 down: Reed, Cairney & Reid (Johasen off)
2-0 up: Reed, Arter & Reid (Johasen & Cairney off)
1-1 draw: Arter, Cairney & Reid (Reed & Johasen off)
0-2 down: Arter, Cairney & Reid (Reed & Johasen off)
What would you do if Cairney got injured in the 15th minute and we were already 0 2 down, and Tom had to be replaced. The reason why I ask that, is because you never know what may happen between now and the end of the match, and players may play well or poorly. Talking about being tired is one of the many bad habits that has infiltrated our shores from abroad. How can anyone be tired, they are athletes, they train every day, and are indulged and pampered and conditioned until the cows come home.
They are asked to play for 90 mins, not a lot to ask, and if fatigue does set in, any sportsman will tell the adrenaline keeps you going and gets you over the line. Unless a player is having a shocker or is badly injured he won't want to come off.
They are not Robots designed only to last a certain amount of time. So tiredness is a nonsense and to talk about it has a detrimental effect.
In his final year, Tigana often use to talk about tiredness and resting players, and he nearly got us relegated.
Quote from: Sting of the North on September 18, 2019, 11:21:10 PM
Not all players have the same playing style. I also can't remember seeing anything from Cairney indicating that he lacks commitment this season, quite the contrary actually as I think he has seemingly worked harder than what we're used to from him. But at the other hand, based on many threads on here, I am starting to believe that I am watching another imaginary team so maybe I know nothing.
Agree with the comments on Cairney. I think he is putting in a shift, and making tackles / interceptions when he can. I'm sure I saw him win a header the other week as well.
TC is more involved all round now.
