Friends of Fulham

Putting this out there.

We know we're going to have ...

Josh, Tom, Harrison (hopefully) as probable starters in the midfield.

Stefjo, maybe Arter...and even BDR can play in the midfield if needed.


Personally, I'd like to keep Zambo...because if Harrison Reed get's hurt (and with the work rate required in the EPL he's going to suffer an injury) I rate Zambo defensively more than I do Stefjo, Arter or Seri.     Zambo also helps us in the air.

Anguissa all day. He walks straight into our first team.

Neither, they didn´t perform last time so why should they this time?

Neither, both milky and disinterested, sooner we can offload them the better.

Quote from: davew on August 08, 2020, 05:54:36 PM
Neither, they didn´t perform last time so why should they this time?

I think it's a bit harsh to say Anguissa didn't perform when he was with us last time (https://www.transfermarkt.us/andre-zambo-anguissa/leistungsdaten/spieler/354361/plus/0?saison=2018).  Scott surely rated him.

There is a bunch of revisionist history going on.   Anguissa faded in the second half of games, but he was not poor for Fulham.  Definitely wasn't on the pitch when we lost to Oldham Athletic.

Zambo any day of the week, and given he played basically every minute under Parker whereas Seri from memory only had one game because Cairney's son was being born- Parker would say the same.

If we had a Midfield Three of Reed, Zambo; Onomah going into next season I'd be more than happy. Most balanced midfield we could have in my opinion.

Quote from: wheelerdeeler on August 08, 2020, 06:19:59 PM
Zambo any day of the week, and given he played basically every minute under Parker whereas Seri from memory only had one game because Cairney's son was being born- Parker would say the same.

If we had a Midfield Three of Reed, Zambo; Onomah going into next season I'd be more than happy. Most balanced midfield we could have in my opinion.

you read my mind with that midfield trio. I'd be more than happy to go into the season with those 3 starting for us

Seri seems to have completely lost his touch, didn't do well in Turkey either. Zambo Anguissa on the other hand was very impressive in Spain by all accounts on the other hand and Parker seems to rate him. Villareal seemingly can't cough up the asking price and I don't think he'll be sold for any less than he was bought for.

Zambo for me, I thought he was just beginning to perform.

Definitely Zambo he is a class player 👍

My favorite Fulham game in 18/19 had Anguissa and Babel in the side (https://www.fulhamfc.com/news/2019/april/14/90-mins-everton).   Seri...no where to be seen.

Neither. Not up to the Prem and as team dynamics go would be a bad move. Flog em, and buy Reed or anyone that wants to play for the shirt.

I would say neither because they were happy to leave.I do not see Zambo changing his attitude as the big name clubs will be more appealing to him

Quote from: Stoneleigh Loyalist on August 08, 2020, 06:59:59 PM
I would say neither because they were happy to leave.I do not see Zambo changing his attitude as the big name clubs will be more appealing to him

What attitude?  Have you read something somewhere?   Did it look like he didn't get on with Scott?

The OWNERS decided to loan him out.   The OWNERS decided that La Liga football was better for him last season.   

Neither, Reed and Cairney have proved to be loyal and better for us over the last tough season. Lets cash in on Seri and Anguissa and use the money to buy one of those high scoring strikers from Brentford.

Anguissa is a quality player who has been getting great reviews in La Liga. Hope he comes back.

Some Fulham fans just haven't warmed to Frank and quite simply aren't prepared to give this guy a chance. They've made their mind up and that's that. It's worth considering that he was a 23 year old who took and job in a new country with a new language to learn. To expect him to hit the ground running in a team as dysfunctional as Fulham last season with all the change in personnel is unreasonable. On top of that he spent a lengthy time out injured only coming back towards the back end of the season by which time we were the whipping boys of the division. He put in some excellent performances which earned him MOM. It was becoming clear that he would be a major asset in the Championship and I and many others were disappointed that he went out on loan.

Earlier this season Josh Onomah came into the side and I thought here we go again. The boo boys were out for him early doors without giving him an inch to prove what an excellent player he obviously is.

If he comes back I really hope Anguissa gets the support he deserves and for that matter any new signings are given a fair chance from all supporters.

Amazed at some of the attitude comments. I can't recall either of them ever saying anything remotely indicative of a bad attitude.

Seri is far too much of a light weight for English football'
Zambo? Possibly. Maybe keep him and if he doesn't perform, dump him in January. If we don't keep Reed, we'll need him. Arter will morp from being a liability in the Championship to a disaster in the Prem.

Quote from: YankeeJim on August 08, 2020, 08:05:39 PM
Seri is far too much of a light weight for English football'
Zambo? Possibly. Maybe keep him and if he doesn't perform, dump him in January. If we don't keep Reed, we'll need him. Arter will morp from being a liability in the Championship to a disaster in the Prem.

we can't make the same mistake as last time though, zambo is not a defensive midfielder and what happens with reed should have no bearing on him

I think we will sell both but would like to see Zambo stay if he is committed I rate him. Seri we should sell

Quote from: Statto on August 08, 2020, 07:50:26 PM
Amazed at some of the attitude comments. I can't recall either of them ever saying anything remotely indicative of a bad attitude.

They didn't but that doesn't read as an interesting backstory for a scapegoat......

Seri absolutely not. Zambo ok if he's ok with starting the season as a bench player. But I doubt he would be and therein lies the problem. On balance I fell it's better to move on.

Seri is absolutely and totally useless, he's had his chance in the prem. and Slav, the Chauffeur, and even slow on the uptake Ranieri gave up on him.

The Khans won't be buying many players this window, four to seven is most estimates with defense being three of those signings, Harrison Reed and a backup striker using up five of them. We definately need Anguiissa and Seri in the squad then.

Quote from: Twig on August 08, 2020, 10:41:55 PM
Seri absolutely not. Zambo ok if he's ok with starting the season as a bench player. But I doubt he would be and therein lies the problem. On balance I fell it's better to move on.

Why wouldn't he be ok with that?   If he doesn't beat out whomever is ahead of him in practice, that's on him.   He's paid a salary to be a player.   He has two years left on his contract...   

He's played well in La Liga, which most feel is one of the, if not THE league with the most footballing talent in it.   Doesn't matter if he'd won the ballon d'or, if he doesn't fit the system we know Scott Parker won't play him.

Anguissa is not a bumb on the pitch (https://www.villarrealusa.com/2020/7/21/21332555/villarreal-fulham-zambo-anguissa-transfer-news-latest), as some would have you think.

Was he great?   No.   Three managers, multiple systems, inconsistency in the midfield...yet he's been good at Villarreal (https://www.goal.com/en-us/news/how-did-zambo-anguissa-turn-it-around-at-villarreal/1uxmsa6ycxsce12hwqxobgy1nt). 

I don't expect him to start immediately (our captain holds his spot (https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=269&v=iux8e4yAwEU&feature=emb_logo)) but at some point he's going to move into the starting lineup.

Not every player succeeds on every team.    Eden Hazard prime example this year.

If all Scott Parker needs in the midfield is a grafter, then Zambo may not get a lot of minutes and might be better served on a different team.   

Quote from: fulhamben on August 08, 2020, 06:24:07 PM

Quote from: wheelerdeeler on August 08, 2020, 06:19:59 PM
Zambo any day of the week, and given he played basically every minute under Parker whereas Seri from memory only had one game because Cairney's son was being born- Parker would say the same.

If we had a Midfield Three of Reed, Zambo; Onomah going into next season I'd be more than happy. Most balanced midfield we could have in my opinion.

you read my mind with that midfield trio. I'd be more than happy to go into the season with those 3 starting for us

No Cairney then?

Anguissa but I'd like both. Both unfairly maligned given most players had a poor season last year. Would improve our squad.

Highlights from his last season at Villareal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1LZGHVejVk  Looks like a different player to who he was playing for us and shows undoubted quality. Harness this at Fulham and he's an asset and first team starter.

Anguissa if he has improved a bit. We have Onomah who is better and scores. As for Seri well he would have to improved beyond belief before I want to see him in a Fulham shirt.

Quote from: General on August 11, 2020, 11:19:14 AM

Highlights from his last season at Villareal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1LZGHVejVk  Looks like a different player to who he was playing for us and shows undoubted quality. Harness this at Fulham and he's an asset and first team starter.

Looks superb. A clear starter if he continues his form. He's our player and if any team wants him they will need to pay more than what we bought him for.

Quote from: General on August 11, 2020, 11:19:14 AM

Highlights from his last season at Villareal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1LZGHVejVk  Looks like a different player to who he was playing for us and shows undoubted quality. Harness this at Fulham and he's an asset and first team starter.

Who was he doing all this wonderful stuff against though? To be fair looks like he has filled out a bit.

Main thing he could bring to the midfield is more pace. Onomah And Cairney aren't exactly sprinters.

https://laligaanalysis.com/analysis/player-analysis/andre-frank-zambo-anguissa-20192020-scout-report-tactical-analysis-tactics

This is a great read for us who havent seen Zambo play in La Liga. Really think hes going to slot in perfectly in our midield

Quote from: Bill2 on August 11, 2020, 11:41:18 AM
Anguissa if he has improved a bit. We have Onomah who is better and scores. As for Seri well he would have to improved beyond belief before I want to see him in a Fulham shirt.

Seri has never been a player with great statistics, but since he moved to the DM role he had the best half season statistical since 16/17. As a comparison, Seri's statistics were about equal with Harrison Reed in the same position.

I think Reed will struggle in the premier league like Seri did so last time it would be nice to have Reed with Seri ready on the bench competiting for one spot. Starting as a bench player Seri will do much better, because earning Harrison Reeds spot in the starting XI will earn him more respect than being thrown in the team.

The thing is with Anguissa is that although he can show very good ball control in tight areas and is physically strong and is capable of winning the ball back, I always feel like he is neither one thing nor the other. I don't see him as a player who is an out and out deep lying midfielder, nor do I see him as an attacking midfielder (have a look at his goals & assists, 2 goals and 2 assists in 40 odd matches this season).

Most of those clips show him surging forward with the ball, but seemingly doing little with it. I appreciate the moments of good football, but after watching that video, I feel the same way as I did when he was playing better when he was with us. I would still have him back but I am not getting as excited as everyone else seems to be at the prospect personally.

Quote from: Jamie88 on August 12, 2020, 02:20:31 PM
The thing is with Anguissa is that although he can show very good ball control in tight areas and is physically strong and is capable of winning the ball back, I always feel like he is neither one thing nor the other. I don't see him as a player who is an out and out deep lying midfielder, nor do I see him as an attacking midfielder (have a look at his goals & assists, 2 goals and 2 assists in 40 odd matches this season).

Most of those clips show him surging forward with the ball, but seemingly doing little with it. I appreciate the moments of good football, but after watching that video, I feel the same way as I did when he was playing better when he was with us. I would still have him back but I am not getting as excited as everyone else seems to be at the prospect personally.

He was playing more of a box-to-box midfielder, so you are correct that he is neither a deep lying or attacking midfielder but a little bit of both/inbetween. Would work well (position wise) in our midfield I reckon, with a DM (Reed?) and either TC or Onomah.

Niether, they are on collision course wit Cairney and Reed who have pro proved themselves first choice players. Seri and Anguissa are too expensive for bench warmers.

Quote from: davew on August 08, 2020, 05:54:36 PM
Neither, they didn´t perform last time so why should they this time?

Agree

Quote from: Slaphead in Qatar on August 12, 2020, 03:14:31 PM

Quote from: davew on August 08, 2020, 05:54:36 PM
Neither, they didn´t perform last time so why should they this time?

Agree

That of course also goes for almost all of the other players in the team. Maybe can let Mitro of the hook as he did score a couple of goals, but I think to be fair we should not give any of the other players a second chance.

Quote from: Slaphead in Qatar on August 12, 2020, 03:14:31 PM

Quote from: davew on August 08, 2020, 05:54:36 PM
Neither, they didn´t perform last time so why should they this time?

Agree

Could similarly apply the logic to any of the players currently in our squad that got relegated last time round, so not the soundest logic ever. Both got played out of position before, Seri wasn't a DM and Anguissa has always played best in a 4-3-3 or with a holding midfielder next to him in a 4-2-3-1/4-5-1 so he can be box to box and use his ability to better effect. Parker player Anguissa in a better role and he looked better for it, if anyone is going to get the best out of a central midfielder it'll be the former premier league central midfielder.

As other people have said, if you want to get rid of players who didn't perform two seasons ago we won't have anyone left going into next season. I'm not that interested in keeping Seri, and I'd be reasonably confident in saying Parker isn't either given he barely played him.

Zambo on the other hand played almost every minute as soon as Parker got the job, and if we acknowledge that he isn't a 6 and he's either an 8 in a 4-3-3 with Reed sitting or part of a double pivot with Reed in a 4-2-3-1 with either Cairney or Onomah as the other midfielder it's got a good balance to it. Especially with Onomah in my opinion. Reed, Zambo, Onomah gives us a good balance, a good energy and Zambo and Onomah can both carry the ball forward from the midfield.

And while I obviously don't know him, based on Zambo's Instagram post when he joined Villarreal on loan where he thanked Parker for believing in him I'd like to think he'd be happy to play under him.

Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on August 11, 2020, 11:03:47 AM
Anguissa but I'd like both. Both unfairly maligned given most players had a poor season last year. Would improve our squad.

Selling both for 30-40m and buying defenders improves the squad. Zambo instead of Reed and Seri instead of Onomah for ex. is a gamble I wouldn't want to take.

Quote from: wheelerdeeler on August 12, 2020, 04:11:20 PM
As other people have said, if you want to get rid of players who didn't perform two seasons ago we won't have anyone left going into next season. I'm not that interested in keeping Seri, and I'd be reasonably confident in saying Parker isn't either given he barely played him.

Zambo on the other hand played almost every minute as soon as Parker got the job, and if we acknowledge that he isn't a 6 and he's either an 8 in a 4-3-3 with Reed sitting or part of a double pivot with Reed in a 4-2-3-1 with either Cairney or Onomah as the other midfielder it's got a good balance to it. Especially with Onomah in my opinion. Reed, Zambo, Onomah gives us a good balance, a good energy and Zambo and Onomah can both carry the ball forward from the midfield.

And while I obviously don't know him, based on Zambo's Instagram post when he joined Villarreal on loan where he thanked Parker for believing in him I'd like to think he'd be happy to play under him.

Reasonable post. If I had to take one and not the other it would def be Zambo.

Quote from: The Rock on August 12, 2020, 05:07:03 PM

Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on August 11, 2020, 11:03:47 AM
Anguissa but I'd like both. Both unfairly maligned given most players had a poor season last year. Would improve our squad.

Selling both for 30-40m and buying defenders improves the squad. Zambo instead of Reed and Seri instead of Onomah for ex. is a gamble I wouldn't want to take.

If you can find teams willing to pay that for them you could put them in contact with Fulham I guess. You can't just simply trade them in for money at a pawn shop.

Perhaps, we just need to give them more belief that they're at the right club and part of something exciting and worth fighting for...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKaPbAj8H6c

I voted for Anguissa as Scott rates him
and I like the idea of him and Reed as a DM pairing

I believe we have to play 2 DMs and one AM to survive

Seri looked a world beater against Burnley early in the season but then faded
He would need to compete and better Cairney , Cordova-Reid and Onamah as the one AM

Quote from: Riverside on August 12, 2020, 05:54:06 PM
I voted for Anguissa as Scott rates him
and I like the idea of him and Reed as a DM pairing

I believe we have to play 2 DMs and one AM to survive

Seri looked a world beater against Burnley early in the season but then faded
He would need to compete and better Cairney , Cordova-Reid and Onamah as the one AM

At Galatasray, Seri spent the first half of last season at CM with Ryan Babel on the wing, the results weren't great. They got rid of Babel and moved Seri back to DM, then Seri played well and did statistically about as well as Reed for the season (although nowhere near as good as Reed's amazing post lockdown stats). Seri can play #6, #8 and #10 well for 30-60 minutes per game, so is an ideal bench player, something we really need.

I think we should start the season with Reed at #6, Anguissa at #8, and Cairney at #10 with midfield backup of S.Sess #6, KMac #6, Seri (#6, #8, #10), Stefjo (#6, #8, #10), Onamah (#8, #10) and Reid (#8, #10), then after four games (i.e. international deadline day) send one of them on loan overseas or after six games (i.e domestic deadline day) send one of them on loan to the Championship. I think Seri will do better starting from the bench and earning his spot when someone else fails.

I have two saved Galatasaray games from late in the season where Seri played DM.   Nothing that I saw tells me Seri is reactive enough in front of our back line to warrent getting any play time ahead of even  Stefjo, who isn't even a DM.


imo  Onomah is a lock to be our starting #10.   Cairney...our starting #8 and Reed as our starting #6.

Anguissa (who I think is better than Tom Cairney) will be on the bench until he proves he's better than Tom as the #8, but I'd definitely bring Anguissa in to play a slash #8/#6 beside Tom before I'd bring Seri onto the pitch.

I see Seri as a 3rd string #8, which to me means, if he's on the pitch we're in trouble stopping the opposing team.

Quote from: AnOldBrownie on August 13, 2020, 03:08:08 AM
I have two saved Galatasaray games from late in the season where Seri played DM.   Nothing that I saw tells me Seri is reactive enough in front of our back line to warrent getting any play time ahead of even  Stefjo, who isn't even a DM. imo  Onomah is a lock to be our starting #10.   Cairney...our starting #8 and Reed as our starting #6.

Anguissa (who I think is better than Tom Cairney) will be on the bench until he proves he's better than Tom as the #8, but I'd definitely bring Anguissa in to play a slash #8/#6 beside Tom before I'd bring Seri onto the pitch. I see Seri as a 3rd string #8, which to me means, if he's on the pitch we're in trouble stopping the opposing team.

Seri is looking at being our 5th best central midfielder; behind Reed, Anguissa, Cairney and Onamah; just ahead of S.Sess, KMac, Stefjo and Reid. He may prove better than some midfielders in the best four now and some of those outside the top five may prove (or improve) to be better than him.

All the teams in the bottom eight of the premier league struggle to get one point per game when they have two of their best four midfielders injured. With Seri playing we might not get one point per game, but he can help us pick up some points until the best midfielders come back as proven by victories in the premier league with him in the starting XI against Burnley, Huddersfield, Southampton, Brighton, and Bournemouth.

I think that midfield is pretty solid for preseason, although I admit it might need an upgrade if the preseason is poor, early season is poor or we get some injuries. But other areas need to be addressed first, namely every defensive position and backup center forward.

If Gala doesn't buy Seri, I see him going back out on loan.

Quote from: AnOldBrownie on August 13, 2020, 03:49:40 AM
If Gala doesn't buy Seri, I see him going back out on loan.

Why loan out Seri, he only earns wages of £3m per season (i.e. 1/50th of next year's spending) that's relatively cheap?
In the PL games that Seri started, we got 0.75 points per game, and next season as a squad player he probably starts 9 games where we get 7 points (ie. acceptable).

We could sell him, loan him or keep him.
If we sell him @MV, then FFC lose around £6m for the season, Seri gets a pay rise and the current squad will stay on the same wages so get jealous (i.e. a morale destroyer).
If we loan him out, then FFC gets £4m to spend on a midfielder, which is only enough to get someone that has failed in the PL (i.e. another Seri from another team).
If we keep him, he will start on the bench, provide some cover for injuries, and could get fit to fight his way into the team (i.e. least worst option).

My personal opinion is the only reason fans want Seri sold is so TK has to acknowledge that be made a serious mistake, not to improve the team.
TK made a mistake buying Seri, but TK acknowledging it doesn't help us one bit, and under FFP rules selling Seri really hurts team morale and finances.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 05:09:36 AM
If we sell him @MV, then FFC lose around £6m for the season, Seri gets a pay rise and the current squad will stay on the same wages so get jealous (i.e. a morale destroyer).

If his market value has dropped from £24m to £6m as you suggest, I doubt he'll be getting a big rise on the wages we're paying him if/when he leaves.

I'm also not sure our players would get particularly unsettled by someone getting a pay rise at another club, anyway.

And finally, I don't see us coming anywhere near being restricted by FFP in relation to transfer spending this season. But IIRC the limit on our wage bill is potentially restrictive.

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 07:58:52 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 05:09:36 AM
If we sell him @MV, then FFC lose around £6m for the season, Seri gets a pay rise and the current squad will stay on the same wages so get jealous (i.e. a morale destroyer).

If his market value has dropped from £24m to £6m as you suggest, I doubt he'll be getting a big rise on the wages we're paying him if/when he leaves. I'm also not sure our players would get particularly unsettled by someone getting a pay rise at another club, anyway.

And finally, I don't see us coming anywhere near being restricted by FFP in relation to transfer spending this season. But IIRC the limit on our wage bill is potentially restrictive.

Many clubs would be willing to give Seri £90k per week, they just wouldn't be prepared to pay Fulham more than £1m transfer fee on those wages.

If we want Seri to leave and 100% decided on it, then he would be wise not to leave unless he gets a pay rise or goes to the club of his choice. Alternatively, if we are prepared to stick him on the bench for most of next season, Seri may consider moving with a pay cut to say £40k per week that would get us a large transfer fee say £11m (valuing him similarly to Bobby Reid).

The question is: Do you want Fulham to have the best squad possible next season? If we sell Seri for a low price, under FFP we cannot replace him this season.

It seems to me to be a lot like someone divorcing their wife because they are now poorer than when they were single and want to go back to being rich again. It's probably not going to give you the expected result and as divorcing will probably going to make you much poorer than you were when married no matter how much your wife spends. If you want to sell Seri so bad and don't care that we probably cannot replace him fine, but if injuries hit he's nice to have around.

I thought the limit of wages was scrapped and only FFP matters now, but I could be wrong. FFP is designed by the big clubs to ensure we sell them our best players and keep our worst players. The systems is well designed that reward clubs that do that like Brentford and punishes clubs that do the opposite like Sunderland. FFP is very well planned so that every bad player you sell you have to balance it by selling a good player.

Seri is worth £60k per week of wages compared to a) Knockaert that costs £105k after wages and amortization and b) Bobby Reid that costs £82k after wages and amortization. Seri may not be as good as Knockaert or Reid, but keeping is cheaper than replacing him with some like Bobby Reid. Seri hasn't robbed us, we paid Seri a fair wage and paid Nice much too much, that's not his fault.

We need to stop blaming TK and Seri, we just need The Khans to keep spending until there is enough talent in the squad. As DOF, Tony Khan may a little more help from his father than some others, but TK is good enough with maximum FFP Spend to make us a premier league team eventually, but it may take one more relegation and promotion.

My guess is TK is going to decide if he should sell Seri, knowing if he does he will have less money for other players this season. If Fulham fans just want to fight about every pound wasted then we probably better accepting that the only way we won't waste money is not to spend it. The Khans know they will get a lot more praise by keeping the 2018 squad than investing in new players, because the media don't like them investing and when they invest more than the big clubs want them to, the media will get FFC fans to hound them that they wasted it.

Bournemouth spends £94m in 2018/19 and Fulham spends £120m in 2018/19 probably getting significantly more additional talent than them. Yet Fulham are the ones that get hounded for wasting money, and that's because the ex-player plus big clubs don't like nonfootballers being DOFs and spending more money than they would like upset the delicate EPL balance that keeps ex-player and big clubs on top.

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

If the wages restrictions no longer apply then I think FFP is frankly an irrelevance this season. Our revenue will be what, £110-120m perhaps, plus permitted losses still at £35m, and a wage bill of about £80m? So £65-75m of headroom on those numbers.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).

And say we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m loss

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

If we keep Seri we could sell him for £8m next year, a £2m profit. Surely Better.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

We may make a small gain, but you cannot get anyone better for even £1-2m.

im getting involved again. We paid nearer 10 million for seri not 24.

Quote from: fulhamben on August 13, 2020, 09:44:13 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

We may make a small gain, but you cannot get anyone better for even £1-2m.

im getting involved again. We paid nearer 10 million for seri not 24.

You're entitled to believe that if you want
Some people believe you get covid from 5G
I'm not getting involved in another debate on either

Quote from: fulhamben on August 13, 2020, 09:44:13 AM
im getting involved again. We paid nearer 10 million for seri not 24.

If we paid £10m for Seri, then his book value is £5m and can sell him for a profit.
If we can sell Seri for a small profit fine, but still he might be useful in the squad.

Do you really want Tony Khan to sell a bunch of players and buying several more?
I think we are wiser buying players now, and selling Seri after he's sick of the bench.

Having depth in midfield will make our team strong, if Seri's only our 6th best midfield great

No to Seri as I believe he is not going to up his game enough for the PL and if he starts on the bench he will get the hump rather than fight for a place.

I am not convinced Zambo can make the best of his undoubted attributes on a regular basis and the PL will find him out when he switches off defensively.

Having said that, I hope I'm wrong because his ability to retain possession is excellent and if he can use his size and athleticism to press and fill the channels when defending he will be a  good asset. 

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:46:51 AM

Quote from: fulhamben on August 13, 2020, 09:44:13 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

We may make a small gain, but you cannot get anyone better for even £1-2m.

im getting involved again. We paid nearer 10 million for seri not 24.

You're entitled to believe that if you want
Some people believe you get covid from 5G
I'm not getting involved in another debate on either

you still believing transfermarket over seris previus club who would have got a big payout if seri went for the money you proclaim. And you are still believing transfermarket over seri himself who only got a signing on bonus of a player that was sold for 10 million. I'm starting to think you have shares in transfermarket 🤔

Quote from: fulhamben on August 13, 2020, 09:50:31 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:46:51 AM

Quote from: fulhamben on August 13, 2020, 09:44:13 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

We may make a small gain, but you cannot get anyone better for even £1-2m.

im getting involved again. We paid nearer 10 million for seri not 24.

You're entitled to believe that if you want
Some people believe you get covid from 5G
I'm not getting involved in another debate on either

you still believing transfermarket over seris previus club who would have got a big payout if seri went for the money you proclaim. And you are still believing transfermarket over seri himself who only got a signing on bonus of a player that was sold for 10 million. I'm starting to think you have shares in transfermarket 🤔

I believe we paid in the region of £30m for Seri and MLM, together.
I also accept it sounds like Nice then tried to claim half of that related to MLM, to reduce the payment they had to make to Seri.
Whether we were involved in that and whether it affects our book value of the player, I've no idea. I think it quite possible we just agreed to pay for £30m for both players and whatever Nice did was nothing to do with us.
And even if we were involved, given this has gone to court, if Seri's lawyer is to be believed, then it will be corrected in due course to show that most of the fee related to Seri, not MLM.
So I really don't see the relevance

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:57:36 AM

Quote from: fulhamben on August 13, 2020, 09:50:31 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:46:51 AM

Quote from: fulhamben on August 13, 2020, 09:44:13 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

We may make a small gain, but you cannot get anyone better for even £1-2m.

im getting involved again. We paid nearer 10 million for seri not 24.

You're entitled to believe that if you want
Some people believe you get covid from 5G
I'm not getting involved in another debate on either

you still believing transfermarket over seris previus club who would have got a big payout if seri went for the money you proclaim. And you are still believing transfermarket over seri himself who only got a signing on bonus of a player that was sold for 10 million. I'm starting to think you have shares in transfermarket 🤔

I believe we paid in the region of £30m for Seri and MLM, together.
I also accept it sounds like Nice then tried to claim half of that related to MLM, to reduce the payment they had to make to Seri.
Whether we were involved in that and whether it affects our book value of the player, I've no idea. I think it quite possible we just agreed to pay for £30m for both players and whatever Nice did was nothing to do with us.
And even if we were involved, given this has gone to court, if Seri's lawyer is to be believed, then it will be corrected in due course to show that most of the fee related to Seri, not MLM.
So I really don't see the relevance

the combined fee wasn't near 30 million. And even if it gets turned they will price him at 12 to 15 million max.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

If we keep Seri we could sell him for £8m next year, a £2m profit. Surely Better.

Ok so to do the maths again making the same assumptions we did before

Sell him now for £8m = £4m loss on book value

Sell him next year for £8m = £2m profit on book value, less £6m charge in amortisation and £3m (according to you) in wages = net loss £7m

Rather just sell him now

FWIW (no pun intended) Fulhamben is almost right re transfer fee and TRF is almost right re wages.  £11m and £66k respectively.

Quote from: Southcoastffc on August 13, 2020, 10:13:39 AM
FWIW (no pun intended) Fulhamben is almost right re transfer fee and TRF is almost right re wages.  £11m and £66k respectively.

What, the fee Nice initially allocated to Seri was £11m, or the fee allocated to Seri after the court case will be £11m?

And either way, does your inside source know how/whether this affects our own valuation of Seri in our accounts? (Which I assume isn't necessarily determined by how Nice allocate the combined fee at their end)

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 10:06:13 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

If we keep Seri we could sell him for £8m next year, a £2m profit. Surely Better.

Ok so to do the maths again making the same assumptions we did before

Sell him now for £8m = £4m loss on book value

Sell him next year for £8m = £2m profit on book value, less £6m charge in amortisation and £3m (according to you) in wages = net loss £7m

Rather just sell him now

Why sell a bench player like Seri?

The financial argument doesn't make sense. 

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 10:19:16 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 10:06:13 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

If we keep Seri we could sell him for £8m next year, a £2m profit. Surely Better.

Ok so to do the maths again making the same assumptions we did before

Sell him now for £8m = £4m loss on book value

Sell him next year for £8m = £2m profit on book value, less £6m charge in amortisation and £3m (according to you) in wages = net loss £7m

Rather just sell him now

Why sell a bench player like Seri?

To make an extra £3m, which is almost enough to cover Harrison Reed (£8m on a 4 yr deal = £2m per year, plus say another £2m wages)

Harrison Reed is probably going earn a lot more than Seri, on top of that you will have to pay for Reed's transfer fee.

Besides we don't need to sell anyone to buy Reed. The Club has more than enough money for Harrison Reed.

You could save an extra £3m by selling Seri, but you could save an extra £3m by selling KMac or an extra £4m by selling Stefjo.

Seri is possibly similar standard to KMac and Stefjo, but one thing is for certain Seri is cheaper to keep than KMac or Stefjo.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 12:23:53 PM
Harrison Reed is probably going earn a lot more than Seri

No chance
We broke the bank for Seri
I don't know if it's £66k or £80k we're paying him per week (more likely to be nearer £80k IMO) but whatever it is he'll be one of our top few earners with Mitrovic and Anguissa (which Reed won't)

I agree we don't "need" to sell Seri. I never said we did. Just making the point that we can easily afford to sell him, write-off the loss and bring in a better player if we want to. And in fact we're probably not any worse off financially for selling him anyway.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 10:19:16 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 10:06:13 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:40:10 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:30:25 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 09:23:07 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 09:19:16 AM
Selling Seri for a few million less than his book value and incurring a small loss on that isn't going to bother us at all.

Why sell? What's the point of selling Seri for a small cost, when you can keep him for the same cost.

If Seri costs the same to sell and to keep, then I'd prefer to keep him in case of injuries to say Stefjo.

On what maths does it cost the same to keep him?
Say for sake of argument he's got a current book value of £12m amortising at £6m per year (£24m fee, 4 year contract) and wages of £4m per year (£80k per week).
And say for the sake of argument we sold him now at the ridiculously low price of £3m (realistically we could surely get more)...

Sell him now for £3m = £9m loss on book value

Keep him = £4m wages + £6m in further amortisation = £10m

His wages are reported as £3m per year or £60k per week.

Sell him costs us £9m loss on book value
Keep him costs us £3m in wages and £6m in further amortization = £9m

If we keep Seri we could sell him for £8m next year, a £2m profit. Surely Better.

Ok so to do the maths again making the same assumptions we did before

Sell him now for £8m = £4m loss on book value

Sell him next year for £8m = £2m profit on book value, less £6m charge in amortisation and £3m (according to you) in wages = net loss £7m

Rather just sell him now

Why sell a bench player like Seri?

The financial argument doesn't make sense. 

Because he will wear the bench out, which will cost money to replace it. does that financial explanation make sense.   

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 03:20:42 PM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 12:23:53 PM
Harrison Reed is probably going earn a lot more than Seri

No chance. We broke the bank for Seri
I don't know if it's £66k or £80k we're paying him per week (more likely to be nearer £80k IMO) but whatever it is he'll be one of our top few earners with Mitrovic and Anguissa (which Reed won't)

I agree we don't "need" to sell Seri. I never said we did. Just making the point that we can easily afford to sell him, write-off the loss and bring in a better player if we want to. And in fact we're probably not any worse off financially for selling him anyway.

Fulham didn't break the bank for Seri's wages, ten players at Crystal Palace earn more than Jean Michel Seri including Cheikhou Kouyaté. If Crystal Palace want Harrison Reed, they have to offer him a better package than anyone at Fulham gets and they might do that. Getting Reed might not be easy if we haven't agreed on terms yet, because his price is high right now and paying a lot is a risk as he is still unproven in the PL.

Before we get rid of Seri and replace him by buying another bench midfielder, we need to see Harrison Reed and Josh Onamah in the premier league because we need to find out if they are truly premier league starters or also premier league bench players. If Reed or Onamah are bench player, we need to bring in another experienced starter, but if Reed and Onamah are truly premier league quality than we should bring in some younger (early 20s) midfielders for the long-term.

All Tony Khan's focus should be getting a center-back better than Hector, two full-backs better than Bryan, a holding midfielder better than Anguissa (so he can move to the #8 role) and another center-forward better than Kamara or Reid, plus a fair bit of under 21 youth.

If we get all those five players, then we will have 26 overaged players in the squad, and assuming they are all 100% fit the one player that has a poor preseason would have to go loan for the season.

As for whether we can afford to writeoff Seri that really depends on how well the existing squad goes in the premier league, I would like to have the maximum amount of FFP money available in case we need to spend big in the winter transfer window to stay up.

Although, if things go well we are mid-table and we don't need to spend in the winter, I am pretty sure Tony Khan will be writing off as many players as possible (such as Seri, MLM, Mawson and Knockaert etc) to near-zero book value, so that in the summer he can get a much younger bench.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 14, 2020, 02:00:37 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 03:20:42 PM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 12:23:53 PM
Harrison Reed is probably going earn a lot more than Seri

No chance. We broke the bank for Seri
I don't know if it's £66k or £80k we're paying him per week (more likely to be nearer £80k IMO) but whatever it is he'll be one of our top few earners with Mitrovic and Anguissa (which Reed won't)

I agree we don't "need" to sell Seri. I never said we did. Just making the point that we can easily afford to sell him, write-off the loss and bring in a better player if we want to. And in fact we're probably not any worse off financially for selling him anyway.

Fulham didn't break the bank for Seri's wages, ten players at Crystal Palace earn more than Jean Michel Seri including Cheikhou Kouyaté. If Crystal Palace want Harrison Reed, they have to offer him a better package than anyone at Fulham gets and they might do that. Getting Reed might not be easy if we haven't agreed on terms yet, because his price is high right now and paying a lot is a risk as he is still unproven in the PL.

Before we get rid of Seri and replace him by buying another bench midfielder, we need to see Harrison Reed and Josh Onamah in the premier league because we need to find out if they are truly premier league starters or also premier league bench players. If Reed or Onamah are bench player, we need to bring in another experienced starter, but if Reed and Onamah are truly premier league quality than we should bring in some younger (early 20s) midfielders for the long-term.

All Tony Khan's focus should be getting a center-back better than Hector, two full-backs better than Bryan, a holding midfielder better than Anguissa (so he can move to the #8 role) and another center-forward better than Kamara or Reid, plus a fair bit of under 21 youth.

If we get all those five players, then we will have 26 overaged players in the squad, and assuming they are all 100% fit the one player that has a poor preseason would have to go loan for the season.

As for whether we can afford to writeoff Seri that really depends on how well the existing squad goes in the premier league, I would like to have the maximum amount of FFP money available in case we need to spend big in the winter transfer window to stay up.

Although, if things go well we are mid-table and we don't need to spend in the winter, I am pretty sure Tony Khan will be writing off as many players as possible (such as Seri, MLM, Mawson and Knockaert etc) to near-zero book value, so that in the summer he can get a much younger bench.

I know it doesn't take much to confuse me,
but I am confused.
You are saying on the one hand Fulham can get a much younger bench, but your also saying that we need players who have proved they are Premier League starters. 

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 14, 2020, 04:47:26 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 14, 2020, 02:00:37 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 03:20:42 PM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 12:23:53 PM
Harrison Reed is probably going earn a lot more than Seri

No chance. We broke the bank for Seri
I don't know if it's £66k or £80k we're paying him per week (more likely to be nearer £80k IMO) but whatever it is he'll be one of our top few earners with Mitrovic and Anguissa (which Reed won't)

I agree we don't "need" to sell Seri. I never said we did. Just making the point that we can easily afford to sell him, write-off the loss and bring in a better player if we want to. And in fact we're probably not any worse off financially for selling him anyway.

Fulham didn't break the bank for Seri's wages, ten players at Crystal Palace earn more than Jean Michel Seri including Cheikhou Kouyaté. If Crystal Palace want Harrison Reed, they have to offer him a better package than anyone at Fulham gets and they might do that. Getting Reed might not be easy if we haven't agreed on terms yet, because his price is high right now and paying a lot is a risk as he is still unproven in the PL.

Before we get rid of Seri and replace him by buying another bench midfielder, we need to see Harrison Reed and Josh Onamah in the premier league because we need to find out if they are truly premier league starters or also premier league bench players. If Reed or Onamah are bench player, we need to bring in another experienced starter, but if Reed and Onamah are truly premier league quality than we should bring in some younger (early 20s) midfielders for the long-term.

All Tony Khan's focus should be getting a center-back better than Hector, two full-backs better than Bryan, a holding midfielder better than Anguissa (so he can move to the #8 role) and another center-forward better than Kamara or Reid, plus a fair bit of under 21 youth.

If we get all those five players, then we will have 26 overaged players in the squad, and assuming they are all 100% fit the one player that has a poor preseason would have to go loan for the season.

As for whether we can afford to writeoff Seri that really depends on how well the existing squad goes in the premier league, I would like to have the maximum amount of FFP money available in case we need to spend big in the winter transfer window to stay up.

Although, if things go well we are mid-table and we don't need to spend in the winter, I am pretty sure Tony Khan will be writing off as many players as possible (such as Seri, MLM, Mawson and Knockaert etc) to near-zero book value, so that in the summer he can get a much younger bench.

I know it doesn't take much to confuse me,
but I am confused.
You are saying on the one hand Fulham can get a much younger bench, but your also saying that we need players who have proved they are Premier League starters.

I am suggesting we give Reed and Onamah a chance to start in the premier league before brining in another midfielder to replace Seri as a bench player. If they  (Reed and Onamah) succeed, we should replace Seri maybe in a year with a younger midfielder that learns as a squad player to improve overtime and develops into a premier league player. If they (Reed and Onamah) fail, we need to bring in the best-experienced premier league midfielder we can find to achieve immediate results to save us from relegation and then work out who stays as bench players based on performance.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 14, 2020, 05:17:47 AM

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 14, 2020, 04:47:26 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 14, 2020, 02:00:37 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 03:20:42 PM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 12:23:53 PM
Harrison Reed is probably going earn a lot more than Seri

No chance. We broke the bank for Seri
I don't know if it's £66k or £80k we're paying him per week (more likely to be nearer £80k IMO) but whatever it is he'll be one of our top few earners with Mitrovic and Anguissa (which Reed won't)

I agree we don't "need" to sell Seri. I never said we did. Just making the point that we can easily afford to sell him, write-off the loss and bring in a better player if we want to. And in fact we're probably not any worse off financially for selling him anyway.

Fulham didn't break the bank for Seri's wages, ten players at Crystal Palace earn more than Jean Michel Seri including Cheikhou Kouyaté. If Crystal Palace want Harrison Reed, they have to offer him a better package than anyone at Fulham gets and they might do that. Getting Reed might not be easy if we haven't agreed on terms yet, because his price is high right now and paying a lot is a risk as he is still unproven in the PL.

Before we get rid of Seri and replace him by buying another bench midfielder, we need to see Harrison Reed and Josh Onamah in the premier league because we need to find out if they are truly premier league starters or also premier league bench players. If Reed or Onamah are bench player, we need to bring in another experienced starter, but if Reed and Onamah are truly premier league quality than we should bring in some younger (early 20s) midfielders for the long-term.

All Tony Khan's focus should be getting a center-back better than Hector, two full-backs better than Bryan, a holding midfielder better than Anguissa (so he can move to the #8 role) and another center-forward better than Kamara or Reid, plus a fair bit of under 21 youth.

If we get all those five players, then we will have 26 overaged players in the squad, and assuming they are all 100% fit the one player that has a poor preseason would have to go loan for the season.

As for whether we can afford to writeoff Seri that really depends on how well the existing squad goes in the premier league, I would like to have the maximum amount of FFP money available in case we need to spend big in the winter transfer window to stay up.

Although, if things go well we are mid-table and we don't need to spend in the winter, I am pretty sure Tony Khan will be writing off as many players as possible (such as Seri, MLM, Mawson and Knockaert etc) to near-zero book value, so that in the summer he can get a much younger bench.

I know it doesn't take much to confuse me,
but I am confused.
You are saying on the one hand Fulham can get a much younger bench, but your also saying that we need players who have proved they are Premier League starters.

I am suggesting we give Reed and Onamah a chance to start in the premier league before brining in another midfielder to replace Seri as a bench player. If they  (Reed and Onamah) succeed, we should replace Seri maybe in a year with a younger midfielder that learns as a squad player to improve overtime and develops into a premier league player. If they (Reed and Onamah) fail, we need to bring in the best-experienced premier league midfielder we can find to achieve immediate results to save us from relegation and then work out who stays as bench players based on performance.

I feel you may need a bigger bench than first anticipated, but I cannot see Seri making it.

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 14, 2020, 02:05:00 PM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 14, 2020, 05:17:47 AM

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 14, 2020, 04:47:26 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 14, 2020, 02:00:37 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 13, 2020, 03:20:42 PM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 12:23:53 PM
Harrison Reed is probably going earn a lot more than Seri

No chance. We broke the bank for Seri
I don't know if it's £66k or £80k we're paying him per week (more likely to be nearer £80k IMO) but whatever it is he'll be one of our top few earners with Mitrovic and Anguissa (which Reed won't)

I agree we don't "need" to sell Seri. I never said we did. Just making the point that we can easily afford to sell him, write-off the loss and bring in a better player if we want to. And in fact we're probably not any worse off financially for selling him anyway.

Fulham didn't break the bank for Seri's wages, ten players at Crystal Palace earn more than Jean Michel Seri including Cheikhou Kouyaté. If Crystal Palace want Harrison Reed, they have to offer him a better package than anyone at Fulham gets and they might do that. Getting Reed might not be easy if we haven't agreed on terms yet, because his price is high right now and paying a lot is a risk as he is still unproven in the PL.

Before we get rid of Seri and replace him by buying another bench midfielder, we need to see Harrison Reed and Josh Onamah in the premier league because we need to find out if they are truly premier league starters or also premier league bench players. If Reed or Onamah are bench player, we need to bring in another experienced starter, but if Reed and Onamah are truly premier league quality than we should bring in some younger (early 20s) midfielders for the long-term.

All Tony Khan's focus should be getting a center-back better than Hector, two full-backs better than Bryan, a holding midfielder better than Anguissa (so he can move to the #8 role) and another center-forward better than Kamara or Reid, plus a fair bit of under 21 youth.

If we get all those five players, then we will have 26 overaged players in the squad, and assuming they are all 100% fit the one player that has a poor preseason would have to go loan for the season.

As for whether we can afford to writeoff Seri that really depends on how well the existing squad goes in the premier league, I would like to have the maximum amount of FFP money available in case we need to spend big in the winter transfer window to stay up.

Although, if things go well we are mid-table and we don't need to spend in the winter, I am pretty sure Tony Khan will be writing off as many players as possible (such as Seri, MLM, Mawson and Knockaert etc) to near-zero book value, so that in the summer he can get a much younger bench.

I know it doesn't take much to confuse me,
but I am confused.
You are saying on the one hand Fulham can get a much younger bench, but your also saying that we need players who have proved they are Premier League starters.

I am suggesting we give Reed and Onamah a chance to start in the premier league before brining in another midfielder to replace Seri as a bench player. If they  (Reed and Onamah) succeed, we should replace Seri maybe in a year with a younger midfielder that learns as a squad player to improve overtime and develops into a premier league player. If they (Reed and Onamah) fail, we need to bring in the best-experienced premier league midfielder we can find to achieve immediate results to save us from relegation and then work out who stays as bench players based on performance.

I feel you may need a bigger bench than first anticipated, but I cannot see Seri making it.

He might make a bench, if his woodwork skills are good enough. He certainly doesn't merit sitting on the bench.

Injuries happen.

I'm of the opinion that if any of our starting midfielders get hurt...miss a few games....or 10 games... I don't want Seri as an option to get those starts.  At all.    I'd much rather have Arter (who I don't EPL rate) or even ...god forbid...KMac.    Hell, I'd sign banged up Chambers and hope we don't need within our first 10 games.

Seri does not get in my starting 5 midfielders.

Onomah
Reed
Cairney
Zambo
BDR
(anyone but Seri)

But that's just me.

Question.   Whose our U18 holding midfielder?   Put him on our bench.

Quote from: AnOldBrownie on August 14, 2020, 08:56:51 PM
Injuries happen.

I'm of the opinion that if any of our starting midfielders get hurt...miss a few games....or 10 games... I don't want Seri as an option to get those starts.  At all.    I'd much rather have Arter (who I don't EPL rate) or even ...god forbid...KMac.    Hell, I'd sign banged up Chambers and hope we don't need within our first 10 games.

Seri does not get in my starting 5 midfielders.

Onomah
Reed
Cairney
Zambo
BDR
(anyone but Seri)

But that's just me.

Question.   Whose our U18 holding midfielder?   Put him on our bench.

I'm sorry but Seri is better than BDR, no way he isn't and in my opinion he's as good as Cairney. I know I'm in the minority though.

Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on August 14, 2020, 09:59:25 PM

Quote from: AnOldBrownie on August 14, 2020, 08:56:51 PM
Injuries happen.

I'm of the opinion that if any of our starting midfielders get hurt...miss a few games....or 10 games... I don't want Seri as an option to get those starts.  At all.    I'd much rather have Arter (who I don't EPL rate) or even ...god forbid...KMac.    Hell, I'd sign banged up Chambers and hope we don't need within our first 10 games.

Seri does not get in my starting 5 midfielders.

Onomah
Reed
Cairney
Zambo
BDR
(anyone but Seri)

But that's just me.

Question.   Whose our U18 holding midfielder?   Put him on our bench.

I'm sorry but Seri is better than BDR, no way he isn't and in my opinion he's as good as Cairney. I know I'm in the minority though.

Well he wasn't better for us and he has just finished another poor season so again hasn't shown this alleged ability.

Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on August 14, 2020, 09:59:25 PM

Quote from: AnOldBrownie on August 14, 2020, 08:56:51 PM
Injuries happen.

I'm of the opinion that if any of our starting midfielders get hurt...miss a few games....or 10 games... I don't want Seri as an option to get those starts.  At all.    I'd much rather have Arter (who I don't EPL rate) or even ...god forbid...KMac.    Hell, I'd sign banged up Chambers and hope we don't need within our first 10 games.

Seri does not get in my starting 5 midfielders.

Onomah
Reed
Cairney
Zambo
BDR
(anyone but Seri)

But that's just me.

Question.   Whose our U18 holding midfielder?   Put him on our bench.

I'm sorry but Seri is better than BDR, no way he isn't and in my opinion he's as good as Cairney. I know I'm in the minority though.

Different types of midfielders, and I know BDR crushes Seri for work rate and finishing.   Again though... different types of midfielders.

I don't think Serri is as bad as people make him to be, but can't see him fitting in our current system. I would look to loan him out again with an option to buy, if the money offered (if any) for a permanent transfer is not to our liking.

On the other hand, I would keep Anguissa and use a midfield three of Reed, Anguissa and either Cairney or Onomah. I wouldn't buy Arter, but would go fot Ndiaye from Stoke - a loan with an option to buy should do the trick and he would compete with Reed for the DM role.

Reed; Anguissa; Cairney - Ndiaye; Johansen; Onomah - McDonald as a backup when needed.

There were moments at the start of the season with Seri where I really thought we were on to something special. Some great touches and little moments that make you think he was a level above the other players on the pitch. But when the going got tough and the atmosphere soured it just all went down hill fast. Having listened to the players, the vibe was awful and it obviously affected the guy to the point where he didnt want to be here.

With that said, and Scott or Tony alluded to this being the case I believe, we should be open to giving him another chance if he is open to being part of the group and contributing. If they ascertain that this is not to be the case then we go our separate ways, or to use him appropriately to raise his value.

Its clear that TK sees Anguissa as a big asset so I am pretty confident he will be playing a sizable role this year.

I'd love to see us all let bygones be bygones, focus on the task at hand with our full support, and not get on the boys too early this season! We will probably only be winning 25 - 30 % of our games this year if we are to stay up so we best not start having a go to early me thinks.

Quote from: Statto on August 08, 2020, 07:50:26 PM
Amazed at some of the attitude comments. I can't recall either of them ever saying anything remotely indicative of a bad attitude.

I am to understand in the case of attitude with these two players is orchestrated by their body language and visual disinterest in what is happening on the field of play whilst they loaf around looking as though they wish they were somewhere else, it is a visual observation.

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 15, 2020, 11:44:58 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 08, 2020, 07:50:26 PM
Amazed at some of the attitude comments. I can't recall either of them ever saying anything remotely indicative of a bad attitude.

I am to understand in the case of attitude with these two players is orchestrated by their body language and visual disinterest in what is happening on the field of play whilst they loaf around looking as though they wish they were somewhere else, it is a visual observation.

I think during that season the sentiments you have expressed here
apply equally to anybody who attended matches..

Quote from: john dempsey on August 15, 2020, 12:11:58 PM

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 15, 2020, 11:44:58 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 08, 2020, 07:50:26 PM
Amazed at some of the attitude comments. I can't recall either of them ever saying anything remotely indicative of a bad attitude.

I am to understand in the case of attitude with these two players is orchestrated by their body language and visual disinterest in what is happening on the field of play whilst they loaf around looking as though they wish they were somewhere else, it is a visual observation.

I think during that season the sentiments you have expressed here
apply equally to anybody who attended matches..

Most certainly at times Cairney displayed that attitude as well. Seri seemed to go downhill when the story about his and mlm valuations broke.

Seri looked enthusiastic  during our brilliant victory, with a  great second half performance,  home to Brighton in the Prem.

He seemed to combine well with Cairney in midfield, and when i shouted   support to him from the front of the hammy End, when he went to take a corner, he  touched the badge.
But that  was one of the few times i  actually got to the Cottage, and the rest of the time he mostly seemed to struggle - easily knocked off the ball,  mistiming tackles, slow in thought and action on the ball.
But was he  struggling to get up to Prem pace? and also  with the general morale  and decline in confidence of the  whiole team , which had started the season so promisingly

I'm influenced by the  not usually publicly outspoken Ream's comments about some  of the  players in the team not having the right attitude, though.
Something seems to have been wrong around the team - a team where some  players important to our promotion were sent on loan, or on the bench, with  a lot of newcomers on presumably on high wages put straight into the side.

We gave josh a chance let's give seri another one, he is a good player his stats don't lie- he's obviously temperamental and that was a love up season maybe he'll be better now with a better energy

I trust Parker's judgement in these things.

Quote from: Twig on August 14, 2020, 10:14:34 PM

Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on August 14, 2020, 09:59:25 PM

Quote from: AnOldBrownie on August 14, 2020, 08:56:51 PM
Injuries happen.

I'm of the opinion that if any of our starting midfielders get hurt...miss a few games....or 10 games... I don't want Seri as an option to get those starts.  At all.    I'd much rather have Arter (who I don't EPL rate) or even ...god forbid...KMac.    Hell, I'd sign banged up Chambers and hope we don't need within our first 10 games.

Seri does not get in my starting 5 midfielders.

Onomah
Reed
Cairney
Zambo
BDR
(anyone but Seri)

But that's just me.

Question.   Whose our U18 holding midfielder?   Put him on our bench.

I'm sorry but Seri is better than BDR, no way he isn't and in my opinion he's as good as Cairney. I know I'm in the minority though.

Well he wasn't better for us and he has just finished another poor season so again hasn't shown this alleged ability.

On what basis was his season poor? His rating was higher than Reid and he played in the Champions League. I like Reid but I like Seri too.

Quote from: spoonffc on August 15, 2020, 01:53:39 PM
We gave josh a chance let's give seri another one, he is a good player his stats don't lie- he's obviously temperamental and that was a fcuk up season maybe he'll be better now with a better energy

Agree. I don't really understand the negativity towards him when people seem willing to cut the other poor PL performers slack.

Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on August 15, 2020, 02:31:11 PM

Quote from: spoonffc on August 15, 2020, 01:53:39 PM
We gave josh a chance let's give seri another one, he is a good player his stats don't lie- he's obviously temperamental and that was a fcuk up season maybe he'll be better now with a better energy

Agree. I don't really understand the negativity towards him when people seem willing to cut the other poor PL performers slack.

The negativity is probably because his performances nose dived when the story about the transfer fee and his apparently reduced cut of it surfaced.

Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

I'd rather we move him on to be honest.

Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on August 15, 2020, 02:30:12 PM

Quote from: Twig on August 14, 2020, 10:14:34 PM

Quote from: Mitrovic the warrior on August 14, 2020, 09:59:25 PM

Quote from: AnOldBrownie on August 14, 2020, 08:56:51 PM
Injuries happen.

I'm of the opinion that if any of our starting midfielders get hurt...miss a few games....or 10 games... I don't want Seri as an option to get those starts.  At all.    I'd much rather have Arter (who I don't EPL rate) or even ...god forbid...KMac.    Hell, I'd sign banged up Chambers and hope we don't need within our first 10 games.

Seri does not get in my starting 5 midfielders.

Onomah
Reed
Cairney
Zambo
BDR
(anyone but Seri)

But that's just me.

Question.   Whose our U18 holding midfielder?   Put him on our bench.

I'm sorry but Seri is better than BDR, no way he isn't and in my opinion he's as good as Cairney. I know I'm in the minority though.

Well he wasn't better for us and he has just finished another poor season so again hasn't shown this alleged ability.

On what basis was his season poor? His rating was higher than Reid and he played in the Champions League. I like Reid but I like Seri too.

Of course he played in the Champions League he's at Galatasary who finished top of a relatively weak league for two years running. I don't see what your point is?
Interestingly with Seri involved they have finished down in 6th. Not saying that's just down to him but he's part of a squad that has performed poorly this year.

No doubt, Seri's statistics in the premier league weren't great, and neither were his performances worth of a starting spot in the premier league, but we only have eight outfield players in the squad that did better than him in the premier league and that's what we need even for the bench. In addition, some of those who were better than Seri like Christie and MLM still weren't good enough to be a premier league starter.

Christie, MLM, Bryan, Anguissa, Cairney, Mitro, Knockaert at Brighton, and Mawson at Swansea are the only eight outfield players currently in the squad that have better stats in the premier league than Seri. I think the statistics are correct that Mawson, Ream, KMac, Stefjo, Cav, Kamara, and Reid all did worse in the PL than Seri in 18/19.

We have added Hector and Onamah to the squad, which should be better than Seri but are unproven in the premier league. This means Fulham has 10 outfield players better than Seri, but we need to add at least another 5 to 8 outfield players over the next 18 months before we don't need Seri in the squad and I'd like 20 outfield players better than him.

Quote from: Penfold on August 15, 2020, 02:55:23 PM
Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

Do you have a link to these stories?
The only thing along those lines I can recall seeing was Ream's comments, which RaySmith mentions above. However, they didn't refer specifically to Seri, and given we'd signed 11 new players, it seems harsh (and to be frank, a bit xenophobic) to assume he was one of the people Ream was talking about. And also they come with the caveat that Ream was about as strong as soggy newspaper going into most challenges that season, so was in no position to question anyone else in the team.

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 11:00:12 AM

Quote from: Penfold on August 15, 2020, 02:55:23 PM
Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

Do you have a link to these stories?
The only thing along those lines I can recall seeing was Ream's comments, which RaySmith mentions above. However, they didn't refer specifically to Seri, and given we'd signed 11 new players, it seems harsh (and to be frank, a bit xenophobic) to assume he was one of the people Ream was talking about. And also they come with the caveat that Ream was about as strong as soggy newspaper going into most challenges that season, so was in no position to question anyone else in the team.

:plus one:

I think most of those stories were invented on here, or on other fan sites. Seri and Anguissa were probably the most popular scape goats because of their high cost and lack of previous positive impressions, and so when Ream (seemingly trying to deflect from his own poor performances) made those comments it was easy for people to immediately look in their direction. There may of course be truth behind it, but I can't remember ever seeing anything even resembling a hint of evidence. I don't see everything of course, so may have also missed it.

I thought Seri was a nice footballer but that relegation season proved that there just wasn't space in the team for him and Cairney. No doubt right now that Cairney has earnt a season in the Premier league and as our captain, seems Seri has to go.

Also I would much prefer to have Reed in our starting line up than Anguissa and therefore thought that he too had to go. However there now seems to be some hang up about signing Reed and if he cannot be here for the start of the season it may be wise to grab hold of Anguissa to see if he is up to the task.

Quote from: filham on August 17, 2020, 11:26:31 AM
I thought Seri was a nice footballer but that relegation season proved that there just wasn't space in the team for him and Cairney. No doubt right now that Cairney has earnt a season in the Premier league and as our captain, seems Seri has to go.

Also I would much prefer to have Reed in our starting line up than Anguissa and therefore thought that he too had to go. However there now seems to be some hang up about signing Reed and if he cannot be here for the start of the season it may be wise to grab hold of Anguissa to see if he is up to the task.

Is there anything in particular that makes you think there is a hang up, other than the perfectly normal negotiations that takes place between club and player and that might have to factor in that Reed has been on vacation for two weeks?

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 11:00:12 AM

Quote from: Penfold on August 15, 2020, 02:55:23 PM
Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

Do you have a link to these stories?
The only thing along those lines I can recall seeing was Ream's comments, which RaySmith mentions above. However, they didn't refer specifically to Seri, and given we'd signed 11 new players, it seems harsh (and to be frank, a bit xenophobic) to assume he was one of the people Ream was talking about. And also they come with the caveat that Ream was about as strong as soggy newspaper going into most challenges that season, so was in no position to question anyone else in the team.

A lot circulated after the Ream stuff.

I was told by somebody who attended a lot of academy games. Maybe someone with an agenda, as I said who knows if it's actually true.

For me, the total drop in performance after stories about the transfer fee and his cut broke is the reason I wouldn't have him back. Maybe not connected but seems odd.

Voted for Anguissa and not Seri.  In the second half of his season with us it was clear that Seri was being targeted as someone who could be knocked off the ball by a tenacious midfielder in a way that referees here allow, but might be a free kick elsewhere.  It's doubtful he will have improved that element of his game in the past year.  So he just seems unsuited to our league and it would be better for all concerned if we move on.  In contrast I didn't see anyone taking liberties with Anguissa and suspect they would have regretted it.  I'd still be concerned that the pressing game will be a shock to the system - it's not how Spanish teams tend to play - but he's a quality footballer and I'd be happy to see him back.

Quote from: Penfold on August 17, 2020, 11:38:18 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 11:00:12 AM

Quote from: Penfold on August 15, 2020, 02:55:23 PM
Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

Do you have a link to these stories?
The only thing along those lines I can recall seeing was Ream's comments, which RaySmith mentions above. However, they didn't refer specifically to Seri, and given we'd signed 11 new players, it seems harsh (and to be frank, a bit xenophobic) to assume he was one of the people Ream was talking about. And also they come with the caveat that Ream was about as strong as soggy newspaper going into most challenges that season, so was in no position to question anyone else in the team.

A lot circulated after the Ream stuff.

I was told by somebody who attended a lot of academy games. Maybe someone with an agenda, as I said who knows if it's actually true.

For me, the total drop in performance after stories about the transfer fee and his cut broke is the reason I wouldn't have him back. Maybe not connected but seems odd.

FWIW I agree the timing of his performances dropping may suggest a connection with story about his fee (although it also coincided with us generally becoming crap, suffering some humiliating defeats, the manager being being sacked and it becoming clear we weren't going to be competing anywhere near the middle of the table as initially envisaged). But in any case, does a player becoming a bit depressed after hearing that his current and previous employers may have conspired to shaft him out of some money, really make him a "bad influence in the dressing room"?

For comparison, Bryan has admitted to suffering from depression - does that make him a bad influence (and "poison", and all the other things said about Seri on this thread) as well?

Anguissa.
Think he showed enough by the end and has since kicked on.
Seri's lack of pace just wont play in the Prem

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 12:04:24 PM

Quote from: Penfold on August 17, 2020, 11:38:18 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 11:00:12 AM

Quote from: Penfold on August 15, 2020, 02:55:23 PM
Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

Do you have a link to these stories?
The only thing along those lines I can recall seeing was Ream's comments, which RaySmith mentions above. However, they didn't refer specifically to Seri, and given we'd signed 11 new players, it seems harsh (and to be frank, a bit xenophobic) to assume he was one of the people Ream was talking about. And also they come with the caveat that Ream was about as strong as soggy newspaper going into most challenges that season, so was in no position to question anyone else in the team.

A lot circulated after the Ream stuff.

I was told by somebody who attended a lot of academy games. Maybe someone with an agenda, as I said who knows if it's actually true.

For me, the total drop in performance after stories about the transfer fee and his cut broke is the reason I wouldn't have him back. Maybe not connected but seems odd.

FWIW I agree the timing of his performances dropping may suggest a connection with story about his fee (although it also coincided with us generally becoming crap, suffering some humiliating defeats, the manager being being sacked and it becoming clear we weren't going to be competing anywhere near the middle of the table as initially envisaged). But in any case, does a player becoming a bit depressed after hearing that his current and previous employers may have conspired to shaft him out of some money, really make him a "bad influence in the dressing room"?

For comparison, Bryan has admitted to suffering from depression - does that make him a bad influence (and "poison", and all the other things said about Seri on this thread) as well?

If Seri is a bad influence on the dressing room, then that means that some players cannot or refuse to play their best with him there. I suggest we sell these players first, if having Seri in the dressing room is the reason that other players play badly then they are the problem. A player with the right attitude gives their best every time they wear a Fulham shirt. A player that only plays their best when Seri is not in the dressing room is not a player i want wearing a Fulham shirt.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 18, 2020, 01:16:17 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 12:04:24 PM

Quote from: Penfold on August 17, 2020, 11:38:18 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 11:00:12 AM

Quote from: Penfold on August 15, 2020, 02:55:23 PM
Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

Do you have a link to these stories?
The only thing along those lines I can recall seeing was Ream's comments, which RaySmith mentions above. However, they didn't refer specifically to Seri, and given we'd signed 11 new players, it seems harsh (and to be frank, a bit xenophobic) to assume he was one of the people Ream was talking about. And also they come with the caveat that Ream was about as strong as soggy newspaper going into most challenges that season, so was in no position to question anyone else in the team.

A lot circulated after the Ream stuff.

I was told by somebody who attended a lot of academy games. Maybe someone with an agenda, as I said who knows if it's actually true.

For me, the total drop in performance after stories about the transfer fee and his cut broke is the reason I wouldn't have him back. Maybe not connected but seems odd.

FWIW I agree the timing of his performances dropping may suggest a connection with story about his fee (although it also coincided with us generally becoming crap, suffering some humiliating defeats, the manager being being sacked and it becoming clear we weren't going to be competing anywhere near the middle of the table as initially envisaged). But in any case, does a player becoming a bit depressed after hearing that his current and previous employers may have conspired to shaft him out of some money, really make him a "bad influence in the dressing room"?

For comparison, Bryan has admitted to suffering from depression - does that make him a bad influence (and "poison", and all the other things said about Seri on this thread) as well?

If Seri is a bad influence on the dressing room, then that means that some players cannot or refuse to play their best with him there. I suggest we sell these players first, if having Seri in the dressing room is the reason that other players play badly then they are the problem. A player with the right attitude gives their best every time they wear a Fulham shirt. A player that only plays their best when Seri is not in the dressing room is not a player i want wearing a Fulham shirt.

I have a far better idea, you get rid of the source of the problem which is the bad influence not the remainder of the dressing room. If somebody is toxic you get rid of them not everyone else. It appears the only dressing room you have sat in is your local Mens Outfitters.
Because what you have just stated tells me you have never sat in a football dressing room or any team sports dressing room if you have those views because you wouldn't last five minutes.

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 18, 2020, 01:38:29 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 18, 2020, 01:16:17 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 12:04:24 PM

Quote from: Penfold on August 17, 2020, 11:38:18 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 11:00:12 AM

Quote from: Penfold on August 15, 2020, 02:55:23 PM
Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

Do you have a link to these stories?
The only thing along those lines I can recall seeing was Ream's comments, which RaySmith mentions above. However, they didn't refer specifically to Seri, and given we'd signed 11 new players, it seems harsh (and to be frank, a bit xenophobic) to assume he was one of the people Ream was talking about. And also they come with the caveat that Ream was about as strong as soggy newspaper going into most challenges that season, so was in no position to question anyone else in the team.

A lot circulated after the Ream stuff.

I was told by somebody who attended a lot of academy games. Maybe someone with an agenda, as I said who knows if it's actually true.

For me, the total drop in performance after stories about the transfer fee and his cut broke is the reason I wouldn't have him back. Maybe not connected but seems odd.

FWIW I agree the timing of his performances dropping may suggest a connection with story about his fee (although it also coincided with us generally becoming crap, suffering some humiliating defeats, the manager being being sacked and it becoming clear we weren't going to be competing anywhere near the middle of the table as initially envisaged). But in any case, does a player becoming a bit depressed after hearing that his current and previous employers may have conspired to shaft him out of some money, really make him a "bad influence in the dressing room"?

For comparison, Bryan has admitted to suffering from depression - does that make him a bad influence (and "poison", and all the other things said about Seri on this thread) as well?

If Seri is a bad influence on the dressing room, then that means that some players cannot or refuse to play their best with him there. I suggest we sell these players first, if having Seri in the dressing room is the reason that other players play badly then they are the problem. A player with the right attitude gives their best every time they wear a Fulham shirt. A player that only plays their best when Seri is not in the dressing room is not a player i want wearing a Fulham shirt.

I have a far better idea, you get rid of the source of the problem which is the bad influence not the remainder of the dressing room. If somebody is toxic you get rid of them not everyone else. It appears the only dressing room you have sat in is your local Mens Outfitters.
Because what you have just stated tells me you have never sat in a football dressing room or any team sports dressing room if you have those views because you wouldn't last five minutes.

If you think Seri in the dressing room is the source of Ream, KMac and Stefjo poor performance in
premier league, and it is undoubtably Tony Khans fault that Seri is in the dressing room; the Tony Khan is to blame for Betts, Ream, KMac and Stefjo performance rather than the players themselves or Slavisa.

Somehow with this logic Tony Khan and Seri are always to blame for everything and the players plus coach are completely blameless. In my world, Betts, Ream, KMac and Stefjo are responsible for their poor performances in the premier league and Seri influence on them in the dressing room was not the problem with their performance.

I would note the last time Betts, Ream, KMac and Stefjo all started for Fulham was Barnsley Away and Seri wasn't in the dressing room. Frankly, I think more likely is too much drinking in the off season is the problem.

Seri to Galatasaray for Babel straight up please.   Pretty please.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 18, 2020, 03:30:07 AM

Quote from: Woolly Mammoth on August 18, 2020, 01:38:29 AM

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 18, 2020, 01:16:17 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 12:04:24 PM

Quote from: Penfold on August 17, 2020, 11:38:18 AM

Quote from: Statto on August 17, 2020, 11:00:12 AM

Quote from: Penfold on August 15, 2020, 02:55:23 PM
Stories that he was a bad influence in the dressing room also surfaced. Whether there's any truth in this I don't know.

Do you have a link to these stories?
The only thing along those lines I can recall seeing was Ream's comments, which RaySmith mentions above. However, they didn't refer specifically to Seri, and given we'd signed 11 new players, it seems harsh (and to be frank, a bit xenophobic) to assume he was one of the people Ream was talking about. And also they come with the caveat that Ream was about as strong as soggy newspaper going into most challenges that season, so was in no position to question anyone else in the team.

A lot circulated after the Ream stuff.

I was told by somebody who attended a lot of academy games. Maybe someone with an agenda, as I said who knows if it's actually true.

For me, the total drop in performance after stories about the transfer fee and his cut broke is the reason I wouldn't have him back. Maybe not connected but seems odd.

FWIW I agree the timing of his performances dropping may suggest a connection with story about his fee (although it also coincided with us generally becoming crap, suffering some humiliating defeats, the manager being being sacked and it becoming clear we weren't going to be competing anywhere near the middle of the table as initially envisaged). But in any case, does a player becoming a bit depressed after hearing that his current and previous employers may have conspired to shaft him out of some money, really make him a "bad influence in the dressing room"?

For comparison, Bryan has admitted to suffering from depression - does that make him a bad influence (and "poison", and all the other things said about Seri on this thread) as well?

If Seri is a bad influence on the dressing room, then that means that some players cannot or refuse to play their best with him there. I suggest we sell these players first, if having Seri in the dressing room is the reason that other players play badly then they are the problem. A player with the right attitude gives their best every time they wear a Fulham shirt. A player that only plays their best when Seri is not in the dressing room is not a player i want wearing a Fulham shirt.

I have a far better idea, you get rid of the source of the problem which is the bad influence not the remainder of the dressing room. If somebody is toxic you get rid of them not everyone else. It appears the only dressing room you have sat in is your local Mens Outfitters.
Because what you have just stated tells me you have never sat in a football dressing room or any team sports dressing room if you have those views because you wouldn't last five minutes.

If you think Seri in the dressing room is the source of Ream, KMac and Stefjo poor performance in
premier league, and it is undoubtably Tony Khans fault that Seri is in the dressing room; the Tony Khan is to blame for Betts, Ream, KMac and Stefjo performance rather than the players themselves or Slavisa.

Somehow with this logic Tony Khan and Seri are always to blame for everything and the players plus coach are completely blameless. In my world, Betts, Ream, KMac and Stefjo are responsible for their poor performances in the premier league and Seri influence on them in the dressing room was not the problem with their performance.

I would note the last time Betts, Ream, KMac and Stefjo all started for Fulham was Barnsley Away and Seri wasn't in the dressing room. Frankly, I think more likely is too much drinking in the off season is the problem.

Well after that explosive statement I reckon it's all your fault along with Seri and TK, the three of you have to share the blame.

Somehow we are in the premier league and it's The Khans fault. Regardless of whether Seri is a good buy, he is a talented player that is very confidence based, if he is on the field we need to get behind him, as we get behind Bobby Reid, hoping that next game is going to be his breakout game that turns his PL career at the cottage around. I think both Bobby Reid and Seri are a bit hot and cold that may be best starting most games from the bench, but if that changes either will be great assets.

We can add four overaged players to the squad before we have to start "replacing and upgrading" players, let's get four absolute quality players in and we need a couple of under 21s players too to deepen the squad. If we bring in the right seven players, the squad should be looking fairly decent for preseason and first few games, before any summer deadline day fixes and/or winter transfer window moves.

You must not put words in my mouth except the word Food. If Seri enters the field of play wearing a Fulham shirt I shall support him fully.
I agree we need 4 quality players, but in the right positions needed, and of the right character and mental strength, supplemented by three u/21s that can hack it. So we agree to agree on this occasion it appears.

Quote from: The Rational Fan on August 13, 2020, 03:35:16 AM

Quote from: AnOldBrownie on August 13, 2020, 03:08:08 AM
I have two saved Galatasaray games from late in the season where Seri played DM.   Nothing that I saw tells me Seri is reactive enough in front of our back line to warrent getting any play time ahead of even  Stefjo, who isn't even a DM. imo  Onomah is a lock to be our starting #10.   Cairney...our starting #8 and Reed as our starting #6.

Anguissa (who I think is better than Tom Cairney) will be on the bench until he proves he's better than Tom as the #8, but I'd definitely bring Anguissa in to play a slash #8/#6 beside Tom before I'd bring Seri onto the pitch. I see Seri as a 3rd string #8, which to me means, if he's on the pitch we're in trouble stopping the opposing team.

Seri is looking at being our 5th best central midfielder; behind Reed, Anguissa, Cairney and Onamah; just ahead of S.Sess, KMac, Stefjo and Reid. He may prove better than some midfielders in the best four now and some of those outside the top five may prove (or improve) to be better than him.

All the teams in the bottom eight of the premier league struggle to get one point per game when they have two of their best four midfielders injured. With Seri playing we might not get one point per game, but he can help us pick up some points until the best midfielders come back as proven by victories in the premier league with him in the starting XI against Burnley, Huddersfield, Southampton, Brighton, and Bournemouth.

I think that midfield is pretty solid for preseason, although I admit it might need an upgrade if the preseason is poor, early season is poor or we get some injuries. But other areas need to be addressed first, namely every defensive position and backup center forward.

Seri is only a little fella, the last time I measured him he was standing on a box and I was standing in a hole. He measured 5 ft and a fag paper, my Garden Gnome on my front lawn is taller, and Seri is quite lightweight. So I would have to go with Zambo providing he has turned over a new leaf and has not been sold.