Our scouting system

[MikeW]

I have been critical in the past and see no reason to stop now about the Talbot & Son set up.

Looking at the moves that have taken place on the BBC transfer listings and many national papers, I often think 'he would have been good for us' yet no, never a hint that Fulham are interested.  Our defence is woeful yet excellent CB's and full backs are moving (many well in our budget I'm sure).

We always seem to  be chasing obscure overseas players when on our doorstep there seem to be many answers.  Or should I say 'were' many answers.  All snapped up now.

Our summer signings look good but no one seems to addressing the defensive problem.  Soon be too late.

[bill taylors apprentice]

I have been critical in the past and see no reason to stop now about the Talbot & Son set up.

Looking at the moves that have taken place on the BBC transfer listings and many national papers, I often think 'he would have been good for us' yet no, never a hint that Fulham are interested.  Our defence is woeful yet excellent CB's and full backs are moving (many well in our budget I'm sure).

We always seem to  be chasing obscure overseas players when on our doorstep there seem to be many answers.  Or should I say 'were' many answers.  All snapped up now.

Our summer signings look good but no one seems to addressing the defensive problem.  Soon be too late.

Ah ha! But our scouting system has a better methodology than anyone else, didn't you know?

[Roberty]

Our defence is woeful yet excellent CB's and full backs are moving (many well in our budget I'm sure).

Our defence may have been woeful but in part it may well have something to do with the coaching and organisation - I do remember Stuart Grays departure being blamed last season

As to the "excellent" CB's and full back who are moving - do you really think any or many of them are better than what we have - because if they were I doubt that Leeds and others would be so keen to get shot of them

[wheelerdeeler]

I'm not sure how you can say we always seem to be chasing obscure overseas players when both signings we've made and pretty much every proper link we've had to players this summer (Konsa, Hector, Besic etc.) have been domestic.

In fact, if we were looking abroad more we'd probably have more signings in- because they're almost always cheaper and easier to get done.

[MikeW]

Roberty: In answer to you question, yes I do think many of them are better than what we have!  Ream and Odoi are at best back up players and I don't think the Mawson/Le Marchand combination is terribly fearsome.

Wheelerdealer:  Scroll back through the daily news updates since May and we have been supposedly pursuing a load of European based players.  Brentford.  By contrast have signed 3 centre backs - Pinnock an outstanding prospect for about £3M.  He would walk into our team. 

[wheelerdeeler]

Genuinely, who have we been properly linked to from abroad? That Kosovan winger earlier in the week, Chema, Cabral who I doubt we're in for now we've signed Knockaert and Cavaleiro and then...? Compare that to being linked with Konsa, Hector, Assombalonga, Gayle, Forshaw, Besic, Nkoudou, Onomah and O'Dowda on top of signing Knockaert and Cavaleiro.

This has been our least "looking abroad" summer since Tony Khan came in by an absolute mile. 

Plus, Pinnock's Left-Footed. So I'm not sure why we'd be in for him in the first place.

[MikeW]

Err ... to replace Ream I was thinking.

[Andy S]

There's nothing like a good moan about nothing

[wheelerdeeler]

Err ... to replace Ream I was thinking.

We have Mawson and Le Marchand who can both comfortably play as the LCB already (on top of Ream). Left-Sided Centre-Back would literally have been bottom of my priority list for signings this summer.

[Woolly Mammoth]

I'm not sure how you can say we always seem to be chasing obscure overseas players when both signings we've made and pretty much every proper link we've had to players this summer (Konsa, Hector, Besic etc.) have been domestic.

In fact, if we were looking abroad more we'd probably have more signings in- because they're almost always cheaper and easier to get done.

Too many failures, and expensive ones in some cases. There is a higher risk of failure from abroad, that's why they are cheaper, some take far too long to settle in if at all, some are too lightweight with no upper body strength, many get homesick, and cannot speak English, and some find our League too tough. 
Which is frustrating when there are better players in our lower Divisions, who don't have all those problems and maintenance.

[spikey norman]

What I wonder is how Talbot junior can be chief European scout with only non league experience and no previous  scouting experience.

[wheelerdeeler]

What I wonder is how Talbot junior can be chief European scout with only non league experience and no previous  scouting experience.

I think people vastly overestimate the general "ability" of scouts. I remember watching the Sunderland documentary on Netflix and one of their scouts had recommended they sign Ibrahimovic. And another got completely put off a player because he was wearing gloves. Bar the very top level ones (who inevitably end up at the top clubs), there's not much difference between any of them.

[wheelerdeeler]

I'm not sure how you can say we always seem to be chasing obscure overseas players when both signings we've made and pretty much every proper link we've had to players this summer (Konsa, Hector, Besic etc.) have been domestic.

In fact, if we were looking abroad more we'd probably have more signings in- because they're almost always cheaper and easier to get done.

Too many failures, and expensive ones in some cases. There is a higher risk of failure from abroad, that's why they are cheaper, some take far too long to settle in if at all, some are too lightweight with no upper body strength, many get homesick, and cannot speak English, and some find our League too tough. 
Which is frustrating when there are better players in our lower Divisions, who don't have all those problems and maintenance.

We can take a chance on one or two players from abroad this summer. We've got a very, very Championship-centric core of a team already. From the team I'm expecting to start against Barnsley the only players who wouldn't have played in the Championship before are S. Sessegnon and Le Marchand, and even then S. Sessegnon could be swapped for Christie.

I'd personally look domestically for a right-sided Centre-Back so a Hector, Ayala type and then look abroad to pad out our Midfield because we have the Cairney, Johansen, McDonald core which means we don't have to throw said Midfielders in at the deep end and they'll have to play their way in.

[The Rational Fan]

What I wonder is how Talbot junior can be chief European scout with only non league experience and no previous  scouting experience.

I think people vastly overestimate the general "ability" of scouts. I remember watching the Sunderland documentary on Netflix and one of their scouts had recommended they sign Ibrahimovic. And another got completely put off a player because he was wearing gloves. Bar the very top level ones (who inevitably end up at the top clubs), there's not much difference between any of them.

I also think we are a bit harsh on our scouts and write players off pretty quickly. For example, the goalkeeping scouts considered statistics for Fabri of 12,000 minutes of playing time, probably with a highlight real of saves and goals, then after 180 minutes of Premier League and a few friendly we declare the scout a fool.

Another great example, I have a friend from south america that helped some scouts, tell me that Maradona's Goal of the Century vs England was against crap defenders (Butcher, Samson) and goalkeeper (Shilton), which is nonsense unless you have only watched those players against Maradona.

[Matt10]

I wouldn't be surprised if Mawson is being groomed for the RCB spot. Seen it in training videos as well. Then, either Ream or LeMarchand on the left-hand side. My hope is it will be Ream because of how dominant he was in our promo year. LeMarchand is a good shout as well.

I know we want to keep hanging last season over every participant's head, but I've accepted it was guilty by association - and it's just pointless to bring up because we're starting a new season - time to move on.

[The Rational Fan]

I wouldn't be surprised if Mawson is being groomed for the RCB spot. Seen it in training videos as well. Then, either Ream or LeMarchand on the left-hand side. My hope is it will be Ream because of how dominant he was in our promo year. LeMarchand is a good shout as well.

I know we want to keep hanging last season over every participant's head, but I've accepted it was guilty by association - and it's just pointless to bring up because we're starting a new season - time to move on.

I think Mawson is being groomed to play both RCB and LCB, that way if we get promoted and we can buy two premier league centre backs and we can play either two if one is injured.

[toshes mate]

... our scouting system ... et cetera ...

Is, like our data system, our analysis of our data system, our negotiation processes, our initial bids, and so on and so forth, almost identical to any other football club's system.  Similar data, similar interests, similar targets, and probably similar responses from other clubs to our targets.  That is what happens when generic information is broadly available to anyone prepared to pay the subscription fee. 

All this would be true of the top echelons of professional football data but less true of those who play their football in less well observed territory and may explain why some who work on the leading [sic] edge of the technology are trying to break new ground if only because less external interest, in theory, means less demand, and lower prices for superficially similar goods.  It also means higher risk, the very thing comprehensive data knowledge is trying to reduce.  Scandinavian groups (with considerable interest from brokers in the US) are using an impressive array of technology to find ways of tracking their registered players to the extent of managing team squads although not quite to the point of selecting teams.  That remains a longer term goal.

The market place is being homogenised and that has, historically, meant more average (median) outcomes but less ability to spot the real catches there are to be had and even how to find them.  If the player watchers are homogenised then talent spotting becomes an endangered art.  It is a bit like trying to find a human being who is demonstrably good at manual filing after years of not having paper records - the skill is lost.  We are in danger of losing our talent spotters unless we are prepared to pay them money to do talent spotting the hard (and more expensive) way.   Computers have done this to huge swathes of industry already and it is a common law of unintended consequences that'll one day be a recipient of renewed interest because humans are better than machines at most things if you are looking for originality and talent.