What don't the big clubs understand?

[Andy S]

Johnny Haynes, George Cohen and a few others as well were all one club players. This club, Fulham. So why am I reading from every avenue that Tottenham, Man united and Liverpool have missed out on Ryan Sessignon? This is a 17 year-old kid who still lives at home with Mum and Dad. And by the way they only wanted him as his cost would have been next to nothing. In reality what could they offer him? Nothing apart from a drop of cash. The boy is still developing both physically and mentally. I'm glad for his sake that he has stayed at Fulham where he will be given that time in an atmosphere he knows to really develop in to a top class player. Who knows he may also be a one club player which in it's self has become a dieting breed

[HatterDon]

It wouldn't hurt to remind ourselves that The Maestro stayed with Fulham because he was getting the highest wages of any footballer in England. If that were still the case, none of our bright young players would have departed in search of a pay raise.

[aaronmcguigan]

There are so many contributing factors stopping people becoming one club players. You can sense the affinity Sess has for the club but does that mean he needs to show that in lifelong loyalty? There's so many factors stopping that.

- His ability as it grows would need to be matched by our ambition. He will be premier league standard and it is so wrong to stop him achieving that if we don't sustain our own investment and development as a club.

-Owners, managers , investors all change far more often than back in the day, different priorities whether it's cashing in on assets, wanting funds for other areas of the team, liquidity etc all contributing factors

- The one club man in the past you refer to , was paid handsomely and getting international recognition . No one in the championship inn21st century gets consistent international recognition with England. And im assuming as a one club man, you don't count the teams he played for on loan, or the 2 after Fulham?

- potential for that player to become stale, disillusioned, case in point Gabby Agbonlahor, barring a loan or 2, he hasnt left his club, but would any other team want him to be fair?

-the biggest clubs will never change. They will always want the next flavour of the month, to have and to stockpile, then castoff, it's the nature of 21st century football in England, and probably further afield.

-these big clubs will throw money around to anyone that wants us, and clubs are now businesses before football clubs, and balance sheet will come before the team sheet

-Football fans are fickle. They don't care about loyalty. Cauley Woodrow has been here 6 years but most fans only care about the next player to come in from Ligue2 or another cheap import from Belgium. Not saying they're bad, but just that all fans look to the future , to change and evolve. If Betts stays at the club all his career as 2nd choice , in the championship, will he be a hero, or will he be labelled a failure for not trying to maximise his potential?

-Hate to point something like this out but some other clubs have world class facilities and links throughout the world. You say big clubs can offer cash and nothing else. Look at how United players have worldwide exposure, world class facilities, what if a Barca or a Madrid came calling?

- span of a regular footballer is 20yrs. You name one footballer who would have survived under all the different playing styles, philosophies and management teams that we've had since 1997. The styles have been so diverse , so different and no one player would sustain that.

Could go on but Aston Villa seem to have a good few players that haven't moved and are one club men, Gardner, Agbonlahor, Grealish etc but you know fine rightly as much as Grealish loves Villa, as soon as he starts showing his potential consistently, he will be off like a shot, regardless of whether they are PL or not

[cmg]

Players like Jezzard, Haynes and Cohen are rightly given credit for their loyalty. However, in those days, they didn't have a great deal of choice in the matter. The Club could decide to transfer the player or not as they saw fit. A player could request a transfer but if the club refused, that was it. If the club agreed the player lost the 10% of the transfer fee to which he would otherwise have been entitled.

A player's registration was retained by his original club until he retired or until he was transferred or released by his club. This virtual paid slavery was in force until George Eastham's successful High Court case in 1963. The freedom to move at the end of a fixed contract did not happen (for EU players) until the Bosman ruling of 1995.

[toshes mate]

I'd like to believe there is space for all sorts in football.  It's a game that has lurched from what cmg calls 'virtual slavery' to 'player power' and neither extreme point of the compass is actually healthier than the other.   Somewhere around the middle, the heart of all free movement, is the best place to be so that neither money, nor its hidden motives, can damage the game or individual player as a whole.   These days we talk of genius needing a proper place to blossom and yet history tells us genius is its own reward and will appear wherever it is cherished by its owner, wherever it is comfortable in making an appearance, disappearing as rapidly as it appeared when moved to the wrong place.   

Ryan and Steven Sessegnon will write their own history and I hope wherever it takes them their own individual brands of genius will prosper and flourish and reward them in their hearts where only true reward can be found.

[filham]

The one thing lacking throughout those wonderful years that MAf was in control was a player from our academy finding a regular place in our first team. In the last few years we have seen a number of players from the academy with the skills necessary to make a mark in our first team, regrettably it hasn't happened,  a few have left us for bigger clubs and wages.

Next season we have Sess. and Cauley in the squad, two home grown players, and I am really looking forward to seeing them both in the team. I honestly enjoy seeing a Fulham youngster coming through as much as the big money signing.

[cmg]

Bettinelli, at Fulham since he could crawl, is often forgotten in these assessments.

[bill taylors apprentice]

Comparing today's football world to previous era's bears no comparison, CMG highlights just some of the differences.

Sessignon's decision to stay is refreshing and the right and sensible thing for him to do for now.

We can't compete financially with the big clubs but I'm sure there will have been a handsome financial package offered by FFC, including a hefty signing on fee.
Unless that kind of thing is illegal?

[e4b]

Good shout CMG

[filham]

Bettinelli, at Fulham since he could crawl, is often forgotten in these assessments.

Oh, I forgot Betts, apologies due.
Now next season we could see Cauley, Betts and Woodrow in the team, how refreshing would that be.

[Tabby]

Oh, I forgot Betts, apologies due.
Now next season we could see Cauley, Betts and Woodrow in the team, how refreshing would that be.

Cauley and Woodrow? He was considered a prodigy at Luton and Fulham signed him for half a million pounds. Wouldn't that make Fulham the big club that doesn't understand?

Fulham aren't completely innocent here either. Foday Nabay is an example where the big money came calling and caused a 15 year old to hand in a transfer request. Williams is almost an identical case to Sessegnon if he'd have signed for Tottenham. LVC, De La Torre, Noe Baba, Kait, Hyndman, Frei, Tankovic etc etc were hardly local lads, they signed with Fulham because Fulham were a large club, relatively speaking.

It is easy to forget that Fulham is a big fish too when larger clubs look at our players.

[aaronmcguigan]

Players like Jezzard, Haynes and Cohen are rightly given credit for their loyalty. However, in those days, they didn't have a great deal of choice in the matter. The Club could decide to transfer the player or not as they saw fit. A player could request a transfer but if the club refused, that was it. If the club agreed the player lost the 10% of the transfer fee to which he would otherwise have been entitled.

A player's registration was retained by his original club until he retired or until he was transferred or released by his club. This virtual paid slavery was in force until George Eastham's successful High Court case in 1963. The freedom to move at the end of a fixed contract did not happen (for EU players) until the Bosman ruling of 1995.

Fascinating hearing pre bosman stories. Applying logic to football contracts, why would an employee not have freedom to negotiate a contract if their previous contract ended? Just wondering what kept players at clubs without contracts ?

[cmg]

..../....

Fascinating hearing pre bosman stories. Applying logic to football contracts, why would an employee not have freedom to negotiate a contract if their previous contract ended? Just wondering what kept players at clubs without contracts ?

According to Football League regulations the Club retained the player's registration. Like the Maximum Wage the Clubs enforced it because it suited them and they got away with it until challenged in the courts. Without wishing to be too political, this has so often been the way with industrial relations.

An interesting article on Retain and Transfer (as it was called) and the Maximum Wage:

http://twohundredpercent.net/the-maximum-wage-and-retain-transfer-a-match-made-in-hell-for-players/

"With the maximum wage gone, the times were a-changing and the days of retain and transfer were also numbered. In 1959, George Eastham had submitted a transfer request to his club, Newcastle United, and then refused to sign a contract with them and left to find work elsewhere. Newcastle eventually agreed a fee with Arsenal of £47,500 for Eastham's services, but Eastham, with the backing of the PFA, took the matter further, stating that:

Our contract could bind us to a club for life. Most people called it the "slavery contract". We had virtually no rights at all. It was often the case that the guy on the terrace not only earned more than us — though there's nothing wrong with that — he had more freedom of movement than us. People in business or teaching were able to hand in their notice and move on. We weren't. That was wrong.
The case was heard before Justice Wilberforce in 1963, and the judge found partially in favour of Eastham, stating that Newcastle's decision to retain his registration had amounted to an unfair relationship but that he was not entitled to wages from Newcastle because he had refused to pay for them. As such, Eastham did not personally gain from the case, but the retain and transfer system was fundamentally altered. Transfer tribunals were introduced for end of contract disputes and players received better terms for agreeing new contracts. This system remained in place until the Bosman ruling, in 1995."

[Jims Dentist]

Had a good pub conversation last week about player loyalty.
We went on to try and name any current prem players who have stayed with their club.
The only one we could come up with was Mark Noble of WHU.
Any others??

[AlexW132]

Had a good pub conversation last week about player loyalty.
We went on to try and name any current prem players who have stayed with their club.
The only one we could come up with was Mark Noble of WHU.
Any others??

Leon Britton of Swansea has spent most of his career there. He left for Sheffield United in 2010 but admitted it was a mistake then went back. Apparently last season he bought the whole squad DVDs of Swansea's history to remind them that they needed to get their act together and avoid relegation. Others I can think of, Andy King of Leicester has been with them since 2004, Angel Rangel has been at Swansea for 10 years although he has been at various Spanish clubs before, Ryan Shawcross almost entirely at Stoke. Probably some others but can't remember.

[aaronmcguigan]

Is that excluding loans then? Noble had a loan at Ipswich.

Other players who haven't moved other than loans:
Wilshere, Gibbs, Iwobi, Barkley, Dummett, Lingard,

Without loans
Andy King (Leicester)
J Ward Prowse (Southampton)


Plenty in lower leagues like Gibson, Grealish, Baker, Agbonlahor , Lewington etc