I fully appreciate that youngsters like to stand during a game, it helps to generat an atmosphere, I was young once but then, standing was the norm. Today I was in the Hammy Endand there where a few empty seats in front of me, which were suddenly filled after the twenty minute mark, by a group of young bloke who had watched the game on the concourse while they finished their beers. From then on I couldn't see any of the action because they kept on standing up. Please, I get it but one day these youngsters will not be young and they will develop things like arthritis etc and become a moaning Minnie, like me, because some youngster will be standing front of them, depriving them of a decent view of the game.
Quote from: Peabody on January 28, 2023, 11:54:50 PM
I fully appreciate that youngsters like to stand during a game, it helps to generat an atmosphere, I was young once but then, standing was the norm. Today I was in the Hammy Endand there where a few empty seats in front of me, which were suddenly filled after the twenty minute mark, by a group of young bloke who had watched the game on the concourse while they finished their beers. From then on I couldn't see any of the action because they kept on standing up. Please, I get it but one day these youngsters will not be young and they will develop things like arthritis etc and become a moaning Minnie, like me, because some youngster will be standing front of them, depriving them of a decent view of the game.
My wife won't come now because at her last game, a 3-1, she only saw one goal...
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Quote from: Peabody on January 28, 2023, 11:54:50 PM
I fully appreciate that youngsters like to stand during a game, it helps to generat an atmosphere, I was young once but then, standing was the norm. Today I was in the Hammy Endand there where a few empty seats in front of me, which were suddenly filled after the twenty minute mark, by a group of young bloke who had watched the game on the concourse while they finished their beers. From then on I couldn't see any of the action because they kept on standing up. Please, I get it but one day these youngsters will not be young and they will develop things like arthritis etc and become a moaning Minnie, like me, because some youngster will be standing front of them, depriving them of a decent view of the game.
Well that's the reason I don't go anymore, I begrudge paying out a good few quid to stare at some blokes backside, when I said this a while ago I was instantly told to "go and sit down the front then"
I don't want to sit down the front and not be able to see the wider aspects of the game. I get that some want to stand, but it's a bit of "I'm all right Jack sod the rest of you".
There that's my moan out of the way.
I did my first commute back to central London last week & it's clear the modern way is screw you, I'll do exactly what I want regardless of the impact on anyone else.
You're not a moaning minnie Peabody. That is bloody rude and thoughtless behaviour. :031: Where were the stewards? The money paid to watch a game should not be interrupted like that. Yes we jump (or I try to) when something looks likely to happen and when we score but otherwise sit down!
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This is precisely why you need standing areas that rail seating gives you. Then seating only areas where people are not allowed to stand. It's blindingly obvious.
Quote from: StuinSalop on January 29, 2023, 09:17:30 AM
This is precisely why you need standing areas that rail seating gives you. Then seating only areas where people are not allowed to stand. It's blindingly obvious.
Nail on head.
Seating only should never have been the way to go at PL or any other level of football and safe standing has been available throughout to satisfy the safety argument about too many people crammed into too little space is dangerous. Standing or sitting makes no difference to capacity where safe standing is provided and if you need to sit down for any reason then there is a seat just behind you if you need it and it isn't locked up. The football authorities need to look after all fans young or old and have a duty of care to do so. No wonder attendances are falling because the authorities can't be bothered to do a job properly as long as their gravy train is operating as they hoped.
I've had this problem many times in the hammy end. Stewards should do more.
Seating was bought in to make watching matches safer after the violence of the 1970s. Safe standing has been available in Europe for a good few years now and should be available here as well. I used to stand but I now need a seat as I am older and the legs aren't what they were. I don't really understand why people need to jump up as if your view is not impaired why would you? But the people in front of me jump up then I have to and it is like a domino effect. It happens in the Hammy end but does it happen all around the ground?
Quote from: StuinSalop on January 29, 2023, 09:17:30 AM
This is precisely why you need standing areas that rail seating gives you. Then seating only areas where people are not allowed to stand. It's blindingly obvious.
Agreed
Quote from: Andy S on January 29, 2023, 10:12:16 AM
Seating was bought in to make watching matches safer after the violence of the 1970s. Safe standing has been available in Europe for a good few years now and should be available here as well. I used to stand but I now need a seat as I am older and the legs aren't what they were. I don't really understand why people need to jump up as if your view is not impaired why would you? But the people in front of me jump up then I have to and it is like a domino effect. It happens in the Hammy end but does it happen all around the ground
It does
Agree and it is ridiculous that people stand up as soon as Fulham cross the halfway line, it is absolutely ridiculous, ignorant and antisocial to stand up in front of the person behind you preventing them for viewing the action and spectate showing no consideration.
In the absence of any quick fix Safe Standing has to be the answer, to allow people to sit in the seat they paid for to view the action. If any inconsiderate neanderthal stood up in front of me blocking my
view and then refuse to stay seated when asked politely.
Unfortunately for them i would not Stand for it, and i would not take it Sitting down either.
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on January 29, 2023, 10:42:40 AM
Agree and it is ridiculous that people stand up as soon as Fulham cross the halfway line, it is absolutely ridiculous, ignorant and antisocial to stand up in front of the person behind you preventing them for viewing the action and spectate showing no consideration.
In the absence of any quick fix Safe Standing has to be the answer, to allow people to sit in the seat they paid for to view the action. If any inconsiderate neanderthal stood up in front of me blocking my
view and then refuse to stay seated when asked politely.
Unfortunately for them i would not Stand for it, and i would not take it Sitting down either.
I did get a little fexated (is that a word?) Wooly
Quote from: Peabody on January 29, 2023, 10:51:19 AM
Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on January 29, 2023, 10:42:40 AM
Agree and it is ridiculous that people stand up as soon as Fulham cross the halfway line, it is absolutely ridiculous, ignorant and antisocial to stand up in front of the person behind you preventing them for viewing the action and spectate showing no consideration.
In the absence of any quick fix Safe Standing has to be the answer, to allow people to sit in the seat they paid for to view the action. If any inconsiderate neanderthal stood up in front of me blocking my
view and then refuse to stay seated when asked politely.
Unfortunately for them i would not Stand for it, and i would not take it Sitting down either.
I did get a little fexated (is that a word?) Wooly
I think the word you are thinking of Peabody is "Fixated".
Although i feel you are being harsh on yourself and my observation is that you are naturally concerned due to circumstances beyond your control at the moment.
Therefore i think there is a more appropriate word which is " absorbed " and you are not the only one.
Quote from: StuinSalop on January 29, 2023, 09:17:30 AM
This is precisely why you need standing areas that rail seating gives you. Then seating only areas where people are not allowed to stand. It's blindingly obvious.
But even with safe-standing you'll still have oriole standing up in front of oriole who might want to sit down.
Quote from: bigalffc on January 29, 2023, 10:00:35 AM
I've had this problem many times in the hammy end. Stewards should do more.
Yes I "sit" at the back of the Hammy End and it's standing for 90 minutes because the row in front are stood up...because the row in front of them are stood up, and so it goes on. It is the domino effect as someone says above.
Quote from: StuinSalop on January 29, 2023, 09:17:30 AM
This is precisely why you need standing areas that rail seating gives you. Then seating only areas where people are not allowed to stand. It's blindingly obvious.
People are not allowed to stand now, but they do.
Safe standing zones are introduced for this purpose they should buy tickets for this section if they wanna stand
It's now already starting to happen in the new stand in lower section wher I sit . Already I don't go to very many away games because of it . The club (s) seem unable or unwilling to address it . So after attending regularly since 1958 I'm thinking I may not renew my season ticket after 46 years continuous . Sad but a fact.
Quote from: StuinSalop on January 29, 2023, 09:17:30 AM
This is precisely why you need standing areas that rail seating gives you. Then seating only areas where people are not allowed to stand. It's blindingly obvious.
I won't fix the problem unfortunately, it will mitigate it somewhat, but only for those that buy tickets for the standing area, and that will then depend on the location of the said area, and cost.
Quote from: bobbo on January 29, 2023, 01:27:29 PM
It's now already starting to happen in the new stand in lower section wher I sit . Already I don't go to very many away games because of it . The club (s) seem unable or unwilling to address it . So after attending regularly since 1958 I'm thinking I may not renew my season ticket after 46 years continuous . Sad but a fact.
Very sad to hear.
Hearing this fuels the arguments I've seen on other boards that little effort is made for our diehard supporters. I really don't want to believe that they actually want to replace you (us) with people who'll pay £12 for a glass of Prosecco & some popcorn.
Appreciate the demographic on the board is probably 55+ on average but football is an emotional game and the notion that idea that fans shouldn't even stand up in a moment of excitement when we are on the attack is preposterous to me. If we take that out of football it simply wouldn't be what it is. Fulham means a lot to all of us and sometimes you can't contain your excitement. However, I agree that fans shouldn't just stand up in front of others all game and not care about who is behind them. I personally like to stand but will not do so if the person behind me asks if i can sit and do not buy tickets at the front of away games
That's very considerate of you👍. As I mentioned earlier, I always have to stand at the back of the Hammy End, but if I'm sat at an away game for example, I always like to be conscious of the person behind me if I stand...and I'll only stand if the people in front of me are. I sat in a different part of the Hammy End for the Chelsea game and actually got to sit down for a lot of it.
It happens at every club,it happens through adrenaline and excitement,you naturally jump up when you think a goals going in,I do it's just natural.
If you stay seated when a goal goes in,then you are at the wrong place, should be at the Opera not in a football ground.
I'm fed up with it and I'm in the Riverside . It's bloody ridiculous and shows no respect for others end of
Quote from: Mince n Tatties on January 29, 2023, 02:47:59 PM
It happens at every club,it happens through adrenaline and excitement,you naturally jump up when you think a goals going in,I do it's just natural.
If you stay seated when a goal goes in,then you are at the wrong place, should be at the Opera not in a football ground.
I quite agree, but I don't think that's the issue here.
Quote from: toshes mate on January 29, 2023, 09:46:18 AM
Quote from: StuinSalop on January 29, 2023, 09:17:30 AM
This is precisely why you need standing areas that rail seating gives you. Then seating only areas where people are not allowed to stand. It's blindingly obvious.
Nail on head.
Seating only should never have been the way to go at PL or any other level of football and safe standing has been available throughout to satisfy the safety argument about too many people crammed into too little space is dangerous. Standing or sitting makes no difference to capacity where safe standing is provided and if you need to sit down for any reason then there is a seat just behind you if you need it and it isn't locked up. The football authorities need to look after all fans young or old and have a duty of care to do so. No wonder attendances are falling because the authorities can't be bothered to do a job properly as long as their gravy train is operating as they hoped.
Agree with this. I would always prefer to stand at a game if possible but realise not everyone wants to, or can. All should be catered for imo..
The only issues with safestanding is that we would have to have the barriers installed in front of every seat affected, and then have a big overhaul of who has season tickets where, i.e. move people who currently have season tickets in the area that becomes safestanding who want to sit in that area. Could cause a lot of problems moving people who've been sitting there for years.
Standing up or sitting down - makes no difference to me. At 5 foot 4 inches I still can't see! If I can get in to the opposition area it is better as they don't stand up when I do! A bit risky but at 82 I think they take pity on me.
No one complained about it for the decades it was all standing?
I feel for the OP, but in reality seated (Sit Down) areas are the JH and Riverside, behind the goals is typically standing, and hopefully will return to safe standing in the near future. I am no longer classed as a youngster, and certainly the legs are not what they used to be, but I dont see an issue with the standing in the back 30 plus rows that I currently see.
Because everyone stood as it was a terrace, no-one had the option to sit down and find themselves unable to see.
That may be how it's become, but it's not officially like that - it's all-seater, end of. As I've mentioned earlier, I find myself having to stand for the whole game every game at the back of the Hammy End, I've no major problem with it, but others might have.
So what we need are some safe standing areas at the back and compulsory sitting areas at the front.
The sitting ones could have lap bars like those on chairlifts or theme parks which are only released at half and full time. Would stop the annoyance of late arrivals and those irritants who leave a few minutes before half time to get in the beer/pee queues too....
Put the standing area in the putney stand. Guarantee its what standing people deserve. Plus it still won't solve the problem of people selfishly standing despite people behind them not having a choice at times.
Quote from: General on January 30, 2023, 10:09:34 AM
Put the standing area in the putney stand. Guarantee its what standing people deserve. Plus it still won't solve the problem of people selfishly standing despite people behind them not having a choice at times.
Cant see that happening as it'll likely attract the gobby kids giving it to the away fans and there is no segregation in the concourse below
Quote from: KentFulham on January 30, 2023, 08:20:43 AM
No one complained about it for the decades it was all standing?
I feel for the OP, but in reality seated (Sit Down) areas are the JH and Riverside, behind the goals is typically standing, and hopefully will return to safe standing in the near future. I am no longer classed as a youngster, and certainly the legs are not what they used to be, but I dont see an issue with the standing in the back 30 plus rows that I currently see.
Once (at a ground I will not name) I was, as a unaccompanied 10 year old with same age friends, lifted over the concrete barrier and placed on the dog racing track with a whole host of other kids simply because the place was jam packed full. Funny how standing only people seemed to care in those days ... but segregating sitters and standers is going to cause all manner of upheaval! I am just happy to see live football and enjoy the atmosphere and if I miss something then these days I'll make sure to watch the full match video when and if I can something I couldn't do as a kid. Just wish football was still as cheap as chips and people showed genuine respect.
Quote from: Mince n Tatties on January 29, 2023, 02:47:59 PM
It happens at every club,it happens through adrenaline and excitement,you naturally jump up when you think a goals going in,I do it's just natural.
If you stay seated when a goal goes in,then you are at the wrong place, should be at the Opera not in a football ground.
Agree
Quote from: ffcthereligion on January 29, 2023, 02:06:19 PM
Appreciate the demographic on the board is probably 55+ on average but football is an emotional game and the notion that idea that fans shouldn't even stand up in a moment of excitement when we are on the attack is preposterous to me. If we take that out of football it simply wouldn't be what it is. Fulham means a lot to all of us and sometimes you can't contain your excitement. However, I agree that fans shouldn't just stand up in front of others all game and not care about who is behind them. I personally like to stand but will not do so if the person behind me asks if i can sit and do not buy tickets at the front of away games
Agree
Quote from: @jolslover on January 30, 2023, 11:33:34 AM
Quote from: ffcthereligion on January 29, 2023, 02:06:19 PM
Appreciate the demographic on the board is probably 55+ on average but football is an emotional game and the notion that idea that fans shouldn't even stand up in a moment of excitement when we are on the attack is preposterous to me. If we take that out of football it simply wouldn't be what it is. Fulham means a lot to all of us and sometimes you can't contain your excitement. However, I agree that fans shouldn't just stand up in front of others all game and not care about who is behind them. I personally like to stand but will not do so if the person behind me asks if i can sit and do not buy tickets at the front of away games
Agree
But that's not the point nor the argument. Of course when things get exciting and in an attack fair enough. It's people who don't know the nuance of this and stand up in front of everyone for as much of the game as possible. Don't do it.
Quote from: KentFulham on January 30, 2023, 08:20:43 AM
No one complained about it for the decades it was all standing?
I feel for the OP, but in reality seated (Sit Down) areas are the JH and Riverside, behind the goals is typically standing, and hopefully will return to safe standing in the near future. I am no longer classed as a youngster, and certainly the legs are not what they used to be, but I dont see an issue with the standing in the back 30 plus rows that I currently see.
Like the idea of putting the designated standing areas at the back of the stand. That'd be a good compromise.
Quote from: General on January 30, 2023, 11:57:21 AM
Quote from: @jolslover on January 30, 2023, 11:33:34 AM
Quote from: ffcthereligion on January 29, 2023, 02:06:19 PM
Appreciate the demographic on the board is probably 55+ on average but football is an emotional game and the notion that idea that fans shouldn't even stand up in a moment of excitement when we are on the attack is preposterous to me. If we take that out of football it simply wouldn't be what it is. Fulham means a lot to all of us and sometimes you can't contain your excitement. However, I agree that fans shouldn't just stand up in front of others all game and not care about who is behind them. I personally like to stand but will not do so if the person behind me asks if i can sit and do not buy tickets at the front of away games
Agree
But that's not the point nor the argument. Of course when things get exciting and in an attack fair enough. It's people who don't know the nuance of this and stand up in front of everyone for as much of the game as possible. Don't do it.
With respect posters have on this thread gone as far to say that fans standing up 'as soon as we cross the halfway line' ie in an attacking moment, or at all in the riverside should not be be doing so, and that there is no need to do so anyway as your view of the attack doesn't change sitting down. So i think that point IS being made and I think that can be challenged
Even if there becomes standing areas I feel sure it will still go on where it's not standing . No stewards at any club will enforce it . At Southampton about 3 years back our fans stood in front of me I asked politely for them to sit , they ignored me it said on thesoton ticket standing will not be tolerated . The steward said I know we can't stop it though.
