How much of our stagnation?

[General]

do you think we can genuinely attribute to disrupting our starting 11 with last minute new signings.

If we think about it Jozabed, Martin, Kebano at the very least are three attacking players who've come in relatively last minute - been thrown in to our starting line up where they are unfamiliar with one another and in 2/3rds of the cases the league and before that we had a squad or team that had been together for the most part last season up front and knew how one another played.

Has it thrown up that much of a distraction? I think it'd be fair to say it's had an impact, because we used to not score many but always score.. recently we have hardly scored a single goal.. even when our chances created and possession stats have been mindboggling one sided in our favour.

If that's the case, then how do you as an individual (if you were in Slavs position) go about creating that formula again with a whole influx of new players? There's few denying Jozabeds ability for example but the end product is missing.

Do you think we should intergrate them one by one over time and revert back to the team we had and knew worked before..

How different has our team been recently to the one that started against and beat Newcastle for instance?

[General]

Team vs Newcastle

David Button
Denis Odoi
Tomas Kalas
Michael Madl
Scott Malone
Kevin McDonald
Ryan Tunnicliffe
Tom Cairney
Sone Aluko
Floyd Ayité
Matt Smith

[General]

Team vs Wigan

David Button
Denis Odoi
Tomas Kalas
Ragnar Sigurdsson (New)
Ryan Sessegnon (New)
Scott Parker (New?)
Kevin McDonald
Tom Cairney
Jozabed   (New)
Neeskens Kebano (New)
Chris Martin (New)

[General]

Team vs Wigan

David Button
Denis Odoi
Tomas Kalas
Ragnar Sigurdsson (New)
Ryan Sessegnon (New)
Scott Parker (New?)
Kevin McDonald
Tom Cairney
Jozabed   (New)
Neeskens Kebano (New)
Chris Martin (New)

5 arguably 6 new players to the starting team which I believe trained as the original team through pre season.

[MJG]

Far from scientific but on the player rating and also from my own view, t the two players whos performances have differed a lot in the last 3 have been Cairney and McDonald.
They were key to how we played first 5 games but McDonald while better on Saturday was very poor in the two home games. and Cairney has not really done much in any of the 3 games. the marking out the game against Birmingham and his loss of form have been the most dramatic.
Martin has not hit the ground running but then neither Smith or Woodrow were exactly pulling up trees.
maybe players like Aluko  are more important than many see and has been an consistent performer prior to this run.
Defence has pretty much held firm, but issue is the three behind the striker. Its finding the balance there.

[toshes mate]

Far from scientific but on the player rating and also from my own view, t the two players whos performances have differed a lot in the last 3 have been Cairney and McDonald.
They were key to how we played first 5 games but McDonald while better on Saturday was very poor in the two home games. and Cairney has not really done much in any of the 3 games. the marking out the game against Birmingham and his loss of form have been the most dramatic.
Martin has not hit the ground running but then neither Smith or Woodrow were exactly pulling up trees.
maybe players like Aluko  are more important than many see and has been an consistent performer prior to this run.
Defence has pretty much held firm, but issue is the three behind the striker. Its finding the balance there.

It's fair to say Sigurdsson had a really good debut. Is he the exception that proves the rule, or is he just a naturally confident player who slots in and gets on with his game? Perhaps it's easier for defenders to fit in than it is for others.

I believe all the 'new' players have shown their talents, skills and abilities in the team, although not all at the same time, and that, for me, means that they will click together as we progress.  However, we cannot afford too many games when teams show how we can be dominated on the pitch without counter ploys which overcome the types of defensiveness encountered against Burton and Wigan, which were of a different nature but equally effective in denying us many clear cut chances.  We must speed up play from defence to attack with Button providing a variety of balls from his distribution.  All that requires is some honest movement from those ahead of him, and a little bit more speed from the provider too.     

[H4usuallysitting]

We need a core of players....something we haven't had since the Prem

[filham]

Yes, those late signings have yet to show their worth and we are beginning to think they are but poor replacements for Dembele and McCormac and that they were not our first choice players.

Maybe we will see improvement as they settle in but just now it looks as if Jocanovic has one hell of a problem in getting goals from this Fulham team.

[nose]

I do not think we are stagnating and I also think if ross and demblee were here we would be a rather worse team

We have a team that works hard, refuses to lose or give up, defends from the front and capable of some brilliant football. BUT we have lost the knack of scoring and i do think that the manager needs to kick (nicely) a couple of appropriate backsides. I think once we click we will motor up the table again. we are two goals from being second, that's how far we have come. last season we were relegation fodor even if we did score loads. I trust this team to win more than they lose, i trusted last seasons team to be a disaster!

[General]

We are kinda stagnating though in terms of results. Draws are all too frequent.. although we've still only seemingly lost one game so far this season.. although I'm sure as the season progresses that will change.

[HillingdonFFC]

Still relatively early days and players  need to gel. Was hoping that a point to prove Chris Martin may've hit the ground running which hasn't happened.
I'm actually more disappointed that despite years of watching Fulham I naively allowed myself to think we were half decent & could mount a serious challenge.
Its the misplaced optimism that kills ya. Think we're probably looking midtable at best.
I had these visions of Kebano ,Ayite etc terrorising full backs, MacDonald strolling about like a Scottish Pirlio & Chris Martin banging em in for fun and Jozabed being different class to anything in the league.
Oh well I'll learn one day

[Burt]

Our stagnation is as a result of a failure to have ready-made replacements for McCormack and Moussa. Defensively we are pretty good, much better than last season. At the other end we lack a real 20+ goals a season threat.

[Twig]

I do not think we are stagnating and I also think if ross and demblee were here we would be a rather worse team

We have a team that works hard, refuses to lose or give up, defends from the front and capable of some brilliant football. BUT we have lost the knack of scoring and i do think that the manager needs to kick (nicely) a couple of appropriate backsides. I think once we click we will motor up the table again. we are two goals from being second, that's how far we have come. last season we were relegation fodor even if we did score loads. I trust this team to win more than they lose, i trusted last seasons team to be a disaster!

Sorry, you think that with Ross and Dembele, who were worth 40 goals, we "would be a rather worse team".  From where do you see even 30 of those goals coming?

[filham]

I do not think we are stagnating and I also think if ross and demblee were here we would be a rather worse team

We have a team that works hard, refuses to lose or give up, defends from the front and capable of some brilliant football. BUT we have lost the knack of scoring and i do think that the manager needs to kick (nicely) a couple of appropriate backsides. I think once we click we will motor up the table again. we are two goals from being second, that's how far we have come. last season we were relegation fodor even if we did score loads. I trust this team to win more than they lose, i trusted last seasons team to be a disaster!

Sorry, you think that with Ross and Dembele, who were worth 40 goals, we "would be a rather worse team".  From where do you see even 30 of those goals coming?

That is right Twig, I have seen goal droughts in Fulham teams from time to time over the years and believe me without the right players it is not easy to get out of. Oh for a god goal scorer in the squad.

[RaySmith]

The likes of Ross and Moussa don't come along every day. Where would we have been without their goals?

[nose]

I do not think we are stagnating and I also think if ross and demblee were here we would be a rather worse team

We have a team that works hard, refuses to lose or give up, defends from the front and capable of some brilliant football. BUT we have lost the knack of scoring and i do think that the manager needs to kick (nicely) a couple of appropriate backsides. I think once we click we will motor up the table again. we are two goals from being second, that's how far we have come. last season we were relegation fodor even if we did score loads. I trust this team to win more than they lose, i trusted last seasons team to be a disaster!

Sorry, you think that with Ross and Dembele, who were worth 40 goals, we "would be a rather worse team".  From where do you see even 30 of those goals coming?

That is right Twig, I have seen goal droughts in Fulham teams from time to time over the years and believe me without the right players it is not easy to get out of. Oh for a god goal scorer in the squad.

well dembele was lazy and massively overated, especially on this message board, and a one of the reasons we were so poor because he never did his part in winning the ball back or pressing..so that is one reason
and whilst ross was a genius, he is slow, and a bit of a loose cannon and i cannot help notice despite his talent has never played in a team that achieved

and lastly, check the league table this season and last...two more goals this season would have seen us 2nd  (maybe third) two less goals conceded at the same stage last season would have season just as pathetic.

we are now  good team, we have chances... you need every player to contribue, that is what we now have.

[@jolslover]

I do not think we are stagnating and I also think if ross and demblee were here we would be a rather worse team

We have a team that works hard, refuses to lose or give up, defends from the front and capable of some brilliant football. BUT we have lost the knack of scoring and i do think that the manager needs to kick (nicely) a couple of appropriate backsides. I think once we click we will motor up the table again. we are two goals from being second, that's how far we have come. last season we were relegation fodor even if we did score loads. I trust this team to win more than they lose, i trusted last seasons team to be a disaster!

Sorry, you think that with Ross and Dembele, who were worth 40 goals, we "would be a rather worse team".  From where do you see even 30 of those goals coming?

That is right Twig, I have seen goal droughts in Fulham teams from time to time over the years and believe me without the right players it is not easy to get out of. Oh for a god goal scorer in the squad.

well dembel;e was lazy and massively overated especially on this message board and a one of the reasons we were so poor because he never did his part in winning the ball back or pressing..so that is one reason
and whilst ross was a genius, he is slow, and a bit of a loose cannon and i cannot help notice despite his talent has never played in a team that achieved

and lastly, check the league table this season and last...two more goals this season would have seen us 2nd  (maybe third) two less goals conceded at the same stage last season would have season just as pathetic.

we are now  good team, we have chances... you need every player to contribue, that is what we now have.

Lazy was an absolute myth, he is a class striker and just because he didnt chase the ball like a headless chicken it annoyed some fans. He wasn't overrated. He would be more useful in our current system than Mccormack as Ross cant play up top by himself. I dont feel we could (realistically) get a better striker in our current system than Dembele.

[Carborundum]

We have adopted a defence first approach all season.  In this approach the player we miss most of all is Dembele.  He would significantly improve 23 Championship teams and would give Gayle a run for his money at Newcastle. 

We really weren't that great on Day 1.  Most of my euphoria  revolved around being back at the Cottage and a flick the like of which I likely won't  see again.  Preston were dire pre season and we did them again in August.

So to the OP, my sense is that the arrival of new players hasn't really disrupted us much.  We are still getting tight results albeit with a bit less fortune.

It's going to be an attritional campaign.  Teams with smaller squads will start hurting and opportunities will open up because we have some strength in depth. 

Failing that, there's always QPR to look forward to. 

[Skatzoffc]

Far from scientific but on the player rating and also from my own view, t the two players whos performances have differed a lot in the last 3 have been Cairney and McDonald.
They were key to how we played first 5 games but McDonald while better on Saturday was very poor in the two home games. and Cairney has not really done much in any of the 3 games. the marking out the game against Birmingham and his loss of form have been the most dramatic.
Martin has not hit the ground running but then neither Smith or Woodrow were exactly pulling up trees.
maybe players like Aluko  are more important than many see and has been an consistent performer prior to this run.
Defence has pretty much held firm, but issue is the three behind the striker. Its finding the balance there.

Interesting points MJG, but I'm going to return to my previous posts on other threads.
I don't believe this is a change due to strikers or lack thereof but due to a problem in mid-field. The biggest Change to happen causing stagnation up front, imo, is down to the selection of Parker and MacDonald in the same lineup.

Don't get me wrong.  Parker is a valuable player for us but I feel he is counterproductive in our current set up unless brought on to close out games.

If we want to win the game, I feel he should not start, but come on to close it out once we are leading. We have a much more dynamic squad this season and need to grasp the nettle to use it effectively.

I for one found our early games massively more exciting and dynamic this season and feel we have regressed to a negative, tho still pleasingly less easy to score against team.

Personally I know what I would rather see and feel we can acheive much this season.

COYW!

[davew]

We are kinda stagnating though in terms of results. Draws are all too frequent.. although we've still only seemingly lost one game so far this season.. although I'm sure as the season progresses that will change.

Probably right, we will start to get into the losing habit like the last 3 seasons, this year taking a little longer than usual! A solid defence now but not likely to win many games with our inept strikers, still another 38 draws should keep us up!