Liverpool v Fulham match thread

[ScalleysDad]

IT'S ENOUGH TO MAKE AN ONION CRY !!!!!!

Just to break the chain of malaise a moment.
is the somerset cockernee set to be flooded out? in exeter we have water water everywhere and the trains are screwed again

[Logicalman]

Can we stick hangeland as a CM next game just for fun? Our defence can't get much worse.

Lets stick him up front with Berbie, then maybe some enthusiasm might rub off on him and he might remember why he wears that white shirt each week, and gets paid poops-load of dosh to do so.

[ffcbulgaria]

Put Schwarzer alongside him. After all, we need someone with an eye for a pass.

He passes to the opposition most of the time. However the Hangeland idea might be useful!

[Logicalman]

This has been a Christmas performance. We've been well and truly stuffed.

More like a Panto I would say

[craig10]

P!ss poor yet again! Not happy. Does Berbatov actually want to play for us.....?

Are you actually watching this game??

I'm not. Are you suggesting otherwise? I hope so

Well he looks a little disillusioned with proceedings, but he's certainly contributing and is the best player in a white shirt on the field.

complete rubbish

[Oakeshott]

There are three separate issues:

1) are our players, individually, good enough for the Premiership?

2) are our players deployed to best advantage?

3) are our players motivated/de-motivated?

My concern is NOT (1). Obviously losing both Demps. and Dembele at the end of the transfer window weakened our squad, but we still have plenty of decent players including, arguably, the best back four we have had for a while as well as the best striker we've had since Saha went to Man United and arguably before that. With two key midfield players rarely able to play due to injuries, we are weak there, but one good signing would substantially remedy that (and wouldn't of course have been necessary had our management been more on the ball).

I believe the problem lies not with the calibre of our players but in (2) and (3) and responsibility for that lies squarely with the manager. Jol may have a vision about the football he would like to see us play, but what delivers results is using the players we've actually got effectively. Our defence, excellent under Roy and Hughes, now looks fragile and no side does well in the Premiership with a fragile defence. And as regards man management and motivation, it has been obvious from very early on that Jol is a complete lemon.

[TheDaddy]

Oh we'll there's always Christmas Day to look forward too.

[ffcbulgaria]

Only positive from today >>>

Last time we lost to Liverpool by 4 we beat Chelsea 1-0 next game.

[Swedish Terrier]

Can we stick hangeland as a CM next game just for fun? Our defence can't get much worse.

Put Schwarzer alongside him. After all, we need someone with an eye for a pass.

 

[grandad]

Midfield,midfield, midfield, midfield. We don´t have one even with 5 today who were supposed to do this job.. What we have do not take pressure off our defence & don´t supply anything to our strikers.

[God The Mechanic]

I believe the problem lies not with the calibre of our players but in (2) and (3) and responsibility for that lies squarely with the manager. Jol may have a vision about the football he would like to see us play, but what delivers results is using the players we've actually got effectively. Our defence, excellent under Roy and Hughes, now looks fragile and no side does well in the Premiership with a fragile defence. And as regards man management and motivation, it has been obvious from very early on that Jol is a complete lemon.

Surely part of the problem is also, therefore, Jol not being given enough funding to buy the players to fit his style.  If you buy into a manager, you buy into his style and if you do hat then you have to back it up with buying the correct players if they are not already at the club.  He has had 3 transfer windows and more important layers have left than joined, that HAS to e down to the powers that be above Jol.

Also, he back 4 are not the best in x years.  At their peak they were, but their peaks are: Schwarzer - a good few years ago; Hangeland - probably 2 years ago; Hughes - likewise 2 years ago or so; Riise and Reither - before they ere at Fulham.  They are not what they once were!

[Matt Inglis]

Put Schwarzer alongside him. After all, we need someone with an eye for a pass.

He passes to the opposition most of the time. However the Hangeland idea might be useful!

But then we'd have to play Senderos!!

[craig10]

we are Fulham NOT man united.... we dont have most possession or 20 shots a game. we dont have the quality of them and require ALL 10 outfield players to work their socks off for 90mins...

as much as i admire Berba's ability on the ball, off the ball the man is a joke..... he passes then stands still(school boy), he doesnt close down the nearest man and doesnt show much interest in working hard.

feel free to come at me for my comments but i have a few recordnings of games i will happily send to u

i am not comparing us to barca but despite all their passing and skill it is their off the ball work that allows them to be the best in the world... they dont stop running, they are rarely without the ball for more than 10 seconds and the off the ball runs are incredible... as i said im not comparing us to barca but they show how working hard AS A TEAM can make u very hard to play against

im not just bashing Berba but he is the one out of the 11 that rarely has a bad word against him and sometimes i think having a player like him at a club like ous can actually have a negative effect

[craig10]

i expect to be slated for my previou comment but actually see it for hat it is....

i am a fan of Berba but as class as he is he must work hard off the ball.... he wont get the chances he got at unted and doesnt have the midfield he had at united

[deeffc]

Against Sunderland Berbatov was all round class. He made runs, he challenged in the air, he closed down and he almost single handedly kept us in that game. He and Ruiz were working together hardly using anyone else but playing to each others strengths. If we can get back to playing in a way that involves Berbatov he'll keep his interest in a game and he'll get involved in it. It is frustrating that he requires that kind of attention but that's the way he is, which we knew all along. Frankly we're better off without him than playing in a way that doesn't suit him, but he is good enough that tailoring the side to suit him is worthwhile.

[craig10]

Against Sunderland Berbatov was all round class. He made runs, he challenged in the air, he closed down and he almost single handedly kept us in that game. He and Ruiz were working together hardly using anyone else but playing to each others strengths. If we can get back to playing in a way that involves Berbatov he'll keep his interest in a game and he'll get involved in it. It is frustrating that he requires that kind of attention but that's the way he is, which we knew all along. Frankly we're better off without him than playing in a way that doesn't suit him, but he is good enough that tailoring the side to suit him is worthwhile.

yh i agree... dont recall him being good against sunderland i must say....
against Reading he and ruiz looked good though but as u say just between the 2 of them.
i have to say, playing our way without him we would (like u say) be better but i wouldnt go back to August and not sign him just pull him to one side and try to get more out of him off the ball as we dont have the ball as much as he is used to especially away from home

[craig10]

Against Sunderland Berbatov was all round class. He made runs, he challenged in the air, he closed down and he almost single handedly kept us in that game. He and Ruiz were working together hardly using anyone else but playing to each others strengths. If we can get back to playing in a way that involves Berbatov he'll keep his interest in a game and he'll get involved in it. It is frustrating that he requires that kind of attention but that's the way he is, which we knew all along. Frankly we're better off without him than playing in a way that doesn't suit him, but he is good enough that tailoring the side to suit him is worthwhile.

yh i agree... dont recall him being good against sunderland i must say....
against Reading he and ruiz looked good though but as u say just between the 2 of them.
i have to say, playing our way without him we would (like u say) be better but i wouldnt go back to August and not sign him just pull him to one side and try to get more out of him off the ball as we dont have the ball as much as he is used to especially away from home

his debut against West Brom i was very impressed with how he worked off the ball but its no good only doing that when we are winning

[ScalleysDad]

Against Sunderland Berbatov was all round class. He made runs, he challenged in the air, he closed down and he almost single handedly kept us in that game. He and Ruiz were working together hardly using anyone else but playing to each others strengths. If we can get back to playing in a way that involves Berbatov he'll keep his interest in a game and he'll get involved in it. It is frustrating that he requires that kind of attention but that's the way he is, which we knew all along. Frankly we're better off without him than playing in a way that doesn't suit him, but he is good enough that tailoring the side to suit him is worthwhile.

True but. Back in the early days even when under seige the slap on the back he gave out to the likes of kaca and Dejagah would have been inspiring. I remember him talking to Kaca and telling him and showing him how to lay the ball off earlier. This has stopped as he has become more and more insular on the pitch.

[deeffc]

That's my point though, he's that kind of player that will take a strop if he isn't getting the ball enough, if other people mess up, if decisions go against him etc. The problem is that we are compounding that by playing with him basically out of position, he isn't happy and he gives off. If we can keep him happy by giving him the ball when he wants it then he's much more likely to produce an all round good performance. If we can't then maybe we're better off without him in the side if he's going to show his frustration negatively.