still a weak squad...

[General]

Just gone through our squad and can't help but think it's still actually quite weak, especially if we make the moves we do (getting rid of Madl in particular).

In goal we have two in button and Betinelli

Defence, we have only two or three real CB options.. if Madl goes we'll only have 2 in Ream and kalas. Regardless of what the khan's think Madl is better than Djalo and Djalo will struggle in this league.. he's a last option in my mind as unfair as that may seem.

Then we have Odoi,  Fredericks and sessegnon.. it's good those three are here but in all honesty there's still depth that's lacking. Bring in the lad from Porto who apparently isn't the fastest and you could suggest out of the back five positions we're semi comfortable  (with the new addition) at full backs. I dread to think what would happen if one of kalas, Odoi or Ream got injured and another suffered a suspension.

On the wings we're now arguably just ok Ojo,  neesken's,  ayite are there and can be complimented by the full backs but having lost piazon we're arguably in the same position.. Aluko normally seems to play centrally at the top of a diamond formation. So we have three max four wingers for 2 spots.. if one got injured on top of piazon we'd be on things ground. We already are and can't risk it in these situations.

Cm is solid in my opinion. 5 good to very good performers. Feel Norwood and cisse will prove to be solid and worthwhile additions before the seasons out.

Up front it's good to have options there and they're different types of players but from slavisas comments it's suggested they aren't exactly what he had in mind and aren't the finished articles. . Which for strikers who are meant to score goals is worrying. It's nice to have two strikers signed on permanent contracts but they don't come across as reliable in terms of knowing what to expect and in the championship in particular.

[Lighthouse]

Rodak played very well in the league cup so I have changed my mind about keepers. Button on form at the moment.

If Madl goes then Odoi, much to my surprise has proved a very capable player. However I would like to see another centre back.

Full Back I would have thought we are well catered for with the possible new loan arrival.

Again I see no problem with wide players or players that can play there. Up front we are now covered as we only ever play with one. Unless Aluko goes then we may well be a player short as he is capable wide and central.

Really just the central defence is a problem if we get in the full back on loan. Considering what the squad was like, after I moaned about it being weak, I think we are close to being fairly good.

[Arthur]

General,

Terms such as 'weak' and 'strong' are relative to the league we are in, of course. (Put us in League 2, for instance, and our squad couldn't be anything other than 'very strong'.)

May I ask where you think we'll finish in the league this season? 14th? 17th? 20th?

It has to be in the lower half of the table to fit with the definition of being a 'weak squad'.

Or is this merely a wind-up?

[Deeping_white]

Is this a WUM post?? Button has shown he's more than good enough to be #1, and when he isn't on good form you've got Betts to fill in who is a more than adequate backup. Soares is quicker than Malone, I find it odd you saying that he's not very fast seeing as you've probably never seen him play. These are also the same full backs that are paramount to our style of play and fit in perfectly, and saying we lack depth when Ream can also play there, as well as Cisse, is a bit weird.  Saying Djalo is the worst CB is also quite amusing as he's not played a league game for us yet, and when he did play in the League cup against Wycombe, he was better than Madl, so how did you come to that conclusion?

We have 6 players able to play on the wings: Aluko, Ayite, Kebano, Ojo, Piazon and Kamara - how many more do you need when Piazon comes back from injury?? The four we had last year showed how effective they were minus the finishing, and we've just signed two ACTUAL STRIKERS to lower the burden on them needing to score so many. Which brings me onto my last point - how do you know Slav doesn't want players like them, just look at his comments around Kamara compared to say Cyriac and you'll see that he rates him.

This is the weirdest post ever, it's like you've decided you can't find bad things in the squad so you're trying to pick holes for the sake of it. If Soares comes in, the squad is arguably better than last year so for you to call it weaker when it's only missing two main players from last year's squad is quite an odd statement.

[dannyboi-ffc]

Short in defence by one or two. Certainly a left back and being greedy a centre half. Or maybe 1 player who does both.

If we get those players in then this will be the perfect window for building on last season's squad.

[Denver Fulham]

I know this will be disappointing to many on here, but if Soares comes in, our team is really freaking good, and credit should be given to all involved in recruitment.

[General]

Is this a WUM post?? Button has shown he's more than good enough to be #1, and when he isn't on good form you've got Betts to fill in who is a more than adequate backup. Soares is quicker than Malone, I find it odd you saying that he's not very fast seeing as you've probably never seen him play. These are also the same full backs that are paramount to our style of play and fit in perfectly, and saying we lack depth when Ream can also play there, as well as Cisse, is a bit weird.  Saying Djalo is the worst CB is also quite amusing as he's not played a league game for us yet, and when he did play in the League cup against Wycombe, he was better than Madl, so how did you come to that conclusion?

We have 6 players able to play on the wings: Aluko, Ayite, Kebano, Ojo, Piazon and Kamara - how many more do you need when Piazon comes back from injury?? The four we had last year showed how effective they were minus the finishing, and we've just signed two ACTUAL STRIKERS to lower the burden on them needing to score so many. Which brings me onto my last point - how do you know Slav doesn't want players like them, just look at his comments around Kamara compared to say Cyriac and you'll see that he rates him.

This is the weirdest post ever, it's like you've decided you can't find bad things in the squad so you're trying to pick holes for the sake of it. If Soares comes in, the squad is arguably better than last year so for you to call it weaker when it's only missing two main players from last year's squad is quite an odd statement.

Not a wum. Far from it. You're more a wum for not seemingly taking the valid points from what I said.

You accounted for Piazon but he's out injured... you accounted for CB's but with kalas out suspended we played with Odoi at CB. . Which by chance worked out remarkably well. If kalas got suspended again this season - which is a possibility and Madl was sold or out injured or whatever practical possibility then we would only have Djalo as a recognised CB. Now you may say that's depth but Djalo isn't depth.

Up front we have two recognised strikers.. neither of who are familiar with this league or proven goalscorers really. Neither has a strong historical record of even being able to score goals... even slavisa has acknowledged they have room to grow... so you're with two potential strikers but no guarantees about them.. that is don't consider a strong position moving forward. Obviously I can see their strengths and what they're supposed to add to our squad in Kamara pace and fontes poaching/hold up play but we have to change our setup. Woodrow who was really our only other out and out striker has gone.

Wing backs and wings are now a challenge in having surplus and having to see them compete. Hopefully that will make our wingers really up their game and contribute goals.

Norwood and cisse are good but have seemingly broken up our strongest asset last season in our three main midfielders.

If you're weak in defence and unsure of an ability to score goals and have an unfamiliar cm I'd say right now we have a potentially prolific starting 11 but very weak squad and I worry about what injuries and suspensions - like last season - would do to us.. I think if we have two in any one position up front or in defence we will look weak there. That's all. I think that's  a fair assessment as much as we can be optimistic and there are huge bonuses about this squad in comparison to last year we still should be aware of genuine potential problems

[bobbo]

General as chas and dave said " THERS NO PLEASING YOU "

[Deeping_white]

Is this a WUM post?? Button has shown he's more than good enough to be #1, and when he isn't on good form you've got Betts to fill in who is a more than adequate backup. Soares is quicker than Malone, I find it odd you saying that he's not very fast seeing as you've probably never seen him play. These are also the same full backs that are paramount to our style of play and fit in perfectly, and saying we lack depth when Ream can also play there, as well as Cisse, is a bit weird.  Saying Djalo is the worst CB is also quite amusing as he's not played a league game for us yet, and when he did play in the League cup against Wycombe, he was better than Madl, so how did you come to that conclusion?

We have 6 players able to play on the wings: Aluko, Ayite, Kebano, Ojo, Piazon and Kamara - how many more do you need when Piazon comes back from injury?? The four we had last year showed how effective they were minus the finishing, and we've just signed two ACTUAL STRIKERS to lower the burden on them needing to score so many. Which brings me onto my last point - how do you know Slav doesn't want players like them, just look at his comments around Kamara compared to say Cyriac and you'll see that he rates him.

This is the weirdest post ever, it's like you've decided you can't find bad things in the squad so you're trying to pick holes for the sake of it. If Soares comes in, the squad is arguably better than last year so for you to call it weaker when it's only missing two main players from last year's squad is quite an odd statement.

Not a wum. Far from it. You're more a wum for not seemingly taking the valid points from what I said.

You accounted for Piazon but he's out injured... you accounted for CB's but with kalas out suspended we played with Odoi at CB. . Which by chance worked out remarkably well. If kalas got suspended again this season - which is a possibility and Madl was sold or out injured or whatever practical possibility then we would only have Djalo as a recognised CB. Now you may say that's depth but Djalo isn't depth.

Up front we have two recognised strikers.. neither of who are familiar with this league or proven goalscorers really. Neither has a strong historical record of even being able to score goals... even slavisa has acknowledged they have room to grow... so you're with two potential strikers but no guarantees about them.. that is don't consider a strong position moving forward. Obviously I can see their strengths and what they're supposed to add to our squad in Kamara pace and fontes poaching/hold up play but we have to change our setup. Woodrow who was really our only other out and out striker has gone.

Wing backs and wings are now a challenge in having surplus and having to see them compete. Hopefully that will make our wingers really up their game and contribute goals.

Norwood and cisse are good but have seemingly broken up our strongest asset last season in our three main midfielders.

If you're weak in defence and unsure of an ability to score goals and have an unfamiliar cm I'd say right now we have a potentially prolific starting 11 but very weak squad and I worry about what injuries and suspensions - like last season - would do to us.. I think if we have two in any one position up front or in defence we will look weak there. That's all. I think that's  a fair assessment as much as we can be optimistic and there are huge bonuses about this squad in comparison to last year we still should be aware of genuine potential problems

"Norwood and cisse are good but have seemingly broken up our strongest asset last season in our three main midfielders." - and why might that be? They're covering for them when injured, Slav hasn't dropped them for bants because he thinks "ooh I've got to play the new guys" - nobody is under that illusion, or would you like Cairney to play on a dodgy knee and be out for even longer?

[Andy S]

It looks like a stronger squad than we have had for some time to me

[Twig]

Sorry but it did cross my mind that this was a bit of a wind up post.  Even if that wasn't the intention I'm not sure how you can conclude the squad is thin when, on your own admission, defence is the one area that needs strengthening?
I agree with those who have already said that with one decent defensive signing we have a pretty good squad. Yes I'd like a Mark Shwarzer as number one keeper but Betts, Butts and Rodak is not a bad depth.

[twang]

Bettinelli, Button

Fredericks, Odoi
Kalas, Djaló
Ream, Madl
Rafa Soares, R Sessegnon

Cairney, Piazón
McDonald, Cissé
Johansen, Norwood

Aluko, Ojo
Fonte, Kamara
Ayité, Kebano

And that's without any of the up-and-coming players that has also been given a shirt. Look at all the second placed names; I'd back that the eleven of them could hold their own in this division, with the possible exception of the central defence.

So if we do the expected business i.e. get Rafa Soares over the line and replace Madl with an upgrade, then I'd argue that we have an extremely strong squad for a Championship team. I'd in fact argue that it's 'too' strong in the sense that unless we constantly have the same (bad) luck with injuries as at the start of the season Jok will struggle to keep everyone happy. But that is a nice problem for him to have and nothing to worry about at this point.

What would be worrying though is if we sell someone like Aluko. While we'd have the bodies to cover the loss, we wouldn't be able to replace his quality with the players currently in the squad. I would understand if the board is tempted to recoup some of that Fonte money by doing so but hopefully Slav can convince them not to. A few goals and/or assists tomorrow wouldn't hurt his case...

[Forever Fulham]

We need wins, not draws.  We aren't building up enough points to ensure promotion.  It's all fine and dandy to say it's still early.  It is early.  But we can't think that way if we want promotion.  We need quality riding the pine, ready to go when a man goes down or is tossed.  We aren't scoring in numbers like last season.  I know we play crazy well at times, and look like giant killers, but something I can't explain is gnawing at me about this team.  And I assume a lot of you feel the same way.  We're in it.  We look great.  But we aren't getting the "W" at the end of the game.  I think Slava is a miracle worker. And maybe there's something to hiring on stats analysis.  Who knows.   This string is about finding holes in the personnel, and you can make the case we have quality to take the pitch even with our missing players.  And yet, something is still 'off'.  Last part of last season we played beautiful football.  I mean, it was pinch me is that my team?  Can we pick up where we left off when we start this season?  And so far, the answer's no, not quite.  Curvature of the spine.  Confidence still there.  Self belief still there.  Maybe it's just the luck that's been missing.  Balls clanking off the side bars.  Near misses.  Great saves.  Frustrating. 

[toshes mate]

Is this a WUM post??

Not a wum. Far from it. You're more a wum for not seemingly taking the valid points from what I said.

Well played, General.  I largely share your views and while I welcome all the new players and wish them every success I can't help but remind people it is Jokanovic who has to make the permutations work since he is not directly responsible for who is bought and who is sold.   If anyone can make this team work it is SJ but, as we saw last season, it takes time and meanwhile points are being thrown away.   Ideally I would have liked to see the same side (i.e. including Malone) start this campaign but with TC and KMc injured and TK suspended we have already observed how important cover is.   Cisse and Kamara look very good given a few more games, and Norwood shows some promise.  Ojo and Fonte are clearly better than some we have seen from the recruitment team, but it is what they do together and how we cope with injuries and suspensions that will make the difference. 

My worry is that we may not see this season, what we saw last season, with goal scorers all over the pitch, which is what made Malone, for example, so important to the team. If we go back to the scoring deficiencies of the past with a leaky defence then we have a mountain to climb.  Button has been excellent so far but that shows up how vulnerable we may be right now. 

[toshes mate]

I know this will be disappointing to many on here, but if Soares comes in, our team is really freaking good, and credit should be given to all involved in recruitment.

Mmm, you believe recruitment do all the hard work.  How is that working out in Jacksonville?

[jayffc]

Bettinelli, Button

Fredericks, Odoi
Kalas, Djaló
Ream, Madl
Rafa Soares, R Sessegnon

Cairney, Piazón
McDonald, Cissé
Johansen, Norwood

Aluko, Ojo
Fonte, Kamara
Ayité, Kebano

And that's without any of the up-and-coming players that has also been given a shirt. Look at all the second placed names; I'd back that the eleven of them could hold their own in this division, with the possible exception of the central defence.

So if we do the expected business i.e. get Rafa Soares over the line and replace Madl with an upgrade, then I'd argue that we have an extremely strong squad for a Championship team. I'd in fact argue that it's 'too' strong in the sense that unless we constantly have the same (bad) luck with injuries as at the start of the season Jok will struggle to keep everyone happy. But that is a nice problem for him to have and nothing to worry about at this point.

What would be worrying though is if we sell someone like Aluko. While we'd have the bodies to cover the loss, we wouldn't be able to replace his quality with the players currently in the squad. I would understand if the board is tempted to recoup some of that Fonte money by doing so but hopefully Slav can convince them not to. A few goals and/or assists tomorrow wouldn't hurt his case...

This....
And this thread is the biggest case.of half full vs half empty I've seen. Part of strength in depth OP has completely overlooked is the quality in our youth set up.

Bare in mind that to add to the above as 3rd 4th options for positions we have

GK:Rodak, Norman
Full backs : Opoku, S. Sessegnon, Fossey
CB: Aron Davies, Jenz
CM: Edun, Luca de la torre, Adeniran
Wide: Williams, O'Riley
CF: Humphries.

Bare in mind these are 3rd/4th choices and how many teams have top quality that far back in their squad and I think you'll find we're doing more than ok for depth. Part of that is having promising youth and letting them grow by having the odd chance to shine ala Ryan Sess... Only CB and LB for me that needs improving and we appear immediately to have one of those in bound and presumably from some of the noises in the background we are still looking at CBs with 2 weeks to go. I'm very happy with the state of the squad.

Yes I'd.love a prolific striker but once again we were top scorers
In the division without one so not the be all and end all providing we defend better, which we dod towards the end of last year. With CB cover we'll be looking in very good shape.

[Classic94]

GK: Button, Betts

RB: Fredericks, Odoi, Cisse
LB: Soares, Odoi, Sess
CB: Kalas, Ream, Odoi, Madl, Djalo

CM: TC, Johansen, McDonald, Norwood, Cisse
RW: Aluko, Ojo, Piazon
LW: Ayite, Kebano, Sess

CF: Fonte, Kamara, Ayite, Kebano

Assuming we sign the LB and replace Madl if/when he goes, that looks pretty strong to me - even without the likes of Edun and other prospects who could play a role. Having players like Odoi who can cover a number of roles is also a huge asset.

[FulhamStu]

Add Soares and a central defender and we will have a brilliant and very well balanced 1st team squad with excellent additional cover from the younguns.

[toshes mate]

Having players like Odoi who can cover a number of roles is also a huge asset.

Odoi has been outstanding and has a great attitude as demonstrated in his Leed's after match interview.  However, we can only ever play him in one position at a time which is a great pity.

[Twig]

Having players like Odoi who can cover a number of roles is also a huge asset.

Odoi has been outstanding and has a great attitude as demonstrated in his Leed's after match interview.  However, we can only ever play him in one position at a time which is a great pity.

And that is my only concern. Bring in one decent defender and I will be happy with the summer dealings.