Outsider view on Chris Hughton

[Bill Johnson (visitor)]

Having been an admirer of Chris Hughton as a player I have followed his managerial career with interest as he never struck me as a born leader.

Chris Hughton was appointed manager at Newcastle following relegation to the Championship having been part of the set up that failed miserably in the PL. He was left with a squad that should have been a mid table side in the PL (Harper, Coloccini, Steven and Ryan Taylor, Jose Enrique, Joey Barton, Nicky Butt, Nolan, Ameobi and Carroll to name a few) so for him to get promotion there was the bare minimum that was expected.

As soon as he was back in the PL he showed how tactically inept he was and got sacked after 4 months in the PL.
He then took over a Birmingham side that had won the Carling Cup but also been relegated. Again the side stayed reasonably intact. He did a steady un-exciting job that got them to the play offs but didn't get promoted.

Following on from this he was appointed manager at Norwich (lack of loyalty to B'ham?) and did a good job in his first season ending the season in 11th place. However, having seen how Paul Lambert is slowly getting Villa playing better and very structured I feel a lot of this was still down to him leaving the foundations behind. (Look at Everton last season under Martinez on the back of what Moyes built and how he has started this season).

The second season in the PL was uninspiring, he bought a number of players that were clearly not good enough and didn't come over in the press as someone with a huge amount of fighting spirit and this ended up with him getting sacked late on in the season.

Besides all of this, I would say that the Fulham fans should be most worried about the fact that he has no track record in making players better and hasn't promoted youth players at any of his clubs (bar a cup appearance for the Murphy twins). As the current Fulham squad has a lot of youth and players adapting to the Championship you need a manager who is willing to work with them on this every day as in the long run this looks like a good group of players that only need a couple of additions to make them very solid and strong for the Championship.

What has happened in the past can't be changed, but I'm sure Kit Symons would have loved to have Kacaniklic, Tunicliffe, Stockdale (championship experience) and let alone Sidwell and Hageland in this squad.

Lastly, what does experience as a manager matter. Pep Guardiola was manager of Barcelona B for one season before taking over the first team. He lost his first league game to a newly promoted side but the rest is history. Frank de Boer was 18s manager for a couple of seasons before being promoted to the first team and has won the league 4 years in a row. I know there are examples the other way as well, however it seems the current manager knows what he has at the club and the players seem to be responding to this.

Just my thoughts as an outsider looking in.

[TonyGilroy]

Very few managers bring lasting added value to a club and you're describing a likeable and safe pair of hands who won't rock the boat.

I think we need someone for now who wholly gets the Fulham predicament and I see no good reason for not sticking with Kit.

[LBNo11]

...thank you for posting this, an interesting analysis and thought provoking...

[Fulham1959]

...thank you for posting this, an interesting analysis and thought provoking...

Agreed.  An informed, dispassionate view is most welcome.

[NogoodBoyo]

You say what many fear.
Nogood "no good indeed, isit" Boyo

[Deanothefulhamfan]

Out of interest Bill, who do you follow?

Welcome to the board and a very fair analysis. I have said countless times Hughton is great to get us out of this league, but that's where his limit is. Not the name to take us further, should we get promotion.

That being said I have said I will trust the 5 man committee, and will support whoever gets named the next permanent boss, as I hope everyone else does.

I just hope it is Kit

[Snibbo]

... I'm sure Kit Symons would have loved to have Kacaniklic, Tunicliffe, Stockdale (championship experience) and let alone Sidwell and Hageland in this squad.

Sidwell maybe, but he didn't want to stay. Stockdale yes, though Bettinelli may well turn out better. Tunnicliffe - lasted a day or two with Wigan before being sent back. Hangeland - great servant but woeful in the last two years and not even on the bench for Palace last time I looked. Kaca - talented but rarely made an impression on the match.

[Deanothefulhamfan]

Tunnicliffe was never given a chance.... A player we desperately need this season.

I agree with the rest of Snibbo though

[BedsFFC]

"I've got the right five men to help us find the right man for Fulham," Khan said. "They each bring something similar, and yet unique, to the search. They understand what we want to achieve and they're committed to the process. And they very much respect Fulham. They know this is a special job for a manager and they want to play a role in making sure we get this right for everyone who plays for Fulham or loves the Club. And we will."
.......

"But this will be an exhaustive, thorough and deliberate process," Khan said in his programme notes on Saturday, Sept. 20. "No decisions will be made for the sake of deadlines or convenience. I plan to summon a number of qualified advisors for input, some within or close to the Fulham family and others who will bring a perspective from outside the Club. In the end the decision will be mine, but the choice will be made with the benefit of excellent and highly respected counsel.

How can the answer of this be...Chris Hughton?

Of all the managers across the world after this exhaustive search. How possibly that the answer is Chris Hughton?

It surely can't be?

[beijing ben]

You make it sound like he had an easy job at Newcastle. Yes they kept a lot of the (relegated) premiership side but he took over at a time when the fans were demonstrating against Ashley and almost wanting the team to do badly to get Ashley out. Its a tough enough job to manage Newcastle with their fans expectations anyway, without that kind of situation.

He did well in the transfer window hardly spending anything while the club sold players like Obafemi Martins, Bassong and Duff (to us of course), bringing in Williamson, Routledge and Danny Simpson as well as re signing Lovenkrands. In the premiership, he got sacked when they were twelfth, a seemingly unpopular decision (Nolan: 'Sometimes at clubs, when a manager goes, there will be some players that are pleased to see the back of him.. But everybody liked Chris. He was very popular, not just with the players but everyone who worked at the club'). Before the match with Liverpool, their fans had a protest outside the ground in order to thank Hughton for what he had done as well as have a go at Ashley for sacking him. He signed Tiote and Ben Arfa for relatively cheap prices and had to deal with Carroll getting arrested and Barton lashing out in a game and getting banned for 3 games

The season he had with financially shot Birmingham he had to deal with the Europa League. They finished third in their group, one point behind both first and second. They got to the fifth round of the Fa Cup where they drew away to Chelsea before losing at home. They finished fourth in the league. Its not easy to know how much was spent and received in the transfer windows but only two signings were made during his time for money (Elliott and Ibanez), the rest were free, whilst they sold players like Craig Gardner, Roger Johnson, Barry Ferguson, Michel, Scott Dann, Cameron Jerome and Ben Foster before the season started and Beausejour and Ridgewell in the winter. He brought in loans like Myhill and Townsend. I'd say this is his best achievement

With Norwich, he took over a good team from lambert and didnt do much to that although he signed Snodgrass who has turned out really well. But maybe the high finish of 11th can be attributed to the previous regime. He made some big money signings in the second season and i think expectations were for a decent season so it was a bit disappointing but when he was sacked they were in 17th, not actually in the relegation zone but fair enough, the fans wanted him gone it seems. However, i think Norwich are a similar club to us and survival in the premiership should be seen as a success

As has been said by others, his premiership record is irrelevant. We need someone who can get us to do well in the Championship and i think his Championship record is excellent. I honestly think he is the best realistic choice we have and its up to him whether he gets the job..

[K33NY]

... I'm sure Kit Symons would have loved to have Kacaniklic, Tunicliffe, Stockdale (championship experience) and let alone Sidwell and Hageland in this squad.

Sidwell maybe, but he didn't want to stay. Stockdale yes, though Bettinelli may well turn out better. Tunnicliffe - lasted a day or two with Wigan before being sent back. Hangeland - great servant but woeful in the last two years and not even on the bench for Palace last time I looked. Kaca - talented but rarely made an impression on the match.

where do you have the impression of Sidwell not wanting to stay?? From what he said after the last match last season he said something very different to us behind the goal, and I have the strong impression from interviews as well after leaving that he did want to stay, what made him leave is primarely money I think, Fulham couldnt afford to keep both Sidwell and Parker with such wages

[RidgeRider]

You make it sound like he had an easy job at Newcastle. Yes they kept a lot of the (relegated) premiership side but he took over at a time when the fans were demonstrating against Ashley and almost wanting the team to do badly to get Ashley out. Its a tough enough job to manage Newcastle with their fans expectations anyway, without that kind of situation.

He did well in the transfer window hardly spending anything while the club sold players like Obafemi Martins, Bassong and Duff (to us of course), bringing in Williamson, Routledge and Danny Simpson as well as re signing Lovenkrands. In the premiership, he got sacked when they were twelfth, a seemingly unpopular decision (Nolan: 'Sometimes at clubs, when a manager goes, there will be some players that are pleased to see the back of him.. But everybody liked Chris. He was very popular, not just with the players but everyone who worked at the club'). Before the match with Liverpool, their fans had a protest outside the ground in order to thank Hughton for what he had done as well as have a go at Ashley for sacking him. He signed Tiote and Ben Arfa for relatively cheap prices and had to deal with Carroll getting arrested and Barton lashing out in a game and getting banned for 3 games

The season he had with financially shot Birmingham he had to deal with the Europa League. They finished third in their group, one point behind both first and second. They got to the fifth round of the Fa Cup where they drew away to Chelsea before losing at home. They finished fourth in the league. Its not easy to know how much was spent and received in the transfer windows but only two signings were made during his time for money (Elliott and Ibanez), the rest were free, whilst they sold players like Craig Gardner, Roger Johnson, Barry Ferguson, Michel, Scott Dann, Cameron Jerome and Ben Foster before the season started and Beausejour and Ridgewell in the winter. He brought in loans like Myhill and Townsend. I'd say this is his best achievement

With Norwich, he took over a good team from lambert and didnt do much to that although he signed Snodgrass who has turned out really well. But maybe the high finish of 11th can be attributed to the previous regime. He made some big money signings in the second season and i think expectations were for a decent season so it was a bit disappointing but when he was sacked they were in 17th, not actually in the relegation zone but fair enough, the fans wanted him gone it seems. However, i think Norwich are a similar club to us and survival in the premiership should be seen as a success

As has been said by others, his premiership record is irrelevant. We need someone who can get us to do well in the Championship and i think his Championship record is excellent. I honestly think he is the best realistic choice we have and its up to him whether he gets the job..

Good post and appreciate the detail and the other perspective of looking at the same thing and seeing something different.

[fulhamben]

You make it sound like he had an easy job at Newcastle. Yes they kept a lot of the (relegated) premiership side but he took over at a time when the fans were demonstrating against Ashley and almost wanting the team to do badly to get Ashley out. Its a tough enough job to manage Newcastle with their fans expectations anyway, without that kind of situation.

He did well in the transfer window hardly spending anything while the club sold players like Obafemi Martins, Bassong and Duff (to us of course), bringing in Williamson, Routledge and Danny Simpson as well as re signing Lovenkrands. In the premiership, he got sacked when they were twelfth, a seemingly unpopular decision (Nolan: 'Sometimes at clubs, when a manager goes, there will be some players that are pleased to see the back of him.. But everybody liked Chris. He was very popular, not just with the players but everyone who worked at the club'). Before the match with Liverpool, their fans had a protest outside the ground in order to thank Hughton for what he had done as well as have a go at Ashley for sacking him. He signed Tiote and Ben Arfa for relatively cheap prices and had to deal with Carroll getting arrested and Barton lashing out in a game and getting banned for 3 games

The season he had with financially shot Birmingham he had to deal with the Europa League. They finished third in their group, one point behind both first and second. They got to the fifth round of the Fa Cup where they drew away to Chelsea before losing at home. They finished fourth in the league. Its not easy to know how much was spent and received in the transfer windows but only two signings were made during his time for money (Elliott and Ibanez), the rest were free, whilst they sold players like Craig Gardner, Roger Johnson, Barry Ferguson, Michel, Scott Dann, Cameron Jerome and Ben Foster before the season started and Beausejour and Ridgewell in the winter. He brought in loans like Myhill and Townsend. I'd say this is his best achievement

With Norwich, he took over a good team from lambert and didnt do much to that although he signed Snodgrass who has turned out really well. But maybe the high finish of 11th can be attributed to the previous regime. He made some big money signings in the second season and i think expectations were for a decent season so it was a bit disappointing but when he was sacked they were in 17th, not actually in the relegation zone but fair enough, the fans wanted him gone it seems. However, i think Norwich are a similar club to us and survival in the premiership should be seen as a success

As has been said by others, his premiership record is irrelevant. We need someone who can get us to do well in the Championship and i think his Championship record is excellent. I honestly think he is the best realistic choice we have and its up to him whether he gets the job..

Good post and appreciate the detail and the other perspective of looking at the same thing and seeing something different.

just out of intrest, what do you see out of that then?

[ChesterTheTabby]

After this win, if Kit doesn't get the job, I will stop watching Fulham and probably stop supporting this club. There is only one man, and if he doesn't get the job now the Fulham I love is gone.

That may just be emotions speaking but holy hell what else do you want from the man!

[Me-ate-Live, innit??]

Out of interest Bill, who do you follow?

Welcome to the board and a very fair analysis. I have said countless times Hughton is great to get us out of this league, but that's where his limit is. Not the name to take us further, should we get promotion.

That being said I have said I will trust the 5 man committee, and will support whoever gets named the next permanent boss, as I hope everyone else does.

I just hope it is Kit

Deano ...............He's a Spurt
If they are not going with Kit    (gurrrrrrr !!! they had better )    then it has to be Bald  Brian  he is a nice man and we need a Nice Bright Man ....don't we ????

[Berserker]

whose bald Brian?

[Me-ate-Live, innit??]

whose bald Brian?

Really ????


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_McDermott_(footballer)

[MasterHaynes]

... I'm sure Kit Symons would have loved to have Kacaniklic, Tunicliffe, Stockdale (championship experience) and let alone Sidwell and Hageland in this squad.

Sidwell maybe, but he didn't want to stay. Stockdale yes, though Bettinelli may well turn out better. Tunnicliffe - lasted a day or two with Wigan before being sent back. Hangeland - great servant but woeful in the last two years and not even on the bench for Palace last time I looked. Kaca - talented but rarely made an impression on the match.

where do you have the impression of Sidwell not wanting to stay?? From what he said after the last match last season he said something very different to us behind the goal, and I have the strong impression from interviews as well after leaving that he did want to stay, what made him leave is primarely money I think, Fulham couldnt afford to keep both Sidwell and Parker with such wages

I agree that we couldn't afford both Sidwell's and Parker's wages and we all thought no one made an offer for Parker but in an interview with the Metro Parker last week came out and said that he had the offer to join Harry at QPR in the summer but Felix asked him to stay and take on the responsibility of guiding the youngsters,  he felt that he couldn't say no with the trust that Felix was placing in him. Combined with the story of paying the youth players fines(even if it was considerably less than reported) has greatly elevated Parker in my eyes, a real club captain and (which is a real turnaround for me) coupled with his performances of late worth every penny we are paying him.I definitely think we kept the right player, letting Sidwell go for the money on offer from Stoke based on his gals and  performances last season for a relegated team

[RaySmith]

I wanted them both to stay -but Parker has been very important for us, leading  by example.

[Skatzoffc]

I was talking to a Norwich fan in the pub, (who was at our game) and he didn't have much good to say about Hughton.

To be fair, I was thinking Hughton would be fine as he would sort out the defensive frailties we have.

But having watched a much better defensive display on Saturday and, imo, a change of style to counteract the strengths of the opposition, I see no reason to change Kit at the moment.
It would be detrimental to the team morale who are all pulling together for him.

Imo, there is no rush to change a winning formula.

So I'd like to see Kit left in charge until later in the year and see where we are. We could well be safe by christmas!

If results change for the worse under Kit, then  maybe the bringing in of someone like Steve Clarke will be necessary, at a time when January signings could allow him to make any changes required to hone the team.

But no need at the mo.

COYW!

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