Martin Jol

[nose]

Jol was a one man disaster area.
His so called reputation is fiction underacieving everywhere.

We had a brilliant settked team he deconstructed it. He broke up the back four, alienated ray lewington, brought in steck, ruiz and berba... alll disasters.

I hated him, the end was obviius.

Joca is the antidote.

If ali mac was any good he wud have stopped maf from getting jol, the bloke was dreadful and i am not sure about the nature of many of his transfers.

[Lighthouse]

Jol was manager of Spuds who were beating Fulham with ease. Jol, the master tactician made a sub. Fulham ended up winning. At no time did Jol do anything to change my mind that he was just lucky and overrated. At Fulham he could do little but make us less interesting to watch. Not everything could be balmed on him. But from the early season games in the Europa to when he went. I was never convinced.

[dannyboi-ffc]

Jol was manager of Spuds who were beating Fulham with ease. Jol, the master tactician made a sub. Fulham ended up winning. At no time did Jol do anything to change my mind that he was just lucky and overrated. At Fulham he could do little but make us less interesting to watch. Not everything could be balmed on him. But from the early season games in the Europa to when he went. I was never convinced.

Well there's another one for ya. He failed to get out of a Europa League group that had Twente, Wisla Krakov and Odense in it just 2 years after we'd reached the final. Twente weren't a bad side but I'm sorry, he was even a crap tactician in Europe.

[@jolslover]

I liked Martin Jol (as my name suggests).

Wish I could change my name though. Made it when he was taking us to prem mid table dreamlands!

I think Martin Jol recruited alright on a tight budget SHORT TERM wise. But many of the players he signed were loans or nearing the end of their careers. I think we would have had more chance of staying up had we kept him, however.

Interesting debate though and I like reading peoples thoughts.

[dannyboi-ffc]

I liked Martin Jol (as my name suggests).

Wish I could change my name though. Made it when he was taking us to prem mid table dreamlands!

I think Martin Jol recruited alright on a tight budget SHORT TERM wise. But many of the players he signed were loans or nearing the end of their careers. I think we would have had more chance of staying up had we kept him, however.

Interesting debate though and I like reading peoples thoughts.

You could change it to 'JOL it's Over' to confirm the breakup

[Scrumpy]

Jol was a one man disaster area.
His so called reputation is fiction underachieving everywhere.

We had a brilliant settled team he deconstructed it. He broke up the back four, alienated ray lewington, brought in steck, ruiz and berba... alll disasters.

I hated him, the end was obvious.

This is how I see it. I think the guy was clueless. I can support a team that lacks skill but tries. However, some of the performances put in by Jol's teams were absolutely embarrassing. I remember Shearer and Co on MOTD saying they should be ashamed of their performance. I DO suspect that some of his transfers were crooked and benefitted only him, the player and the agent. And for an experienced football man to think that a team with Ruiz, Berbatov and Taarabt in it would actually work is nothing short of criminal.

[HatterDon]

Jol's a manager who can take a club with top 5 talent and help it finish in the top 10.

What went wrong? Well, MAF was cutting costs to make the club more attractive a purchase and locked up the checkbook. The club started underperforming and Jol responded by weeding out our veteran performers.

What REALLY went wrong? We won the final match of his last full season at Swansea -- finished about 4 positions higher than we would have with an expected road loss -- and convinced our new boss that he could keep us in the Premier League.

Jol is NOT the guy you want if you're a club like ... like Fulham. Some of us wanted him gone after his first season.

[Sgt Fulham]

Jol wasn't sacked soon enough, and some people seem to forget what the end of his time was like. The man simply didn't care, stood with his arms crossed with a half-smile on his face despite a gutless losing performance. Remember that hands behind the back crap in the box? He wasn't helped by the loss of Dembele/Dempsey of course, but that doesn't excuse our relegation, which is on his hands. I still remember him telling us to get over the fact that we got to the Europa League final and how he boasted about beating up one of our fans.

[toshes mate]

Martin Jol managed Fulham FC for a while.  How did he do?

I am guessing, of course, but I reckon there is a huge difficulty in finding absolute historic truths in most forensic examinations.  As Mark Twain said 'a lie can travel half way around the world before truth has got its shoes on', and so examinations of what the truth is about our own personal histories is only ever as powerful as our ability to observe and understand the truth, and even then, to faithfully commit it to our memory.  And so, when it comes to remembering the management of a beloved 'Cinderella' football club, how do you measure memories of something like the worth of a man in a position some of us may like to try but none of us ever has done.  Do you take his best and worse episodes and judge him somewhere in the middle? Do you trust his friends to tell you the truth about him or accept they'll lie?  Do you look back at his past and give him merit points for the things people say he did, the things he achieved, the prizes he won?  Do you measure him against what you believed he should achieve while you knew him better?  Do you only remember the bad things he did?  Was there an especial moment when he won your heart and your mind giving you a feeling that he was something he was not?  Are you noted for your unbiased and fact driven opinions about others?

But don't let that spoil the fun of having a lively debate, huh?

Martin Jol managed Fulham FC for a while.  How did he do?

I really don't know the answer to that question but I do remember Fulham playing both well and badly under his charge and so I guess he was neither the best nor the worse manager we have had or ever will have.  I also remember 'him' selling Dembele and Dempsey at the last possible moment in the transfer window and without the back up necessary to recover from such losses but I don't know who made the decision to sell and I doubt I'll ever know the truth about why they both had to go.   But I can and do remember the moment I heard the news of those transfers and my thought at the time that Fulham and Martin Jol were in trouble, serious trouble.  But then I had previously thought that Hodgson showed a side of his character I didn't know he had when he decided to move to Liverpool, of all places, and so how useless am I at gauging the worth and character of people?

Martin Jol managed Fulham FC for a while.  I am guessing, of course, but I guess he did his best.

[filham]

Jol and Fulham were never a good fit and he played a major part in our Premiership demise. I have wiped those years from my memory and now prefer to jump from Roy to Jocanovic and to think more of last season and hopes for next season.

[colinwhite]

agree with lots of the points of view and an interesting post to follow. I wont repeat points of view that others have already made  but I think Jol really lost the plot when he started to patronise us fans in his interviews ,with us having false expectations etc. One super plus to him was as somebody stated earlier, his conversersion of MD to centrala midfielder of class. He also took Clint to another level . When he signed Berbatov the patronising started to seriously get on my wick !The best player we ever had ? Do me a favour!!

[cmg]

His reputation was based on his association with some big name teams, but the truth is he didn't achieve much with any of them:
Spurs - 9th, 5, 5, 18

Spurs then were a different proposition to Spurs now. Turning then into a good top 5 team (only missing out on champions league because an arsenal fan poisoned them) was a massive achievement back then

You can't expect to have it both ways. My 'big name teams' was based directly on:

His record speaks for itself: Spurs, Hamburg, Ajax, some of the best clubs in Europe, then very respectable 9th and 12th placed finishes with us. (To give some context, under Hodgson we were 7th, with 1pt more than Jol's tally for 9th, and 12th.)

His 'massive achievement' in achieving 5th place should be compared with the relegation spot 18th place that he left them in when he was sacked.

[nose]

He changed a top class back four for no reason and we went backwards from there.

He alienated Ray lewington, he excluded him and got even more of the hump because lewy asked to take the half time talk and turned round a game we were losing at half time (newcastle I think).

The man was a disaster area, he took over a team that was in good shape and ripped it apart.... nothing to do with cheque books though we got ruiz berba and stecks......   it was his lack of ability that killed us.

Hios reputation so called was based on heaven knows what, it isn't that successful.... he rescued defeat from the jaws of victory at spurs and with all the resource they had he couldn't manage top four, even when it was easier to make it!

[St Eve]

Not my favorite but in fairness Dembele and Dempsey were sold on the last day of the transfer deadline. funds were restricted and he had to struggle through with loans and journeymen. I think he would have kept us up but we hit the panic switch and ended up with a clown