matches?
For me the answer is yes.
Yes from me too
Yes from me three
Yes.
another manager might do a bit better but this squad has bottom three written all over it.
I am no longer allowed to mention why that is my opinion as it offends some posters sensibilites for me to give a full opinion (this is self regulation not a mods driven thing).
Yes - BUT Klopp was given time by the Liverpool board. He finished 8th in his first season at Liverpool, worse than his predecessor (6th). We were not an outstanding team last season (and we were coming off the back of a shambolic season), and IMO Parker did well overall to get us promoted. We had problems in a number of positions which were only going to be exacerbated this season. We have some better players in but it takes time for them to become an effective team. Unfortunately it seems quite likely we will be relegated if we don't pick up wins soon but if we were to win next Monday it could also be the turning point.
It would depend on the persons ability to see into the future an hour and ten minutes before the game starts, ie, before they peg the team sheet up. If they could have seen Hector having his very own and expensive mare, Mitrovic having his own personal mares in both penalty boxes and in front of an empty net and TC needing yet more time to find his full mojo then probably yes they could. In the real world it is what it is with all of the above and until many people's preferred CB pairing is available and bedded in I suspect there will have to be more changes to the match day squad, actually definitely so following AKs card on Saturday.
Important games for us tonight and by bedtime we could still be within reach of 17th............. sigh of despair emoji
The thing for me is that we don't look like we practice anything in training defensively. How long have we been brutal at set pieces .There are times when I watch us that I don't know who is marking who .The same can be said in the other box .
We can argue about the quality of the squad all we like but unless we are organized it makes no difference .
Take palace or us under roy there was probably much better squads but roy has palce and had us organised and that made us hard to beat .
Look at newcastle under keegan probably the best squad they ever had but weren't organised defensively and didnt win a thing.
So at this moment in time I would take any manager that would come in and organise us better and give us a chance beacuse as it is we need to score at least 2 goals before a ball is kicked .
Rant over
Quote from: Finnans Right Peg on October 26, 2020, 01:37:36 PM
The thing for me is that we don't look like we practice anything in training defensively. How long have we been brutal at set pieces .There are times when I watch us that I don't know who is marking who .The same can be said in the other box .
We can argue about the quality of the squad all we like but unless we are organized it makes no difference .
Take palace or us under roy there was probably much better squads but roy has palce and had us organised and that made us hard to beat .
Look at newcastle under keegan probably the best squad they ever had but weren't organised defensively and didnt win a thing.
So at this moment in time I would take any manager that would come in and organise us better and give us a chance beacuse as it is we need to score at least 2 goals before a ball is kicked .
Rant over
Did I hear correctly that both Anderson and Kongolo are both far more vocal than anything we currently have? When Kongolo was set to join us last time round for some reason I had him down as captain for this season.
I had other things on this weekend but the football banter last weekend with the neighbours had our defence compared to a Morecombe and Wise sketch, all the pieces are there but not always where they should be. It's like taking brain fogs to a whole new level.
Scalleys dad .
They probably are more vocal but again this all comes down to been coached correctly if everybody knows their job and who to pick up there is less need for people to be vocal and just get on doing their own jobs .
But I do think the whole squad lacks leaders
It occurs to me that most managers set their teams tactics according to the opposition. Now we know from our own experience with Roy he always has a solid back 4 or 5, and catches the opposition on the break as per last Saturday; but SP plays one way and one way only. The opposition in all our recent games are happy for us the have most of the possession and in some cases most of the shots. But until SP gets a plan B and C and our front men get their act together we are toast.
I only hope when Andersen, Kongolo and Tete are back and fit our fortunes will improve. And yes I do believe Klopp and a number of other managers would have won at least one and drawn a couple more with our current line up but varying tactics
Klopp might get more out of them, but Paker hasn't lost a game 7-2 this season......Yet 049:gif
It would take Klopp (and did at liverpool where many wanted rid after one season ) a season plus to put his mark on any team.Parker has effectively a new team and so far has worked with them for more or less 3 games since the window shut.We need to be realistic here .
Quote from: colinwhite on October 26, 2020, 04:53:54 PM
It would take Klopp (and did at liverpool where many wanted rid after one season ) a season plus to put his mark on any team.Parker has effectively a new team and so far has worked with them for more or less 3 games since the window shut.We need to be realistic here .
But we had the same problems last season when he was also in charge .
We were too slow with the ball and easy to score against only in this league we get punished more
Quote from: Finnans Right Peg on October 26, 2020, 05:03:41 PM
Quote from: colinwhite on October 26, 2020, 04:53:54 PM
It would take Klopp (and did at liverpool where many wanted rid after one season ) a season plus to put his mark on any team.Parker has effectively a new team and so far has worked with them for more or less 3 games since the window shut.We need to be realistic here .
But we had the same problems last season when he was also in charge .
We were too slow with the ball and easy to score against only in this league we get punished more
Exactly, in interviews he talks about 'learning' all the time, he doesn't need to develop something that isn't working, 'Parkerball'.
He just needs to look at a 3 match unbeaten run in the Prem under him in 2018, won all three matches without conceding.
Quote from: colinwhite on October 26, 2020, 04:53:54 PM
It would take Klopp (and did at liverpool where many wanted rid after one season ) a season plus to put his mark on any team.Parker has effectively a new team and so far has worked with them for more or less 3 games since the window shut.We need to be realistic here .
Yes, 3 games, but is there improvement in each match. I don't think so.
I cant ssee Klopp leaving Liverpool for us
Id saythere was a big improvement in both the wolves and sh utd games and even to a degree against Palace compared with the first 3 games.
As far as last season is concerned we got promoted ,so dont by your own way of reasoning see the beef there and this is now more or less a completely new team . If Mete and Andersen were available i think we would only have Mitro left from last seasons starting line -up.tYou asked the question and even Klopp would struggle to make that work straight away!
It doesn't need to work right away but there has to be improvements week after week and it we need to look like we worked on things in training.
Don't kid urself about the wolves game they didn't get out of 1st gear and we only looked good because we were so bad the games before .
The sheff utd game we were shocking in the first half and did a lot better in the 2nd .
Against Palace we passed the ball around because they let us we had so much possession but who looked the more likely to score it wasn't us .
I'm all for giving managers time but we need to be improving a lot better than 1 half of a game all season beacuse thats all we have played imo.and for what its worth I think Sheff utd will struggle also.
The annoying thing is I think we can stay up but not with the system and tactics we are using because we can't score and we can't keep a clean sheet
He would but it'd take a season or two to turn things around. He got rid of the vast majority of the Liverpool team before they started winning trophies. Money was no object for him either, which wouldn't be the case here.
My grandmother could easily, drop Mitro , drop Cairney.
Quote from: ex-Pat on October 26, 2020, 07:50:45 PM
My grandmother could easily, drop Mitro , drop Cairney.
Good job your granny isn't available then isn't it?
To the OP Klopp might do better but like many top notch managers he isn't available and anyway ain't coming to FFC so it's irrelevant. Of the more realistic potential targets, some might improve us but as we found out last time around some certainly wouldn't.
I'm no great fan of the playing style SP is currently imposing and want to see changes but I'm not keen on a managerial change. Once bitten and all that!
Scott Parker isn't a great head coach, but isn't terrible either and he knows the team. He was the best head coach available six weeks ago, there is nothing to say the second choice six weeks ago would have done better and no new manager has become available.
Yes. They wouldnt start the season saying they'd lose more matches than they'd win either. Perhaps the most defeatest thing i've heard from a football manager ever!
100% klopp could, another manager? yes
Quote from: Denzil Dexter on October 26, 2020, 11:09:46 PM
Yes. They wouldnt start the season saying they'd lose more matches than they'd win either. Perhaps the most defeatest thing i've heard from a football manager ever!
something's aren't necessary to say so why say them?
that really was a bizarre thing to say as it sets a poor standard of acceptability
Quote from: Mr K.Dilkington on October 26, 2020, 11:18:28 PM
Quote from: Denzil Dexter on October 26, 2020, 11:09:46 PM
Yes. They wouldnt start the season saying they'd lose more matches than they'd win either. Perhaps the most defeatest thing i've heard from a football manager ever!
something's aren't necessary to say so why say them?
that really was a bizarre thing to say as it sets a poor standard of acceptability
Definitely. If he's saying sh1t like that to the players no wonder we're struggling
Quote from: bencher on October 26, 2020, 01:19:12 PM
Yes - BUT Klopp was given time by the Liverpool board. He finished 8th in his first season at Liverpool, worse than his predecessor (6th). We were not an outstanding team last season (and we were coming off the back of a shambolic season), and IMO Parker did well overall to get us promoted. We had problems in a number of positions which were only going to be exacerbated this season. We have some better players in but it takes time for them to become an effective team. Unfortunately it seems quite likely we will be relegated if we don't pick up wins soon but if we were to win next Monday it could also be the turning point.
0001.jpeg This is exactly how I see it. As others have said Yes, there needs to be consistent improvements in the squad on how they play as a team. But, there also needs to be consistent performances out of the individual players. That is what I'm not seeing.
People can blame the coaches, and I do put some of the blame on them, but for me there needs to be more of the blame put on the players. I feel they switch off on basic things like defending at odd times and that is causing serious problems.
Quote from: Denzil Dexter on October 26, 2020, 11:09:46 PM
Yes. They wouldnt start the season saying they'd lose more matches than they'd win either. Perhaps the most defeatest thing i've heard from a football manager ever!
Clearly you didn't hear this when Roy Hodgson said it around the same time last year then...
"Fans would like to hear 'yeah it's going to be a great season, we've finished roughly in the middle of the table the last couple of seasons, we're going to go on and do much better than that'.
I would like to say that to you but if I'm realistic I'm not certain I can. I think staying in the Premier League is always going to be the be all and end all for us and always going to be a fight, a bit of suffering.
There's not going to be rainbows and blue skies and rose coloured spectacles all the way through. There's gong to be plenty of fighting and heartache along the way."
The squad isn't at all bad (bar having no centre forward options) It's the tactics being used and total lack of coaching that are the problem.
Quote from: Statto on October 27, 2020, 12:57:32 AM
Quote from: Denzil Dexter on October 26, 2020, 11:09:46 PM
Yes. They wouldnt start the season saying they'd lose more matches than they'd win either. Perhaps the most defeatest thing i've heard from a football manager ever!
Clearly you didn't hear this when Roy Hodgson said it around the same time last year then...
"Fans would like to hear 'yeah it's going to be a great season, we've finished roughly in the middle of the table the last couple of seasons, we're going to go on and do much better than that'.
I would like to say that to you but if I'm realistic I'm not certain I can. I think staying in the Premier League is always going to be the be all and end all for us and always going to be a fight, a bit of suffering.
There's not going to be rainbows and blue skies and rose coloured spectacles all the way through. There's gong to be plenty of fighting and heartache along the way."
Managers cannot win. If a manager plays down expecation, then people criticize him for not being ambition. But, if (like when Parker was a player at Spurs) a Manager builds up expecations like Harry Redknapp did at Spurs then he gets sacked for not improving upon a fourth place finish.
I remember what Ranieri said in 2018 - the squad is good enough - and look what happened there. And that was a good Khan - manager relationship.
Klopp would need a lot of time and apply constant pressure on his DoF to get his assistants and player picks in before the season starts. Klopp would soon walk away from it all saying - "I don't need this ..." - probably before a ball is kicked in anger. Repeat for many other managers until TK steps aside and allows a professional DoF into the job.
Without a doubt, although who in their right mind would join with TK still here?
Yes!
I am now (finally) reasonably happy with the squad we have despite some areas of concern.
The two goals conceded against Palace were well worked goals from their point of view and while we can argue that we should have defended better these kind of goals do get scored against even the best teams.
My biggest problem right now is that our team is incapable of making these runs behind the defence and delivering a telling pass or shot, we over play again and again.
Parker has mentioned the fact we need to shoot more but fails to see his tactics are stifling the players freedom to play in the final third.
The defence has its issues but that was a game we could have scored 3 or 4 in
Agree ,running and playing the ball into space is something lacking in our play when we have alot of possession. It should be more varied at times with more risk taking and quicker decision making. I would also like to see us mix up the range and length of passing more.There are too many `alibi` passes, and too few asking questions of opposing defenses.
A massive YES from me.
There is no guarantee, it isn't rocket science setting up a team. Managers pundits and coaches would like to make us think it's a massive skill above the ideas of the ordinary bloke in the pub. Of course a blank cheque book does not guarantee any success, but it certainly helps rather than hinders, as it is no coincidence that the biggest spenders are up the top end of the table in general. If you do not have the money to buy the players you want, then a manager has to find another way of winning matches, as going toe to toe with one or two of the big boys is futile, that is where the Roy Hodgsons of this world come into their own.
Practice practice practice on how to be difficult to beat, he has made a good living out of it. How to keep the shape and the balance and the depth, how to win the ball back as soon as you lose it. How to win back possession as straight after you score to starve the opponents of the ball.
A very very important how to make the most of set pieces because that is an area you can dominate against teams that have spent more money on one player than you have on your own team.
A manager to a certain extent can only be as good as the players he has to choose from.
Then their is the motivation, how did Wimbledon punch above their weight under Dave Bassett, how did Brian Clough make his players feel a foot taller than they were and convince them they could beat anybody. Same with Ron Saunders and Bill Shankley. These managers were worth their weight in gold and could motivate a corpse. Part of their success was down to fitness, they got their players to run further run faster and run longer that their opposition. Make them feel as though we have 14 players on the pitch Cloughie use to say.
Yes believe it or not there is more than one way to win a football match at any level of the game. Hodgson is in his element coaching the under dog, less pressure for a start.
The bible of Association Football tells you that a new manager from the start comes in and makes the team hard to score against, be mean. First and foremost a strong spine down the middle and the Goalkeeper comes first that is why he has a number one on the back of his shirt. Then once the spine is built you put the meat on the bones. It is no coincidence that all these managers I have mentioned made sure they had a strong Captain a leader, and in some cases had many leaders. Of course in Fulhams case the managers are hamstrung by the incompetence of the owners son who is impersonating a Director of Football.
Nevertheless, whether the purists like it or not Fulham have to evaluate how they win matches and pick up points anywhere and everywhere as that is the key to staying this Division and if it means parking the bus or parking a fleet of buses to keep the likes of Liverpool out then so be it, whatever it takes, a 0 0 draw would be a moral victory for manager and players, imagine how they would feel walking off the pitch unbeaten, that is confidence building. It may not be pretty but who cares we are Fulham not Man Utd, never will be.
You want pretty football all the time you need to go and watch Man City.
The rule of thumb is to start making ourselves hard to score against with every player knowing what his job is, and to talk and communicate, get the basics right and the technique will follow. If your having a bad game you can still run around.
You walk passed a match in the park of adult open age football and in the main the team who is the loudest and talking non stop to each other is the team that is winning, it is no game for faint hearts.
But to commence playing to a teams strengths a manager has to be allowed to flood the team with real leaders of men, real personalities and real fighters, real characters and real warriors, but because Fulham do not under a poor stats system and a poor D of F, Fulham have a very soft underbelly and every other team knows that, and in the English Premier League there is no mercy and you will get punished and have our noses rubbed in it, and until there are changes and adjustments through the chain of command downwards, starting at the top, Fulham will just go round and round in circles.
So it really is a simple game where the object of the exercise is to score more goals that the opponents, and not forgetting to concede less than your opponents, keep a clean sheet and you only need to score one goal to win a match.
Did you eat three weetabix this morning Wooly? Good post. ;)
Quote from: blingo on October 28, 2020, 09:25:48 AM
Did you eat three weetabix this morning Wooly? Good post. ;)
Four weetabix actually blingo, the wife is a hard taskmaster.
Quote from: Statto on October 27, 2020, 12:57:32 AM
Quote from: Denzil Dexter on October 26, 2020, 11:09:46 PM
Yes. They wouldnt start the season saying they'd lose more matches than they'd win either. Perhaps the most defeatest thing i've heard from a football manager ever!
Clearly you didn't hear this when Roy Hodgson said it around the same time last year then...
"Fans would like to hear 'yeah it's going to be a great season, we've finished roughly in the middle of the table the last couple of seasons, we're going to go on and do much better than that'.
I would like to say that to you but if I'm realistic I'm not certain I can. I think staying in the Premier League is always going to be the be all and end all for us and always going to be a fight, a bit of suffering.
There's not going to be rainbows and blue skies and rose coloured spectacles all the way through. There's gong to be plenty of fighting and heartache along the way."
there's more experience in relegation fights and general experience with Roy. He's a calming figure and you never really doubt you won't eventually come out on top. Scott doesn't have that level of earned respect and experience yet to make these brutally honest statements imo yet .
Quote from: Mr K.Dilkington on October 28, 2020, 09:34:24 AM
Quote from: Statto on October 27, 2020, 12:57:32 AM
Quote from: Denzil Dexter on October 26, 2020, 11:09:46 PM
Yes. They wouldnt start the season saying they'd lose more matches than they'd win either. Perhaps the most defeatest thing i've heard from a football manager ever!
Clearly you didn't hear this when Roy Hodgson said it around the same time last year then...
"Fans would like to hear 'yeah it's going to be a great season, we've finished roughly in the middle of the table the last couple of seasons, we're going to go on and do much better than that'.
I would like to say that to you but if I'm realistic I'm not certain I can. I think staying in the Premier League is always going to be the be all and end all for us and always going to be a fight, a bit of suffering.
There's not going to be rainbows and blue skies and rose coloured spectacles all the way through. There's gong to be plenty of fighting and heartache along the way."
there's more experience in relegation fights and general experience with Roy. He's a calming figure and you never really doubt you won't eventually come out on top. Scott doesn't have that level of earned respect and experience yet to make these brutally honest statements imo yet .
Well, luckily then that those who matters in this respect, namely the players, don't have to base their view on Parker on an over analyzed comment taken out of context so obviously no harm done whatsoever because of this. In my opinion.
