"Defending" corners

[Riverside]

Watching the Stoke highlights Huth had 4 yes 4 clear headers .
We weren't any better defending corners against Cardiff either .
As for time added on in WBA ...

What is going wrong ?

1) Stockdale not dominating or being decisive
2) Hageland off form
3) Amore not knowing where he should be ?
4) Richardson has speed but not dominant in the air
5) Limited help from those in front of the back 4/5  - Huth seemed to be Berba's man for the 1st 2 chances ( i think that because Berba was closest ). But after ( If it was Bent he was nowhere close ) ?

What is going right ?

1) Reither stays on his post
2) ???????????????

Solutions ?

1) Steks ?
2) Steady CB pairing . Currently that would be Amore and Senderos .
3) Boeteng ?
4) Coaching !!!

[TonyGilroy]

I think we miss guys like Zamora, Dempsey, Etuhu, Konchesky and Paintsil who were all good in the air and useful in defending deadballs.

Stockdale is a problem but not the problem. Boateng would help as will Amorebieta if Senderos plays central defence. Maybe Kasami as well.

Part of the problem is that we have too many small players or players like Berbatov and Bent who won't help much.

Boateng stopping guys like Huth getting a run up from outside the area would help enormously.

[Brown@FFC]

We put every man in the box when defending corners. If we even put 1 player up the pitch, that will draw back 2 of their defenders. We can't take corners, or defend them, so, there needs to be major work in training this week.

[TonyGilroy]

We put every man in the box when defending corners. If we even put 1 player up the pitch, that will draw back 2 of their defenders. We can't take corners, or defend them, so, there needs to be major work in training this week.

I don't understand that either but a lot of teams do the same.

Perhaps the defence has an advantage the more crowded the penalty area with any collision likely to be a free kick in its favour.

[res]

 We don't defend corners as a team. In the past Zamora took care of near post corners, Etuhu blocked incoming attackers from reaching the corner delivery, and Hangeland (and others) could deal with the rest. If you look at Huth's efforts, and McCauley's goal, they all had clear runs at the ball and could therefore get in strong headers, unchallenged.

[God The Mechanic]

I'm sure last season Berba was covering the near post - from the grainy streams I've seen this season he seems to have moved more central.  Which just seems weird, as he was cutting a fair few out before they got to anywhere near a dangerous area.

[epsomraver]

We put every man in the box when defending corners. If we even put 1 player up the pitch, that will draw back 2 of their defenders. We can't take corners, or defend them, so, there needs to be major work in training this week.

A man who talks sense, have been saying this for ages

[MJG]

We put every man in the box when defending corners. If we even put 1 player up the pitch, that will draw back 2 of their defenders. We can't take corners, or defend them, so, there needs to be major work in training this week.

I don't understand that either but a lot of teams do the same.

Perhaps the defence has an advantage the more crowded the penalty area with any collision likely to be a free kick in its favour.

Its a stats thing. The number of goals scored from breakaways is so small that to pack the 18 yard box with all the players outweighs the advantage of having someone upfield.
Same as why most teams dont have a man on each post a lot of the time.

Who remembers Northampton in late 80's early 90's who used to leave 3 up on the halfway line?

[TonyGilroy]

It certainly isn't a uniquely "this proves what a buffoon Jol is" thing.

[jarv]

I find it totally bizarre that a PREMIER league team (Fulham) have no idea how to defend a corner and cannot seem to be able to take one.
I play in the Massachusets over 60 league on Sunday mornings and take all the corners for my team. I swear they are better than what I have seen from Fulham.  092.gif

[Ed]

The problem with our defending at corners, free kicks etc is down to Stockdale. If you watch our defending of set plays this season Stockdale stays rooted to the line, on Sat he only once made an attempt to come for one of these balls. In contrast MS dominated the 6y box far more. For defenders this is a nightmare, being used to a keeper that dominates and then getting use to one that stays stuck on his line.

[RaySmith]

Agree that Stockers is part of the problem. I was someone who warned against letting Schwarz go - though he would obviously have needed to be replaced sooner or later.

I'm sure defending at corners is covered in training, and these are experienced pros - who  surely know what to do at corners.

Though, we're not as organised defensively as under Roy, where the whole team defended as a unit.

And we do seem nervous and lacking confidence, and teams will try to catch us out with our record - and have players running from deep into the box, who just aren't picked up, while Stockdale doesn't dominate his area, and  shout instructions? like Schwarz did.

[HatterDon]

defending corners is a team exercise. It's something that should be worked out on the training ground. All the players are professionals and have the requisite skills. What is needed is the appropriate coaching to assign roles. I don't think our coaching staff -- at least at the first team level -- can recognize our problems and/or figure out how to remedy them.

Now TAKING corners and free kicks that are not directly aimed at the first defenders knee is more a skill thing. I'm sure not even Jol thinks that's a good tactic.

[WhiteJC]

didn't Roy have AJ at the edge of the penalty area close to the corner taker? this forced the corners to have to try and lift the ball over him, that would appear to be a tactic to use "smaller" players

[Chesh]

[Its a stats thing. The number of goals scored from breakaways is so small that to pack the 18 yard box with all the players outweighs the advantage of having someone upfield.
Same as why most teams dont have a man on each post a lot of the time.

Who remembers Northampton in late 80's early 90's who used to leave 3 up on the halfway line?

You're right, that's the supposed rationale, but rather than the reason needing to be to aid a breakaway, surely it would also just give an outlet for the right man to be able to hold a clearance up, and enable the team to keep possession, as opposed to the ball just coming straight back when it is cleared.

Unfortunately it's a sign that a manager doesn't back his defenders to win the battle and wants as much of a scramble as possible.

It's a negative tactic that imo is overstated in it's effectiveness, and I would definitely keep at least one up no matter who we were playing.

[Chesh]

defending corners is a team exercise. It's something that should be worked out on the training ground. All the players are professionals and have the requisite skills. What is needed is the appropriate coaching to assign roles. I don't think our coaching staff -- at least at the first team level -- can recognize our problems and/or figure out how to remedy them.

Now TAKING corners and free kicks that are not directly aimed at the first defenders knee is more a skill thing. I'm sure not even Jol thinks that's a good tactic.

I'd like to know which bright spark has come up with the seemingly now universal opinion that the best way to defend a corner is not to simply want the ball more, and outjump your opponent (i.e. attacking the ball), but to manhandle your opponent, not even looking at the ball (looks more like bloody netball), and somehow getting away with a blatant foul EVERY time.

This is for me, next to diving, the worst and most puzzling aspect to come into the game in the last 5-10 years, and yet for some reason, refs haven't got the bottle to just give a penalty - it'd soon stop...

[alfie]

I know it is not something that you want to hear but even Jol is not stupid enough not to go through the opposition and each players must know who they are picking up, it is just sheer bad defending, not tactical just people not doing their jobs, there is no way that someone was not instructed to mark Huth, obviously we do not know who that someone was, but they failed in their job.

We have become quite used to blaming Jol for anything that moves or does not move, but these guys are very experienced players and should know what they are doing.

[filham]

The problem with our defending at corners, free kicks etc is down to Stockdale. If you watch our defending of set plays this season Stockdale stays rooted to the line, on Sat he only once made an attempt to come for one of these balls. In contrast MS dominated the 6y box far more. For defenders this is a nightmare, being used to a keeper that dominates and then getting use to one that stays stuck on his line.

Stockdale is earning himself the nickname "Daffodil" - he only comes out in the spring.

We are in trouble at almost every corner , every team we meet will be confident of a goal or two from corners.

[horse1031]

if we put every single one of our players in the box there is bound to be confusion.  It comes down to whoever is marking the big center backs need to guard them.  They are getting out jumped and out muscled.  I know there is a lot of misdirection and screening going on but Hangeland needs to figure it out.

[The Swan]

On Saturday just before Stoke took one of their many corners Hangeland, Senderos and Amorebieta were in a line in our penalty box and they were almost holding hands. Anyone sitting near me would have heard me shouting at to mark a Stoke player and not mark a zone.
This is the answer MAN MARKING and not zonal marking.