Wigan/Wednesday/Derby...Points Deductions.

[Mince n Tatties]

This farce has been taking ages,should have been sorted out by EFL before last night.
Just listening on radio and you have to feel for Wigan,as their deduction has been installed right away.
Wednesday could face up to 10 to 21 point deduction, even the 10 point would put them down,yet that looks like it want be installed till next season.
Derby who along with Wednesday haven't had theirs worked out yet for breaking regulations.
Being going on for months this should have been sorted earlier.

[SuffolkWhite]

I think the whole financial fair play system is about to implode anyway especially if the likes of "Citeh" can get things overturned, it'l boil down to the Lawyers in the end.

It is rubbish though.

[filham]

Just can't understand why those responsible allow such a situation to continue unresolved for so long. Certainly unfair to the club, players and fans.

[Statto]

I see lots of criticisms of this nature flying around and (mostly on other threads) suggestions that the Man City case undermines other cases. But has anyone bothered to read the intricacies of each case?

I'm happy to admit I haven't, but I suspect there are distinctioms between them which may explain the different timefrrames and why City's case (which, for a start, arose under a totally different FFP regime) was overturned on appeal to CAS.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not fan of FFP, the EFL or UEFA and I've no confidence in their decisions. But nonethess, if someone had a criminal conviction overturned on appeal, we'd just assume the original conviction was weak or mistaken. We wouldn't say it meant that all other convictions should also be overturned and if they weren't, accuse the court of double-standards. Similarly, it would be accepted that different cases take different lengths of time to resolve and merit different punishments, eg community service for one guy and life in prison for another.

[toshes mate]

Being going on for months this should have been sorted earlier.

Absolutely spot on.  What with appeals etc., you'd think the EFL would want all their members to be certain of where they stand from the moment a problem or rule break is identified.  What happens if a relegated club wins an appeal against points deduction, effectively restored to Championship status and someone else needs to be relegated having already started gearing up for next season? 

[The Cravenette]

Barnsley did so well winning their last 2 matches to stay up (affecting the top of the table with those wins too). But they only stayed up because of Wigan's 12 point deduction. So what happens if Wigan win their appeal? It would be harsh on Barnsley after seeing their celebrations at Griffin Park last night.

[SuffolkWhite]

I see lots of criticisms of this nature flying around and (mostly on other threads) suggestions that the Man City case undermines other cases. But has anyone bothered to read the intricacies of each case?

I'm happy to admit I haven't, but I suspect there are distinctioms between them which may explain the different timefrrames and why City's case (which, for a start, arose under a totally different FFP regime) was overturned on appeal to CAS.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not fan of FFP, the EFL or UEFA and I've no confidence in their decisions. But nonethess, if someone had a criminal conviction overturned on appeal, we'd just assume the original conviction was weak or mistaken. We wouldn't say it meant that all other convictions should also be overturned and if they weren't, accuse the court of double-standards. Similarly, it would be accepted that different cases take different lengths of time to resolve and merit different punishments, eg community service for one guy and life in prison for another.

Yea all fair points, each case should be heard individually. Just can't help feeling that if you can afford the legal fees you will stand a much better chance of getting off, but that's a different question. I just think of Wet Spam amongst other teams in the past that somehow have avoided real punishment.

[bog]

Once again you look at those in charge at the top of football and wonder what planet they are on. (FIFA Blatter) I have every sympathy for Wigan, how could the EFL think the new owners to be fit and proper? When Bury went under Greg Clarke at the FA said he only learnt of the club's plight just before they closed down.  I remember years ago they took 30 points of Luton for misdemeanors of a former chairman and they ended up in the Conference.  Took years to recover.   

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[bobbo]

There's almost certainly a smelly word attaching itself to the decsions --------- " corruption "

[H4usuallysitting]

There's almost certainly a smelly word attaching itself to the decsions --------- " corruption "

Manure

[Wolf]

Barnsley did so well winning their last 2 matches to stay up (affecting the top of the table with those wins too). But they only stayed up because of Wigan's 12 point deduction. So what happens if Wigan win their appeal? It would be harsh on Barnsley after seeing their celebrations at Griffin Park last night.

I think the general view in football may be that there is no chance Wigan will win the appeal.

[The Rational Fan]

I see lots of criticisms of this nature flying around and (mostly on other threads) suggestions that the Man City case undermines other cases. But has anyone bothered to read the intricacies of each case?

I'm happy to admit I haven't, but I suspect there are distinctioms between them which may explain the different timefrrames and why City's case (which, for a start, arose under a totally different FFP regime) was overturned on appeal to CAS.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not fan of FFP, the EFL or UEFA and I've no confidence in their decisions. But nonethess, if someone had a criminal conviction overturned on appeal, we'd just assume the original conviction was weak or mistaken.

We wouldn't say it meant that all other convictions should also be overturned and if they weren't, accuse the court of double-standards. Similarly, it would be accepted that different cases take different lengths of time to resolve and merit different punishments, eg community service for one guy and life in prison for another.

Not all cases are the same.

Wigan have so clearly broken the rules that the 12 point deduction is a no brainer, but equally, they were also the most honest as the owner planned to keep the club running with extra cash, but couldn't during covid-19.

Sheffield Wednesday and Derby are a little more tricky, while they are clearly trying to be deceptive without actually being prepared to lie, but everything happened within the UK and it's pretty easy to trace the truth.

Man City on the other hand probably didn't do anything wrong, but it seems that people financially connected to Man Cities owners have spent more on sponsorship than could be reasonably justified in a business case.

While it was likely something happened outside Europe and outside Man City to bypass these laws, there is actually not a lot of proof apart from a few indicative emails.

When international companies sponsor football teams owned by international owners any case involves international law, so it may be a little hard to track the money trails and given the international police are busy tracking terrorism money, drug money and international arms trade, football money may not be their top priority.

Ultimately, every rule in football whether on or off the field has someone trying to avoid it. On the field, we have some players doing tactical fouls and another screaming with the smallest touch. FFP is no different, everyone is trying to bend the rules and make them advantage them.

For me the FFP rules are about three things: i) punishing teams that try to overtake the big clubs and go bankrupt ii) preventing teams trying to overtake the big clubs by risking bankruptcy and iii) preventing teams trying to overtake the big clubs by investing enormous amounts of money.

What is not covered is fans spending enormous amounts of money boosting the club's commercial income, because Man United love that source of income from millions of fans. Man City have a few fans willing to spend similar amounts of money on the team that are probably also owners, and Man United want that stop.

I wonder what they do if Shahid Khan places a price of "a million dollars per home" for renting the seats on the craven cottage balcony and then a family member of the Khans bought the seats for the entire season.