QPR lose arbitration claims against fine for breaching the EFL's FFP

[BestOfBrede]

There's no way QPR will go bankrupt over this (unfortunately). The EFL have already said they "understand the challenges that this decision could create for our valued member club and will work with them..." An easy solution, for example, would be to let them pay in instalments over several years. A more fun option would be to let them take a double relegation in lieu of the fine  :005:

Sorry I should have stated relegation as a good means of 'fine', I believe other teams have been?

[Whitesideup]

Agree that QPR (owners/directors) knew the rules and flaunted them, but isn't this ffp rubbish supposed to be there to save clubs from going bust?
My point is, the owners tried to be clever/sly and get away with it and so shouldn't it be them that pays rather than the Club(fans)?

We took our punishment and got on with it, which we could say delayed any progression. Therefore, all teams should also take their punishment and the QPR owners did not.
But to put the club in danger of going bankrupt and being no more seems totally against the reason ffp Was designed in the first place?

I dislike them enormously and agree that many of their fans would be in their element if it was us, but us smaller clubs will be wiped out if we don't stick together!

I think qpr should be fined (reasonable) and certainly have a recruitment ban, which should be reasonably harsh due to their ridiculous delay tactics, but not to the extent of making them bankrupt.

In the context of the overspend, the financial penalty was commensurate. And it was in the rules. And it was clear to everyone. And surely if there is a fine, it is not the fans that will be paying, it will be the owners. If they then choose not to support the club financially, (and to the owners, the fine is still just a tiny drop in the ocean) then that is not FFP that is penalizing the club, but the owners. Fit and proper?

[Logicalman]

There but for the grace of the dyslexic dog go us.

Cast our minds back

Yes, I've no time for QPR but totally disagree with FFP. Businesses (which football clubs are) should be allowed to grow if they have an investor to provide financial backing.
If this was dyson or Sainsbury's the business world would be in uproar. Chelscum and Man City didn't grow just on the back of supporters and shirt sales.

+1

It's supposed to stop clubs going bust (an extremely rare occurrence since money began flowing into English football in the 90s) but under the current model, the collateral damage of stifling growth far outweights that benefit.

Not to mention it still doesn't address the riskiest current issue, the huge fall in revenue when clubs are relegated from the PL.

And then there's the opacity of it as well.

But the bottom line is simple that if the clubs comply with FFP AND they run their finances correctly (ergo - no 'Arry at the helm) then they have the same opportunity to grow and everyone else, and having the richest backer in the world has less direct impact on the playing staff or the ability ti get them, without putting substantial funds into growing the business first. If they grow the business they have more money to spend, and that is as simple as it gets.

QPR bucked the trend because they thought their promotion put them beyond the reach of the EFL, unfortunately they were/are crap enough that they fell back into their clutches and so the story continues.

[Logicalman]

Agree that QPR (owners/directors) knew the rules and flaunted them, but isn't this ffp rubbish supposed to be there to save clubs from going bust?
My point is, the owners tried to be clever/sly and get away with it and so shouldn't it be them that pays rather than the Club(fans)?

We took our punishment and got on with it, which we could say delayed any progression. Therefore, all teams should also take their punishment and the QPR owners did not.
But to put the club in danger of going bankrupt and being no more seems totally against the reason ffp Was designed in the first place?

I dislike them enormously and agree that many of their fans would be in their element if it was us, but us smaller clubs will be wiped out if we don't stick together!

I think qpr should be fined (reasonable) and certainly have a recruitment ban, which should be reasonably harsh due to their ridiculous delay tactics, but not to the extent of making them bankrupt.

In the context of the overspend, the financial penalty was commensurate. And it was in the rules. And it was clear to everyone. And surely if there is a fine, it is not the fans that will be paying, it will be the owners. If they then choose not to support the club financially, (and to the owners, the fine is still just a tiny drop in the ocean) then that is not FFP that is penalizing the club, but the owners. Fit and proper?

I agree.
The club ARE the owners and vice-versa as the club is simply a business. You cannot separate the two entities.

[BestOfBrede]

Of course you can separate the two entities:
We the fans pay to support our club
The club bank that money
The club choose to then use that money in a way they see fit (rightly or wrongly)

If the club go outside the ffp rules and get caught then the owners/board who chose to flounce the rules, should be penalised rather than the fans! We (the fans) had no say whatsoever in the use of the clubs money which basically was our money!

Fulham fans, as with qpr fans, had no say in what was over spent. Therefore why should we be held responsible ?

[Fulham Tup North]

Of course you can separate the two entities:
We the fans pay to support our club
The club bank that money
The club choose to then use that money in a way they see fit (rightly or wrongly)

If the club go outside the ffp rules and get caught then the owners/board who chose to flounce the rules, should be penalised rather than the fans! We (the fans) had no say whatsoever in the use of the clubs money which basically was our money!

Fulham fans, as with qpr fans, had no say in what was over spent. Therefore why should we be held responsible ?

You can separate the Club from the Fans, but lets remember, those 'Fans' were not complaining when the club were 'buying' their way to the Premiership.  Reap what you sow.  But I do agree, you can feel for the older fans, who supported the club prior to their top flight days.

[Marcel_Gecov]

Of course you can separate the two entities:
We the fans pay to support our club
The club bank that money
The club choose to then use that money in a way they see fit (rightly or wrongly)

If the club go outside the ffp rules and get caught then the owners/board who chose to flounce the rules, should be penalised rather than the fans! We (the fans) had no say whatsoever in the use of the clubs money which basically was our money!

Fulham fans, as with qpr fans, had no say in what was over spent. Therefore why should we be held responsible ?

You can separate the Club from the Fans, but lets remember, those 'Fans' were not complaining when the club were 'buying' their way to the Premiership.  Reap what you sow.  But I do agree, you can feel for the older fans, who supported the club prior to their top flight days.

To be fair, when they signed Granero, Cesar, etc it must have been exciting for the fans which we sampled with Berba. The difference is that they didn't defend the downside and will soon see relegation or worse. You are correct, the fans didn't complain. However with the PR spin we can all too easily drink the kool aid. We must remain vigilant to the signs so we don't go the same way.

[FulhamStu]

They should be treated the same way as Luton.   Massive points deduction.

[Marcel_Gecov]

They should be treated the same way as Luton.   Massive points deduction.

Circa 25 points I believe. If that ever happened to us I'd expect to see our first teasers soldier in Jan and the Kaits and Eduns of the world bought in to get experience in preparation for League 1.

[Keynsham]

Good to see old Wobblechops is absolving himself entirely of any blame.

[Riversider]

A long read here but well worth it from Rangers pov.
Of course usual suspects saying spend everything on going up won't bother but hey go.
https://www.fansnetwork.co.uk/football/queensparkrangers/news/46804

I was working with a number of staunch bitters last night, and despite pointing them in the direction of that excellent article to a man they are 100% convinced that the fine will never, ever be paid , they are convinced that their legal team will have too much for the Football League,
Talk about living in denial, talk about naive, it wasn't until last night that I realised that the "Flat Earth Society" obviously has its base in Shepherds Bush !

The Football League need to wrap this up as quickly as possible, get the fine sanctioned and give them a deadline to pay it, failure to do so resulting in demotion and a points fine.

[SP]

I think they're already in real danger of relegation this season as their attacking options are woeful.  Having failed to capitalise against the struggling teams they're about to play top half teams.

[sunburywhite]

That would be such a shame to see them go down