Building for next season

Milo · February 04, 2018, 06:59:00 PM

Let's say we don't go up this season (I mean.. COYW! Positive thoughts and all that..but let's say IF we don't..)... I am concerned we will leave ourselves too many gaps to fill in the summer. I therefore think given that now we look highly likely to make the playoffs that we should play our contracted strikers to develop them and not our loanees.

We will likely lose Sess, Mitrovic, Piazon, Kalas, Targett, Norwood, and potentially Fredericks and Cairney (anyone else notice something wasnt right about Fredericks yesterday? He seemed out of sorts... mildly annoyed? As if he wanted to go in the window?).

We have signed Christie to replace Fredericks, Odoi and Ream will stay, so that just leaves us a LB and a CB shy. I think Targett would be a great signing and then seek a CB in the summer and we are sorted.

Midfield - Johansen and McDonald for me have found their level, playing well and living in London. Don't see either leaving - especially the latter as he will be captain should cairney go. But that leaves a CM spot free and I think we should sign Norwood for circa £5m in the summer when Brighton settle down a bit with their demands.

Lastly, attack. Who will we have left? Ayite has been the forgotten man - I think he will leave for around the £1m ish I think we paid for him. Kebano and Kamara will stay. Fonte will probably stay to save the embarrassment of making a big loss. But none of these players are currently good enough to lead the line week in and week out and I'm concerned we are leaving ourselves too bigger hole to plug up front in the summer.

I have just looked at the table. I don't see us making 2nd when cardiff, Villa and Derby all have 6pts on us and holding strong. I don't see Sheff Utd catching us 6pts below and now tiring towards the back end of the season. Boro have stumbled. I honestly think if we play Mitro, Piazon and the other loanees each week we will make the playoffs ... but equally if we just play the usual suspects we will also make the playoffs! So why not give the guys who will be here next year the game time instead?

Controversial view I'm sure but I think logical.

Thoughts?

hopper · February 04, 2018, 07:03:33 PM

Someone else has posted similar sentiment before.

I think we will be fine, if loanees depart we can surely bring in other loanees. And should we get big money for Sess and Cairney then can bring in new players too.

Means a big turnover of players, but the management seem capable at putting together a decent squad.

SuffolkWhite · February 04, 2018, 07:08:34 PM

Sorry Milo I'm sure there are a few good points here but I just cant think about next season yet. A lot of if buts and maybe's yet to come. Just want to enjoy this season first.

RaySmith · February 04, 2018, 07:15:40 PM

Quote from: SuffolkWhite on February 04, 2018, 07:08:34 PM
Sorry Milo I'm sure there are a few good points here but I just cant think about next season yet. A lot of if buts and maybe's yet to come. Just want to enjoy this season first.

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St Eve · February 04, 2018, 07:23:54 PM

Good points. That is why it is critical to go up. Then we can worry about spending 200 million to stay up

YankeeJim · February 04, 2018, 08:05:51 PM

Not to have a go, but if frogs had wings they wouldn't bump their arses. You make reasonable points but I prefer to dwell on the positive. If we go up we will have some major changes to make. If we don't we'll have some major changes to make. Such is the nature of football. There are only 10 field spots and we just brought in three potential starters? That's a 30% change. Like I said, the nature of football.

ffcthereligion · February 04, 2018, 08:13:31 PM

Add Slavisa to the mix there too.

However, assuming we get worst case 25m for Sess and 15 for Cairney, that before anyone else is considered is enough to build a solid side for this division.

grandad · February 04, 2018, 08:24:26 PM

No team can plan for the long term. It has to be done season by season. Getting back to the Prem would be easier than having to replace the majority of current players after getting there.

brightster · February 05, 2018, 02:26:35 AM

IF we go up do you not think that both Sess, RF and TC might want to stay, at least they will play every week, we should be able to up their wages.
Also perhaps Mitrovic, Piazon and others will feel the same.

Andy S · February 05, 2018, 03:14:48 AM

That is the most likely outcome and then you can ask if they are good enough

Snibbo · February 05, 2018, 05:12:52 AM

Quote from: brightster on February 05, 2018, 02:26:35 AM
IF we go up do you not think that both Sess, RF and TC might want to stay, at least they will play every week, we should be able to up their wages.
Also perhaps Mitrovic, Piazon and others will feel the same.

:plus one:

FulhamStu · February 05, 2018, 08:06:56 AM

Let's go through the loans. Kalas and Piazon are not wanted by the Filth and will be avail for loan or sale in the summer again, so if we really want them we could get them. Ojo is not getting into Liverpool's first team, but he may not be avail. Targett could be avail to buy or loan again as Southampton have better options. Norwood will not get into Brighton's team so will be available. Mitro probably will be sold but not sure he would come to us in the Championship, however if he loves it here and Slav stays as coach it is possible. In football it's impossible to read the future...money talks and that is really the end game. If we are prepared to splash the cash all things are possible, if we sell Cairney and Sess, we will have plenty of cash that's for sure.

JoelH5 · February 05, 2018, 08:48:52 AM

You lost me at 'highly likely to reach the playoffs.' There's still so much football to play. Anything could happen

MJG · February 05, 2018, 09:08:30 AM

Quote from: Statto on February 05, 2018, 07:31:25 AM
Strongly disagree re. Ayite. IMO he's worth closer to £10m,

Really?
Let me ask a question, if we signed Ayite from another Championship side for £10M would you be happy with that?
There is no way I would consider anything above maybe 3M or 4M max for him. And even then I'm not sure thats good value for money.

Decent player, did some good stuff for us last season. But this season way below that standard and I think he offers very little at times.
Pops up with odd goal, but for me trys too much and loses ball a lot when other options are around.

Count Flapula · February 05, 2018, 09:49:56 AM

Sorry to the OP, I see your point but flat out disagree.

IF we make the playoffs WHY would we not play our best team available at the time (whatever that may be) and go for promotion, rather than not play our best team / reduce our chances of promotion to develop our other players that we may not even need if we do get promoted? That's bonkers. We should do EVERYTHING we can to get promoted - the mentality you're suggesting isn't so much contingency planning as it is defeatist and planning to fail, not aiming for success. What signal does that send out to the players if we don't play our best team available? That promotion is a secondary priority?

If Piazon / Mitro / Targett / Kalas etc. are good enough to get in our first eleven while they are here then i'm playing them every time if it increases our chances of promotion - not dropping them when it gets to the most crucial stage of the season.

If you believe Cairney / Fred / Sess are off next year then by your logic should we also drop them in favour of players we think will stay to develop them? If the answer is no then why would you treat them any differently to the loans players under that logic? I'm all for player development - just not at the cost of the team's success / potential promotion.

Woolly Mammoth · February 05, 2018, 10:05:59 AM

Quote from: Count Flapula on February 05, 2018, 09:49:56 AM
Sorry to the OP, I see your point but flat out disagree.

IF we make the playoffs WHY would we not play our best team available at the time (whatever that may be) and go for promotion, rather than not play our best team / reduce our chances of promotion to develop our other players that we may not even need if we do get promoted? That's bonkers. We should do EVERYTHING we can to get promoted - the mentality you're suggesting isn't so much contingency planning as it is defeatist and planning to fail, not aiming for success. What signal does that send out to the players if we don't play our best team available? That promotion is a secondary priority?

If Piazon / Mitro / Targett / Kalas etc. are good enough to get in our first eleven while they are here then i'm playing them every time if it increases our chances of promotion - not dropping them when it gets to the most crucial stage of the season.

If you believe Cairney / Fred / Sess are off next year then by your logic should we also drop them in favour of players we think will stay to develop them? If the answer is no then why would you treat them any differently to the loans players under that logic? I'm all for player development - just not at the cost of the team's success / potential promotion.

Absolutely agree, it would be madness to think otherwise.

grandad · February 05, 2018, 10:23:46 AM

I have forgotten what happens to loan players. Do they return to their parent club at the end of the league season or would they be available for the playoff games?

RaySmith · February 05, 2018, 10:30:53 AM

Agree with Count Flapula and WM, the club, manager and players need have to have a strong determination, expectation and desire to get promotion, and in every game we should play the best team to gain full points, with management of injury being the only reason to leave out top players for a game, though we have a strong squad.

Us fans can mange our own feelings - we don't want to get carried away in case get disappointed, but the team should just feel positive that they will go up.

Think about next season when it comes - obviously it will be a lot different if we get promotion or not.

RaySmith · February 05, 2018, 10:31:47 AM

Quote from: grandad on February 05, 2018, 10:23:46 AM
I have forgotten what happens to loan players. Do they return to their parent club at the end of the league season or would they be available for the playoff games?

Martin played for us in the play-offs didn't he?

We Are Premier League · February 05, 2018, 10:38:57 AM

Quote from: hopper on February 04, 2018, 07:03:33 PM
Someone else has posted similar sentiment before.

I think we will be fine, if loanees depart we can surely bring in other loanees. And should we get big money for Sess and Cairney then can bring in new players too.

Means a big turnover of players, but the management seem capable at putting together a decent squad.

Oh how sentiment has change based on the last 2 hours of the Jan window!

"management seem capable at putting together a decent squad"

News:

Building for next season