Jol and Dembélé

[sipwell]

Dembélé was brought to Fulham as an attacker and played during his first year in Fulham in that role, not to an exceptional success. However, under Jol he started to play more like a central midfielder or, as it is called, a box-to-box player, who can hold the ball, give a good (through) pass and steal a ball. When Dembélé played for Belgium, he played in his old role (and not too successful either) but yesterday, Dembélé played box-to-box in a central role (he replaced Witsel who plays in a similar role for his club). Belgium beat the Dutch superstars with 4-2 and it could have been a lot more. Dembélé played around 30 minutes and he stole balls, gave through passes, held the ball and was obstructing the Dutch midfield.

It goes, in my opinion, to show what a great tactical 'personal' coach Martin Jol really is. He transformed Dembélé, made him better and it has been picked up by the Belgian national manager as well...

[Lighthouse]

There is no doubt that Dembele switching to central midfield works up to a point.

But Jol as a great tactical coach is pushing it a bit. Although I have seen the opinion that Dembele is a bit wasted playing so deep. We play without forwards or just the one up front. So until we look better in the opposition area and not freeze at the borders, Jol remains a tactical coach with ideas that sometimes work. Hardly great IMO

[Andy_M]

I don't think it's a case of Jol transforming Dembele more a case of realising he had all the attributes to make a really good box-to-box midfielder.

As i said in a thread the other day. Credit where credit is due to Jol for spotting this and getting the best out of Dembele - shooting has never looked like his strong point even in the warm ups!

[sipwell]

Well, Dembélé played in an attacking role for most of his young (but already rich) career. Jol saw he was better behind the attack and transformed him. He is a lot better now than he was two years ago, even though physically he still is the same man. That is, in my opinion, down to Jol.

[Andy_M]

I'm not saying it's not down to Jol - like i said credit where credits due. I just don't feel he has transformed Dembele. I feel he has exactly the same attributes as he always has, he is just now played in a position which makes more of those attributes.

For example, ever since he's been at Fulham we've seen how easily he can glide past players with the ball, but when he was played in a more attacking role too often did he do his going side to side or backwards and hardly ever forwards. Usually because he was faced with too many people infront of him with no real space to attack. By playing him in a deeper role he gets on the ball earlier and has the space to attack and can therefore glide past players going forward rather than side to side or backwards.

Like I say the change in position is totally down to Jol but I don't think it's a transformation of the player as to me he has always had the attributes he has now, he can just deploy them better in a deeper midfield role.

[AlFayedsChequebook]

I'm not saying it's not down to Jol - like i said credit where credits due. I just don't feel he has transformed Dembele. I feel he has exactly the same attributes as he always has, he is just now played in a position which makes more of those attributes.

For example, ever since he's been at Fulham we've seen how easily he can glide past players with the ball, but when he was played in a more attacking role too often did he do his going side to side or backwards and hardly ever forwards. Usually because he was faced with too many people infront of him with no real space to attack. By playing him in a deeper role he gets on the ball earlier and has the space to attack and can therefore glide past players going forward rather than side to side or backwards.

Like I say the change in position is totally down to Jol but I don't think it's a transformation of the player as to me he has always had the attributes he has now, he can just deploy them better in a deeper midfield role.

I think that is true, but he seems to have improved his tackling in the CM role.

[fraanske]

he replaced CHADLLI  who plays in a similar role for his club

[HatterDon]

Either you give Jol the tactical credit, or you assume that he MEANT to tell Dembele to play behind Zamora, but he mistakenly said, play deep in the center. Then just as he was about to ask Ray why Dembele was so far from the forward line, he looked up and said, "Heeeeeeeeey, that kid really looks good there. Let's let him play for a while."

Yep, Lighthouse, I'm sure it's really the latter rather than the former.

[itombomb]

There is no doubt that Dembele switching to central midfield works up to a point.

But Jol as a great tactical coach is pushing it a bit. Although I have seen the opinion that Dembele is a bit wasted playing so deep. We play without forwards or just the one up front. So until we look better in the opposition area and not freeze at the borders, Jol remains a tactical coach with ideas that sometimes work. Hardly great IMO

Whilst he definitely isn't wasted playing deep, he was at times too hesitant to get forward last season, and given his quality we could definitely do with him bombing forward a bit more. Though I think part of that was that he was asked to be very disciplined to cover Danny's legs.

[b+w geezer]

He's vastly better in the new role, absolutely no comparison. It's not a question of skills having been absent previously, but of their deployment now in a way that brings much greater benefit to the team. In the process, he is made to look better and more valuable individually, so everyone's a winner -- or would be if he wasn't in his last year of contract.

As for who's responsible, Jol being the best outsider's guess, thanks and congratulations are due without the slightest sliver of reservation. On a final note: shooting has generally been a weakness in his portfolio, but in the last two games of the season (especially at Spurs) he shot impressively. Sustain that improvement and the sky (a.k.a. Real Madrid) really might be the limit.

[epsomraver]

By Dembele playing so deep it makes the whole defence play too deep and that led to some very boring football last season and getting beaten by teams we should have beaten, Blackburn for one

[epsomraver]

There is no doubt that Dembele switching to central midfield works up to a point.

But Jol as a great tactical coach is pushing it a bit. Although I have seen the opinion that Dembele is a bit wasted playing so deep. We play without forwards or just the one up front. So until we look better in the opposition area and not freeze at the borders, Jol remains a tactical coach with ideas that sometimes work. Hardly great IMO

Very true.