I know this has been discussed many times before but now seems a good time to go over this again.
We will have the New Riverside in a coupe of years and this will be clearly a high end place for fans who can either afford it or like myself, to maybe seat on special occasions like birthdays etc. There will be a lot of corporate and it is clearly seen as a money earner, no problem with that.
For many years now, the Hammersmith end has been the home end and the Putney end the away. The Johnny Haynes has been a traditional place for long standing fans and the previous enclosure a place for some of the more hard core long standing fans.
I have experienced the safe standing at Shrewsbury, it's behind the goal and sited for the back third of the stand. Whilst this stand is for home fans, away having the whole away stand behind the other goal, the singers and more passionate fans stand next to the away fans at one end of the stand alongside the pitch. Previously the home end was dead, now however with the safe standing there is a hugely improved atmosphere and strong home support both behind the goal and still next to away fans as explained above.
If we moved the away fans to somewhere else, we could install safe standing in the Putney end, potentially across the back third and encourage the younger more focal fans there with reduced prices for under 21's etc. This would create excellent home support behind both goals and given that the noise carries much better from the Putney end home support much louder on tv and onto the pitch.
The issue is where to put away fans, we could put them in the Riverside corner of the Hammersmith end, or what about at the Hammersmith end of the Johnny Haynes ? I know all solutions present their own problem, however we should be most concerned with making Fulham a more formidable ground for away teams and not be too worries about endulging their fans.
Can the away fans remain where they are?
I can't remember the exact detail but isn't there an entrance and exit with the new riverside walk in the corner of the ground near the Putney/river corner? If that entrance can be used then could we not have home fans where the away fans are now and the away fans come and go as they do now past the Cottage? Just a thought.
Quote from: SuffolkWhite on April 29, 2020, 08:41:47 AM
Can the away fans remain where they are?
I can't remember the exact detail but isn't there an entrance and exit with the new riverside walk in the corner of the ground near the Putney/river corner? If that entrance can be used then could we not have home fans where the away fans are now and the away fans come and go as they do now past the Cottage? Just a thought.
Yes, quite possibly, esp if players changing rooms are in the Riverside, not sure it would be a good idea for players to come onto the pitch next to away fans. But as I said, every permutation presents some kind of problem. I think a Putney end rammed full with passionate Fulham fans would be the best way to improve the atmosphere.
I thought someone said on here previously the changing rooms will remain in the Cottage.
I think that the police like the present arrangement of home and away fans leaving the ground at opposite ends.
I think things work well as they are, us older fans are set in our ways and I for one would not wish to be moved from my accustomed position in the JH stand.
What about sticking them in Bishops Park?
Quote from: filham on April 29, 2020, 10:15:31 AM
I think that the police like the present arrangement of home and away fans leaving the ground at opposite ends.
I think things work well as they are, us older fans are set in our ways and I for one would not wish to be moved from my accustomed position in the JH stand.
Most people are set in their ways and don't like change. Unfortunately as I used to say to my staff, the only thing that is not going to change, is the amount of change. Change will happen post this virus and change will continue to happen in football. Luckily we appear to have secured the long term at the Cottage so it's now a question of making it work best. When I grew up, you watched the game from both ends walking round the Riverside terrace at halftime, can you imagine still being able to do that, with no seats and minimum cover on 3 sides of the ground.
Quote from: FulhamStu on April 29, 2020, 01:10:50 PM
Quote from: filham on April 29, 2020, 10:15:31 AM
I think that the police like the present arrangement of home and away fans leaving the ground at opposite ends.
I think things work well as they are, us older fans are set in our ways and I for one would not wish to be moved from my accustomed position in the JH stand.
Most people are set in their ways and don't like change. Unfortunately as I used to say to my staff, the only thing that is not going to change, is the amount of change. Change will happen post this virus and change will continue to happen in football. Luckily we appear to have secured the long term at the Cottage so it's now a question of making it work best. When I grew up, you watched the game from both ends walking round the Riverside terrace at halftime, can you imagine still being able to do that, with no seats and minimum cover on 3 sides of the ground.
While change is a necessary occurrence for every business, keep moving or die, I don't believe moving fans around is a good idea. I cant think of another club who developed their stadium ever moved fans about and if anything made sure away fans were stuck in a corner somewhere or up in the gods, sometimes both. Also you develop a good relationship with all the fans around you and unless we co-ordinated our moves we would be scattered across the ground.
Fulham should do their best to keep fans in their current locations, why would you want to break up the Hammersmith End which in my opinion is the noisiest and scatter them potentially around the ground.
I see above that someone mentioned an entrance in the Bishops Park corner of the ground which will allow away fans access and exit without having to mix with home fans. This makes sense and would fit in with all new stadium design and keep authorities happy.
Well I remember a couple of initial seasons standing behind the goal at the Putney End and able to move to the halfway line terracing at half time or the Hammy End. After that I fixed myself at the Hammy End in the same spot on the terraces for forty years or more , then two bad, enforced, years at Loftus Road and finally in the JH stand for the all seated arrangement.
Not ready for yet another move .
Quote from: Fernhurst on April 29, 2020, 11:58:14 AM
What about sticking them in Bishops Park?
Anchored in the middle of the Thames on a flat barge with a large screen at each end and no alcohol on site - perfect!
At Salop the hard core vocal support was in the West stand next to the away end and this produced what little atmosphere existed. That had been the position at the old Gay Meadow too so there's history. Now safe standing has moved the lads flags and drum up to the south end stand to increase the noise while the west stand has filled back up with the bigger attendances at this level. This doesn't apply at Fulham although standing at the back of the Hammersmith might solve the problem of jumping up. Security/safety means away fans probably have to be in the Putney end and it's a more flexible space too.
I wonder how much further along we would we be by now towards a remodeled stadium with shops and restaurants and points of interest, gathering places et al. if we had managed to stay up and not get relegated. I haven't been to Jacksonville, Florida's NFL football stadium. But I've read articles and looked at some photos online. Pretty impressive. Seems like a difficult task retaining the quaintness and sense of history that is Craven Cottage while modernising for comfort and convenience, divertissements, satellite support businesses, more seats, and more comfortable ones at that. Architects with grand dreams inevitably build replacement stadiums with fans having to sit further from the field. I love how close I can sit to the action now. The distance from sideline to first row is remarkable in today's age.
Quote from: Forever Fulham on April 29, 2020, 05:28:35 PM
I wonder how much further along we would we be by now towards a remodeled stadium with shops and restaurants and points of interest, gathering places et al. if we had managed to stay up and not get relegated. I haven't been to Jacksonville, Florida's NFL football stadium. But I've read articles and looked at some photos online. Pretty impressive. Seems like a difficult task retaining the quaintness and sense of history that is Craven Cottage while modernising for comfort and convenience, divertissements, satellite support businesses, more seats, and more comfortable ones at that. Architects with grand dreams inevitably build replacement stadiums with fans having to sit further from the field. I love how close I can sit to the action now. The distance from sideline to first row is remarkable in today's age.
Agree that the closeness is unique and important. My neighbour is a life long Arsenal supporter. Sometimes I go along when he has a spare season ticket (his family have four), I see some good football but it's so remote and impersonal. He came to Fulham, was so impressed with the experience that he bought two season tickets. He admits that he now prefers his Fulham experiences but can't let go of his old allegiance to Arsenal, which I understand and respect.
Leave the away fans where they are. There is nowhere else for them to go.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 30, 2020, 09:45:10 AM
Leave the away fans where they are. There is nowhere else for them to go.
Yes those stadiums where you are a long way off the play are terrible, QPR at White City was a failure for that reason, but why are we talking about that, the surrounding restriction ensure that there is no space for that to happen at the Cottage.
If the away fans stay where they are and there's an exit into the park, similar to the gates at the HE then they will have there own exit and one that can be easily controlled by the police.
Quote from: filham on April 30, 2020, 11:08:42 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on April 30, 2020, 09:45:10 AM
Leave the away fans where they are. There is nowhere else for them to go.
Yes those stadiums where you are a long way off the play are terrible, QPR at White City was a failure for that reason, but why are we talking about that, the surrounding restriction ensure that there is no space for that to happen at the Cottage.
What are the conditions attached to our current encampment in Bishops Park?
From the snippets I've read Mr Khan is paying millions now and in the future for the privilege of temporary use. Why don't F&H Council turn the loan into a sale? Too much flack from the NIMBY's?
It would give us so much breathing room to plan for the future.
Quote from: Fernhurst on April 29, 2020, 11:58:14 AM
What about sticking them in Bishops Park?
Nah stick em in the Thames.
Quote from: Milo on April 29, 2020, 05:26:49 PM
At Salop the hard core vocal support was in the West stand next to the away end and this produced what little atmosphere existed. That had been the position at the old Gay Meadow too so there's history. Now safe standing has moved the lads flags and drum up to the south end stand to increase the noise while the west stand has filled back up with the bigger attendances at this level. This doesn't apply at Fulham although standing at the back of the Hammersmith might solve the problem of jumping up. Security/safety means away fans probably have to be in the Putney end and it's a more flexible space too.
I go quite often to Salop and the West Stand hard core of fans has not changed at all. What has happened is that more atmosphere has been created behind the goal due to the safe standing. If people do not want to move from the Hammersmith end or anywhere else in the vast majority of cases they will not need too. What I am suggesting is to have safe standing for home fans in the Putney end to increase the atmosphere, by making it cheaper for the youth, this would also add to the atmosphere as they are generally the singers
Who make the most noise.
To what extent do the current plans rely upon building out on platform 'piers' over the Thames, and if so, how far from water's edge?
I'm sorry, but you shouldn't need away fans in close proximity to create an atmosphere. The issue is getting behind your club and supporting them.
Whilst yes, having away fans closer to a more hardcore element will create a bit more noise, as the friendly exchanges of banter increase. However the focus should be elsewhere, mainly on the 11 chaps in black and white!
Quote from: Forever Fulham on April 29, 2020, 05:28:35 PM
I wonder how much further along we would we be by now towards a remodeled stadium with shops and restaurants and points of interest, gathering places et al. if we had managed to stay up and not get relegated. I haven't been to Jacksonville, Florida's NFL football stadium. But I've read articles and looked at some photos online. Pretty impressive. Seems like a difficult task retaining the quaintness and sense of history that is Craven Cottage while modernising for comfort and convenience, divertissements, satellite support businesses, more seats, and more comfortable ones at that. Architects with grand dreams inevitably build replacement stadiums with fans having to sit further from the field. I love how close I can sit to the action now. The distance from sideline to first row is remarkable in today's age. Quote from: Forever Fulham on April 29, 2020, 05:28:35 PM
I wonder how much further along we would we be by now towards a remodeled stadium with shops and restaurants and points of interest, gathering places et al. if we had managed to stay up and not get relegated. I haven't been to Jacksonville, Florida's NFL football stadium. But I've read articles and looked at some photos online. Pretty impressive. Seems like a difficult task retaining the quaintness and sense of history that is Craven Cottage while modernising for comfort and convenience, divertissements, satellite support businesses, more seats, and more comfortable ones at that. Architects with grand dreams inevitably build replacement stadiums with fans having to sit further from the field. I love how close I can sit to the action now. The distance from sideline to first row is remarkable in today's age.
Slightly deviating from the O P, regarding the other outlets, businesses that are planned for the site/pier, I just hope that the British climate and underwhelming transport links do not undermine the project.
