The Riverside Stand Redevelopment

[Deeping_white]

Couldn't care less about the new stand
I want the team to be successful
Who cares if the owners can make money out of it?
I genuinely hope it doesn't happen until we are established in Premier after the next promotion in 2021

You were on here not so long ago whining that Khan was asset stripping us for a sale, so you probably don't want the new stand so it allows you to keep peddling that angle rather than being proven wrong. The most successful teams are also as a rule of thumb, the richest, so arguably why would you want the club to not press ahead with something that makes us more money and allows us to be more successful from a financial perspective? 3 of the stands on our much loved stadium are knackered and need replacing/seriously updating anyway, so if you don't do it now, when do you do it?

Just curious - which stand isn't knackered?

The JH stand to a point, as it's a listed building so has to be maintained to particular standards and is also expected to be worn out to a certain degree, but then again you're not taking that away because it's the quintessential stand alongside the cottage, and even so it's the only structure that you look at and don't think "yeah that probably needs to come down fairly soon"

[Statto]

Actually think it helps if it happens when we get relegated; less hassle moving people from the Riverside as gates will be less!

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Having a bigger stadium than Crystal Palace, Charlton Athletic and QPR is important to Fulham's future. Only Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea and West Ham will have bigger grounds in the Capital.

Having a Stadium of 30,000 vitually guarantees that any team that fall into League One will get out because 30,000 tickets sold at very low prices is enough to buy players to get out League One (except for MK-Dons and Coventry that i don't believe own their stadiums). For example, I believe Sunderland and Charlton Athletic will be in the Championship in not too long.

How exactly are we going to sell 30.000 tickets in League One?

The stand is really designed to be 20% matchday and 80% non matchday, so in many ways what league we are in makes no difference given the location and new facilities that could be used.

Personally I'd like to hear some numbers.

SF Sorrow makes a good point that we aren't going to get more than 24,000 fans outside the PL so the additional matchday revenue will be zero. In the PL an extra 5,000 fans will equate to what, an extra £3-4m per year or something like that? A meaningless amount in the PL.

The non-matchday revenue needs to be equating to £15m per year or something like that to have any bearing on our success IMO, even in the Championship. Anything much less than that and it's about as useful as the MJ statue.

how many people ever saw us getting 25k again in the cottage, when we were lingering near the bottom of the fourth division? If we so not try to progress, we will only ever go backwards. It's not even like the money for this is coming out of our transfer budget. We haven't sold the jewels to fund it, so lets not look a gift horse in the mouth, and embrace what will be a fantastic new stand for decades to come. I can't imagine many other fans being so against an upgrade, let alone fans from teams whose stadium is seen as prime location for flats by everyone not connected to the club

Where have I said I'm against it? I'm just saying that unless there's a clear, realistic business plan under which it can bring in lots of non-matchday revenue, then it's essentially pointless, just a shiny empty cuboid next to the pitch for us to look at.

[Holders]

Couldn't care less about the new stand
I want the team to be successful
Who cares if the owners can make money out of it?
I genuinely hope it doesn't happen until we are established in Premier after the next promotion in 2021

You were on here not so long ago whining that Khan was asset stripping us for a sale, so you probably don't want the new stand so it allows you to keep peddling that angle rather than being proven wrong. The most successful teams are also as a rule of thumb, the richest, so arguably why would you want the club to not press ahead with something that makes us more money and allows us to be more successful from a financial perspective? 3 of the stands on our much loved stadium are knackered and need replacing/seriously updating anyway, so if you don't do it now, when do you do it?

Just curious - which stand isn't knackered?

The JH stand to a point, as it's a listed building so has to be maintained to particular standards and is also expected to be worn out to a certain degree, but then again you're not taking that away because it's the quintessential stand alongside the cottage, and even so it's the only structure that you look at and don't think "yeah that probably needs to come down fairly soon"

I'd agree, I just wasn't sure which one you meant as, of course, the Riverside is the newest but arguably the most knackered.

[filham]

We have been talking about this stand for some years now and clearly there has been too much talk.  I have always said I will believe it is going to happen only when the first cubic metre of concrete is poured.

Also I would preferred a development that would have improved all sides of the ground to give more comfort to all fans together with an increase in capacity to over 30,000 rather than a giant new stand by the river having the purpose more of a giant monument than a genuine stadium improvement.

The thing is though, the Khans probably couldn't win because if they announced plans to do all three sides of the ground at once, it'd naturally start the conspiracy theorists off about moving us away from the cottage and selling it, as inevitably you'd have to move grounds while the work was underway. Doing the Roverside first gives you the scope to move away from the Cottage to do the Putney and Hammersmith stands while the ground is still making money via the retail units in the updated Riverside stand. Plus work to both ends will take a very long time to sort out, owing to the fact we've got no room to manoeuvre with Bishops park at one end and a built up area right behind the Hammersmith end

No the work to the whole stadium could have been done in planned stages that would have enabled matches to continue.

[flyingfish]

Actually think it helps if it happens when we get relegated; less hassle moving people from the Riverside as gates will be less!

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Having a bigger stadium than Crystal Palace, Charlton Athletic and QPR is important to Fulham's future. Only Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea and West Ham will have bigger grounds in the Capital.

Having a Stadium of 30,000 vitually guarantees that any team that fall into League One will get out because 30,000 tickets sold at very low prices is enough to buy players to get out League One (except for MK-Dons and Coventry that i don't believe own their stadiums). For example, I believe Sunderland and Charlton Athletic will be in the Championship in not too long.

How exactly are we going to sell 30.000 tickets in League One?

The stand is really designed to be 20% matchday and 80% non matchday, so in many ways what league we are in makes no difference given the location and new facilities that could be used.

Personally I'd like to hear some numbers.

SF Sorrow makes a good point that we aren't going to get more than 24,000 fans outside the PL so the additional matchday revenue will be zero. In the PL an extra 5,000 fans will equate to what, an extra £3-4m per year or something like that? A meaningless amount in the PL.

The non-matchday revenue needs to be equating to £15m per year or something like that to have any bearing on our success IMO, even in the Championship. Anything much less than that and it's about as useful as the MJ statue.

how many people ever saw us getting 25k again in the cottage, when we were lingering near the bottom of the fourth division? If we so not try to progress, we will only ever go backwards. It's not even like the money for this is coming out of our transfer budget. We haven't sold the jewels to fund it, so lets not look a gift horse in the mouth, and embrace what will be a fantastic new stand for decades to come. I can't imagine many other fans being so against an upgrade, let alone fans from teams whose stadium is seen as prime location for flats by everyone not connected to the club

Where have I said I'm against it? I'm just saying that unless there's a clear, realistic business plan under which it can bring in lots of non-matchday revenue, then it's essentially pointless, just a shiny empty cuboid next to the pitch for us to look at.

There is. It's  the tonnes of commercial floor space generating rent that this prime space generates **** all at the moment.

[nose returns]

The new stand is pointless if we are not going to establish ourselves as a genuine premiership fixture.
Eric miller lost money, so will mr khan. Get the team right first.

[Berserker]

The new stand will help us in the future even if we get relegated. It will generate income for the club that doesn't just rely on football gates and shirt etc. sales, which will help protect a bit from ffp transgressions.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

[toshes mate]

There is. It's  the tonnes of commercial floor space generating rent that this prime space generates fcuk all at the moment.

The ground is in a residential area.  The ground has access problems as it is at the moment (no direct public transport at all with no viable private vehicle parking).  The ground occupies space that has not been tested for commercial viability in its entire history.  The ground occupies space with considerable potential as a residential property asset (which has, of course, been explored in the past).  Looking at ways of developing income from CC other than from football has been looked at many times historically but even the current planned build will be risky for commercial ventures given the number of restrictions imposed by riverside access issues in the planning brief.   I'd say there is a lot of research and discussion that needs to be and could be done if money were no object to the Khans before going ahead.  But that is just my lay opinion.     

[fulhamben]

There is. It's  the tonnes of commercial floor space generating rent that this prime space generates fcuk all at the moment.

The ground is in a residential area.  The ground has access problems as it is at the moment (no direct public transport at all with no viable private vehicle parking).  The ground occupies space that has not been tested for commercial viability in its entire history.  The ground occupies space with considerable potential as a residential property asset (which has, of course, been explored in the past).  Looking at ways of developing income from CC other than from football has been looked at many times historically but even the current planned build will be risky for commercial ventures given the number of restrictions imposed by riverside access issues in the planning brief.   I'd say there is a lot of research and discussion that needs to be and could be done if money were no object to the Khans before going ahead.  But that is just my lay opinion.     

but first and foremost it's a new stand to increase match day capacity. The rest is a Brucie.

[FulhamStu]

Actually think it helps if it happens when we get relegated; less hassle moving people from the Riverside as gates will be less!

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Having a bigger stadium than Crystal Palace, Charlton Athletic and QPR is important to Fulham's future. Only Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea and West Ham will have bigger grounds in the Capital.

Having a Stadium of 30,000 vitually guarantees that any team that fall into League One will get out because 30,000 tickets sold at very low prices is enough to buy players to get out League One (except for MK-Dons and Coventry that i don't believe own their stadiums). For example, I believe Sunderland and Charlton Athletic will be in the Championship in not too long.

How exactly are we going to sell 30.000 tickets in League One?

The stand is really designed to be 20% matchday and 80% non matchday, so in many ways what league we are in makes no difference given the location and new facilities that could be used.

Personally I'd like to hear some numbers.

SF Sorrow makes a good point that we aren't going to get more than 24,000 fans outside the PL so the additional matchday revenue will be zero. In the PL an extra 5,000 fans will equate to what, an extra £3-4m per year or something like that? A meaningless amount in the PL.

The non-matchday revenue needs to be equating to £15m per year or something like that to have any bearing on our success IMO, even in the Championship. Anything much less than that and it's about as useful as the MJ statue.

how many people ever saw us getting 25k again in the cottage, when we were lingering near the bottom of the fourth division? If we so not try to progress, we will only ever go backwards. It's not even like the money for this is coming out of our transfer budget. We haven't sold the jewels to fund it, so lets not look a gift horse in the mouth, and embrace what will be a fantastic new stand for decades to come. I can't imagine many other fans being so against an upgrade, let alone fans from teams whose stadium is seen as prime location for flats by everyone not connected to the club

Where have I said I'm against it? I'm just saying that unless there's a clear, realistic business plan under which it can bring in lots of non-matchday revenue, then it's essentially pointless, just a shiny empty cuboid next to the pitch for us to look at.

Look at the attendances we had in the championship...the new stand would not be empty in that league.

[SuffolkWhite]

Can't believe the Khan's haven't done all sorts of probabilities around making money on this venture to proceed, whatever Div we are in. They make a lot of money in many ventures and I doubt very much their business acumen is poor!

We can have sour grapes about the football as we are going down by the looks of things, but there investment in our ground and team cant be questioned yet.

Agreed poor decision making on players may be an issue right now but that does not mean they aren't 100% behind the club.

Time as ever will tell, just glad we have the Cottage to go to!

[Statto]

Actually think it helps if it happens when we get relegated; less hassle moving people from the Riverside as gates will be less!

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Having a bigger stadium than Crystal Palace, Charlton Athletic and QPR is important to Fulham's future. Only Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea and West Ham will have bigger grounds in the Capital.

Having a Stadium of 30,000 vitually guarantees that any team that fall into League One will get out because 30,000 tickets sold at very low prices is enough to buy players to get out League One (except for MK-Dons and Coventry that i don't believe own their stadiums). For example, I believe Sunderland and Charlton Athletic will be in the Championship in not too long.

How exactly are we going to sell 30.000 tickets in League One?

The stand is really designed to be 20% matchday and 80% non matchday, so in many ways what league we are in makes no difference given the location and new facilities that could be used.

Personally I'd like to hear some numbers.

SF Sorrow makes a good point that we aren't going to get more than 24,000 fans outside the PL so the additional matchday revenue will be zero. In the PL an extra 5,000 fans will equate to what, an extra £3-4m per year or something like that? A meaningless amount in the PL.

The non-matchday revenue needs to be equating to £15m per year or something like that to have any bearing on our success IMO, even in the Championship. Anything much less than that and it's about as useful as the MJ statue.

how many people ever saw us getting 25k again in the cottage, when we were lingering near the bottom of the fourth division? If we so not try to progress, we will only ever go backwards. It's not even like the money for this is coming out of our transfer budget. We haven't sold the jewels to fund it, so lets not look a gift horse in the mouth, and embrace what will be a fantastic new stand for decades to come. I can't imagine many other fans being so against an upgrade, let alone fans from teams whose stadium is seen as prime location for flats by everyone not connected to the club

Where have I said I'm against it? I'm just saying that unless there's a clear, realistic business plan under which it can bring in lots of non-matchday revenue, then it's essentially pointless, just a shiny empty cuboid next to the pitch for us to look at.

Look at the attendances we had in the championship...the new stand would not be empty in that league.

Perhaps I should clarify I didn't mean literally empty
But even in our promotion season it was only 80% full on average
If we are doubling the size of that stand then simple maths tells you it will be about 40% full

But anyway the fundamental point being made was that increasing the total capacity of the stadium doesn't bring in more matchday revenue unless we're selling out the existing capacity

[toshes mate]

Personally I think the whole 'business outline' is flawed unless corporate sponsors with money to burn are going to arrive in bucket loads simply because the new stand will be too good to be true from any non-football related POV, thus justifying the twenty-eighty percent perspective MJG has mentioned.  I think those figures are 'pie-in-sky' unless, somehow, CC is to be a mecca for the Hammersmith commercial scene as it already is, by providing something that isn't already there.  I don't see anything in the brief that isn't already there either in Hammersmith or on the Thameside walkways existing in the area.  Those are competitors that have to be beaten by whatever project is considered.

[Baszab]

Please stop going on about attendance revenue - it's peanuts compared to TV money/sponsorship/corporate fees

No Premier team = no point in redeveloping the ground

[Woolly Mammoth]

My thoughts are that the longer the development is delayed, the higher the cost of the project.
It is I imagine inevitable that it it built, and needs to be built, and has to be built, if we are not going to be left behind the other clubs in London.

[Holders]

My thoughts are that the longer the development is delayed, the higher the cost of the project.
It is I imagine inevitable that it it built, and needs to be built, and has to be built, if we are not going to be left behind the other clubs in London.

That was the argument when the existing Riverside was built. It cost £300,000.

[MJG]

Please stop going on about attendance revenue - it's peanuts compared to TV money/sponsorship/corporate fees

No Premier team = no point in redeveloping the ground

might as well rent a pitch in a park someone eh?

[Deeping_white]

Please stop going on about attendance revenue - it's peanuts compared to TV money/sponsorship/corporate fees

No Premier team = no point in redeveloping the ground

But therein lies one of the reasons for the new stand, it'll make money year round rather than 18/23 days guaranteed per year which gives the club even more money. There's no link between the playing staff and the ground, Khan can easily invest in both as he did with the Jaguars as both will need improving.

[Woolly Mammoth]

In a Nutshell, the Riverside Stand needs to be built ASAP, for so many different reasons on and off the pitch, that have been explained by more informative people than I.
No matter which Division we happen to be in at the time.
Have no fear or doubts or scepticism about the project, it's necessary and once it is completed, we should all be pleased with the outcome I would like to think.

[Baszab]

I'm also worried about the stand's financing
Will it be out of cash flow or reserves ? I doubt it
Will it be a secured loan from Khans ?
And if we drop to the 3rd division ? And the Khans want their money out
We're left with debts and a crap team ?
No-one knows the Khans' long term  plans - probably not even them