Midfield looking a lot better ...

[MrFFC]

Replacements have been found for our centre midfielders from last season whether they are an improvement on last season is another matter

Sidwell and Baird have remained
Diarra for Murphy
Tavares for Etuhu
Karagounis for Gecov

The only player not replaced is Mousa Dembele who will never be replaced by anyone better he is a top class player, was thinking realistically who could we go for with the money with have I see some good options being

Palacios
Huddlestone
Brama

There any other targets we should be looking at?

[Ordar]

Anyone know who played under Jol at Ajax and Hamburg in CM?

I still think Joe Ledley could do a job for us.

I was actually thinking about the striker overhaul that Jols made. From Johnson, Zamora and Sa at the start of last season to Berbatov, Petric and Rodellaga now. That is a MASSIVE improvement. I dont know exactly how many league goals the former trio got last year, but the new 3 must be close to passing that total already?

[alexbishop]

When you put it like that it does seem healthier...just very concerned about the Greek and Tavares stepping up to the premiership.

Hopefully Jol can perform a miracle with Richardson and convert him into a Dembele replacement. He may not have Dembele's dribbling ability but be has some and has strength and a degree of pace to.

[BishopsParkFantastic]

Jol (apparently in complete denial about the possibility of the Dems' departure) completely misjudged and mishandled the summer transfer window, by failing to address our midfield priorities – to ensure that, by the start of the new season, we would have a strong central midfield with two regular 1st Team, high quality premiership players, filling the 'holding, defensive' and 'attacking, creative' positions, with squad players to back-up. The result....... our midfield is now stuffed full of short term, unfit, inconsistent and under-performing players:
   Sidwell and Baird – squad players (in my view) as back-up for CM positions
   Diarra – on one year contract, the one quality CM player; injured, and out for how long?
   Karagounis – on one year contract; unfit, and will he ever play a full match?
   Tavares  –  on a 'short term deal'. Played 13 matches on loan with Championship    Middlesborough in 2010/11, then went back to    
       Hamburg for the 2011/12 season where he was consigned to playing for the 2nd Team for the whole of the season, then released.
   All of these players will be aged 30 years or over by the end of 2012

This is a 'short term deals', 'filling holes' and no futures strategy by jol. No real quality and no creativity in our CM – the 'engine room' for our Team. Why is this significant? This season, Under-21 players at the club are NOT being given 1st Team opportunities (as people have been suggesting). Our Under-21 Team is now being filled by under-21s and over-age players from the 1st Team squad! Our 1st Team squad is being filled by 'short term contract/deal' players, and that may limit positive signings we can make in January (?). We can only hope that we can keep clear of the bottom three positions of the division before we reach  January!

The whole 1st Team situation is shambolic and short-term  – resulting from Jol's
misjudgements/miscalculations in the summer transfer window – where I started from.......and, of course I would like things to be different.

[PokerMatt]

Shambolic? Chill out.

I'd much rather Jol signed a few stop-gap measures until January than bring in the wrong player on silly money and a long-term deal.

As Ordar says he's worked wonders with the attack and I have faith he'll do the same with the centre of midfield. After all we've lost Dempsey who wasn't a centre-mid anyway and Murphy is old anyway so wasn't a long-term player for us any more.

[MrFFC]

Jol (apparently in complete denial about the possibility of the Dems' departure) completely misjudged and mishandled the summer transfer window, by failing to address our midfield priorities – to ensure that, by the start of the new season, we would have a strong central midfield with two regular 1st Team, high quality premiership players, filling the 'holding, defensive' and 'attacking, creative' positions, with squad players to back-up. The result....... our midfield is now stuffed full of short term, unfit, inconsistent and under-performing players:
   Sidwell and Baird – squad players (in my view) as back-up for CM positions
   Diarra – on one year contract, the one quality CM player; injured, and out for how long?
   Karagounis – on one year contract; unfit, and will he ever play a full match?
   Tavares  –  on a 'short term deal'. Played 13 matches on loan with Championship    Middlesborough in 2010/11, then went back to     
        Hamburg for the 2011/12 season where he was consigned to playing for the 2nd Team for the whole of the season, then released.
   All of these players will be aged 30 years or over by the end of 2012

This is a 'short term deals', 'filling holes' and no futures strategy by jol. No real quality and no creativity in our CM – the 'engine room' for our Team. Why is this significant? This season, Under-21 players at the club are NOT being given 1st Team opportunities (as people have been suggesting). Our Under-21 Team is now being filled by under-21s and over-age players from the 1st Team squad! Our 1st Team squad is being filled by 'short term contract/deal' players, and that may limit positive signings we can make in January (?). We can only hope that we can keep clear of the bottom three positions of the division before we reach  January!

The whole 1st Team situation is shambolic and short-term  – resulting from Jol's
misjudgements/miscalculations in the summer transfer window – where I started from.......and, of course I would like things to be different.

What? Your obviously a QPR fan what tosh, yeah Jol made a mistake but he believed Dembele would stay, Karagounis yes is old but looked good in euro's can do a job and don't write Tavares off before he has played, Diarra Sidwell and Baird are all good players we will be fine Jol has brought players like Riise Ruiz Diarra Petric Berbatov Rodallega to us we have a squad full of quality 5 years ago we did not have even a quarter of the class we have now

[MJG]

Come January he will go and get a couple of CM's. Short term deals I don't mind and im sure they are cheap.things just conspired to leave us a little in the mess we are.
Someone like Mark Davies in January and all our views would change.

[kiwiwaka]

Jol knew Dempsey was going, and imo we didn't need to replace him as we have Kaca/Frei. Dembele was a shock to him and us all (we expected it, but not so quickly and so close to the end of the window). Jol said the day before I think it was that he didn't expect Dembele to go, and suddenly Spurs sold Modric and freed up the cash to pay his clause which for a years contract was very high especially for a club like this. We did not have enough time to replace him. We are just lucky we already had a very technically good player in Ruiz which has softened the blow in terms of replacing Dembele.

We now have a lot of spare cash and the time to evaluate where to spend it. We shouldn't rush into expensive deals, let the ages run down a bit and replace with quality. Someone U25 for a decent price in January or in the Summer to replace someone in midfield and we're probably OK. Long term we probably need to look at another right winger (after Dejegah) and center back but I think we're looking pretty good considering the small amount of cash spent.

[Lighthouse]

The Dems going was no shock to Jol. He was well aware he could lose Dembele and wanted to replace all those that have gone by better players than the very passed it players and not up to it players. But for what ever reason the powers that be, the MD etc didn't or couldn't come through. Now I am not Jols greatest fan but can we stop blaming him for not bringing in players. That isn't HIS job.

Trying to play with what he has is Jols job. Trying to tell the powers that be what players he needs to bring in is his job. At no point (and no I have no written or recorded evidence) did Jol say in case we lose our best players let's just go for very bow legged or old bow legged players on free transfers. Jols only mistake was alienating enough players so they wanted to leave before being replaced.

[Jack Fulham]

Jol (apparently in complete denial about the possibility of the Dems' departure) completely misjudged and mishandled the summer transfer window, by failing to address our midfield priorities – to ensure that, by the start of the new season, we would have a strong central midfield with two regular 1st Team, high quality premiership players, filling the 'holding, defensive' and 'attacking, creative' positions, with squad players to back-up. The result....... our midfield is now stuffed full of short term, unfit, inconsistent and under-performing players:
   Sidwell and Baird – squad players (in my view) as back-up for CM positions
   Diarra – on one year contract, the one quality CM player; injured, and out for how long?
   Karagounis – on one year contract; unfit, and will he ever play a full match?
   Tavares  –  on a 'short term deal'. Played 13 matches on loan with Championship    Middlesborough in 2010/11, then went back to     
        Hamburg for the 2011/12 season where he was consigned to playing for the 2nd Team for the whole of the season, then released.
   All of these players will be aged 30 years or over by the end of 2012

This is a 'short term deals', 'filling holes' and no futures strategy by jol. No real quality and no creativity in our CM – the 'engine room' for our Team. Why is this significant? This season, Under-21 players at the club are NOT being given 1st Team opportunities (as people have been suggesting). Our Under-21 Team is now being filled by under-21s and over-age players from the 1st Team squad! Our 1st Team squad is being filled by 'short term contract/deal' players, and that may limit positive signings we can make in January (?). We can only hope that we can keep clear of the bottom three positions of the division before we reach  January!

The whole 1st Team situation is shambolic and short-term  – resulting from Jol's
misjudgements/miscalculations in the summer transfer window – where I started from.......and, of course I would like things to be different.

Not sure it's complete denial of their departure, of course with Dempsey, he was always going to go. Dembele we weren't so sure but then the Modric transfer happened and so Spurs had money to play with and a gap to fill. Dembele would most likely still be here if Modric stayed at Spurs. It all well and good saying these players should be replaced by quality but obviously these players are of high calibre and we're not going to sell them until we got a reasonable price although in Dembele's case it was a release clause. Sadly they didn't go until the very end of the window which gave us little time to sign replacements, particularly replacements of quality and other clubs aware of our recently banked 20 million could rip us off in a sense because they would know we were desperate. It's easy to blame Jol for this but sadly it is the nature of the transfer window that put us in this position.

[cmg]

Jol (apparently in complete denial about the possibility of the Dems' departure) completely misjudged and mishandled the summer transfer window, by failing to address our midfield priorities – to ensure that, by the start of the new season, we would have a strong central midfield with two regular 1st Team, high quality premiership players, filling the 'holding, defensive' and 'attacking, creative' positions, with squad players to back-up. The result....... our midfield is now stuffed full of short term, unfit, inconsistent and under-performing players:
   Sidwell and Baird – squad players (in my view) as back-up for CM positions
   Diarra – on one year contract, the one quality CM player; injured, and out for how long?
   Karagounis – on one year contract; unfit, and will he ever play a full match?
   Tavares  –  on a 'short term deal'. Played 13 matches on loan with Championship    Middlesborough in 2010/11, then went back to     
        Hamburg for the 2011/12 season where he was consigned to playing for the 2nd Team for the whole of the season, then released.
   All of these players will be aged 30 years or over by the end of 2012

This is a 'short term deals', 'filling holes' and no futures strategy by jol. No real quality and no creativity in our CM – the 'engine room' for our Team. Why is this significant? This season, Under-21 players at the club are NOT being given 1st Team opportunities (as people have been suggesting). Our Under-21 Team is now being filled by under-21s and over-age players from the 1st Team squad! Our 1st Team squad is being filled by 'short term contract/deal' players, and that may limit positive signings we can make in January (?). We can only hope that we can keep clear of the bottom three positions of the division before we reach  January!

The whole 1st Team situation is shambolic and short-term  – resulting from Jol's
misjudgements/miscalculations in the summer transfer window – where I started from.......and, of course I would like things to be different.

What? Your obviously a QPR fan what tosh, yeah Jol made a mistake but he believed Dembele would stay, Karagounis yes is old but looked good in euro's can do a job and don't write Tavares off before he has played, Diarra Sidwell and Baird are all good players we will be fine Jol has brought players like Riise Ruiz Diarra Petric Berbatov Rodallega to us we have a squad full of quality 5 years ago we did not have even a quarter of the class we have now

Although I do not share the bleakness of BishopParkFantastic's view of the current situation, nor agree with his vehement condemnation of Jol, I think it is grotesquely unfair to label him with the ultimate insult ("QPR supporter") just because he is unhappy with the manager's activity (or rather lack of it).

His analysis of the situation has much to be said for it and, although I would say that Jol lost a not unreasonable gamble that we could retain Dembele and that he probably tried to replace Murph, but was unable to do so (it was always going to be very difficult), I feel he is quite entitled to his robust criticism. I disagree with him - but this is not Uncle Joe's USSR, comrades. 

[Burt]

Jol (apparently in complete denial about the possibility of the Dems' departure) completely misjudged and mishandled the summer transfer window, by failing to address our midfield priorities – to ensure that, by the start of the new season, we would have a strong central midfield with two regular 1st Team, high quality premiership players, filling the 'holding, defensive' and 'attacking, creative' positions, with squad players to back-up. The result....... our midfield is now stuffed full of short term, unfit, inconsistent and under-performing players:
   Sidwell and Baird – squad players (in my view) as back-up for CM positions
   Diarra – on one year contract, the one quality CM player; injured, and out for how long?
   Karagounis – on one year contract; unfit, and will he ever play a full match?
   Tavares  –  on a 'short term deal'. Played 13 matches on loan with Championship    Middlesborough in 2010/11, then went back to     
        Hamburg for the 2011/12 season where he was consigned to playing for the 2nd Team for the whole of the season, then released.
   All of these players will be aged 30 years or over by the end of 2012

This is a 'short term deals', 'filling holes' and no futures strategy by jol. No real quality and no creativity in our CM – the 'engine room' for our Team. Why is this significant? This season, Under-21 players at the club are NOT being given 1st Team opportunities (as people have been suggesting). Our Under-21 Team is now being filled by under-21s and over-age players from the 1st Team squad! Our 1st Team squad is being filled by 'short term contract/deal' players, and that may limit positive signings we can make in January (?). We can only hope that we can keep clear of the bottom three positions of the division before we reach  January!

The whole 1st Team situation is shambolic and short-term  – resulting from Jol's
misjudgements/miscalculations in the summer transfer window – where I started from.......and, of course I would like things to be different.

What? Your obviously a QPR fan what tosh, yeah Jol made a mistake but he believed Dembele would stay, Karagounis yes is old but looked good in euro's can do a job and don't write Tavares off before he has played, Diarra Sidwell and Baird are all good players we will be fine Jol has brought players like Riise Ruiz Diarra Petric Berbatov Rodallega to us we have a squad full of quality 5 years ago we did not have even a quarter of the class we have now

Although I do not share the bleakness of BishopParkFantastic's view of the current situation, nor agree with his vehement condemnation of Jol, I think it is grotesquely unfair to label him with the ultimate insult ("QPR supporter") just because he is unhappy with the manager's activity (or rather lack of it).

His analysis of the situation has much to be said for it and, although I would say that Jol lost a not unreasonable gamble that we could retain Dembele and that he probably tried to replace Murph, but was unable to do so (it was always going to be very difficult), I feel he is quite entitled to his robust criticism. I disagree with him - but this is not Uncle Joe's USSR, comrades. 

Agree... I know that Mr BishopsParkFantastic has been following the whites for 50+ years and can't possibly be a QPR fan given he boycotted Loftus Road during the ground share years.

By all means disagree, but lets avoid the insults please.

[LordNelson]

Jol (apparently in complete denial about the possibility of the Dems' departure) completely misjudged and mishandled the summer transfer window, by failing to address our midfield priorities – to ensure that, by the start of the new season, we would have a strong central midfield with two regular 1st Team, high quality premiership players, filling the 'holding, defensive' and 'attacking, creative' positions, with squad players to back-up. The result....... our midfield is now stuffed full of short term, unfit, inconsistent and under-performing players:
   Sidwell and Baird – squad players (in my view) as back-up for CM positions
   Diarra – on one year contract, the one quality CM player; injured, and out for how long?
   Karagounis – on one year contract; unfit, and will he ever play a full match?
   Tavares  –  on a 'short term deal'. Played 13 matches on loan with Championship    Middlesborough in 2010/11, then went back to    
       Hamburg for the 2011/12 season where he was consigned to playing for the 2nd Team for the whole of the season, then released.
   All of these players will be aged 30 years or over by the end of 2012

This is a 'short term deals', 'filling holes' and no futures strategy by jol. No real quality and no creativity in our CM – the 'engine room' for our Team. Why is this significant? This season, Under-21 players at the club are NOT being given 1st Team opportunities (as people have been suggesting). Our Under-21 Team is now being filled by under-21s and over-age players from the 1st Team squad! Our 1st Team squad is being filled by 'short term contract/deal' players, and that may limit positive signings we can make in January (?). We can only hope that we can keep clear of the bottom three positions of the division before we reach  January!

The whole 1st Team situation is shambolic and short-term  – resulting from Jol's
misjudgements/miscalculations in the summer transfer window – where I started from.......and, of course I would like things to be different.

I agree our current central midfield situation is our Achilles heel so to speak. However, if you look at it in the long term, I believe it is a work in progress/stop gap. We seemed to have gotten a handle on our forwards/ strikers.  I'm sure MJ will be working to strengthen CM positions as well.  Good post though.

[HatterDon]

I don't know any other way to say this, but our midfield is much weaker and much shallower than it was last season. I don't know why that isn't obvious to other people.

We've lost 4 key members of last season's midfield and have only signed on three replacements -- two of whom are only here because they couldn't find a job anywhere in the summer.

[MJG]

I don't know any other way to say this, but our midfield is much weaker and much shallower than it was last season. I don't know why that isn't obvious to other people.

We've lost 4 key members of last season's midfield and have only signed on three replacements -- two of whom are only here because they couldn't find a job anywhere in the summer.

when you talk about midfield do you mean CM or are you including the wide men.
We still have Duff. Dempsey has gone but we have 3 or 4 players who can play wise left.
Diarra was a first choice towards the end last season and still here.Etuhu was out of favour, Murphy being subbed everygame.Dembele is the only missing player from cm. Yes we are patched up a little central wise but get to Jan and will be fine.

[HatterDon]

I don't know any other way to say this, but our midfield is much weaker and much shallower than it was last season. I don't know why that isn't obvious to other people.

We've lost 4 key members of last season's midfield and have only signed on three replacements -- two of whom are only here because they couldn't find a job anywhere in the summer.

when you talk about midfield do you mean CM or are you including the wide men.
We still have Duff. Dempsey has gone but we have 3 or 4 players who can play wise left.
Diarra was a first choice towards the end last season and still here.Etuhu was out of favour, Murphy being subbed everygame.Dembele is the only missing player from cm. Yes we are patched up a little central wise but get to Jan and will be fine.

Well, I certainly can't argue that if we can hold on to January, we'll improve. The problem is that our depth -- based upon quality squad players who can come onwhen needed -- has been exposed. We're starting Sidwell, Baird, and Kacaniklic ... all good players, but all players who -- if we had the strength we had last season -- would NOT be starting.

Richardson and Diarra coming back healthy SOON will give us some depth, but it's going to take a very good January to give us the strength and diversity we had last season.