Re: Fulhams scouting system

[btings]

Interest to see the opinions on this article, and whether they are similar to mine...

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/blog/_/name/fulham/id/498?cc=5739 zx

It remains one of football's dark arts. Just how do Europe's top clubs run their scouting networks? We anoraks may think we know all there is about our clubs -- history, players birthdays, statistics ad nauseam. But I'd lay good money there's no more than a handful of Fulham supporters out there who could name a single individual currently working on the club's behalf to unearth the next golden boy. Imagine the weight of responsibility on their shoulders -- these shadowy figures really do have the fate of the football club in their hands.

- Fulham sign Twente's David

In fact, let me throw out the challenge. I confess to being entirely in the dark on this one. As football in now a global business being played for high stakes with ever mounting waves of television cash, can anyone tell me how widespread Fulham's scouting network actually is?

A look at the roster over recent years would suggest nobody is watching soccer down in South America on our behalf. Now I will admit that's one heck of a territory to cover. I've reported on the game in Brazil, Argentina and Paraguay and done a few Copa America commentaries in my time. I know for a fact there is an awful lot of football being played, to the point of overkill.

The breathtaking Brazilian sides from '58 onwards cast a long shadow. There's no space here to list the cast of luminaries who have flown north to grace the European stage. But once the English Premier League found itself in the money, a decade ago managers began showing a preference for Argentinians. They not only had the skill of their samba dancing neighbours, but also combined a more muscular and physical presence from playing half a season through the South American winter. Think Gabriel Batistuta or Juan Sebastian Veron.

Flick through the records and you'll find plenty of stellar names from the smaller nations too. Why, we even have a couple on the books at Fulham -- a Colombian and a Costa Rican. Yes, it's a tall order, even for the richest of clubs, to maintain a watching brief across a dozen nations and a vast territory.

But there are solutions to every problem. You would be amazed at how unsophisticated so much high level scouting is. Both Jol and former manager Mark Hughes simply listen to names put forward by their own agent. The laziest of methods, and look what damage that did to QPR's business plan!

Agents routinely rely on match coverage DVDs to promote their clients. Claims as to a player's character, provenance, medical history, date of birth etc. are often sketchy and must be listened to with great caution. Any top manager worth his salt should spend half his week tuning in to all the major league coverage easily accessible via internet and satellite TV. I know Arsene Wenger routinely does.

Okay, so not every manager has the same single-minded dedication to the job as Arsene, a singular individual for sure. But here's a cut-price answer to the conundrum for you. I would start by calling Tim Vickery in Brazil. As the BBC correspondent down there, he knows more about football in Latin America than anyone else, and he's a thoroughly nice guy. Secondly, many of the TV rights contracts for Latin America are handled through Miami. GolTV is a big player in the U.S., airing 500 live games a year. There's a few ex-Fulham players living now in Florida. Get them watching the coverage and start filing!

I have said before on this blog that Fulham ignore the football landscape of Iberia at their peril. You have seen FIFA this week name their all-star eleven of the year on the back of Lionel Messi picking up the Ballon d'Or. Every single player named plays in La Liga. There is no excuse for Fulham not having a proactive scout based in Barcelona or Madrid. I speak some Spanish and have a property 90 minutes from Barcelona. In the past, I've had my own 'Primera Liga' satellite soccer show. Mr. Mackintosh, give me a call and we'll get the ball rolling.

Now I must get back to the subject matter of my title. Here for your delectation is Fulham's current approach to recruitment from what evidence I can gather. It is not surprisingly a low-cost operation based on the shakiest of foundations. At Motspur the club possess an ever-growing DVD library of matches. The current strategy is to trawl through the tapes, and with the help of player input, recall anyone who ever vaguely made an impact when playing against us. Hence the arrival of John Arne Riise, Ashkan Dejagah, Sascha Riether and now Derek Boateng. Sadly the boys on the job have yet to get to the DVD of the Hamburg loss to Atletico Madrid. "It's still too raw for us to watch, do they have some good players?" a club spokesman told me.

While I know some supporters are getting anxious at the lack of transfer activity to date, I have positive news.
Sources tell me it is only a matter of days before we snap up Runavik's teenage sensation left back and Crusaders veteran striker Rory Moynihan. The 37-year-old Belfast plumber is said to be closing in on a four year deal that Martin Jol insists will solve Fulham's striker crisis and realise Dimitar Berbatov's full potential. To all followers of Fulham I say, keep the faith. Happy days are here again!


I will read just about every bit of useless nonsense about Fulham that I can find, but I never read Philip Mison.

(That said, I don't know anything about our scouting network.  I wouldn't be surprised if it could be improved.)

[Jambo]

An article based purely in his head.  What part of this whole "story" is known for a fact?  I mean apart from the people within the club who knows how many scouts we have and where they are based in the world??  I've read Mr Mison a few times and when things are good he struggles to write anything worth reading but if he can jump on potential negative take on Fulham he will.

[Apprentice to the Maestro]

We have picked up a lot of well regarded youth players so there must be at least one active scout with a bicycle.

[alexbishop]

Philip Mison is a good writer and has been in journalism for donkeys years.

The article is clearly written with tongue firmly pressed in cheek but he raises some provocative points.

Our scouting range at senior level does seem fairly limited. The effect of our youth scouting policy will only be seen in the next 5 years or so.

[CurryForMario]

I think we do manage to sign some half decent players though - Kerim Frei, Kacaniklic, David, etc.

[elgreenio]

absolute drivel that.

[leonffc]

I think we do manage to sign some half decent players though - Kerim Frei, Kacaniklic, David, etc.

Yes but is this 'scouting for youth'?

In my mind it is simply taking known good talent from other clubs. Kaca was a well know starlet at Liverpool. Why they let him go is anyone's guess but can our scouting system really take credit for his recruitment? The same with Chris David? It's not unearthing talent - its taking / buying it from other clubs.
We seem to be doing a lot of this. Arsenals famous academy is built mostly on kids 'stolen' from other clubs.

To me, scouting youth is finding that starlet in grass roots soccer, seeing a kid on a park pitch and realising he/she has something you can nurture.
The problem is nowadays is that big clubs are allowed to go in and plunder smaller academies and take players out after that club have spent time and money on a particular child.
Cauley Woodrow isn't really a product of our youth scouting. He was getting rave reviews at 16 playing for Luton. He was well know in the game at academy level.

[TonyGilroy]

Dog eat dog in a vicious food chain.

We've just seen our two best players taken by bigger clubs. Cue outrage but of course that's what we seek to do to smaller clubs.

[leonffc]

Dog eat dog in a vicious food chain.

We've just seen our two best players taken by bigger clubs. Cue outrage but of course that's what we seek to do to smaller clubs.

Oh I understand that, but Spurs can hardly toast their scouts for those acquisitions can they? That's my point, the talent is there, scouting hardly comes in to it

[TonyGilroy]

You need to acquire the best players you can however you can.

If you can afford to buy top established talent you will. We seem to have hit on a policy of buying the best 16 to 18 year olds we can and developing them. Very exciting if it works which we don't know yet and the smaller clubs that we buy from presumably need the money.

As did we when we took the Smalling money.

[zzamora]

I think we do manage to sign some half decent players though - Kerim Frei, Kacaniklic, David, etc.

Yes but is this 'scouting for youth'?

In my mind it is simply taking known good talent from other clubs. Kaca was a well know starlet at Liverpool. Why they let him go is anyone's guess but can our scouting system really take credit for his recruitment? The same with Chris David? It's not unearthing talent - its taking / buying it from other clubs.
We seem to be doing a lot of this. Arsenals famous academy is built mostly on kids 'stolen' from other clubs.

To me, scouting youth is finding that starlet in grass roots soccer, seeing a kid on a park pitch and realising he/she has something you can nurture.
The problem is nowadays is that big clubs are allowed to go in and plunder smaller academies and take players out after that club have spent time and money on a particular child.
Cauley Woodrow isn't really a product of our youth scouting. He was getting rave reviews at 16 playing for Luton. He was well know in the game at academy level.

And? I'm failing to see a problem with that. The scouts have still got to go along and check out the player and make sure he is quite as good as he is... can he step it up to next level etc.

Just because their good at youth level doesn't mean they are good at any other level- its the scout job to try and see if they think that they can step it up.

And let's not lie: it's not like anyone had heard of Kerim Frei. THAT is top scouting.

It is extremly rare for even the best of academys to have players from the very bottom under 11's to go to the first team. And anyway that's not the point of academys- they should nurture the best talent they can at whatever level for the club first taem.

[leonffc]

I think we do manage to sign some half decent players though - Kerim Frei, Kacaniklic, David, etc.

Yes but is this 'scouting for youth'?

In my mind it is simply taking known good talent from other clubs. Kaca was a well know starlet at Liverpool. Why they let him go is anyone's guess but can our scouting system really take credit for his recruitment? The same with Chris David? It's not unearthing talent - its taking / buying it from other clubs.
We seem to be doing a lot of this. Arsenals famous academy is built mostly on kids 'stolen' from other clubs.

To me, scouting youth is finding that starlet in grass roots soccer, seeing a kid on a park pitch and realising he/she has something you can nurture.
The problem is nowadays is that big clubs are allowed to go in and plunder smaller academies and take players out after that club have spent time and money on a particular child.
Cauley Woodrow isn't really a product of our youth scouting. He was getting rave reviews at 16 playing for Luton. He was well know in the game at academy level.

And? I'm failing to see a problem with that. The scouts have still got to go along and check out the player and make sure he is quite as good as he is... can he step it up to next level etc.

Just because their good at youth level doesn't mean they are good at any other level- its the scout job to try and see if they think that they can step it up.

And let's not lie: it's not like anyone had heard of Kerim Frei. THAT is top scouting.

It is extremly rare for even the best of academys to have players from the very bottom under 11's to go to the first team. And anyway that's not the point of academys- they should nurture the best talent they can at whatever level for the club first taem.

I agree with you regards to scouts having to decide if a player can step up to the next level but the point i was trying to make was to 'curryformario'. Finding Kaca isn't scouting youth. It is scouting, but hardly unearthing a gem. Taking players out of other academies, especially at no cost, isnt neccasarily good scouting. It's gambling with no real risks. If you have good coaches at an academy and you give them good players where's the skill?
Seeing something in a young lad (and by youth i mean 6-15 yrs) on a park pitch or even non league (i know i mentioned Luton but Woodrow was a boy known to all academies) and knowing your development centre can push him through to the academy was the part of youth scouting I was getting at.

[SouthfieldWhite]

We got Kaca as part of the Konchesky deal, but the people at our academy use to work for Liverpool so they new all about him.
The point of an academy is to find talent and nurture it to hopfully get that talent into the first team

Al Fayed has made a point of wanting to see local lads come through and not going out and buying it

Scouting youths is slightly different to going out scouting for first team players

Scouting for youth players isn't all about having a eye for a decent player, it's about making and keeping contacts and also having good relations with grass roots clubs, and sometimes this takes years

But then again, what do I know

[epsomraver]

More than most on here it would appear :Haynes The Maestro: