Odoi this time with the block of the opposing defender for Mitro to get a free run on the corner for our first goal
How are we still getting away with this ha! It's highly effective and we've never been so potent from corners in my memory because of it. Very clever, but should it be legal?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mhqBbpZf_o
If the ref points to the centre circle...it's legal !
QuoteImpeding the progress of an opponent means moving into the opponent's path to obstruct, block, slow down or force a change of direction when the ball is not within playing distance of either player.
All players have a right to their position on the field of play; being in the way of an opponent is not the same as moving into the way of an opponent.
Seems perfectly legal as long as the player who does the block is standing still or not moving in to the path of the defender.
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 01:51:14 PM
Odoi this time with the block of the opposing defender for Mitro to get a free run on the corner for our first goal
How are we still getting away with this ha! It's highly effective and we've never been so potent from corners in my memory because of it. Very clever, but should it be legal?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mhqBbpZf_o
Odoi is entitled to that space. You can't just run into an opposing player and claim it's a foul. Tosin earlier in the season looked like he literally set a screen on a defender, which isn't legal. But this one? Seemed fine to me.
Quote from: MikeTheCubed on October 25, 2021, 02:13:18 PM
QuoteImpeding the progress of an opponent means moving into the opponent's path to obstruct, block, slow down or force a change of direction when the ball is not within playing distance of either player.
All players have a right to their position on the field of play; being in the way of an opponent is not the same as moving into the way of an opponent.
Seems perfectly legal as long as the player who does the block is standing still or not moving in to the path of the defender.
Yeah thought that when Cooper was making his whinging comments post match and criticising the ref. Watched the highlights and odoi didn't move to block their player, their player ran into a stationary odoi.
Part of me thought that Coopers awareness of the tactic (legal and smart) may have played into our hands as the players and he definitely seemed to have tried to account for it (prior to match Cooper mentioned to officials) and also by the reaction of their players after the goal was scored, kinda gave the impression that they automatically assumed it shouldn't have stood because of the clash, despite odoi being flattened and ultimately standing his ground... instead of just playing the game like they should've it looked more like they thought if they remonstrated and made it all obvious to the ref it would help them, but it actually cost them the first goal and in many ways the game.
Wasn't it Odoi that got us the penalty....so, is that 2 assists & a win bonus for him this week
Im suprised I'm noticing this set up for the first time really? Is this not a common tactic - assuming not as it's the first time I've noticed us using it regularly and successfully.
It's classic basketball and it's working brilliantly. Perhaps teams will start marking players Zonally from corners against us to avoid being drawn in to chasing runners etc ...tough one for the opposition to work out! Well played coaching staff!
Whether legal or not its just great to see that we have been working on these things in training
Interesting one. He did stand his ground rather than move to blcck, and if he was looking towards the ball there would be no possible infringement. But he was facing in the opposite direction to the ball and at the opponents instead, to ensure he came to a halt precisely where it would be obstructive. Very clever, but open to ruling out for that reason.
Just watched it again,
He seeks out Mitro's marker,
Takes one step towards him, then a side step to ensure he blocks his path
There is zero intention to play the ball, hes facing away from it. His sole focus is on infringing the movement of the opposition defender. Clever indeed and effective - but I think theres a possibility if it isn't against the law now, it will be once ref's cotton on!
The corner resulted from Mitro being pulled back as he was shooting whch should have been a penalty so they were lucky to have got away with that
I have never seen a team pull people back so much.
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 03:40:45 PM
Just watched it again,
He seeks out Mitro's marker,
Takes one step towards him, then a side step to ensure he blocks his path
There is zero intention to play the ball, hes facing away from it. His sole focus is on infringing the movement of the opposition defender. Clever indeed and effective - but I think theres a possibility if it isn't against the law now, it will be once ref's cotton on!
Exactly this. It reminds me very much of the All Blacks rugby union oft-used tactic.
Quote from: sunburywhite on October 25, 2021, 03:47:23 PM
The corner resulted from Mitro being pulled back as he was shooting whch should have been a penalty so they were lucky to have got away with that
I have never seen a team pull people back so much.
I'm surprised more was not made of this. It was such a clear shirt pull and it would have impacted Mitro's balance as he was shooting, so you couldn't have had some daft pundit saying "it wasn't enough of a foul for me" in an Alan Shearer type of comment. Perhaps Mr Cooper would like to berate the refs for getting that one wrong, which was far clearer.
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 03:40:45 PM
Just watched it again,
He seeks out Mitro's marker,
Takes one step towards him, then a side step to ensure he blocks his path
There is zero intention to play the ball, hes facing away from it. His sole focus is on infringing the movement of the opposition defender. Clever indeed and effective - but I think theres a possibility if it isn't against the law now, it will be once ref's cotton on!
Hmm don't know how clear cut it, and for that reason if it is intentional then its very well done and intelligent.
Another way to see it was that odoi was already marking a player or being marked by a player and mitro got ahead of his marker who in being distracted by a tussle with mitro ended up running into Denis.
Difficult to prove either way..
Think I've just noticed another level to the method too.
Looks like it wasn't just odoi but tosin as well in the way which led to mitro getting away from his man.
Both odoi and Tosin are marked but the angle mitro runs means his marker ends up crashing into one and then the other..
Haha.
Quote from: General on October 25, 2021, 04:22:16 PM
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 03:40:45 PM
Just watched it again,
He seeks out Mitro's marker,
Takes one step towards him, then a side step to ensure he blocks his path
There is zero intention to play the ball, hes facing away from it. His sole focus is on infringing the movement of the opposition defender. Clever indeed and effective - but I think theres a possibility if it isn't against the law now, it will be once ref's cotton on!
Hmm don't know how clear cut it, and for that reason if it is intentional then its very well done and intelligent.
Another way to see it was that odoi was already marking a player or being marked by a player and mitro got ahead of his marker who in being distracted by a tussle with mitro ended up running into Denis.
Difficult to prove either way..
There are a couple of replays on the extended highlights. Odoi isn't looking at the ball but at the defenders coming and he makes a definite move to block one of them. If Odoi had been looking at the ball and sidestepped and got pushed then it could easily be a penalty. If the goal had been disallowed I wouldn't have been surprised.
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 03:40:45 PM
He seeks out Mitro's marker,
Takes one step towards him,
Yep.
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 03:40:45 PM
then a side step to ensure he blocks his path
Sufficiently slight/discreet as to be debatable
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 03:40:45 PM
There is zero intention to play the ball, hes facing away from it. His sole focus is on infringing the movement of the opposition defender.
For sure. A last minute twist of the head towards the ball might make the move safer from sanction, however. And this could be done in the sense that (as I have only eventually noticed) there is no need for an actual collision. Merely by the direction of that step back, Dennis had already ensured that (assuming the corner is taken precisely then, as surely rehearsed) Mitro will be a yard ahead of the markers even if they do manage to breeze pass him. So he might now safely turn towards to the ball and pretend interest.
Really interesting to study!
Quote from: General on October 25, 2021, 04:22:16 PM
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 03:40:45 PM
Just watched it again,
He seeks out Mitro's marker,
Takes one step towards him, then a side step to ensure he blocks his path
There is zero intention to play the ball, hes facing away from it. His sole focus is on infringing the movement of the opposition defender. Clever indeed and effective - but I think theres a possibility if it isn't against the law now, it will be once ref's cotton on!
Hmm don't know how clear cut it, and for that reason if it is intentional then its very well done and intelligent.
Another way to see it was that odoi was already marking a player or being marked by a player and mitro got ahead of his marker who in being distracted by a tussle with mitro ended up running into Denis.
Difficult to prove either way..
Somewhat difficult to prove in the moment perhaps without VAR - but given this is about the 4th time weve done this successfully I think we'd be hard pressed to say it wasnt intentional haha
Its brilliantly executed again though.
Odoi shouldnt be marking anyone its an attacking corner haha
He has no interest in his own marker either his eyes are fixed on Mitros marker the entire move ha... And you are indeed correct Tosin shields he own marker in a way that blocks him also from intervening. Its a great move
Quote from: H4usuallysitting on October 25, 2021, 03:04:11 PM
Wasn't it Odoi that got us the penalty....so, is that 2 assists & a win bonus for him this week
This
Is it really any different to the millions of corners over the years where defenders block attackers or where grappling and shirt pulling is going on by the defending team? Just a way of the attacking team fighting back.
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 01:51:14 PM
Odoi this time with the block of the opposing defender for Mitro to get a free run on the corner for our first goal
How are we still getting away with this ha! It's highly effective and we've never been so potent from corners in my memory because of it. Very clever, but should it be legal?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mhqBbpZf_o
Mitro is always getting blocked off. Most of the time it's illegal. On Sunday he was in the box and had his shirt 'tugged', but he carried on playing.
I believe Odoi was trying to move out of the way of a playing running towards him a full pelt but wasn't quick enough to get out the way, I also believe this is the first time Odoi hasnt backed off someone when they are running at him
What I like about the routine is that it can be done with different combinations of players, I can recall 3 of these this season, all resulting in goals (quite likely I have just failed to notice the unsuccessful ones)
The first I recall was Tosin blocking for Mitro against Hull: this one was, I think the cleverest, Tosin made an early run and then put his hands up in frustration (as did Mitro) as if to moan at Seri for not delivering the corner soon enough. This allowed Tosin to turn and walk back to his starting position, and as soon as his back was turned, Seri took the corner, Mitro made his run, and Tosin stepped in to block. Its clever because the initial faux confusion created a reason for Tosin to be facing away from the corner and towards Mitro (and his marker)
Then they did it at Birmingham, this time it was Chalobah (I think) blocking for Odoi. This one was really obvious, facing away from the ball, seeking out and moving into the path of the marker.
Then this one against Forest, Odoi blocking for Mitro. Again none of the mis-timed corner routine on this one, just a straight block.
Has anyone noticed us do this unsuccessfully? I find it hard to believe it always works!
Quote from: jayffc on October 25, 2021, 03:40:45 PM
Just watched it again,
He seeks out Mitro's marker,
Takes one step towards him, then a side step to ensure he blocks his path
There is zero intention to play the ball, hes facing away from it. His sole focus is on infringing the movement of the opposition defender. Clever indeed and effective - but I think theres a possibility if it isn't against the law now, it will be once ref's cotton on!
This was the first one we have scored on that looks like a foul to me. My understanding is you cannot intentionally obstruct another player's path. Seems it is Mitro's job to find Dennis, not Dennis to find his marker which is what happens here.
Regardless, if you man mark and do not clear out the near post it seems you are going to get hit with these corner tactics. Ironically, Fulham appear to know this which is why they zonal mark the 6 yard and have someone clearing the near and far posts. Several times against Forest I noted they had 2 men out against 4 opposition at the edge of the 18 while keeping a solid contingent at the 6.
